Question about CO2 levels in my tank

[NjF]

Since you were so helpful answering my last question, here is another
for the experts.

Before setting up the tank I tested tap water for pH, KH, and GH (7.8,
8dKH, 17dGH).

After running for a couple of weeks with injected CO2 pH remains
stable at 7.8 with KH and GH not changing as well. The co2 system is
Nutrafin's Natural Plant System which I purchased because I had read
several posts recommending them (or at least the bubble
counter/diffuser).

As I understand it, co2 levels in the tank are directly related to pH
and KH. I don't know the algorithm, nor do I particularly care what
it is, but Chuck's planted aquarium page has a calculator that will
figure out the ppm of co2 based on the numbers you input for pH and
KH. Both his table and calculator give me a reading of about 3.8ppm
of co2 in the water, which is exactly where I started off before
adding co2.

The water is not being agitated in any real way as to cause the co2 to
escape. When leaving the end of the tube, the co2 bubbles are large,
but gradually decrease in size as they travel up the diffuser (I take
this as meaning the co2 is being dissolved). What do I need to do to
increase the levels of co2 in the water?

BTW, I get 1 bubble of co2 about every 3 seconds with about 4 bubbles
in the counter at any given time.

The tank is 10g with 15watts of light (will be upgraded shortly).

Any help is greatly appreciated. I have enjoyed reading many of your
posts already.

NjF

[RifRaf]

I've only seen these systems in action at a LFS so I don't have first
hand experience with them.

Is there any CO2 bubble left by the time it reaches the top?
If there is, then that's basically wasted CO2.

To increase the CO2 levels with this system as it is, you'd need to
increase the bubble rate...if that's possible with the system.

Or....somehow slow down the bubble travel in order to get a more
complete absorbtion of the CO2 into the water.

Chris


On Tue, 17 Dec 2002 04:16:08 GMT, NjF > wrote:

>Since you were so helpful answering my last question, here is another
>for the experts.
>
>Before setting up the tank I tested tap water for pH, KH, and GH (7.8,
>8dKH, 17dGH).
>
>After running for a couple of weeks with injected CO2 pH remains
>stable at 7.8 with KH and GH not changing as well. The co2 system is
>Nutrafin's Natural Plant System which I purchased because I had read
>several posts recommending them (or at least the bubble
>counter/diffuser).
>
>As I understand it, co2 levels in the tank are directly related to pH
>and KH. I don't know the algorithm, nor do I particularly care what
>it is, but Chuck's planted aquarium page has a calculator that will
>figure out the ppm of co2 based on the numbers you input for pH and
>KH. Both his table and calculator give me a reading of about 3.8ppm
>of co2 in the water, which is exactly where I started off before
>adding co2.
>
>The water is not being agitated in any real way as to cause the co2 to
>escape. When leaving the end of the tube, the co2 bubbles are large,
>but gradually decrease in size as they travel up the diffuser (I take
>this as meaning the co2 is being dissolved). What do I need to do to
>increase the levels of co2 in the water?
>
>BTW, I get 1 bubble of co2 about every 3 seconds with about 4 bubbles
>in the counter at any given time.
>
>The tank is 10g with 15watts of light (will be upgraded shortly).
>
>Any help is greatly appreciated. I have enjoyed reading many of your
>posts already.
>
>NjF



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[Philip Ash]

I cant comment as to why your tank is shoing no change, but i have had the
same system on a 70 UKG tank for just over a week.
I have seen a drop in PH of around .3-.5
Are you sure about the accuracy/resolution of your PH test kit?
I have two different kits here. Before CO2 both showed about the same 7.5
Now one clearly shows 7.0 the other still looks like 7.5
I think this is due to the limits in accuracy/resolution/perception of
colour with the test kit.

hth
Phil.




"NjF" > wrote in message
...
> Since you were so helpful answering my last question, here is another
> for the experts.
>
> Before setting up the tank I tested tap water for pH, KH, and GH (7.8,
> 8dKH, 17dGH).
>
> After running for a couple of weeks with injected CO2 pH remains
> stable at 7.8 with KH and GH not changing as well. The co2 system is
> Nutrafin's Natural Plant System which I purchased because I had read
> several posts recommending them (or at least the bubble
> counter/diffuser).
>
> As I understand it, co2 levels in the tank are directly related to pH
> and KH. I don't know the algorithm, nor do I particularly care what
> it is, but Chuck's planted aquarium page has a calculator that will
> figure out the ppm of co2 based on the numbers you input for pH and
> KH. Both his table and calculator give me a reading of about 3.8ppm
> of co2 in the water, which is exactly where I started off before
> adding co2.
>
> The water is not being agitated in any real way as to cause the co2 to
> escape. When leaving the end of the tube, the co2 bubbles are large,
> but gradually decrease in size as they travel up the diffuser (I take
> this as meaning the co2 is being dissolved). What do I need to do to
> increase the levels of co2 in the water?
>
> BTW, I get 1 bubble of co2 about every 3 seconds with about 4 bubbles
> in the counter at any given time.
>
> The tank is 10g with 15watts of light (will be upgraded shortly).
>
> Any help is greatly appreciated. I have enjoyed reading many of your
> posts already.
>
> NjF

[Mark Trueman]

NjF > wrote in message >...
> Since you were so helpful answering my last question, here is another
> for the experts.
>
> Before setting up the tank I tested tap water for pH, KH, and GH (7.8,
> 8dKH, 17dGH).
>
> After running for a couple of weeks with injected CO2 pH remains
> stable at 7.8 with KH and GH not changing as well. The co2 system is
> Nutrafin's Natural Plant System which I purchased because I had read
> several posts recommending them (or at least the bubble
> counter/diffuser).
>
> As I understand it, co2 levels in the tank are directly related to pH
> and KH. I don't know the algorithm, nor do I particularly care what
> it is, but Chuck's planted aquarium page has a calculator that will
> figure out the ppm of co2 based on the numbers you input for pH and
> KH. Both his table and calculator give me a reading of about 3.8ppm
> of co2 in the water, which is exactly where I started off before
> adding co2.
>
> The water is not being agitated in any real way as to cause the co2 to
> escape. When leaving the end of the tube, the co2 bubbles are large,
> but gradually decrease in size as they travel up the diffuser (I take
> this as meaning the co2 is being dissolved). What do I need to do to
> increase the levels of co2 in the water?
>
> BTW, I get 1 bubble of co2 about every 3 seconds with about 4 bubbles
> in the counter at any given time.
>
> The tank is 10g with 15watts of light (will be upgraded shortly).
>
> Any help is greatly appreciated. I have enjoyed reading many of your
> posts already.
>
> NjF

Did you test your tap water straight out of the tap or did you let it
outgass for 24 hours before testing the ph. I find that my tapwater's
pH rises after 24 hours from 7.4 to 8.4. I then inject co2 which
brings the ph back down to 7.4. What you might be seeing is tap water
with a high co2 level straight out of the tap. It would change if you
let it but your co2 injection keeps it the same.

Just a thought

Mark

[Ed]

On Tue, 17 Dec 2002 04:16:08 GMT, NjF > wrote:

>Since you were so helpful answering my last question, here is another
>for the experts.
>
>Before setting up the tank I tested tap water for pH, KH, and GH (7.8,
>8dKH, 17dGH).
>
>After running for a couple of weeks with injected CO2 pH remains
>stable at 7.8 with KH and GH not changing as well. The co2 system is
>Nutrafin's Natural Plant System which I purchased because I had read
>several posts recommending them (or at least the bubble
>counter/diffuser).
>
>As I understand it, co2 levels in the tank are directly related to pH
>and KH. I don't know the algorithm, nor do I particularly care what
>it is, but Chuck's planted aquarium page has a calculator that will
>figure out the ppm of co2 based on the numbers you input for pH and
>KH. Both his table and calculator give me a reading of about 3.8ppm
>of co2 in the water, which is exactly where I started off before
>adding co2.
>
>The water is not being agitated in any real way as to cause the co2 to
>escape. When leaving the end of the tube, the co2 bubbles are large,
>but gradually decrease in size as they travel up the diffuser (I take
>this as meaning the co2 is being dissolved). What do I need to do to
>increase the levels of co2 in the water?
>
>BTW, I get 1 bubble of co2 about every 3 seconds with about 4 bubbles
>in the counter at any given time.
>
>The tank is 10g with 15watts of light (will be upgraded shortly).
>
>Any help is greatly appreciated. I have enjoyed reading many of your
>posts already.
>
>NjF

My LFS replaced one an old Tetra CO2 cannister with one of these Nutra
Fin CO2 gizmo's.... the tank has been suffering ever since.

I can tell you that I am not impressed with this system at all. I
think the normal home made DIY systems are much more effective and
cost quite a bit less to construct and maintain.

Regards,

Ed
i-aquaria.com

[NjF]

On Tue, 17 Dec 2002 07:05:03 -0000, "Philip Ash"
> wrote:

>I cant comment as to why your tank is shoing no change, but i have had the
>same system on a 70 UKG tank for just over a week.
>I have seen a drop in PH of around .3-.5
>Are you sure about the accuracy/resolution of your PH test kit?
>I have two different kits here. Before CO2 both showed about the same 7.5
>Now one clearly shows 7.0 the other still looks like 7.5
>I think this is due to the limits in accuracy/resolution/perception of
>colour with the test kit.
>
>hth
>Phil.

I am most definitely not sure about the accuracy of my pH test kit.
Does any one have a recommendation as to one they have had good
experience with?

An update to my situation... I think I was able to get more dissolved
co2 into my tank by changing where the tube entered the diffuser.
This allowed the co2 to remain in contact with the water for a longer
period of time. Since then it appears that the pH level in my tank
dropped from 7.8 to about 7.2 or so. These are very unofficial as I
did not have my girlfriend to confirm (I am colorblind and the slight
changes in color are very hard for me to make out). However the water
does look slightly more green than blue. :) If I am right, that would
put co2 levels at about 15 ppm, a much more acceptable level. Thanks
for the suggestions.

NjF

[STEVE KREUTZER]

I also thought it was kind of silly to buy the Nutrafin system instead of a
DIY. But, I saw the diffuser for $12 in the lfs (you can get it for $10
online) and bought it. I made my own yeast bottle and use my own yeast and
sugar. I have had good results and it is fun to look at.

<Ed> wrote in message ...
> On Tue, 17 Dec 2002 04:16:08 GMT, NjF > wrote:
>
> >Since you were so helpful answering my last question, here is another
> >for the experts.
> >
> >Before setting up the tank I tested tap water for pH, KH, and GH (7.8,
> >8dKH, 17dGH).
> >
> >After running for a couple of weeks with injected CO2 pH remains
> >stable at 7.8 with KH and GH not changing as well. The co2 system is
> >Nutrafin's Natural Plant System which I purchased because I had read
> >several posts recommending them (or at least the bubble
> >counter/diffuser).
> >
> >As I understand it, co2 levels in the tank are directly related to pH
> >and KH. I don't know the algorithm, nor do I particularly care what
> >it is, but Chuck's planted aquarium page has a calculator that will
> >figure out the ppm of co2 based on the numbers you input for pH and
> >KH. Both his table and calculator give me a reading of about 3.8ppm
> >of co2 in the water, which is exactly where I started off before
> >adding co2.
> >
> >The water is not being agitated in any real way as to cause the co2 to
> >escape. When leaving the end of the tube, the co2 bubbles are large,
> >but gradually decrease in size as they travel up the diffuser (I take
> >this as meaning the co2 is being dissolved). What do I need to do to
> >increase the levels of co2 in the water?
> >
> >BTW, I get 1 bubble of co2 about every 3 seconds with about 4 bubbles
> >in the counter at any given time.
> >
> >The tank is 10g with 15watts of light (will be upgraded shortly).
> >
> >Any help is greatly appreciated. I have enjoyed reading many of your
> >posts already.
> >
> >NjF
>
> My LFS replaced one an old Tetra CO2 cannister with one of these Nutra
> Fin CO2 gizmo's.... the tank has been suffering ever since.
>
> I can tell you that I am not impressed with this system at all. I
> think the normal home made DIY systems are much more effective and
> cost quite a bit less to construct and maintain.
>
> Regards,
>
> Ed
> i-aquaria.com
>
>

[NjF]

A DIY system is fine and I was planning on doing so, but I got the
entire Nutrafin system for only $15. I think it looks a lot better
than most DIY systems. I don't use Nutrafin's yeast and stabilizer
packets. I use my own. Regardless, it works well for me, and for the
price, I can't complain.

I little more info though... I let some water sit out for some time
and than ran another pH test. This time my tap water had a pH of
about 8.4.

NjF

On Tue, 17 Dec 2002 16:58:34 GMT, "STEVE KREUTZER"
> wrote:

>I also thought it was kind of silly to buy the Nutrafin system instead of a
>DIY. But, I saw the diffuser for $12 in the lfs (you can get it for $10
>online) and bought it. I made my own yeast bottle and use my own yeast and
>sugar. I have had good results and it is fun to look at.
>
><Ed> wrote in message ...
>> On Tue, 17 Dec 2002 04:16:08 GMT, NjF > wrote:
>>
>> >Since you were so helpful answering my last question, here is another
>> >for the experts.
>> >
>> >Before setting up the tank I tested tap water for pH, KH, and GH (7.8,
>> >8dKH, 17dGH).
>> >
>> >After running for a couple of weeks with injected CO2 pH remains
>> >stable at 7.8 with KH and GH not changing as well. The co2 system is
>> >Nutrafin's Natural Plant System which I purchased because I had read
>> >several posts recommending them (or at least the bubble
>> >counter/diffuser).
>> >
>> >As I understand it, co2 levels in the tank are directly related to pH
>> >and KH. I don't know the algorithm, nor do I particularly care what
>> >it is, but Chuck's planted aquarium page has a calculator that will
>> >figure out the ppm of co2 based on the numbers you input for pH and
>> >KH. Both his table and calculator give me a reading of about 3.8ppm
>> >of co2 in the water, which is exactly where I started off before
>> >adding co2.
>> >
>> >The water is not being agitated in any real way as to cause the co2 to
>> >escape. When leaving the end of the tube, the co2 bubbles are large,
>> >but gradually decrease in size as they travel up the diffuser (I take
>> >this as meaning the co2 is being dissolved). What do I need to do to
>> >increase the levels of co2 in the water?
>> >
>> >BTW, I get 1 bubble of co2 about every 3 seconds with about 4 bubbles
>> >in the counter at any given time.
>> >
>> >The tank is 10g with 15watts of light (will be upgraded shortly).
>> >
>> >Any help is greatly appreciated. I have enjoyed reading many of your
>> >posts already.
>> >
>> >NjF
>>
>> My LFS replaced one an old Tetra CO2 cannister with one of these Nutra
>> Fin CO2 gizmo's.... the tank has been suffering ever since.
>>
>> I can tell you that I am not impressed with this system at all. I
>> think the normal home made DIY systems are much more effective and
>> cost quite a bit less to construct and maintain.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Ed
>> i-aquaria.com
>>
>>
>

[NjF]

Sugar to the first line of the cannister, add a tsp of champaign
yeast, and because my water is rather hard, leave out the baking soda.
The current bottle I am on has lasted over two 1/2 weeks and does not
appear to be slowing down.

NjF

On Thu, 19 Dec 2002 01:45:56 -0000, "Philip Ash"
> wrote:

>
>"NjF" > wrote in message
...
>> A DIY system is fine and I was planning on doing so, but I got the
>> entire Nutrafin system for only $15. I think it looks a lot better
>> than most DIY systems. I don't use Nutrafin's yeast and stabilizer
>> packets. I use my own. Regardless, it works well for me, and for the
>> price, I can't complain.
>>
>> I little more info though... I let some water sit out for some time
>> and than ran another pH test. This time my tap water had a pH of
>> about 8.4.
>>
>> NjF
>
>
>What recipe and type of yeast do you use?
>
>Phil.
>

[NjF]

A LFS in my area was selling them for about $27, but one of them had
the wrong price tag of $15. The owner gave it to me for that price
because I had spoken to him on several occasions and because I buy
most of my equipment from him. Nice guy... would 've paid the $27.

NjF

On Thu, 19 Dec 2002 01:25:33 GMT, "STEVE KREUTZER"
> wrote:

>Where did you get it for $15?
>
>"NjF" > wrote in message
...
>> A DIY system is fine and I was planning on doing so, but I got the
>> entire Nutrafin system for only $15. I think it looks a lot better
>> than most DIY systems. I don't use Nutrafin's yeast and stabilizer
>> packets. I use my own. Regardless, it works well for me, and for the
>> price, I can't complain.
>>
>> I little more info though... I let some water sit out for some time
>> and than ran another pH test. This time my tap water had a pH of
>> about 8.4.
>>
>> NjF
>>