Bare Bones RO Unit

[Mike]

I am evaluating RO units and would like some help in choosing between Kent
Marine's Bare Bones Unit and their 3 stage Hi S units. My tap water is high
pH (8) and high GH (12). My objective is to lower the hardness and pH so
that I can raise and breed apistogrammas and blue rams. Thanks in advance
for any help.

[Zor]

What I did was get a Culligan drinking water system. This
generates around 30 gallons/day of RO water. Makes great
coffee, too. If I'm not mistaken, it cost about $300.

Mike wrote:

> I am evaluating RO units and would like some help in choosing between Kent
> Marine's Bare Bones Unit and their 3 stage Hi S units. My tap water is high
> pH (8) and high GH (12). My objective is to lower the hardness and pH so
> that I can raise and breed apistogrammas and blue rams. Thanks in advance
> for any help.
>
>
>

[Charles]

On Sun, 09 Mar 2003 03:04:39 GMT, "Mike" >
wrote:

>I am evaluating RO units and would like some help in choosing between Kent
>Marine's Bare Bones Unit and their 3 stage Hi S units. My tap water is high
>pH (8) and high GH (12). My objective is to lower the hardness and pH so
>that I can raise and breed apistogrammas and blue rams. Thanks in advance
>for any help.
>
For what you are talking about, I'd go with the bare bones system.
It's listed at about $ 80 US, the three stage unit about $220. that
makes a difference to me. The bare bones unit will give you water
that is too pure for fish, you will need to mix it partially with tap
water or replacement minerals. I don't see a need to get the
ultra-pure water that the three stage unit will give you.


_

- Charles
-
-does not play well with others

[Buddy]

Some driftwood may do the trick a lot cheaper unless the filtered
water would benifit more than just the fish.

On Sun, 09 Mar 2003 03:04:39 GMT, "Mike" >
wrote:

>I am evaluating RO units and would like some help in choosing between Kent
>Marine's Bare Bones Unit and their 3 stage Hi S units. My tap water is high
>pH (8) and high GH (12). My objective is to lower the hardness and pH so
>that I can raise and breed apistogrammas and blue rams. Thanks in advance
>for any help.
>

[Marksfish]

"Buddy" > wrote in message
...
> Some driftwood may do the trick a lot cheaper unless the filtered
> water would benifit more than just the fish.
>
Or even peat!

Regards

Mark
www.marksfish.f9.co.uk

[KEITH JENNINGS]

"Marksfish" > wrote in message
news:2EEaa.11488$Lq.912013@stones...
>
> "Buddy" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Some driftwood may do the trick a lot cheaper unless the filtered
> > water would benifit more than just the fish.
> >
> Or even peat!
>
> Regards
>
> Mark
> www.marksfish.f9.co.uk
>
>

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think I read somewhere that organic materials
like wood or peat lower the pH of the water by leaching mild acids into the
water. This will lower the pH , but it doesn't change the gh / kh . If these
materials don't absorb minerals , they would actually INCREASE the total
dissolved solids ( TDS ) .

Again , I may be wrong . If so , please explain why ....

Keith J.

[ED KLINE]

"Mike" > wrote in message
. ..
: I am evaluating RO units and would like some help in choosing between
Kent
: Marine's Bare Bones Unit and their 3 stage Hi S units. My tap water
is high
: pH (8) and high GH (12). My objective is to lower the hardness and pH
so
: that I can raise and breed apistogrammas and blue rams. Thanks in
advance
: for any help.

I have a 10 gpd unit and I think it works well. I doese not lower the
ph much though.

[Marksfish]

> Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think I read somewhere that organic
materials
> like wood or peat lower the pH of the water by leaching mild acids into
the
> water. This will lower the pH , but it doesn't change the gh / kh . If
these
> materials don't absorb minerals , they would actually INCREASE the total
> dissolved solids ( TDS ) .
>
> Again , I may be wrong . If so , please explain why ....

Indeed, peat does work by leaching tannins into the water, thus acidifying
the water and also depleting the KH content of the water, making it softer.
Dependent on the type of peat used (I use Irish moss peat), the pH is
dropped from a pH of over 8 to 5.5 and the KH drops from 13 to a respectable
3. The colouring, although not to everyone's liking induces certain fish to
spawn and also brings out a more intense colouration in the fish. I have
also found the tannins to be beneficial in the control of algae.

Regards

Mark
www.marksfish.f9.co.uk

[Iain Miller]

> > Again , I may be wrong . If so , please explain why ....
>
> Indeed, peat does work by leaching tannins into the water, thus acidifying
> the water and also depleting the KH content of the water, making it
softer.
> Dependent on the type of peat used (I use Irish moss peat), the pH is
> dropped from a pH of over 8 to 5.5 and the KH drops from 13 to a
respectable
> 3. The colouring, although not to everyone's liking induces certain fish
to
> spawn and also brings out a more intense colouration in the fish. I have
> also found the tannins to be beneficial in the control of algae.

Not quite 100% right (he says to the man from whom he got the idea to filter
through peat in the first place!)

A Kh of 3 does not give a sustainable Ph of 5.5. After running through the
peat what I find is that if you look at the KH/PH relationship something is
amiss & the answer is that in going through the peat the water absorbs
massive amounts of CO2. This will come back out over time (fairly quickly)
so that water with a Kh of 3 will eventually settle to a Ph of about 7.5 or
so. Kh of 3 & Ph of 5.5 indicates a CO2 content of around 300ppm by my
calculations (!) whereas a "normal" concentration would be around 3ppm.

I also find that filtering through peat does lower the GH of my water - not
quite sure how its doing that but it does.

My tap water has a KH of around 9 degrees & a Gh of around 15

After its been through my peat filtering system it ends up at a Kh of 5 and
a GH of 9.5-10. A Kh of 5 gives me a Ph of around 7.8 which I then reduce in
my tank to 6.8 via CO2 injection (bottled gas system). I run the water
through the system till I get the Kh I'm looking for & then stop it - I can
set the Kh anywhere I like basically - it just depends on how long I leave
the thing running. As far as the colouration of the water is concerned,
after I've done the peat filtering bit I still have 40-50ppm of Nitrates in
my water (cos that's what comes out my tap) so I bought a Nitragon
Nitrate/Phosphate filter and I pump the water through that - a side effect
is that it removes almost all the colouration (and the Nitrates
obviously!). The Nitragon is rechargeable via dishwasher salt solution run
through it in reverse.

My pair of Dutch Rams are laying eggs in the tank (again!!) as I write.

Pictures of the contraption I use to do my peat filtering are on Mark's web
site......

hope that helps,

I.

[Mark Trueman]

"Iain Miller" > wrote in message >...
> > > Again , I may be wrong . If so , please explain why ....
> >
> > Indeed, peat does work by leaching tannins into the water, thus acidifying
> > the water and also depleting the KH content of the water, making it
> softer.
> > Dependent on the type of peat used (I use Irish moss peat), the pH is
> > dropped from a pH of over 8 to 5.5 and the KH drops from 13 to a
> respectable
> > 3. The colouring, although not to everyone's liking induces certain fish
> to
> > spawn and also brings out a more intense colouration in the fish. I have
> > also found the tannins to be beneficial in the control of algae.
>
> Not quite 100% right (he says to the man from whom he got the idea to filter
> through peat in the first place!)
>
> A Kh of 3 does not give a sustainable Ph of 5.5. After running through the
> peat what I find is that if you look at the KH/PH relationship something is
> amiss & the answer is that in going through the peat the water absorbs
> massive amounts of CO2. This will come back out over time (fairly quickly)
> so that water with a Kh of 3 will eventually settle to a Ph of about 7.5 or
> so. Kh of 3 & Ph of 5.5 indicates a CO2 content of around 300ppm by my
> calculations (!) whereas a "normal" concentration would be around 3ppm.
>
> I also find that filtering through peat does lower the GH of my water - not
> quite sure how its doing that but it does.
>
> My tap water has a KH of around 9 degrees & a Gh of around 15
>
> After its been through my peat filtering system it ends up at a Kh of 5 and
> a GH of 9.5-10. A Kh of 5 gives me a Ph of around 7.8 which I then reduce in
> my tank to 6.8 via CO2 injection (bottled gas system). I run the water
> through the system till I get the Kh I'm looking for & then stop it - I can
> set the Kh anywhere I like basically - it just depends on how long I leave
> the thing running. As far as the colouration of the water is concerned,
> after I've done the peat filtering bit I still have 40-50ppm of Nitrates in
> my water (cos that's what comes out my tap) so I bought a Nitragon
> Nitrate/Phosphate filter and I pump the water through that - a side effect
> is that it removes almost all the colouration (and the Nitrates
> obviously!). The Nitragon is rechargeable via dishwasher salt solution run
> through it in reverse.
>
> My pair of Dutch Rams are laying eggs in the tank (again!!) as I write.
>
> Pictures of the contraption I use to do my peat filtering are on Mark's web
> site......
>
> hope that helps,
>
> I.
I used to use a nitragon and found that not only did it lower the
nitrates and phosphates, it seemed to mess up my hardness readings as
well. my water before it went through the unit had a ph of 8.2, when
it came out it was just over 7. Either it put a lot of co2 in the
water or it lowered my kh. I didnt have a kh test kit in those days so
i couldnt confirm the latter.

Mark

[Iain Miller]

"Mark Trueman" > wrote in message
m...
> "Iain Miller" > wrote in message
>...
> > > > Again , I may be wrong . If so , please explain why ....
> > >
> > > Indeed, peat does work by leaching tannins into the water, thus
acidifying
> > > the water and also depleting the KH content of the water, making it
> > softer.
> > > Dependent on the type of peat used (I use Irish moss peat), the pH is
> > > dropped from a pH of over 8 to 5.5 and the KH drops from 13 to a
> > respectable
> > > 3. The colouring, although not to everyone's liking induces certain
fish
> > to
> > > spawn and also brings out a more intense colouration in the fish. I
have
> > > also found the tannins to be beneficial in the control of algae.
> >
> > Not quite 100% right (he says to the man from whom he got the idea to
filter
> > through peat in the first place!)
> >
> > A Kh of 3 does not give a sustainable Ph of 5.5. After running through
the
> > peat what I find is that if you look at the KH/PH relationship something
is
> > amiss & the answer is that in going through the peat the water absorbs
> > massive amounts of CO2. This will come back out over time (fairly
quickly)
> > so that water with a Kh of 3 will eventually settle to a Ph of about 7.5
or
> > so. Kh of 3 & Ph of 5.5 indicates a CO2 content of around 300ppm by my
> > calculations (!) whereas a "normal" concentration would be around 3ppm.
> >
> > I also find that filtering through peat does lower the GH of my water -
not
> > quite sure how its doing that but it does.
> >
> > My tap water has a KH of around 9 degrees & a Gh of around 15
> >
> > After its been through my peat filtering system it ends up at a Kh of 5
and
> > a GH of 9.5-10. A Kh of 5 gives me a Ph of around 7.8 which I then
reduce in
> > my tank to 6.8 via CO2 injection (bottled gas system). I run the water
> > through the system till I get the Kh I'm looking for & then stop it - I
can
> > set the Kh anywhere I like basically - it just depends on how long I
leave
> > the thing running. As far as the colouration of the water is concerned,
> > after I've done the peat filtering bit I still have 40-50ppm of Nitrates
in
> > my water (cos that's what comes out my tap) so I bought a Nitragon
> > Nitrate/Phosphate filter and I pump the water through that - a side
effect
> > is that it removes almost all the colouration (and the Nitrates
> > obviously!). The Nitragon is rechargeable via dishwasher salt solution
run
> > through it in reverse.
> >
> > My pair of Dutch Rams are laying eggs in the tank (again!!) as I write.
> >
> > Pictures of the contraption I use to do my peat filtering are on Mark's
web
> > site......
> >
> > hope that helps,
> >
> > I.
> I used to use a nitragon and found that not only did it lower the
> nitrates and phosphates, it seemed to mess up my hardness readings as
> well. my water before it went through the unit had a ph of 8.2, when
> it came out it was just over 7. Either it put a lot of co2 in the
> water or it lowered my kh. I didnt have a kh test kit in those days so
> i couldnt confirm the latter.

I've seen it go the other way a bit (i.e. Kh & so Ph goes up a bit after
using it) but there is no significant change....