On Tue, 22 Jul 2008 12:24:13 -0500, Jangchub wrote:

On Tue, 22 Jul 2008 11:34:46 -0400, "Paul J. Dudley"
wrote:

On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 19:27:39 -0700, Sheldon wrote:

"Paul J. Dudley" wrote:
Last month ( mid June ) I had applied Seven dust to my grapevine
due to Japanese Beatle infestation. I applied by hand ( gloved ).
I grabbed a handfull at a time and just tossed it across the whole
of the foliage and grape clusters.

Didn't you read the directions... that's the dumbest method for
applying Sevin.


The dust was given to me in a mason jar by my girlfriends father,
complete with no instructions. Just toss it across the whole of the
vine like he does his peach trees. So that is what I did.

If you don't have anything more constructive to offer than your
sarcastic critisism, please keep it to yourself.

= Paul =

Your girlfriends father is a moron.

Gee Vic, so critical.. Just let it rest. Take a friggin' midolPMS or two.

Ima

"The good Lord ruined some perfectly good assholes
when he put teeth in some peoples heads"

On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 15:18:03 -0400, Paul J. Dudley wrote:

Last month ( mid June ) I had applied Seven dust to my grapevine
due to Japanese Beatle infestation. I applied by hand ( gloved ).
I grabbed a handfull at a time and just tossed it across the whole
of the foliage and grape clusters. Here it is mid July and I still
see some rather rich deposits of the dust sitting on the clusters.
As these grapes ( type unknown ) are reaching ripeness they will
no doubt be harvested within the next 2 weeks to make wine. Will
the residual Seven dust pose any health threats at this point ? I've
tried rinsing with a garden hose but to no avail. It is rather "caked"
in some areas. There might have been some moisture on the grapes
when I slung the seven dust causing it to do so.

TIA

Paul

Ok.. My neighbor uses Sevin dust all the time and swears by it. I
just paid her a visit to see if she had any and she has a bag of
GardenTech Sevin-5 - Ready to use 5% dust. Reading the instructions
on the back shows that the preharvest interval (number of days
between last application and harvest) for grapes is 7 days. I will
find out what brand/strength was given to me. In the meantime
I will write to GardenTech to see what they have to say and will
post their advice.

= Paul =

Paul J. Dudley wrote:

On Tue, 22 Jul 2008 12:22:28 -0500, Jangchub
wrote:

On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 20:55:20 -0400, "Paul J.
Dudley" wrote:

On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 16:28:56 -0500, Jangchub
wrote:

On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 15:18:03 -0400, "Paul J.
Dudley" wrote:

Last month ( mid June ) I had applied Seven
dust to my grapevine
due to Japanese Beatle infestation. I applied
by hand ( gloved ). I grabbed a handfull at a
time and just tossed it across the whole of
the foliage and grape clusters. Here it is
mid July and I still see some rather rich
deposits of the dust sitting on the clusters.
As these grapes ( type unknown ) are reaching
ripeness they will no doubt be harvested
within the next 2 weeks to make wine. Will
the residual Seven dust pose any health
threats at this point ? I've tried rinsing
with a garden hose but to no avail. It is
rather "caked" in some areas. There might
have been some moisture on the grapes when I
slung the seven dust causing it to do so.

TIA

Paul

I wouldn't eat them.

I hadn't planned on eating them. I wish to
make wine of them. I might
try washing the binches with mild soapy water
and see how they look. Hopefully I can get it
(Sevin) gone... But if'n that don't do it, I
will trash the grapes and not take a chance.

= Paul =

Okay Paul, if it can systemically enter your
skin and cause harmful reactions, don't you
know it will also be systemic on the cell walls
of grapes?

Yes. But I was hoping that a 6 week duration
might be long enough for
the dust to break down in toxicity. My neighbor
puts the stuff on all her greens ( collard,
cabbage, turnip etc ). She pounces it on with
an old nylon stocking. In fact, she does the
same with her corn (at the silk end of the ear
just as soon as soon as silk appears).

I know one thing. I'll never use Sevin on my
grapes again.

Don't ever say never. A lot if not most of the
vineyards around here (Northern Virginia /
Central Maryland Area - including other areas in
the Mid Atlantic) use Sevin on their vineyards.

Most commercial growers apply with an air blast
sprayer so it goes EVERYWHERE. The concentration
you used sounds excessive. I still recommend you
contact the manufacturer and see what they say.
I would still say you can use it (the sevin you
mix with water) and spray the top of your canopy
with a back pack sprayer.

What kind of grapes are you growing and where do
you live? The earliest any grapes are ready for
harvest around here are some of the whites and
some of them are ready around the 2nd week in
September. The reds usually are harvested around
the end of September with Merlot being the first.
The Cabernet Sauvignon hang until mid to late
October. I am saying all this because you may
have a variety than can hang longer and thus let
nature wash off some of the residue.




I used to
use a Pyrethrin based pesticide ( Tiger Brand )
but haven't seen it at the store this year. It
breaks down rather quickly and most veggies can
be ingested within a week after it's use. The
Sevin was given to me and I tried it. I made a
mistake. All I want to know now is ( and I
thought that was clear ) has enough time passed
to degrade the dust enough or would it still be
hazardous ( ... and would washing them be of
any use ) .

In two weeks I will pick said grapes. I will
attempt to wash the bunches
by hand. Depending of that outcome, I will
either prepare them for wine or if washing
doesn't seem to remove the residue I will trash
those bunches that won't wash clean.

= Paul =

There is one other option. You can go ahead and
harvest, crush and make your wine and send it out
to a lab and have them analyze it for you. They
may even be able to tell you in advance what they
would recommend without even testing it and
charging you. Virginia Tech has a enology
program and a lab. You may want to give them a
call and state your problem.

http://www.fst.vt.edu/extension/enology/index.html

frinjdwelr wrote:


"Paul J. Dudley"
wrote in message
Okay Paul, if it can systemically enter your
skin and cause harmful reactions, don't you
know it will also be systemic on the cell
walls of grapes?

Yes. But I was hoping that a 6 week duration
might be long enough for
the dust to break down in toxicity. My neighbor
puts the stuff on all her greens ( collard,
cabbage, turnip etc ). She pounces it on with
an old nylon stocking. In fact, she does the
same with her corn (at the silk end of the ear
just as soon as soon as silk appears).

You got to be kidding. Have people still not
learned to have more respect for the environment
and themselves?

I know one thing. I'll never use Sevin on my
grapes again. I used to
use a Pyrethrin based pesticide ( Tiger Brand )
but haven't seen it at the store this year. It
breaks down rather quickly and most veggies can
be ingested within a week after it's use. The
Sevin was given to me and I tried it. I made a
mistake. All I want to know now is ( and I
thought that was clear ) has enough time passed
to degrade the dust enough or would it still be
hazardous ( ... and would washing them be of
any use ) .

In two weeks I will pick said grapes. I will
attempt to wash the bunches
by hand. Depending of that outcome, I will
either prepare them for wine or if washing
doesn't seem to remove the residue I will trash
those bunches that won't wash clean.

As someone else pointed out, the grapes will
have absorbed the Sevin. No way would I ever eat
them or use them in wine.

Unless you never drink wine, there is a VERY high
probability that you have drunk wine that was
grown using Sevin or Carbaryl 80 WP (liquid
Sevin)

Sounds like that was a
really expensive gift you got. Japanese beetles
are easily knocked into a bowl of water to drown
and sure when they're at peak you have to do it
every day but it still beats poison.

I have a backyard vineyard of 110 vines. I will
give you a glass of wine each time you come out
and drown them for me :-). I know a lot of
commercial vineyards around here that will make
you the same offer.

"Paul J. Dudley" wrote:
Last month ( mid June ) I had applied Seven dust to my grapevine
due to Japanese Beatle infestation. I applied by hand ( gloved ).
I grabbed a handfull at a time and just tossed it across the whole
of the foliage and grape clusters.

Didn't you read the directions... that's the dumbest method for
applying Sevin.


The dust was given to me in a mason jar by my girlfriends father,
complete with no instructions. Just toss it across the whole of the
vine like he does his peach trees. So that is what I did.


You'll probably take this as more sarcastic criticism, but stories like
this are why I'm not sure most people should be allowed to use other than
a flyswatter as a pesticide.

You accepted an unlabeled jar of unknown chemical of unknown concentration,
with no instructions, and you didn't know how to apply it.

How do you know it was carbaryl, and not, say, Paris green? Or maybe one
of the herbicides? Or flour?

Some day, a stunt like this is going to bite you badly. This might be
that.

Kay Lancaster wrote:


"Paul J. Dudley" wrote:
Last month ( mid June ) I had applied Seven
dust to my grapevine due to Japanese Beatle
infestation. I applied by hand ( gloved ). I
grabbed a handfull at a time and just tossed
it across the whole of the foliage and grape
clusters.

Didn't you read the directions... that's the
dumbest method for applying Sevin.


The dust was given to me in a mason jar by my
girlfriends father,
complete with no instructions. Just toss it
across the whole of the vine like he does his
peach trees. So that is what I did.


You'll probably take this as more sarcastic
criticism, but stories like this are why I'm not
sure most people should be allowed to use other
than a flyswatter as a pesticide.

You accepted an unlabeled jar of unknown
chemical of unknown concentration,
with no instructions, and you didn't know how
to apply it.

How do you know it was carbaryl, and not, say,
Paris green? Or maybe one
of the herbicides? Or flour?

Some day, a stunt like this is going to bite you
badly. This might be that.

Why don't you offer constructive advice instead of
bashing. I would be willing to bet YOU are
equally guilty of being ignorant on a specific
topic equally as hazardous or even more so.

Charlie wrote:

On Tue, 22 Jul 2008 11:34:46 -0400, "Paul J.
Dudley" wrote:

On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 19:27:39 -0700, Sheldon
wrote:

"Paul J. Dudley" wrote:
Last month ( mid June ) I had applied Seven
dust to my grapevine due to Japanese Beatle
infestation. I applied by hand ( gloved ). I
grabbed a handfull at a time and just tossed
it across the whole of the foliage and grape
clusters.

Didn't you read the directions... that's the
dumbest method for applying Sevin.


The dust was given to me in a mason jar by my
girlfriends father,
complete with no instructions. Just toss it
across the whole of the vine like he does his
peach trees. So that is what I did.

If you don't have anything more constructive
to offer than your
sarcastic critisism, please keep it to
yourself.

= Paul =

Sheesh.....besides poisoning our world, you are
too effing careless to effectively use even a
sockpuppet, Ima Paul Dudley Goodguy.

I'm sure as hell glad you aren't my neighbor,
Poisoner of Bees, Spiders, Butterflies and Other
Helpful and Harmless Living Creatures.....such
as your Neighbors!!

Charlie

Get a life, Charlie. Offer CONSTRUCTIVE advice or
join the ranks of the "holier than thou" For
example, there are a LOT of bee keepers who use
chemicals every bit as risky as the OP used.

Has ANY one of you doom and gloomers ever given
the advice such as CONTACT YOUR LOCAL
AGRICULTURE EXTENSION AGENT and ask for THEIR
advice and opinion. Of course not. You have
your own agenda.

In article , Charlie wrote:

Hmmm....I wonder how wine was produced before the advent of carbaryl?

It was pretty good when they used amphoras and fumarias. But then they
severed the wine in these very pretty lead glazed cups and a
Gothic night descended on Europe. Things (flavor) started looking
up again in the mid-1600s when cork stoppers came into use. In the
mean, time beer and wine saved Europe from the main diseases of
ground water. The same function that tea served in the East.

Paul should check with the nearest ag consultant but my understanding is
that nothing harmful to man can survive fermentation. All the same,
you've been a naughty boy Paul. I know it wasn't your intent to
bring about the downfall of Western Civilization (such as it is).
You've got to be careful about unintended consequences. See that
this doesn't happen again.
--

Billy
Bush and Pelosi Behind Bars
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KVTf...ef=patrick.net
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0aEo...eature=related

In article ,
Jangchub wrote:

On Tue, 22 Jul 2008 16:32:20 -0400, "Paul E. Lehmann"
wrote:

really expensive gift you got. Japanese beetles
are easily knocked into a bowl of water to drown
and sure when they're at peak you have to do it
every day but it still beats poison.

I have a backyard vineyard of 110 vines. I will
give you a glass of wine each time you come out
and drown them for me :-). I know a lot of
frinjdwelr wrote:


"Paul J. Dudley"
wrote in message
Okay Paul, if it can systemically enter your
skin and cause harmful reactions, don't you
know it will also be systemic on the cell
walls of grapes?

Yes. But I was hoping that a 6 week duration
might be long enough for
the dust to break down in toxicity. My neighbor
puts the stuff on all her greens ( collard,
cabbage, turnip etc ). She pounces it on with
an old nylon stocking. In fact, she does the

Unless you never drink wine, there is a VERY high
probability that you have drunk wine that was
grown using Sevin or Carbaryl 80 WP (liquid
Sevin)

Sounds like that was a commercial vineyards around here that will make
you the same offer.

Gallo wine is and has been a completely certified organic product for
decades.

Eeeeeh. The good news: Organic wine is a growing trend. Gallo, the
largest U.S. winemaker with 33% market share, currently has 2,700 of its
9,000 total acreage organically certified. Bad news: Gallo buys 2/3 of
California grapes, mostly from the bulk wine area of the "Central Vally".
Most Gallo wine isn't certified organic. Which isn't to say that
it isn't drinkable. Most of it is simply "California" (anywhere
in California) not necessarily one of the premium, cooler, wine
growing regions like North Coast or Central Coast or Alexander
Valley or Edna Valley.

The last I checked (2003) the following local wineries were
organic to some extent.

The following wineries have been ranked as: all organic vineyard and no
sulfites wines, all organic vineyard wines, bio-dynamic vineyards, and
organic vineyards

In order for a wine to qualify as organic, it must have just 10 parts
(or fewer) per million sulfites.
-----------------------------------------------
All organic vineyard and no sulfites wines

H. Coturri & Sons LTD.
Visits by appointment
All wines made from organically-grown grapes, with no sulfites or other
preservatives added.
P.O. Box 396 6725 Enterprise Rd.,
Glen Ellen, CA 95442,
Telephone: (707) 525-9126
Fax707)542-8039
e-mail:
web site - http://www.coturriwinery.com/
Founded 1979
Wines: Albarello, Merlot, Pinot Noir, Cabernet Sauvignon, Cabernet
Sauvignon/Sangiovese, Sangiovese, Zinfandel

Frey Vineyards
All wines made from organically-grown grapes, with no sulfites added.
Tastings by appointment only
14000 Tomki Rd,
Redwood Valley
CA 95470
Tel: 707.485.5177, 1.800.760.3739,
Fax: 707.485.7875
web site - www.freywine.com
Email:
Tastings by appointment only.
Chardonnay, Sauvignon Blanc,Gewurztraminer, Natural White, Blush,
Sauvignon Blanc, Zinfandel, Cabernet Sauvignon, Syrah, Petite Sirah,
Pinot, Merlot, Natural Red

other wineries that produce wines without sulfites:

Orleans Hill Vintners Association,
P.O. Box 1254,
Woodland, CA 95776
Tel: (530) 661-6538
FAX: (530) 661-1864
Founded 1980


La Rocca Vineyards,
P.O. Box 541,
Forest Ranch, CA 95942
Winery: 12360Doe Mill Rd.,
Forest Ranch, CA 95942
Tel: (530) 899-9463, (800) 808-9463,
Fax: (530) 894-7268
e-mail:
web site: www.aroccavineyards.com
Founded 1984

Vinatura,
819 J Street,
Arcata, CA 95501
Tel.: (707) 822-7272

Honeyrun
2309 Park Ave.,
Chico, CA 95928
Phone: (530) 345-6405 Fax: (530) 894-6639

The Organic Wine Works/Hallcrest Vineyards
379 Felton Empire Rd.,
Felton, CA 95018
Phone: (408) 335-4441 or (800) 699-9463
Fax: (408) 335-4450
Hours: Daily 11am-5:30pm

----------------------
All organic vineyard wines

Fetzer Vineyards/Bonterra Vineyards
All Bonterra wines made from organically-grown, CCOF-certified grapes
13601 Eastside Rd.,
Hopland, CA 95449
Tel.: 800.846.8637 ext. 604, or 707.744.7600 ext. 604
e-mail from web site
web site - http://www.fetzer.com/
Wines: Chardonnay, Cabernet Sauvignon, Syrah, Viognier, Sangiovese

Frog's Leap
All wines made from organically-grown, CCOF-certified grapes
P.O. Box 189,
8815 Conn Creek Road,
Rutherford CA 94573
Tel: (800) 959-4704 or (707) 963-4704
Fax: (707) 963-0242
e-mail:
web site - http://www.frogsleap.com/
Merlot, Zinfandel, Chardonnay, Leapfrogsmilch, Sauvignon Blanc, Cabernet
Sauvignon, Rutherford (Cabernet Sauvignon/Cabernet Franc )

Lolonis Winery
(No chemical pesticides since 1956.)
All wines made from organically-grown, CCOF-certified grapes
Mailing Address:
1904 Olympic Blvd., Ste. 8A,
Walnut Creek,
CA 94596
Winery:
1905 Road D,
Redwood Valley, CA
Tel: Sales & Mktg. Off. (510) 938-8066
Fax: (510) 938-8069
e-mail:
web site - : www.lolonis.com/
Founded 1962
Wines: Chardonnay, Sauvignon Blanc, Viognier, Merlot, Pinot Noir,
Cabernet Sauvignon, Valdiguie, Petit Syrah, Zinfandel, Cabernet Franc

Madonna Estate Mont St. John
All wines made from organically-grown, CCOF-certified grapes
5400 Old Sonoma Rd.
Napa,
CA 94559
Tel: (707) 255-8864
Fax (707) 257-2778
e-mail:
web site - http://www.montstjohn.com/
Founded 1977
Wines: Chardonnay, Pinot Noir, Merlot, Cabernet Sauvignon, Pinot Grigio,
Johannisberg Riesling, Gewurztraminer and Muscat di Canelli

Napa Wine Company
All wines made from organically-grown, CCOF-certified grapes
Tastings are available by appointment
P.O. Box 434
7830 - 40 St. Helena Hwy, Oakville,
Ca 94562
Tel: (800) 848-9630 or (707) 944-1710
e-mail: .
web site - http://www.napawineco.com/
Wines: Sauvignon Blanc, Pinot Blanc, Cabernet Sauvignon

Vigil Vineyards
Estate Reserve Terra Vin is made from organically-grown, CCOF-certified
grapes
3340 Hwy. 128,
Calistoga
CA 94515
Tel: (707) 942-2900
e-mail:
web site - http://www.vigilwine.com
Wine: Estate Reserve Terra Vin (Zinfandel/Carignan/Refosco)

Yorkville Cellars
All wines made from organically-grown, CCOF-certified grapes
5701 Highway 128
P.O. Box Three
Yorkville (population 146),
CA 95494 USA
Tel: 707.894.9177
Fax: 707.894.2426
e-mail:
web site - http://www.yorkville-cellars.com/
Wine: Sauvignon Blanc, Semillon, Eleanor of Aquitaine
(Semillon/Sauvignon Blanc), Cabernet Franc, Malbec, Petit Verdot,
Merlot, Cabernet Sauvignon, Richard the Lion-Heart (Cabernet
Franc/Malbec/Petit Verdot/Merlot/Cabernet Sauvignon)

---------------------------------------------------------------

Bio-dynamic vineyards

Benziger Family Winery and Everett Ridge Vineyard's are now using
biodynamic farming practices. Benziger Family Winery at their Sonoma
Mountain Estate Vineyards and all of Everett Ridge Vineyard's grapes.
Everett Ridge Vineyards were certified organic from CCOF in 1999.
Inquire at the wineries to determine if blending from non-organic
vineyards occurred.

Benziger Family Winery
1883 London Ranch Rd.
Glen Ellen,
CA 95442
(707) 935 - 3000 - voice
(707) 935 - 3016 - fax
e-mail:
web site - http://www.benziger.com/index.shtml

Everett Ridge Vineyards and Winery
435 West Dry Creek Road,
Healdsburg CA 95448
Tel: 707-433-1637
Fax 707-433-7024
e-mail:
web site - http://www.everettridge.com/
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Organic Vineyards

The following wineries have, in total or in part, organic vineyards.
This however does not mean that grapes from non-organic vineyards were
not blended into their wines. Inquire at the wineries.

Davis Bynum Winery
8075 Westside Road
Healdsburg, California 95448
Tasting Room: (800) 826-1073
Tel: (707) 433-2611
Fax: (707) 433-4309
e-mail:
web site - http://www.davisbynum.com/


Kenwood Vineyards
P.O. Box 447
Kenwood, CA 95452
Tel: (707) 833-5891
Fax: (707) 833-1146
e-mail:
web site - http://www.kenwoodvineyards.com/
WE'RE CERTIFIED ORGANIC! March 14, 1996
Three of Kenwood's vineyards are certified organic: Kenwood
Estate Vineyard, Yulupa Vineyard, and Upper Weise
Kenwood wines are bottled they are in a range of twenty-five to
thirty-five parts per million free sulfites.
--

Billy
Bush and Pelosi Behind Bars
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KVTf...ef=patrick.net
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0aEo...eature=related

Jangchub wrote:
On Tue, 22 Jul 2008 14:05:43 -0400, "Paul J. Dudley"
wrote:

Yes. But I was hoping that a 6 week duration might be long enough for
the dust to break down in toxicity. My neighbor puts the stuff on all her
greens ( collard, cabbage, turnip etc ). She pounces it on with an old
nylon stocking. In fact, she does the same with her corn (at the silk
end of the ear just as soon as soon as silk appears).

I know one thing. I'll never use Sevin on my grapes again. I used to
use a Pyrethrin based pesticide ( Tiger Brand ) but haven't seen it at
the store this year. It breaks down rather quickly and most veggies can
be ingested within a week after it's use. The Sevin was given to me
and I tried it. I made a mistake. All I want to know now is ( and I
thought that was clear ) has enough time passed to degrade the dust
enough or would it still be hazardous ( ... and would washing them be
of any use ) .

In two weeks I will pick said grapes. I will attempt to wash the bunches
by hand. Depending of that outcome, I will either prepare them for wine
or if washing doesn't seem to remove the residue I will trash those
bunches that won't wash clean.

= Paul =

There is no telling how long the active particles which entered the
cells will persist. It's not a matter of washing off what you can see
as dust or powder on the grapes themselves. Sevin can enter cells and
if it were me, which it wouldn't be due to the nature of my no
pesticides at all, I would not eat or use the grapes for anything.

A little story:

My neighbor had breast cancer and was a nine year survivor. She
planted some Mountain Laurels and bag worms appeared. If she asked me
first I'd have told her to use a simple pathogen called Bt. No harm
to anything but the worms.

However, her other neighbor who is an "agronimist" gave her Sevin in a
pump up sprayer. She read no label, and had no idea about what she
was spraying. She did not have her legs or arms covered and she
started to burn terribly and she jumped into my pool to get rid of
the stinging. Not one year later she relapsed and is now in stage
four, metasticized breast cancer, spread to her sternum and the lining
of her lungs. She goes to M.D. Anderson in Houston for treatment. She
hangs on by a thread. Did the Sevin do it? I don't know. However, I
will never use it. I'd give up the grapes and put them in the trash
so not even animals can eat them.

Your story about the neighbor getting burned has nothing to do with this
issue. Your neighbor did not take the proper precautions to cover
herself, and use a breathing mask.

The issue here is one of retention of the chemical. You have given no
evidence of your theory that Sevin penetrates the skin of the grape. I
don't believe that. Waiting several weeks after application should
elimanate the danger. The Sun and rain will burn and wash off the
chemical, plus it will naturally lose it's toxicity. He should check
with the manufacturers for confirmation, but I think he is ok with
Sevin. He can wash the fruit as he said to be extra sure.

Sherwin

Sheldon wrote:
"Paul J. Dudley" wrote:
�Last month ( mid June ) I had applied Seven dust to my grapevine
due to Japanese Beatle infestation. I applied by hand ( gloved ).
I grabbed a handfull at a time and just tossed it across the whole
of the foliage and grape clusters.

Didn't you read the directions... that's the dumbest method for
applying Sevin.


I know people who apply Sevin that way. They do it because it is
simpler than mixing up a batch for the sprayer. This is practical when
you have a small plant or area to treat. Does it say on the label that
applying the poweder is dangerous?

Sherwin

Jangchub wrote:
On Tue, 22 Jul 2008 19:04:13 -0400, "Paul E. Lehmann"
wrote:


Why don't you offer constructive advice instead of
bashing. I would be willing to bet YOU are
equally guilty of being ignorant on a specific
topic equally as hazardous or even more so.

It would seem an almost unanimous decision and opinion here that you
chuck the grapes you applied a very toxic poison to. Sevin is
advertised using lies, lies and more lies and people have been
gardening for decades, some professionally, some avidly, some used to
use these pesticides who no longer use them because they found out the
truth about them over the years.

Constructive as I can be without crawling on my hands and knees
begging:

Do NOT use these tainted grapes. Chalk it up to a big mistake,
period.

Yes, it's all a conspiracy. They are out to get us.

Sherwin

Charlie wrote:
On Tue, 22 Jul 2008 11:34:46 -0400, "Paul J. Dudley"
wrote:

On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 19:27:39 -0700, Sheldon wrote:

"Paul J. Dudley" wrote:
Last month ( mid June ) I had applied Seven dust to my grapevine
due to Japanese Beatle infestation. I applied by hand ( gloved ).
I grabbed a handfull at a time and just tossed it across the whole
of the foliage and grape clusters.
Didn't you read the directions... that's the dumbest method for
applying Sevin.

The dust was given to me in a mason jar by my girlfriends father,
complete with no instructions. Just toss it across the whole of the
vine like he does his peach trees. So that is what I did.

If you don't have anything more constructive to offer than your
sarcastic critisism, please keep it to yourself.

= Paul =

Sheesh.....besides poisoning our world, you are too effing careless to
effectively use even a sockpuppet, Ima Paul Dudley Goodguy.

I'm sure as hell glad you aren't my neighbor, Poisoner of Bees,
Spiders, Butterflies and Other Helpful and Harmless Living
Creatures.....such as your Neighbors!!

Charlie

A good friend of mine raises bees on his urban property (fairly
small) and has been spraying chemicals (wisely) for years. The bees
don's seem
to mind.

Sherwin

Jangchub wrote:
On Tue, 22 Jul 2008 19:09:58 -0400, "Paul E. Lehmann"
wrote:


Get a life, Charlie. Offer CONSTRUCTIVE advice or
join the ranks of the "holier than thou" For
example, there are a LOT of bee keepers who use
chemicals every bit as risky as the OP used.

Has ANY one of you doom and gloomers ever given
the advice such as CONTACT YOUR LOCAL
AGRICULTURE EXTENSION AGENT and ask for THEIR
advice and opinion. Of course not. You have
your own agenda.

You mean the Land Grant Universities who are paid by Monsanto, Dow
Elanco and Bayer to "test" and evaluate their latest carcinogens? NOT.

Yep, they are all out to get us.

Sherwin

On Tue, 22 Jul 2008 19:04:13 -0400, Paul E. Lehmann
wrote:

Kay Lancaster wrote:


"Paul J. Dudley" wrote:
Last month ( mid June ) I had applied Seven
dust to my grapevine due to Japanese Beatle
infestation. I applied by hand ( gloved ). I
grabbed a handfull at a time and just tossed
it across the whole of the foliage and grape
clusters.

Didn't you read the directions... that's the
dumbest method for applying Sevin.


The dust was given to me in a mason jar by my
girlfriends father,
complete with no instructions. Just toss it
across the whole of the vine like he does his
peach trees. So that is what I did.


You'll probably take this as more sarcastic
criticism, but stories like this are why I'm not
sure most people should be allowed to use other
than a flyswatter as a pesticide.

You accepted an unlabeled jar of unknown
chemical of unknown concentration,
with no instructions, and you didn't know how
to apply it.

How do you know it was carbaryl, and not, say,
Paris green? Or maybe one
of the herbicides? Or flour?

Some day, a stunt like this is going to bite you
badly. This might be that.

Why don't you offer constructive advice instead of
bashing. I would be willing to bet YOU are
equally guilty of being ignorant on a specific
topic equally as hazardous or even more so.

I did, Dippy, in my first post. If you're going to use a pesticide, make sure
you follow the label directions. No label. Mason jar.
This is playing chemical Russian Roulette.
And it's a violation of US federal law. And if this wasn't in the US, then
it's likely to have violated the laws of most other countries.

Not to mention the law of common sense: you don't keep toxic materials
in a food container. Especially not an unlabeled food container.

Learn from your mistakes. If you can.