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Old 10-09-2015, 04:53 PM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Tomato plant in a pot

I had an extra seedling this year that looked pretty healthy, so I put
some stones in a pot (it is a big pot and I didn't have enough spare
dirt to fill it, so I put eight or ten inches of dirt on top of the
stones and transplanted the seedling to the dirt.

The problem is that the water runs through the dirt and stones and out
the hole in the bottom of the pot, so every day the plant, while it has
been growing well, loses the structure of the leaves (it almost looks
dead) until I water it, when it regains its vitality and looks healthy
until the next day. And the early maturing tomatoes have rather
advanced end stage rot.

So I am looking for a way to solve the watering problem for next year.
I am thinking of removing the stones and filling the whole pot with good
dirt, and burying a bowl at the bottom of the pot, reasoning that when I
water, some water will filter into the bowl and keep the plant happy.
I've been told that standing water in the bottom of the pot is not a
good idea, but I grow my seedlings in dirt over a tray of water, and
they grow extensive roots in the water.

We are in a moderate climate, subject to freezing. The last vortex was
brutal here, killing many plants and trees (all the peach trees, for
example, were killed). But our garden seems to have survived. I had an
arborist look at my sweet cherry tree; I wanted it pruned, but he
recommended cutting it down. I pruned it myself (it is no longer a
pretty tree) and it survived. providing a bumper crop. Our pie cherries
also produced well, as did the strawberries and blueberries. The
vegetables have struggled, possibly because we had a lot of rain, so we
don't have ripe tomatoes yet, but plenty of beans, and the corn is
within days of being ready.
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Old 10-09-2015, 06:26 PM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Tomato plant in a pot

On 9/10/2015 7:53 AM, Not@home wrote:
I had an extra seedling this year that looked pretty healthy, so I put
some stones in a pot (it is a big pot and I didn't have enough spare
dirt to fill it, so I put eight or ten inches of dirt on top of the
stones and transplanted the seedling to the dirt.

The problem is that the water runs through the dirt and stones and out
the hole in the bottom of the pot, so every day the plant, while it has
been growing well, loses the structure of the leaves (it almost looks
dead) until I water it, when it regains its vitality and looks healthy
until the next day. And the early maturing tomatoes have rather
advanced end stage rot.

So I am looking for a way to solve the watering problem for next year.
I am thinking of removing the stones and filling the whole pot with good
dirt, and burying a bowl at the bottom of the pot, reasoning that when I
water, some water will filter into the bowl and keep the plant happy.
I've been told that standing water in the bottom of the pot is not a
good idea, but I grow my seedlings in dirt over a tray of water, and
they grow extensive roots in the water.

We are in a moderate climate, subject to freezing. The last vortex was
brutal here, killing many plants and trees (all the peach trees, for
example, were killed). But our garden seems to have survived. I had an
arborist look at my sweet cherry tree; I wanted it pruned, but he
recommended cutting it down. I pruned it myself (it is no longer a
pretty tree) and it survived. providing a bumper crop. Our pie cherries
also produced well, as did the strawberries and blueberries. The
vegetables have struggled, possibly because we had a lot of rain, so we
don't have ripe tomatoes yet, but plenty of beans, and the corn is
within days of being ready.


DO NOT block water from draining out of the pot. The soil will get too
soggy, and the plant will die.

Blend your own potting mix per my do-it-yourself recipe at
http://www.rossde.com/garden/garden_potting_mix.html. This mix will
drain well but also remain moist. Some commercial potting mixes seem to
"lock up" moisture as they start to dry; my recipe gives a mix that
makes its moisture available to plant roots until it is almost dust-dry.

For tomatoes, use only 2/3 of the indicated amount of blood meal;
nitrogen promotes growth at the expense of flowering and fruiting. Add
a little extra bone meal; phosphorus promotes flowering and fruiting.

Rain? What is rain?

--
David E. Ross
Climate: California Mediterranean, see
http://www.rossde.com/garden/climate.html
Gardening diary at http://www.rossde.com/garden/diary
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Old 10-09-2015, 06:26 PM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Tomato plant in a pot

On Thursday, September 10, 2015 at 7:53:55 AM UTC-7, Not@home wrote:
I had an extra seedling this year that looked pretty healthy, so I put
some stones in a pot (it is a big pot and I didn't have enough spare
dirt to fill it, so I put eight or ten inches of dirt on top of the
stones and transplanted the seedling to the dirt.

The problem is that the water runs through the dirt and stones and out
the hole in the bottom of the pot, so every day the plant, while it has
been growing well, loses the structure of the leaves (it almost looks
dead) until I water it, when it regains its vitality and looks healthy
until the next day. And the early maturing tomatoes have rather
advanced end stage rot.

So I am looking for a way to solve the watering problem for next year.
I am thinking of removing the stones and filling the whole pot with good
dirt, and burying a bowl at the bottom of the pot, reasoning that when I
water, some water will filter into the bowl and keep the plant happy.
I've been told that standing water in the bottom of the pot is not a
good idea, but I grow my seedlings in dirt over a tray of water, and
they grow extensive roots in the water.

[...]

Honestly don't see the problem. Put a big saucer under the pot so the runoff from your watering method will be saved.

Your idea of removing the stones and replacing with "good dirt" is a winner. Follow up with a big capacity saucer underneath and you should be home free.

Occam's Razor...

HB
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Old 10-09-2015, 10:11 PM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Tomato plant in a pot

On 9/10/2015 10:53 AM, Not@home wrote:
I had an extra seedling this year that looked pretty healthy, so I put
some stones in a pot (it is a big pot and I didn't have enough spare
dirt to fill it, so I put eight or ten inches of dirt on top of the
stones and transplanted the seedling to the dirt.

The problem is that the water runs through the dirt and stones and out
the hole in the bottom of the pot, so every day the plant, while it has
been growing well, loses the structure of the leaves (it almost looks
dead) until I water it, when it regains its vitality and looks healthy
until the next day. And the early maturing tomatoes have rather
advanced end stage rot.

So I am looking for a way to solve the watering problem for next year. I
am thinking of removing the stones and filling the whole pot with good
dirt, and burying a bowl at the bottom of the pot, reasoning that when I
water, some water will filter into the bowl and keep the plant happy.
I've been told that standing water in the bottom of the pot is not a
good idea, but I grow my seedlings in dirt over a tray of water, and
they grow extensive roots in the water.

We are in a moderate climate, subject to freezing. The last vortex was
brutal here, killing many plants and trees (all the peach trees, for
example, were killed). But our garden seems to have survived. I had an
arborist look at my sweet cherry tree; I wanted it pruned, but he
recommended cutting it down. I pruned it myself (it is no longer a
pretty tree) and it survived. providing a bumper crop. Our pie cherries
also produced well, as did the strawberries and blueberries. The
vegetables have struggled, possibly because we had a lot of rain, so we
don't have ripe tomatoes yet, but plenty of beans, and the corn is
within days of being ready.


Deer and shade have forced me to planting my tomatoes in pots.

Have to water frequently but while pots drain, there is a catch
container underneath and as long as there is water in it, I figure it
can wick to roots.

Also sounds like you have blossom end rot caused by lack of calcium.
Every year I mix a handful of limestone with dirt in the pot.
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Old 10-09-2015, 10:13 PM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Tomato plant in a pot

On 2015-09-10 14:53:48 +0000, Not@home said:

I had an extra seedling this year that looked pretty healthy, so I put
some stones in a pot (it is a big pot and I didn't have enough spare
dirt to fill it, so I put eight or ten inches of dirt on top of the
stones and transplanted the seedling to the dirt.

The problem is that the water runs through the dirt and stones and out
the hole in the bottom of the pot, so every day the plant, while it has
been growing well, loses the structure of the leaves (it almost looks
dead) until I water it, when it regains its vitality and looks healthy
until the next day. And the early maturing tomatoes have rather
advanced end stage rot.

So I am looking for a way to solve the watering problem for next year.
I am thinking of removing the stones and filling the whole pot with
good dirt, and burying a bowl at the bottom of the pot, reasoning that
when I water, some water will filter into the bowl and keep the plant
happy. I've been told that standing water in the bottom of the pot is
not a good idea, but I grow my seedlings in dirt over a tray of water,
and they grow extensive roots in the water.

We are in a moderate climate, subject to freezing. The last vortex
was brutal here, killing many plants and trees (all the peach trees,
for example, were killed). But our garden seems to have survived. I
had an arborist look at my sweet cherry tree; I wanted it pruned, but
he recommended cutting it down. I pruned it myself (it is no longer a
pretty tree) and it survived. providing a bumper crop. Our pie
cherries also produced well, as did the strawberries and blueberries.
The vegetables have struggled, possibly because we had a lot of rain,
so we don't have ripe tomatoes yet, but plenty of beans, and the corn
is within days of being ready.


Improve water retention while still promoting good drainage with
appropriate soil amendments. Coir fiber is great. Vermiculite and
perlite are helpful and not prohibitively expensive if bought in bulk.
Aged manure and/or organic composts in the proper amounts are nice.
Also, always apply a heavy layer of non-nutritive organic mulch atop
the soil to reduce evaporative loss and prevent roots overheating, and
avoid using dark-colored pots.



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Old 10-09-2015, 10:28 PM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Tomato plant in a pot

On 2015-09-10 20:13:21 +0000, Amos Nomore said:

On 2015-09-10 14:53:48 +0000, Not@home said:

I had an extra seedling this year that looked pretty healthy, so I put
some stones in a pot (it is a big pot and I didn't have enough spare
dirt to fill it, so I put eight or ten inches of dirt on top of the
stones and transplanted the seedling to the dirt.

The problem is that the water runs through the dirt and stones and out
the hole in the bottom of the pot, so every day the plant, while it has
been growing well, loses the structure of the leaves (it almost looks
dead) until I water it, when it regains its vitality and looks healthy
until the next day. And the early maturing tomatoes have rather
advanced end stage rot.

So I am looking for a way to solve the watering problem for next year.
I am thinking of removing the stones and filling the whole pot with
good dirt, and burying a bowl at the bottom of the pot, reasoning that
when I water, some water will filter into the bowl and keep the plant
happy. I've been told that standing water in the bottom of the pot is
not a good idea, but I grow my seedlings in dirt over a tray of water,
and they grow extensive roots in the water.

We are in a moderate climate, subject to freezing. The last vortex
was brutal here, killing many plants and trees (all the peach trees,
for example, were killed). But our garden seems to have survived. I
had an arborist look at my sweet cherry tree; I wanted it pruned, but
he recommended cutting it down. I pruned it myself (it is no longer a
pretty tree) and it survived. providing a bumper crop. Our pie
cherries also produced well, as did the strawberries and blueberries.
The vegetables have struggled, possibly because we had a lot of rain,
so we don't have ripe tomatoes yet, but plenty of beans, and the corn
is within days of being ready.


Improve water retention while still promoting good drainage with
appropriate soil amendments. Coir fiber is great. Vermiculite and
perlite are helpful and not prohibitively expensive if bought in bulk.
Aged manure and/or organic composts in the proper amounts are nice.
Also, always apply a heavy layer of non-nutritive organic mulch atop
the soil to reduce evaporative loss and prevent roots overheating, and
avoid using dark-colored pots.


5-10% playsand or other fine washed sand by volume also helps.
Unaltered bentonite clay can also be good when added to well-draining
soil in small quantities - but never combine with sandy soils.

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Old 10-09-2015, 10:44 PM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Tomato plant in a pot

Frank wrote:

Deer have forced me to planting my tomatoes in pots.


Never heard of a fence?!?!?
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Old 10-09-2015, 11:33 PM posted to rec.gardens
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On 9/10/2015 3:11 PM, Frank wrote:

Also sounds like you have blossom end rot caused by lack of calcium.
Every year I mix a handful of limestone with dirt in the pot.


Water stress (periods of too dry) does it, too.
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Old 11-09-2015, 12:39 AM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Tomato plant in a pot

On 9/10/2015 4:44 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
Frank wrote:

Deer have forced me to planting my tomatoes in pots.


Never heard of a fence?!?!?

Selective reading.

You left "shade" out of my reply.
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Old 11-09-2015, 01:45 PM posted to rec.gardens
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On Thu, 10 Sep 2015 18:39:59 -0400, Frank "frank wrote:

On 9/10/2015 4:44 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
Frank wrote:

Deer have forced me to planting my tomatoes in pots.


Never heard of a fence?!?!?

Selective reading.

You left "shade" out of my reply.



I grow just about all my veggies in tubs.

You need good size ones, such as folks use to plant patio evergreens.
Decide carefully where you want it to be, as they are quite heavy to
move around after they are filled.

Make sure there are drainage holes (some tubs some with them merely
indicated in the plastic and need to be drilled out) and layer the
bottom of the pot with stones or broken crockery to provide drainage.

You can use garden soil if yours is in decent shape, or create a mix,
or buy a bag or two from a big box store. Use common sense, tweak it a
bit with some compost or other decent organics.

Insofar as preventing blossom end rot - well, that can certainly be
calcium deficiency, or it can be the variety of tomato you are
growing, also. All my tubs have the same soil mix. I had a hard time
with a couple of new-to-me heirlooms this year that got blossom rot.
None of the other pots suffered, so I tend to believe some varieties
are more susceptible. Live and learn.

http://i59.tinypic.com/2yoyjjk.jpg


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Old 11-09-2015, 02:33 PM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Tomato plant in a pot

On 9/11/2015 7:45 AM, Boron Elgar wrote:
On Thu, 10 Sep 2015 18:39:59 -0400, Frank "frank wrote:

On 9/10/2015 4:44 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
Frank wrote:

Deer have forced me to planting my tomatoes in pots.

Never heard of a fence?!?!?

Selective reading.

You left "shade" out of my reply.



I grow just about all my veggies in tubs.

You need good size ones, such as folks use to plant patio evergreens.
Decide carefully where you want it to be, as they are quite heavy to
move around after they are filled.

Make sure there are drainage holes (some tubs some with them merely
indicated in the plastic and need to be drilled out) and layer the
bottom of the pot with stones or broken crockery to provide drainage.

You can use garden soil if yours is in decent shape, or create a mix,
or buy a bag or two from a big box store. Use common sense, tweak it a
bit with some compost or other decent organics.

Insofar as preventing blossom end rot - well, that can certainly be
calcium deficiency, or it can be the variety of tomato you are
growing, also. All my tubs have the same soil mix. I had a hard time
with a couple of new-to-me heirlooms this year that got blossom rot.
None of the other pots suffered, so I tend to believe some varieties
are more susceptible. Live and learn.

http://i59.tinypic.com/2yoyjjk.jpg


Pots look like mine and I do what you do.

Lot of tomatoes and cucumbers this year except wet spring may have led
to more fungus. My tomato plants pooped out early as did others I know.
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Old 11-09-2015, 04:22 PM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Tomato plant in a pot

Boron Elgar wrote:
Frank wrote:
Brooklyn1 wrote:
Frank wrote:

Deer have forced me to planting my tomatoes in pots.

Never heard of a fence?!?!?


I grow just about all my veggies in tubs.


Tubs will do nothing to protect plants from foraging deer unless
fenced, in fact raised plants make browsing more comfortable for
deer... you obviously have no deer.

You need good size ones, such as folks use to plant patio evergreens.
Decide carefully where you want it to be, as they are quite heavy to
move around after they are filled.


There are planter dollies available at low cost or it's easy to make
ones own.

Make sure there are drainage holes (some tubs come with them merely
indicated in the plastic and need to be drilled out) and layer the
bottom of the pot with stones or broken crockery to provide drainage.


Plastic tubs don't permit air to reach roots, use unglazed pottery or
wooden containers. It's very easy to build ones own wooden tubs
(cubic or rectangular) and attach casters/wheels at each corner I
much prefer wooden planters, large plastic and pottery tends to crack,
not only from the weight of wet soil but more from the pressure
exerted be expanding roots. When constructing wooden planters leave a
gap between boards to allow for expansion and for air to reach roots.
Cedar privacy fencing lumber makes great planters, is reasonably
priced, and won't rot for many years.

http://i59.tinypic.com/2yoyjjk.jpg


Do not place plants close to a wall that receives direct sun or the
plants will cook.
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Old 13-09-2015, 01:22 AM posted to rec.gardens
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On 11/09/2015 12:53 AM, Not@home wrote:
I had an extra seedling this year that looked pretty healthy, so I put
some stones in a pot (it is a big pot and I didn't have enough spare
dirt to fill it, so I put eight or ten inches of dirt on top of the
stones and transplanted the seedling to the dirt.

The problem is that the water runs through the dirt and stones and out
the hole in the bottom of the pot, so every day the plant, while it has
been growing well, loses the structure of the leaves (it almost looks
dead) until I water it, when it regains its vitality and looks healthy
until the next day. And the early maturing tomatoes have rather
advanced end stage rot.

So I am looking for a way to solve the watering problem for next year. I
am thinking of removing the stones and filling the whole pot with good
dirt, and burying a bowl at the bottom of the pot, reasoning that when I
water, some water will filter into the bowl and keep the plant happy.
I've been told that standing water in the bottom of the pot is not a
good idea, but I grow my seedlings in dirt over a tray of water, and
they grow extensive roots in the water.

We are in a moderate climate, subject to freezing. The last vortex was
brutal here, killing many plants and trees (all the peach trees, for
example, were killed). But our garden seems to have survived. I had an
arborist look at my sweet cherry tree; I wanted it pruned, but he
recommended cutting it down. I pruned it myself (it is no longer a
pretty tree) and it survived. providing a bumper crop. Our pie cherries
also produced well, as did the strawberries and blueberries. The
vegetables have struggled, possibly because we had a lot of rain, so we
don't have ripe tomatoes yet, but plenty of beans, and the corn is
within days of being ready.


Wow. Why didn't you use broken up polystyrene boxes rather than rocks?
Moving posts with rocks in the bottom must be interesting.

But to your question... You use the word "dirt", not "soil" which I
find odd so am wondering what it is you have used.

8 or 10 inches of soil in the top of a big pot doesn't sound like enough
soil TMWOT. I'd be using a greater depth than that and I'd use either a
good quality potting mix to which I'd added seed raising mix (it fills
in thelarge gaps in the 'good quality' potting mix that is for sale
here. To that I'd add also coir and some well rotted bulky animal
manure (horse/cow/elephant) and/or leaf mould or use home made compost
with the addition of those other ingredients. I'd also put mulch on the
top of the pot and try to put the pot where it got shade in the
afternoon so the roots didnt'cook in the afternoon heat. I wouldn't let
it sit in water but try to make sure the mix the plant grew in was water
retentive but not evaporating and/or baking.
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Old 13-09-2015, 01:28 AM posted to rec.gardens
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On 11/09/2015 6:13 AM, Amos Nomore wrote:
On 2015-09-10 14:53:48 +0000, Not@home said:



Improve water retention while still promoting good drainage with
appropriate soil amendments. Coir fiber is great. Vermiculite and
perlite are helpful and not prohibitively expensive if bought in bulk.
Aged manure and/or organic composts in the proper amounts are nice.
Also, always apply a heavy layer of non-nutritive organic mulch atop the
soil to reduce evaporative loss and prevent roots overheating, and avoid
using dark-colored pots.


Drat. I should have read all of the thread before posting my response.
It seems you and I have given advice that is almost the same.

I love coir and would join a fan club to promote and support it's use.
I even use it in my garden beds to lighten up very heavy soil when I
don't have enough well rotted cow poo.

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Old 15-09-2015, 08:31 PM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Tomato plant in a pot

On 9/10/2015 10:53 AM, Not@home wrote:
I had an extra seedling this year that looked pretty healthy, so I put some
stones in a pot (it is a big pot and I didn't have enough spare dirt to
fill it, so I put eight or ten inches of dirt on top of the stones and
transplanted the seedling to the dirt.

The problem is that the water runs through the dirt and stones and out the
hole in the bottom of the pot, so every day the plant, while it has been
growing well, loses the structure of the leaves (it almost looks dead)
until I water it, when it regains its vitality and looks healthy until the
next day. And the early maturing tomatoes have rather advanced end stage rot.

So I am looking for a way to solve the watering problem for next year. I am
thinking of removing the stones and filling the whole pot with good dirt,
and burying a bowl at the bottom of the pot, reasoning that when I water,
some water will filter into the bowl and keep the plant happy. I've been
told that standing water in the bottom of the pot is not a good idea, but I
grow my seedlings in dirt over a tray of water, and they grow extensive
roots in the water.

We are in a moderate climate, subject to freezing. The last vortex was
brutal here, killing many plants and trees (all the peach trees, for
example, were killed). But our garden seems to have survived. I had an
arborist look at my sweet cherry tree; I wanted it pruned, but he
recommended cutting it down. I pruned it myself (it is no longer a pretty
tree) and it survived. providing a bumper crop. Our pie cherries also
produced well, as did the strawberries and blueberries. The vegetables
have struggled, possibly because we had a lot of rain, so we don't have
ripe tomatoes yet, but plenty of beans, and the corn is within days of
being ready.


I'd say that if you have the time to water twice a day and tend the plants
in ordinary pots of any sort, more power to you. If, on the other hand, you
just want to grow tomatoes in a container that doesn't tie you down so much
you need to either buy something like an 'Earth Box' or simply make your
own. I do the latter. A planter made from a 5-gallon plastic bucket and a
few bits of PVC pipe and sheet plastic can be made in an hour or so if you
are handy and have tools available. It holds enough planting mix to
actually grow a determinant tomato plant such as 'Patio' and it largely
self-waters so that it needs attention only every few days. I put the
divider in mine between 1/4 and 1/3 up from the bottom; higher gives more
water capacity and lower gives more room for roots.

Example:
http://squarepennies.com/2012/06/diy...n-buckets.html

Definitely stick with a determinant variety since trying to support an
indeterminant in a container is nearly impossible to do well.
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