On Wed, 06 Dec 2006 13:04:29 -0600, Tristan wrote:

Folks speaking the facts and truth sure do hurt don;t they Gail.

On Wed, 6 Dec 2006 15:30:54 -0500, Jayne Kulikauskas
wrote:

Thank you for providing this opportunity for Gail to demonstrate her
ability to remain calm and polite even when dealing with abusive,
unreasonable and dishonest posters. This is a valuable trait in a
moderator.

I expect the entire group creation team appreciates your posts because you
make a persuasive case for moderation. I hope you will continue to build
support for a moderated ponds group as we approach the RFD in
news.groups.proposals.

VBG ~ jan
-----------------

Also ponding troll free at:
http://groups.google.com/group/The-Freshwater-Aquarium

Gail Futoran wrote:

"Vorian Atreides" wrote in message
...
Derek Broughton wrote:

[Yes, I'm one of the secret cabal -
don't tell anyone]

Then you are not to be trusted Derek. No Wonder Carol attitude changed
from oppostion to accepting the Moderated group. A person who acts in
secret for supposed benefit of a group is called a dictator and a coward.

Duh? There's no secret, stupid.

That's certainly not _our_ purpose.

Yes the Frak it is. You are the only rec.ponder who supported Carol and
her harassment of other groups for years.

That's just an outright lie. I have supported Carol's right to post _in
this group_ for years. I'm proud of that. I haven't a clue about, or an
interest in, anything else she does on the net.

Are you Jew Burner Derek? Do you support the Palestinian and Iran on
killing Jews? Wipe them off the planet?

YES! I WIN. Anytime somebody starts throwing racist slurs at me, I know
I'm right.

Because that is what Carol is,

It's never once been demonstrated here (in fact, this is the first time I've
ever even seen _that_ bit of nastiness).

Damn. When I plonk someone, I really shouldn't read other people's quotes
of them...
--
derek

"Derek Broughton" wrote in message
news
That's just an outright lie. I have supported Carol's right to post _in
this group_ for years. I'm proud of that. I haven't a clue about, or an
interest in, anything else she does on the net.
==================
Nor should anyone else have an interest where else I post.

Thank you
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }((((* ~~~ }{{{{(ö ~~~~ }((((({*





--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Zëbulon wrote:

"Derek Broughton" wrote in message
news
That's just an outright lie. I have supported Carol's right to post _in
this group_ for years. I'm proud of that. I haven't a clue about, or an
interest in, anything else she does on the net.

==================
Nor should anyone else have an interest where else I post.

Thank you

Isn't wherever Carol posts as Derek says a little irrelevant to the
topic in hand?.....someones posting history should not make any
difference in a moderated Usenet group - so I don't understand why she
is trying to make a point on it....nym shifting, which has happened
twice today - once to Zebulon and now to Zebulon using additional
characters I can't be bothered to find out how to do....is again
irrelevant but very annoying and confusing (and in fact might not be
that irrelevant if a poster is setting out to confuse)....Zebulon has
been used as a nym in the discussion with Koi-Lo - surely during such a
serious discussion such as this deciding to change your nym is confusing
at the very least or disruptive at the worst....

IIRC and I have read far more of the sad history than I should have done
- Derek is supporting the fundemental principle of anyone to post on
Usenet without any bias on personality or behaviour elsewhere - I won't
say right because anyone going out to deliberately curb the rights of
others has no rights at all in my mind to be included in the little
communities that occur in these groups (and before you leap on the email
again Carol this is a generic statement).

The moderation team also needs to consider whether nym shifting or
morphing is acceptable in the moderated group along with
impersonation....all of which generally tend to hint to me that people
are up to no good (again generic)

Gill

"Gill Passman" wrote in message
...
Zëbulon wrote:

"Derek Broughton" wrote in message
news
That's just an outright lie. I have supported Carol's right to post _in
this group_ for years. I'm proud of that. I haven't a clue about, or
an
interest in, anything else she does on the net.

==================
Nor should anyone else have an interest where else I post.

Thank you
----------------------------
Isn't wherever Carol posts as Derek says a little irrelevant to the topic
in hand?.....someones posting history should not make any difference in a
moderated Usenet group - so I don't understand why she is trying to make
a point on it....

Because it was made quite a point to me by e-mail and more than once.
I believe you and I even discussed this very subject on the phone that
night.

nym shifting, which has happened
twice today - once to Zebulon and now to Zebulon using additional
characters I can't be bothered to find out how to do....is again
irrelevant but very annoying and confusing (and in fact might not be that
irrelevant if a poster is setting out to confuse)....Zebulon has been used
as a nym in the discussion with Koi-Lo - surely during such a serious
discussion such as this deciding to change your nym is confusing at the
very least or disruptive at the worst....

Sorry Gill but I have a reason for changing it. I'm not trying to deceive
anyone.

IIRC and I have read far more of the sad history than I should have done -
Derek is supporting the fundemental principle of anyone to post on Usenet
without any bias on personality or behaviour elsewhere - I won't say right
because anyone going out to deliberately curb the rights of others has no
rights at all in my mind to be included in the little communities that
occur in these groups (and before you leap on the email again Carol this
is a generic statement).

If you sent me an e-mail I did *not* recieve it.

The moderation team also needs to consider whether nym shifting or
morphing is acceptable in the moderated group along with
impersonation....all of which generally tend to hint to me that people are
up to no good (again generic).

I would have no reason on a moderated group to change my NYM. Impersonation?
Wasn't that the reason I refused to go along with you people to start with?
Remember? I told all of you all I could never pull off coming back with a
while new persona - to pretend to be a whole different person. To be in
hiding so to speak. At that point you all turned on me and that was that.
On a moderated group there is no reason to NYM change. If I chose to I
would let everyone know as I did this time. Sometimes there are good
reasons people change their NYMs. I'm sorry if all this crap has made you
so suspicious. I'm extremely suspicious of everyone myself now so I'm sorry
for us both.........

--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }((((* ~~~ }{{{{(ö ~~~~ }((((({*





--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

On Sat, 9 Dec 2006 15:03:12 -0600, Zëbulon wrote:

Sorry Gill but I have a reason for changing it.

Clue us in, why the change?

Remember? I told all of you all I could never pull off coming back with a
while new persona - to pretend to be a whole different person. To be in
hiding so to speak.

I don't see it as hiding, just not being obvious. Water under the bridge
now as it won't matter in a moderated group one way or the other. ~ jan

"~ janj" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 9 Dec 2006 15:03:12 -0600, Zëbulon wrote:

Sorry Gill but I have a reason for changing it.

Clue us in, why the change?

I can't believe it's not obvious to you. I'll drop you an email later
tonight when I have more time. There's no use giving trolls more ideas.
;-)

Remember? I told all of you all I could never pull off coming back with a
while new persona - to pretend to be a whole different person. To be in
hiding so to speak.

I don't see it as hiding, just not being obvious. Water under the bridge
now as it won't matter in a moderated group one way or the other. ~ jan

Exactly - because no one can frog me there which was one reason I suggested
a m. group last year. I can chose a name I like and keep it indefinitely.
:-)
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }((((* ~~~ }{{{{(ö ~~~~ }((((({*







--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Zëbulon wrote:



Sorry Gill but I have a reason for changing it. I'm not trying to
deceive anyone.

I can see no valid reason for changing your nym especially when this
type of discussion is going on - other than to create confusion



If you sent me an e-mail I did *not* recieve it.

I certainly did not reply to your email....I did receive an email from
someone saying they were you but not from an email address that I
recognise as being one of yours....either you are forgetting which nyms
you use to talk to people or someone was forging you....anyone, who
mails me from an address I don't know ends up right away in my trash
can....if it was you I think you rather proved the mixed up Ids and nym
shifting point...



I would have no reason on a moderated group to change my NYM.

Ther is no reason to change it on an unmoderated group - especially if
you then go ahead and advertise that you have done it on that
unmoderated group...and especially at a time when discussions are going
on as they are right now....I cannot even start to imagine the benefit
to you by moving away from Koi-Lo

Impersonation? Wasn't that the reason I refused to go along with you
people to start with? Remember? I told all of you all I could never
pull off coming back with a while new persona - to pretend to be a whole
different person.

So why nym shift now??? To someone who has already posted pretending to
be someone other than Koi-Lo - posts on the abortion groups (your
perogative) and in fact is using a nym of an established poster in
Germany....beyond me....

If you had any interest in resolving this mess without things going
moderated you would have done so....right now if you truly back
moderation then good....time will tell if you actually will post on a
moderated group....

Gill

Strategos wrote:



That is what Carol does, and will be blocked. However You raised a
concern, If Carol is Derek, then Carol is a moderator.
Derek should step down as a moderator from the group.


I have never seen anything to suggest that Derek is Carol from my time
lurking on this newsgroup.....

There is a fundemental difference between holding the principle that
people's posting habits are their own affair and people's personal
posting habits being forced on others who have no interest in the
subject on hand.....(via cross-posting, off-topic posts or whatever
other means are used).....and this applies to anyone who does this not
just one or two individuals....there is also a point where someone has
to take responsibility for their posting habits if they are impacting
the freedom of others to discuss freely the topics of interest in a
specific group. This does not necessarily mean that a person who posts
on other, and maybe controversially, groups should be banned from an
unrelated group - merely that they should keep their own house in order
and respect the rights of others to post in peace...

Gill

Strategos wrote:


George and CArol talking by phone?
not good.

I think she meant talking to me....and I'm no George

Gill

"Gill Passman" wrote in message
...
Zëbulon wrote:


Sorry Gill but I have a reason for changing it. I'm not trying to
deceive anyone.

I can see no valid reason for changing your nym especially when this type
of discussion is going on - other than to create confusion

I'm sorry if YOU can't see it - I and a few others can see it very well. I
sent Jan the reason I changed it.

If you sent me an e-mail I did *not* recieve it.

I certainly did not reply to your email....I did receive an email from
someone saying they were you but not from an email address that I
recognise as being one of yours....either you are forgetting which nyms
you use to talk to people or someone was forging you....anyone, who mails
me from an address I don't know ends up right away in my trash can....if
it was you I think you rather proved the mixed up Ids and nym shifting
point...

Then it was a FORGERY because I always sign my e-mail with my given name
which is Carol.

I would have no reason on a moderated group to change my NYM.

Ther is no reason to change it on an unmoderated group - especially if you
then go ahead and advertise that you have done it on that unmoderated
group...

There is a reason.

and especially at a time when discussions are going
on as they are right now....I cannot even start to imagine the benefit to
you by moving away from Koi-Lo

You wouldn't, since you probably either have some trolls killfiled or your
reader is missing messages.

Impersonation? Wasn't that the reason I refused to go along with you
people to start with? Remember? I told all of you all I could never pull
off coming back with a while new persona - to pretend to be a whole
different person.

So why nym shift now???

I explained it to Jan last night. Why are you giving me the 3rd degree but
say nothing to the other poster here who NYM shifts constantly?

To someone who has already posted pretending to
be someone other than Koi-Lo - posts on the abortion groups (your
perogative) and in fact is using a nym of an established poster in
Germany....beyond me....

I have no idea who else may be using the same NYM or where they're from. I
don't dumpster-dive people - do you?

If you had any interest in resolving this mess without things going
moderated you would have done so....

What would I have done? Run away because of a few vicious trolls? Gone
away and try to sneak back as someone else as you asked me to do and hope
the trolls didn't recognize me. How stupid do you think they are? Why even
ask someone to do such a thing? And by GOD, you turned on me when I refused
to try and pull such a stunt off. Get real Gill - you tried to manipulate
me by *pretending* to be my friend. I knew who was behind it all. Most, if
not all of them weren't even from rec.ponds. You yourself were not from
this NG, but the Aquarium groups. When I refused to try and pull off this
plan you all come up with, you turned on me like a dog - just like I
suspected you would. Just like I was warned you would. You're right Gill, I
did trust a few of the wrong people........

right now if you truly back
moderation then good....time will tell if you actually will post on a
moderated group....

And tell us Gill,... why wouldn't I - since I've posted here on rec.ponds
for 10 years? For someone not even from this NG why all the sudden
interest?
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }((((* ~~~ }{{{{(ö ~~~~ }((((({*






--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

"Gill Passman" wrote in message
...
This does not necessarily mean that a person who posts
on other, and maybe controversially, groups should be banned from an
unrelated group - merely that they should keep their own house in order
and respect the rights of others to post in peace...
=========================
No matter what's said to these trolls from other NGs, and the few from
rec.ponds who jumped on the troll-wagon, it still comes down to rec.ponds
needing a moderated group. It's the only way to get rid of people who are
on a "MISSION" as Jayne called it. And they know their mission will be cut
short the day they can't hold this group hostage anymore. Their power over
the entire group will be GONE. They will be shrieking into a void where no
one cares. That's the last thing these people want - to lose their audience
and boy did they have a great audience here on rec.ponds.
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }((((* ~~~ }{{{{(ö ~~~~ }((((({*





--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Am I the only one that finds it hypocritical that on one hand "some" say
use your killfilter, and yet when those "some" are plonked, they call the
plonker childish? Hmmmmm? Interesting. ~ jan

No Jan, thats not what was stated. It was stated to post
P L O N K in big bold letters al la NIck Cramer
style and Derek style it accomplishes little except to really show yuu
don't get your own way so your taking yur toys and going home being
the child yu are, and haveing to have th elast word.........and then
not give a poster an opporetunity to respond. Typical for Derek, NIck,
Gail, KAthy30 and you in lots of cases to do so. Its best to invoke
and use a killlfile and shut the hellup about it and just get on with
business.....without the need to advertise what you did. (figure of
speach not aimed directl.y at you unless the shoe fits) I had always
figurered you Janj above all else especialy those orthes of this so
called moderator gorup had better sense to know that advertising such
PLONKs is nothing but opening more avenues for flames. I
canunderstand NIck doing it as he is juyst an old codger with his
panties in a perpetual wad, and Derek was born with a silver spoon in
his mouth so it seems.......as he is pretty quick to get PLONK in
action or just plain sull up and drop of the radar screen......

You all say trolls do their thing for attention, well others view
folks like NIck and Derek like children whith their emphatic PLONKS..

..On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 07:52:13 GMT, ~ janj
wrote:

Am I the only one that finds it hypocritical that on one hand "some" say
use your killfilter, and yet when those "some" are plonked, they call the
plonker childish? Hmmmmm? Interesting. ~ jan



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

~ janj wrote:

Am I the only one that finds it hypocritical

No.

that on one hand "some" say
use your killfilter, and yet when those "some" are plonked, they call the
plonker childish? Hmmmmm? Interesting. ~ jan

While I use filters for the really annoying, I also use filters just to
prevent specific posters pushing my buttons. Hey, I've put you there
before :-) I suppose if I _tell_ those people they're plonked, that's
childish. otoh, the trolls who are already being childish need to be told
that nobody's listening to them any more.
--
derek