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#1
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Dying new growth
This year I bought 6 bareroot roses from Edmunds. I followed the planting
instructions to the letter for 3 of them. On 2 I did the same except for mounding around the canes and on one, left it a bucket of water for a week then just planted it. Of the three that got the mounding around the canes I waited until I saw 2-4 new growth popping out before removing the mound. There was alot of new growth under the mound, blanched from no sun. The growth outside of the mound is doing wonderfully but the growth under the mound has just died off and no new growth can be seen from those canes. Why would this happen? The 2 roses that never got the mounding have alot of new growth and are very healthy. The one that got left in the bucket of water for a week is doing just fine also. Maybe mounding here in So. CA just doesn't need to be done, I have no idea. Can anyone explain to me why the mounding roses new growth has died off and is there anyway to get them jump started again to get new growth? Thanks to all for even reading this post. Rick In Chula Vista CA |
#2
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Dying new growth
Rick wrote:
This year I bought 6 bareroot roses from Edmunds. I followed the planting instructions to the letter for 3 of them. On 2 I did the same except for mounding around the canes and on one, left it a bucket of water for a week then just planted it. Of the three that got the mounding around the canes I waited until I saw 2-4 new growth popping out before removing the mound. There was alot of new growth under the mound, blanched from no sun. The growth outside of the mound is doing wonderfully but the growth under the mound has just died off and no new growth can be seen from those canes. Why would this happen? The 2 roses that never got the mounding have alot of new growth and are very healthy. The one that got left in the bucket of water for a week is doing just fine also. Maybe mounding here in So. CA just doesn't need to be done, I have no idea. Can anyone explain to me why the mounding roses new growth has died off and is there anyway to get them jump started again to get new growth? Conventional wisdom is that you remove the compost that you mounded gradually once you see 2 inches of growth at the tips of the exposed canes. Then you don't remove the mounded compost all at once: you wash off an inch or so each day for several days. Some of the chlorophyl-deprived growth will die, but a lot of it will turn green and continue growing. Mounding is really important, so don't feel bad if that new growth looks lousy. Maybe you got lucky with the roses you didn't mound, but mounding is insurance in those years that the March winds blow from the day you plant your new bareroot and continues for 3 weeks. I suggest you resist the temptation to try to force growth with fertilizer. Your bareroot has enough stored sugars to put out several inches of new growth. Once you get a sense that it is growing *actively* (and all I can say is you'll know it when you see it), then you can apply a half-dilution application of fish emulsion or another mild, not heavy-nitrogen fertilizer. Maybe you had too many canes to begin with. Bareroots come with instructions to cut back to a bud and some even suggest that you reduce the number of canes. But maybe you got a dud. That does happen. Keep watering regulary and if you need to, contact Edmunds for a replacement. Good luck. If you have 3 or 4 good canes, you don't really need to worry if one or two don't leaf out. |
#3
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Dying new growth
"Rick" wrote This year I bought 6 bareroot roses from Edmunds. I followed the planting instructions to the letter for 3 of them. On 2 I did the same except for mounding around the canes and on one, left it a bucket of water for a week then just planted it. Of the three that got the mounding around the canes I waited until I saw 2-4 new growth popping out before removing the mound. There was alot of new growth under the mound, blanched from no sun. The growth outside of the mound is doing wonderfully but the growth under the mound has just died off and no new growth can be seen from those canes. Why would this happen? The 2 roses that never got the mounding have alot of new growth and are very healthy. The one that got left in the bucket of water for a week is doing just fine also. Maybe mounding here in So. CA just doesn't need to be done, I have no idea. Can anyone explain to me why the mounding roses new growth has died off and is there anyway to get them jump started again to get new growth? Thanks to all for even reading this post. Rick In Chula Vista CA Hello Rick, I cannot tell you for certain why the new growth died, but I have my suspicions. Roses are covered at the graft in colder areas of the country to avoid cold damage to the tissue where the graft has taken place. If that part of the rose - you know, the bumpy little bulge between the canes and the trunk of the rose - dies, your rose reverts to the stock that was used to graft it. In the west it is likely to be our good Dr. Huey. In our side of the country not only isn't necessary to cover the graft, but actually is better that you don't. Your rose got the message from the light and the temperature that it was time to break dormancy. The warmth of the soil and the light that helps to develop photosynthesis which indicates to the plant that now is the time to spread those feeder roots and get going, was short-circuited by the soil on top of the bottom of the rose. It pushed out in hopes of reaching the light that the upper part was getting, and thus you got growth under the soil. But it didn't develop the same tissue as the leaves exposed to the light, the warmth and the air that the rest of your rose did. When it finally did, the connecting tissue was way too thin to survive UV rays and its burning effect plus the dehydration that comes from thin tissue and lack of exposure. Don't worry; your rose is not going to die. In a couple of months she will perhaps comeback with another batch of leaves and if you make sure that continues to be well watered and fed, your rose will be just fine. Remember that there is no reason to cover the graft here. You may plant your roses with the graft at ground level or even a couple of inches above. That will allow mulch to insulate the roots as well during very hot weather. What are you growing? Rule of this place is that we tell, spill, account for, you name it, but we name names. Hope this helps, and good luck Allegra |
#4
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Dying new growth
Thank you Cass for the information. I've never planted bare root roses
before so this is all new to me. I maybe a lot of things but I'm not a quiter and I won't let my roses quit either. Next time ( and there will be one) I'll remember to remove the mounding alittle at a time. "Cass" wrote in message ... Rick wrote: This year I bought 6 bareroot roses from Edmunds. I followed the planting instructions to the letter for 3 of them. On 2 I did the same except for mounding around the canes and on one, left it a bucket of water for a week then just planted it. Of the three that got the mounding around the canes I waited until I saw 2-4 new growth popping out before removing the mound. There was alot of new growth under the mound, blanched from no sun. The growth outside of the mound is doing wonderfully but the growth under the mound has just died off and no new growth can be seen from those canes. Why would this happen? The 2 roses that never got the mounding have alot of new growth and are very healthy. The one that got left in the bucket of water for a week is doing just fine also. Maybe mounding here in So. CA just doesn't need to be done, I have no idea. Can anyone explain to me why the mounding roses new growth has died off and is there anyway to get them jump started again to get new growth? Conventional wisdom is that you remove the compost that you mounded gradually once you see 2 inches of growth at the tips of the exposed canes. Then you don't remove the mounded compost all at once: you wash off an inch or so each day for several days. Some of the chlorophyl-deprived growth will die, but a lot of it will turn green and continue growing. Mounding is really important, so don't feel bad if that new growth looks lousy. Maybe you got lucky with the roses you didn't mound, but mounding is insurance in those years that the March winds blow from the day you plant your new bareroot and continues for 3 weeks. I suggest you resist the temptation to try to force growth with fertilizer. Your bareroot has enough stored sugars to put out several inches of new growth. Once you get a sense that it is growing *actively* (and all I can say is you'll know it when you see it), then you can apply a half-dilution application of fish emulsion or another mild, not heavy-nitrogen fertilizer. Maybe you had too many canes to begin with. Bareroots come with instructions to cut back to a bud and some even suggest that you reduce the number of canes. But maybe you got a dud. That does happen. Keep watering regulary and if you need to, contact Edmunds for a replacement. Good luck. If you have 3 or 4 good canes, you don't really need to worry if one or two don't leaf out. |
#5
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Dying new growth
Thanks Allegra, I have hope now. Well since you ask here's what is planted
and still to come: In the ground: Bride's Dream Climbing Pearly Gates Fragrant Cloud New Zealand St. Patrick Whisper Waiting to arrive: Mellow Yellow Aint She Sweet One I can't remember the name I ordered ( getting old ) Still to propagate: A fifty year old Red rose from my Mother's garden that was given to them as a house warming gift. My wife and I bought this house a year ago and I'm re-doing the whole garden to resemble the garden that I grew up with. This is only the start. I've grown roses for a nunber of years but never bare root. Thanks again. Rick "Allegra" wrote in message news:8QSda.137283$3D1.12225@sccrnsc01... "Rick" wrote This year I bought 6 bareroot roses from Edmunds. I followed the planting instructions to the letter for 3 of them. On 2 I did the same except for mounding around the canes and on one, left it a bucket of water for a week then just planted it. Of the three that got the mounding around the canes I waited until I saw 2-4 new growth popping out before removing the mound. There was alot of new growth under the mound, blanched from no sun. The growth outside of the mound is doing wonderfully but the growth under the mound has just died off and no new growth can be seen from those canes. Why would this happen? The 2 roses that never got the mounding have alot of new growth and are very healthy. The one that got left in the bucket of water for a week is doing just fine also. Maybe mounding here in So. CA just doesn't need to be done, I have no idea. Can anyone explain to me why the mounding roses new growth has died off and is there anyway to get them jump started again to get new growth? Thanks to all for even reading this post. Rick In Chula Vista CA Hello Rick, I cannot tell you for certain why the new growth died, but I have my suspicions. Roses are covered at the graft in colder areas of the country to avoid cold damage to the tissue where the graft has taken place. If that part of the rose - you know, the bumpy little bulge between the canes and the trunk of the rose - dies, your rose reverts to the stock that was used to graft it. In the west it is likely to be our good Dr. Huey. In our side of the country not only isn't necessary to cover the graft, but actually is better that you don't. Your rose got the message from the light and the temperature that it was time to break dormancy. The warmth of the soil and the light that helps to develop photosynthesis which indicates to the plant that now is the time to spread those feeder roots and get going, was short-circuited by the soil on top of the bottom of the rose. It pushed out in hopes of reaching the light that the upper part was getting, and thus you got growth under the soil. But it didn't develop the same tissue as the leaves exposed to the light, the warmth and the air that the rest of your rose did. When it finally did, the connecting tissue was way too thin to survive UV rays and its burning effect plus the dehydration that comes from thin tissue and lack of exposure. Don't worry; your rose is not going to die. In a couple of months she will perhaps comeback with another batch of leaves and if you make sure that continues to be well watered and fed, your rose will be just fine. Remember that there is no reason to cover the graft here. You may plant your roses with the graft at ground level or even a couple of inches above. That will allow mulch to insulate the roots as well during very hot weather. What are you growing? Rule of this place is that we tell, spill, account for, you name it, but we name names. Hope this helps, and good luck Allegra |
#6
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Dying new growth
Rick wrote:
Still to propagate: A fifty year old Red rose from my Mother's garden that was given to them as a house warming gift. Have you already tried softwood cuttings, or have I confused you with someone else who is trying to propagate a red rose without success? Did you try a hardwood cutting last winter? I took some rose prunings in February and "stuck" them. It is very easy: use wood the size of a pencil (which I wouldn't ordinarily prune, but some roses are prolific). Cut a sufficient length to get 2 buds above ground, 2 buds below ground. Using a sterile and very sharp knife, make 1/4 inch scores on the opposite side of the two lower buds. Then "stick" your cuttings in your fallow vegetable garden with 2 buds below the soil and 2 buds above. Some recommend using a broomstick to make the hole and then fill the hole with sand. Some also use rooting hormone. Cover the cutting with a clear plastic bottle that has the bottom cut out and the screw-on top discarded to make a little greenhouse over the cutting. If you're in a really cold part of the country, I don't know exactly how you manage this in the winter or when you take the cuttings, but I know someone to ask if you're interested. Where are you located and what zone are you in? -- -=- Cass Zone 9 San Francisco Bay Area http://home.attbi.com/~cassbernstein/index.html |
#7
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Dying new growth
Hi Cass. I'm in Chula Vista CA, just south of San Diego, Zone 10.
I've never propagated before but I will succeed, it's very important for me to make sure my brother and sisters get the rose from my Mother's garden so we will really have something of hers when she is gone. I'll teach my siblings the art of propagating so they too can give a rose to there children when it's time. I will also be doing a rose for my daughters. I found what may be the perfect green house for propagating new roses. I found it at the Container Store in Fashion Valley. It was made for keeping cat & dog food fresh. It looks like a small narrow thrash can about 2.5 feet high and about 6 inches wide and about 10-12 inches long with a top that seals and flips open. Clear with a white top. I plan to cut a half circle in the top about 2 inches in dia. Then getting a fender washer and cut a wedge out and screwing it over the half circle so I can slowly add fresh air to the green house. It should work. I just checked on the new roses and found them covered with aphids !!!! What can I use that will be gentle on the new growth? Besides water. Rick Zone 10 Chula Vista, CA "Cass" wrote in message ... Rick wrote: Still to propagate: A fifty year old Red rose from my Mother's garden that was given to them as a house warming gift. Have you already tried softwood cuttings, or have I confused you with someone else who is trying to propagate a red rose without success? Did you try a hardwood cutting last winter? I took some rose prunings in February and "stuck" them. It is very easy: use wood the size of a pencil (which I wouldn't ordinarily prune, but some roses are prolific). Cut a sufficient length to get 2 buds above ground, 2 buds below ground. Using a sterile and very sharp knife, make 1/4 inch scores on the opposite side of the two lower buds. Then "stick" your cuttings in your fallow vegetable garden with 2 buds below the soil and 2 buds above. Some recommend using a broomstick to make the hole and then fill the hole with sand. Some also use rooting hormone. Cover the cutting with a clear plastic bottle that has the bottom cut out and the screw-on top discarded to make a little greenhouse over the cutting. If you're in a really cold part of the country, I don't know exactly how you manage this in the winter or when you take the cuttings, but I know someone to ask if you're interested. Where are you located and what zone are you in? -- -=- Cass Zone 9 San Francisco Bay Area http://home.attbi.com/~cassbernstein/index.html |
#8
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Dying new growth
"Rick" wrote in message ... Hi Cass. I'm in Chula Vista CA, just south of San Diego, Zone 10. I've never propagated before but I will succeed, it's very important for me to make sure my brother and sisters get the rose from my Mother's garden so we will really have something of hers when she is gone. I'll teach my siblings the art of propagating so they too can give a rose to there children when it's time. I will also be doing a rose for my daughters. I found what may be the perfect green house for propagating new roses. I found it at the Container Store in Fashion Valley. It was made for keeping cat & dog food fresh. It looks like a small narrow thrash can about 2.5 feet high and about 6 inches wide and about 10-12 inches long with a top that seals and flips open. Clear with a white top. I plan to cut a half circle in the top about 2 inches in dia. Then getting a fender washer and cut a wedge out and screwing it over the half circle so I can slowly add fresh air to the green house. It should work. I just checked on the new roses and found them covered with aphids !!!! What can I use that will be gentle on the new growth? Besides water. Rick Zone 10 Chula Vista, CA Hello again Rick, Allegra here. BH and I were looking at your idea to make a greenhouse and it sounds great. Let us know how it works, we may want to copy you. Right now I only use the "stick them in the ground" and the hormone in the gallon pot system to propagate, both of which have worked remarkably well for me. But this is Oregon, what doesn't drown will flourish! Aphids are certainly a pain, and other than Safer soap and big, nasty showers with the dial on jet I know of no way to get rid of them. In the old days when the children were little "squish, squash the aphids" got them a couple of dollars for "working in the yard" but never got rid of the entire population. There is something I have never tried so I cannot vouch for its effectiveness and that is to mix together 1 garlic bulb, 1 small onion, 1 t cayenne pepper, 1 quart water. Steep one hour and add 1 T liquid hand soap. Store in the refrigerator. Spray with it and even the deer seems to dislike the taste. As I said I haven't tried it but it doesn't take much to strain this into a spray bottle and go after the pest. Do you know what is the name of your Mother's rose? If you do, it may be easier to find out how difficult or hopefully easier it is to propagate through some of the people here who may have tried to do that. Allegra |
#9
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Dying new growth
In article QQ2ea.140306$eG2.18014@sccrnsc03, Allegra
wrote: "Rick" wrote in message ... I just checked on the new roses and found them covered with aphids !!!! What can I use that will be gentle on the new growth? Besides water. Hello again Rick, Allegra here. BH and I were looking at your idea to make a greenhouse and it sounds great. Let us know how it works, we may want to copy you. Right now I only use the "stick them in the ground" and the hormone in the gallon pot system to propagate, both of which have worked remarkably well for me. But this is Oregon, what doesn't drown will flourish! Aphids are certainly a pain, and other than Safer soap and big, nasty showers with the dial on jet I know of no way to get rid of them. In the old days when the children were little "squish, squash the aphids" got them a couple of dollars for "working in the yard" but never got rid of the entire population. There is something I have never tried so I cannot vouch for its effectiveness and that is to mix together 1 garlic bulb, 1 small onion, 1 t cayenne pepper, 1 quart water. Steep one hour and add 1 T liquid hand soap. Store in the refrigerator. Spray with it and even the deer seems to dislike the taste. As I said I haven't tried it but it doesn't take much to strain this into a spray bottle and go after the pest. What I hear is that the predatory critters that eat aphids lag a bit in population, so they build up after you've gotten the major aphid bloom. I know nothing besides washing them off, and I mean off, away, so the little bugs can't get back up to the tender new growth. Aphids don't like wind, so I don't have much of a problem here in the coast. |
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