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Ponds, Herons and Lil'uns
"Alison" o.uk wrote
in : Subject: Ponds, Herons and Lil'uns From: "Alison" o.uk Newsgroups: uk.rec.gardening Back to this pond thing again (have read previous posts but the heron bit wasn't covered). Up until now the only 'worry' we've had with the ponds is the heron thinking it's easy fishing :-( but that has been a big worry! Now there are horrible unsightly beams straddled across both ponds with black garden netting stapled on tight. That seems to have fixed the problem but was a temporary measure until something more attractive could be found. We provided a selection of those rounded roof ridge tiles at the bottom of the pond for the fish to hide in. We still got the odd heron visit, but didn't lose any fish to it. This was a small (but fairly deep) pond with only 3 fish, so it was easy to tell! |
#3
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Ponds, Herons and Lil'uns
"Malcolm" wrote in message ... In article , sacha writes in article , Alison at o.uk wrote on 23/1/03 10:29 pm: Back to this pond thing again (have read previous posts but the heron bit wasn't covered). Up until now the only 'worry' we've had with the ponds is the heron thinking it's easy fishing :-( but that has been a big worry! Now there are horrible unsightly beams straddled across both ponds with black garden netting stapled on tight. That seems to have fixed the problem but was a temporary measure until something more attractive could be found. Now we have the double whammy of a baby on the way. I love the ponds and fish so we're not considering filling them in. One is a very informal wildlife pond (that the birds etc can't even bathe at now cos of the ugly protection) about 5m x 7m at extremities. The other is a formal round raised pond about 3m diameter with fountain in the middle. If we go the heavy-duty-wire-mesh-just-at-surface-and-not-sagging route for child safety and attractiveness, will the heron still be capable of killing the fish but not making off with them? Can I deter the blasted bird in any other supplementary way. The informal pond also has a water jet heron scarer and, whilst operational, I've never had the guts to rely on it solely for protection (hence the netting also). All suggestions warmly welcolmed as we'd like to get things in place before all the pond plants start growing again. When I had a similar sort of wild life-ish pond, I strung fishing line around the edges and criss-crossed the pond, too. Apparently, the important thing is to stop the heron wading in because that's when they catch the fish and (I'm told) they have fish attracting scent glands in their ankles. Hmm. Whoever told you that was having you on! The thing with the fishing line is that as long as you keep it absolutely taut it's almost invisible. I think a small gauge heavy duty wire mesh will do the trick for you. The herons aren't going to waste their energy trying to catch fish they can't carry off - they're not stupid! They will, however, swallow it on the spot and then fly off! Wouldn't they have to get the fish through the mesh to be able to swallow it, Malcolm? |
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Ponds, Herons and Lil'uns
In article , sacha writes in article , Malcolm at wrote on 24/1/03 8:55 am: In article , sacha writes snip Apparently, the important thing is to stop the heron wading in because that's when they catch the fish and (I'm told) they have fish attracting scent glands in their ankles. Hmm. Whoever told you that was having you on! Possibly. But they were passing it on as a bit of 'folklore' they'd been told themselves. I keep meaning to post a query on a wildlife site - must get round tuit! Err, you won't get a different answer, or at least not a different one that is correct :-)) -- Malcolm |
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Ponds, Herons and Lil'uns
in article , Malcolm at
wrote on 24/1/03 9:10 pm: In article , sacha writes in article , Malcolm at wrote on 24/1/03 8:55 am: In article , sacha writes snip Apparently, the important thing is to stop the heron wading in because that's when they catch the fish and (I'm told) they have fish attracting scent glands in their ankles. Hmm. Whoever told you that was having you on! Possibly. But they were passing it on as a bit of 'folklore' they'd been told themselves. I keep meaning to post a query on a wildlife site - must get round tuit! Err, you won't get a different answer, or at least not a different one that is correct :-)) But how do you know or indeed how do I know that you know? ;-) Are you a heron expert? -- Sacha www.hillhousenursery.co.uk |
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Ponds, Herons and Lil'uns
In article , sacha writes in article , Malcolm at wrote on 24/1/03 9:10 pm: In article , sacha writes in article , Malcolm at wrote on 24/1/03 8:55 am: In article , sacha writes snip Apparently, the important thing is to stop the heron wading in because that's when they catch the fish and (I'm told) they have fish attracting scent glands in their ankles. Hmm. Whoever told you that was having you on! Possibly. But they were passing it on as a bit of 'folklore' they'd been told themselves. I keep meaning to post a query on a wildlife site - must get round tuit! Err, you won't get a different answer, or at least not a different one that is correct :-)) But how do you know or indeed how do I know that you know? ;-) I just know :-) Are you a heron expert? A bird expert, not just herons! If you want to get technical, birds only have one main external gland, the preen gland, plus a few tiny glands in the ear opening. They don't have them in their skin, not even sweat glands. No bird has scent glands and, even if they did, to have one at the bottom of the leg would be most unlikely because the leg isn't covered with soft skin, but with a tough, leathery sheathing. -- Malcolm |
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Ponds, Herons and Lil'uns
in article , Malcolm at
wrote on 25/1/03 7:37 am: In article , sacha writes in article , Malcolm at wrote on 24/1/03 9:10 pm: In article , sacha writes in article , Malcolm at wrote on 24/1/03 8:55 am: In article , sacha writes snip Apparently, the important thing is to stop the heron wading in because that's when they catch the fish and (I'm told) they have fish attracting scent glands in their ankles. Hmm. Whoever told you that was having you on! Possibly. But they were passing it on as a bit of 'folklore' they'd been told themselves. I keep meaning to post a query on a wildlife site - must get round tuit! Err, you won't get a different answer, or at least not a different one that is correct :-)) But how do you know or indeed how do I know that you know? ;-) I just know :-) Are you a heron expert? A bird expert, not just herons! If you want to get technical, birds only have one main external gland, the preen gland, plus a few tiny glands in the ear opening. They don't have them in their skin, not even sweat glands. No bird has scent glands and, even if they did, to have one at the bottom of the leg would be most unlikely because the leg isn't covered with soft skin, but with a tough, leathery sheathing. I think I should tell you at this point that I've had an email informing me that you are indeed a *very considerable* expert, so I'm more than happy to take your word for it! Nice to know there is someone so knowledgeable on this group because queries about birdlife often come up. Now if you can just tell me why it is that jackdaws so enjoy falling down chimneys........ ;-) And why our rookery is practically empty during parts of the summer and then they all come home again......fascinating, really. -- Sacha www.hillhousenursery.co.uk |
#8
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Ponds, Herons and Lil'uns
In article , sacha writes in article , Malcolm at wrote on 25/1/03 7:37 am: In article , sacha writes Are you a heron expert? A bird expert, not just herons! If you want to get technical, birds only have one main external gland, the preen gland, plus a few tiny glands in the ear opening. They don't have them in their skin, not even sweat glands. No bird has scent glands and, even if they did, to have one at the bottom of the leg would be most unlikely because the leg isn't covered with soft skin, but with a tough, leathery sheathing. I think I should tell you at this point that I've had an email informing me that you are indeed a *very considerable* expert, Have you, now? Hmm, I wonder who that could have been, though I think I can guess... so I'm more than happy to take your word for it! Phew! Nice to know there is someone so knowledgeable on this group because queries about birdlife often come up. Oh, I've been here quite a while, because I'm a keen gardener, and have sometimes answered queries about birdlife, as a way of repaying all the good advice on offer here about gardening. Now if you can just tell me why it is that jackdaws so enjoy falling down chimneys........ ;-) They're just copying the starlings, though they're not as good at it, being larger :-) And why our rookery is practically empty during parts of the summer and then they all come home again......fascinating, really. Once the young have left the nest, they are taken by their parents out into the countryside looking for sources of food, staying as a family group within a larger flock. The young are fed by their parents for about six weeks or so. Once they have become independent, the parents are free to come back to the rookery, which they usually do in September-October, occasionally earlier, and from then on take a natural interest in it (sometimes sporadic depending on the weather) until nest-building starts in earnest in the early spring. -- Malcolm |
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Ponds, Herons and Lil'uns
"sacha" wrote in message . uk... in article , Malcolm at wrote on 24/1/03 9:10 pm: In article , sacha writes in article , Malcolm at wrote on 24/1/03 8:55 am: In article , sacha writes snip Apparently, the important thing is to stop the heron wading in because that's when they catch the fish and (I'm told) they have fish attracting scent glands in their ankles. Hmm. Whoever told you that was having you on! Possibly. But they were passing it on as a bit of 'folklore' they'd been told themselves. I keep meaning to post a query on a wildlife site - must get round tuit! Err, you won't get a different answer, or at least not a different one that is correct :-)) But how do you know or indeed how do I know that you know? ;-) Are you a heron expert? Yes, he is - anything with beak and feathers, Malcolm can probably give you chapter and verse (and he is very knowledgeable about most wildlife, not just birds, too). Although Herons do not have fish attracting scent glands on their ankles, one heron has been observed dropping bits of bread (filched from people feeding ducks) into the water to attract small fish within striking range. Incidentally, I've tried the 'string around the perimeter' technique to deter herons from my pond, and I've still lost fish. |
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Ponds, Herons and Lil'uns
in article , Malcolm at
wrote on 25/1/03 7:29 pm: In article , sacha writes snip And why our rookery is practically empty during parts of the summer and then they all come home again......fascinating, really. Once the young have left the nest, they are taken by their parents out into the countryside looking for sources of food, staying as a family group within a larger flock. The young are fed by their parents for about six weeks or so. Once they have become independent, the parents are free to come back to the rookery, which they usually do in September-October, occasionally earlier, and from then on take a natural interest in it (sometimes sporadic depending on the weather) until nest-building starts in earnest in the early spring. Thank you! We've seen signs of them starting to build now but I imagine it's not serious construction work yet. The sparrows are certainly nest building, though. I was fascinated to learn about the rooks that the reason one sees them flying in pairs to pick up twigs but only one of them coming back with a stick, is that the unencumbered one is the male riding 'shotgun' to prevent 'his woman' from mating with another! -- Sacha www.hillhousenursery.co.uk |
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Ponds, Herons and Lil'uns
In article , sacha writes in article , Malcolm at wrote on 25/1/03 7:29 pm: In article , sacha writes snip And why our rookery is practically empty during parts of the summer and then they all come home again......fascinating, really. Once the young have left the nest, they are taken by their parents out into the countryside looking for sources of food, staying as a family group within a larger flock. The young are fed by their parents for about six weeks or so. Once they have become independent, the parents are free to come back to the rookery, which they usually do in September-October, occasionally earlier, and from then on take a natural interest in it (sometimes sporadic depending on the weather) until nest-building starts in earnest in the early spring. Thank you! We've seen signs of them starting to build now but I imagine it's not serious construction work yet. The sparrows are certainly nest building, though. I was fascinated to learn about the rooks that the reason one sees them flying in pairs to pick up twigs but only one of them coming back with a stick, is that the unencumbered one is the male riding 'shotgun' to prevent 'his woman' from mating with another! Who've you been listening to again? Ask your informant how they know this and why it isn't the male having to carry the stick because the female doesn't want him chasing after other females? As the sexes are identical in plumage, it's almost impossible to say which is which when they're in flight, and pretty difficult even if you see them side by side on the nest, when the male is very slightly the larger. Of course, if you happen to see them copulate, then the male is the one on top! In fact, studies have shown that it is the male which usually does most of the stick collecting while the female does more of the actual building of the nest. And it is often normal for the female to stand guard over the nest to stop neighbours stealing twigs from it while the male is away twig collecting. -- Malcolm |
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Ponds, Herons and Lil'uns
"Malcolm" wrote in message ... In article , sacha writes in article , Malcolm at wrote on 25/1/03 7:29 pm: In article , sacha writes snip snip I was fascinated to learn about the rooks that the reason one sees them flying in pairs to pick up twigs but only one of them coming back with a stick, is that the unencumbered one is the male riding 'shotgun' to prevent 'his woman' from mating with another! Who've you been listening to again? Ask your informant how they know this and why it isn't the male having to carry the stick because the female doesn't want him chasing after other females? Haven't you heard, Malcolm? It's the latest in corvid female cosmetics, 'beak-stick' :-) |
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Ponds, Herons and Lil'uns
in article , Malcolm at
wrote on 27/1/03 10:06 pm: snip sacha wrote: I was fascinated to learn about the rooks that the reason one sees them flying in pairs to pick up twigs but only one of them coming back with a stick, is that the unencumbered one is the male riding 'shotgun' to prevent 'his woman' from mating with another! Who've you been listening to again? Ask your informant how they know this and why it isn't the male having to carry the stick because the female doesn't want him chasing after other females? As the sexes are identical in plumage, it's almost impossible to say which is which when they're in flight, and pretty difficult even if you see them side by side on the nest, when the male is very slightly the larger. Of course, if you happen to see them copulate, then the male is the one on top! I might just notice that. Being a female and all..... ;-) In fact, studies have shown that it is the male which usually does most of the stick collecting while the female does more of the actual building of the nest. And it is often normal for the female to stand guard over the nest to stop neighbours stealing twigs from it while the male is away twig collecting. I hope I haven't misquoted someone but I asked on the ornithology group quite a while back and I thought I correctly remembered that as the answer I got. I watch rooks and jackdaws wandering around the lawn in the very early morning hours, squabbling over the food and behaving like yobs generally but I can't pretend to tell males from females! -- Sacha www.hillhousenursery.co.uk |
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Ponds, Herons and Lil'uns
in article , BAC at
wrote on 28/1/03 9:20 am: "Malcolm" wrote in message ... In article , sacha writes in article , Malcolm at wrote on 25/1/03 7:29 pm: In article , sacha writes snip snip I was fascinated to learn about the rooks that the reason one sees them flying in pairs to pick up twigs but only one of them coming back with a stick, is that the unencumbered one is the male riding 'shotgun' to prevent 'his woman' from mating with another! Who've you been listening to again? Ask your informant how they know this and why it isn't the male having to carry the stick because the female doesn't want him chasing after other females? Haven't you heard, Malcolm? It's the latest in corvid female cosmetics, 'beak-stick' :-) Oh now that is VERY good! -- Sacha www.hillhousenursery.co.uk |
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