Gunner wrote:

I really do not have the time today to wrestle the pig, but I promise
I will address your points if there really are any bird. The first
time I read I did not see any but still. Meantime go read some of
the references I gave billy below as well as Milpa & swidden

Milpa and Swidden what?


Understand you are talking about monoculture. Don't know where native
plants came in.

specifically we were talking about how to
deal with arid land that is barren and lacking
much cover at all. that is land that is on the
verge of desertification. i mentioned setting
up rocks to start a reforestation effort and
then you said something about the three sisters
which are not involved in reforestation (they
can play a later role in a more sustainable
agricultural setup, but initially the idea is
to get some shade and trees to support wild
life). the rock line captures water even for a
moment and allows more of it to soak in and it
also captures seeds that blow on the wind.
native seeds. so there is no overt agriculture
going on to start with, just getting some shade
and trees that produce food/fruit and wood for
people to use (eventually).

notice that this natural and native setup
does not need any additional irrigation because
it is using native seeds and it needs no
subsidies because the seeds are there already.
the only thing it needs is people to line up
the rocks and then for them to keep the animals
from eating the new growth and for them to not
over harvest wood or burn the hedge/trees. once
you get one line going the shade and treeline
will act as a continual source of other seeds
for the surrounding area and it will harbor
plants and animals.

i'm not talking theory here, i'm talking what
has been tried and found to work for low cost
reforestation in arid regions.


Still subsidies are subsidies regardless of who they go to. Get the
people a real job instead of giving them water, seed and money to
continue to screwing up the fragile eco system of this arid regions.

i don't see how sustainable methods using
native plants is screwing up a fragile
ecosystem. it's restoring an ecosystem likely
damaged by war, fire, over grazing, monoculture
farms, irrigation, etc. and really, i'm not
talking about jobs here, i'm talking about
growing food to live as simply as possible.
jobs are things that people have who are not on
the brink of starvation because their land is
destroyed.


songbird