"Torsten Brinch" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 8 Nov 2002 02:54:29 -0600, "Gordon Couger"
wrote:


"Torsten Brinch" wrote in message
.. .

If there were to be toxic protein in the brains of BSE cows,
there should be at least sproadic reports of acute cases of dementia
in humans caused by the sunday dinner, and there should be huge
masses of supporting animal evidence for the acute toxic effects of
BSE brain muck. But quite on the contrary, there is a vast body of
evidence proving beyond any doubt, that experimental animals tolerate
large acute doses of BSE muck with no ill effect. IOW, we do not have
a clue what vCJD is caused by, and to be worse very many people think
it is caused by something that the EPA has determined that it cannot
be caused by.

The fantasicly intestisting thing about the TSE diseses is they are an
entirely new class of diseases. The incubation peroiod are so slow and
the
method of transmision counter to what we think we know about he digestion
of
protiens it will be a long time getting the research done.

Again, compare with the time delayed effect of methyl mercury.
We would not say that a person who has just ingested a dose
of methyl mercury which will in time make him go down with
neurological disease, has had a disease transmitted to him, nor
would we say that the time passing until his symptoms appear
is an incubation time. We would say that he has been exposed
to a toxic dose of methylmercury, sufficient to cause chronic
effects.
--------------------------------
It would be facinting to find out how and why man contacts vCJD with so few
pateints I expect a guess will be best they can do with spieces that catch
TSE diseases not developed in their species.

Probably our best bet scrapie or CWD. If I were to guess and it is a guess
only if come from sniffing another animal wiht and getting the protien on
the nerve endings of the nerves that do the smelling. The ony reason for the
guess is it is the shortest path to the brain. It may well be licking and a
oral route.


When you look at
the economic return on investment of reserch in TSE's the return is very
poor. It is simple not worth the opertunity cost spent on it when there
are
more important things to spend money on.

Well, in practice it apparently has been worth a Nobel prize, and a
whole lot of research besides, and the knowledge gathered so far has
made pretty much everyone adopt the view that proteins may well exist
which act by chronic toxicity mechanism while causing effects which
can not be provoked by short term feeding experiments using large
doses.
==================
Discovering a completly new mode of disease tramission is the stuff Nobe
prizes are made their econimic revalace is not a consideration.

The US EPA, in the context of GM approvals, is a notable exception.
In that context the EPA has determined, that it is 'known' that when
proteins are toxic they act invariably by acute mechanism and in very
small doses. That is quite expedient, because that means one can just
feed large doses of the protein to the calf for a few days to prove
that no ill effect can come from the ingestion of the protein in the
feed in the long term.
===========
Prions are not toxic in the usual sense that cause the body to make more of
them clogging up the works. The EPA head has been replaced wih a science guy
insted of a political guy I expect things will start to get streightined out
there.

Getting vCJD appears to be two to 3 times as likely as being
killed by lighiningin the UK. I must confess I would prefer lightineing.

That's an idiotic comparison, don't try to get a job in risk
communication.

Give a better example of you chancge of getting vCJD.

I can't find the number on cattle killed by ligthing

Oh well. Putting up that number here would be idiotic and it's hard to
see how you can find use for on this avenue anyway.

but the Mad Cow numers
range from 300,000 to 3,000,000. I the lower number is the ones diagnosed
and ones reasonable expected to have died from BSE and I know that the
UK
has much better reporting than the US but I am sure that in the early
part
of the out break it was low and probalbly to some extent all throug the
out
break.How every even if you take the high figure it was not an economicly
disatorus disease

considerably more disastrous than lightning, tho' :-)

Regardless the only thing that mad a economic problem of Mad Cow Disease is
caused by the press and the governments bungling. Higher risks like
Ecoli:157, listeria, salmonella, that we have real solutions for we are not
interested enough to get around to irradiating the food after it is
packaged. In fact the greens are against it. Again with no proof against 50
year of proof that it has caused no harm. We also have the solution to BSE
don't feed cows MBM.

Gordon