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Grass gardens
I've been wanting to try some of this fancy grass garden thing for a while.
Today I bought some grass! I'm on a mountain in the Monara/ACT region, it's very windy, very shaley hydro-phobic soil, and usually quite dry. We have irrigation to get thigns (trees!) to grow, but I've a preference not to do this. The spot I'm going to experiment with, before doing a proper large grass garden, is a little scrap strip at the base of a rock wall, and enclosed by flat paving. I'm hoping the water from the lawn at the top of the wall will filter down to my little grasses, and the paving will also trap moisture. I want to do something like a minature landscape, with indigenous rocks, and tufty grass. What I really like is Poa-type grass, snowgrass being the best, but shopping in teh rain today, best prospect I found was some Blue Fescue stuff. Had been idly thinking of Mondo, although it's not really my thing, but lady at the nursery said it's more of a watering grass. So I'm back with the dry tufty types to start with. Anyway, can anyone see problems with this blue Fescue? And are there any other good tough tufty grasses easily obtainable? It's hot and dry in summer, (and windy), cold and dry and windy in winter. I want to make something with embedded rocks, and tufts, maybe a little bit of gravel... like a bonsai landscape. -- ant |
Grass gardens
"ant" wrote in message
I'm on a mountain in the Monara/ACT region, it's very windy, very shaley hydro-phobic soil, and usually quite dry. What I really like is Poa-type grass, snowgrass being the best, but shopping in teh rain today, best prospect I found was some Blue Fescue stuff. Had been idly thinking of Mondo, although it's not really my thing, but lady at the nursery said it's more of a watering grass. So I'm back with the dry tufty types to start with. Anyway, can anyone see problems with this blue Fescue? And are there any other good tough tufty grasses easily obtainable? It's hot and dry in summer, (and windy), cold and dry and windy in winter. Just how much Poa do you want? You can stop by the roadside on the way to Cooma and dig out as much Poa as you like. |
Grass gardens
Farm1 wrote:
Just how much Poa do you want? You can stop by the roadside on the way to Cooma and dig out as much Poa as you like. true, and I have quite a bit of something which I THINK is Poa on my place. Trouble is, my region is infested with Serrated Tussock, and I'm buggered if i can tell the difference. I was eyeing some nice looking tufts on the driveway today, but i just don't know which is which, and I'd feel like an idiot planting up a Special Grass Garden with serrated tussock! (it'd grow too big, too). I think that the tufty stuff on my hilltop is proper alpine poa, but have my suspicions about stuff lower down, nearer the trees. -- ant |
Grass gardens
this site might help identifyng the serrated tussock
http://www.dpi.vic.gov.au/dpi/nrenin...00128CA256BCF0 00AD548ECC844336D72F0634A256DEA00293F8A "ant" wrote in message ... Farm1 wrote: Just how much Poa do you want? You can stop by the roadside on the way to Cooma and dig out as much Poa as you like. true, and I have quite a bit of something which I THINK is Poa on my place. Trouble is, my region is infested with Serrated Tussock, and I'm buggered if i can tell the difference. I was eyeing some nice looking tufts on the driveway today, but i just don't know which is which, and I'd feel like an idiot planting up a Special Grass Garden with serrated tussock! (it'd grow too big, too). I think that the tufty stuff on my hilltop is proper alpine poa, but have my suspicions about stuff lower down, nearer the trees. -- ant |
Grass gardens
loosecanon wrote:
this site might help identifyng the serrated tussock http://www.dpi.vic.gov.au/dpi/nrenin...00128CA256BCF0 00AD548ECC844336D72F0634A256DEA00293F8A Thanks. I've been to a weeds day, got a coloured sheet handout, all the stuff, and I'm still scratching my head. Nearest thing I can find in it is that the serrated tussock has purple bases. Haven't found any of those yet, but there's some things near the trees that develop long seed fronds in summer. thing is I don't want to be ripping out good grass mistakenly thinking it's serrated tussock. Maybe I should volunteer my place for the next weed day. Looking at the site though, all the big stuff down near the trees may well be serrated tussock.Great! -- ant |
Grass gardens
ant wrote: loosecanon wrote: this site might help identifyng the serrated tussock http://www.dpi.vic.gov.au/dpi/nrenin...00128CA256BCF0 00AD548ECC844336D72F0634A256DEA00293F8A Thanks. I've been to a weeds day, got a coloured sheet handout, all the stuff, and I'm still scratching my head. Nearest thing I can find in it is that the serrated tussock has purple bases. Haven't found any of those yet, but there's some things near the trees that develop long seed fronds in summer. thing is I don't want to be ripping out good grass mistakenly thinking it's serrated tussock. Maybe I should volunteer my place for the next weed day. Looking at the site though, all the big stuff down near the trees may well be serrated tussock.Great! -- ant Take a look at http://www.weeds.crc.org.au/document...ed_tussock.pdf They refer to the Tasmanian DPI's checklist for identifying ST and that states that " "The leaf cases are more tightly packed and more slender than other tussocks and are a whitish colour - never purplr or blue-green" The seed heads create quite a fire hazard in the outer western suburbs of Melbourne. |
Grass gardens
GreenieLeBrun wrote:
ant wrote: loosecanon wrote: this site might help identifyng the serrated tussock http://www.dpi.vic.gov.au/dpi/nrenin...00128CA256BCF0 00AD548ECC844336D72F0634A256DEA00293F8A Thanks. I've been to a weeds day, got a coloured sheet handout, all the stuff, and I'm still scratching my head. Nearest thing I can find in it is that the serrated tussock has purple bases. Haven't found any of those yet, but there's some things near the trees that develop long seed fronds in summer. thing is I don't want to be ripping out good grass mistakenly thinking it's serrated tussock. Maybe I should volunteer my place for the next weed day. Looking at the site though, all the big stuff down near the trees may well be serrated tussock.Great! Take a look at http://www.weeds.crc.org.au/document...ed_tussock.pdf They refer to the Tasmanian DPI's checklist for identifying ST and that states that " "The leaf cases are more tightly packed and more slender than other tussocks and are a whitish colour - never purplr or blue-green" argh. they say never purple, but hte previous site said the fluffy seed-mess is purple! and my sheet, I'm pretty sure, says the seating for the leaves etc at the base is purple. The seed heads create quite a fire hazard in the outer western suburbs of Melbourne. I do get some of the heads rolling up and becoming tumble weed type things. But it could be good tussock, not evil tussock. Very frustrating. -- ant |
Grass gardens
hi ant
i can see the problem, this website mentions several grasses that look like serrated tussock, see the heading "look alikes" http://www.esc.nsw.gov.au/Weeds/Shee...%20tussock.htm and this one points out how similar poa is to serrated tussock: http://www.sgaonline.org.au/weed_nas...richotoma.html but i've learned a lot about grass weeds just because you asked! ant wrote: I do get some of the heads rolling up and becoming tumble weed type things. But it could be good tussock, not evil tussock. Very frustrating. |
Grass gardens
jils wrote:
hi ant i can see the problem, this website mentions several grasses that look like serrated tussock, see the heading "look alikes" http://www.esc.nsw.gov.au/Weeds/Shee...%20tussock.htm and this one points out how similar poa is to serrated tussock: http://www.sgaonline.org.au/weed_nas...richotoma.html but i've learned a lot about grass weeds just because you asked! I've got a lot of stuff that looks like the first picture, but I've never seen rolling masses of that white flossy stuff. Purple seems to be the main way of IDing it though. It's terrible stuff, useless as a nutrient so animals eat it but get no benefit. -- ant |
Grass gardens
"ant" wrote in message
... Farm1 wrote: Just how much Poa do you want? You can stop by the roadside on the way to Cooma and dig out as much Poa as you like. true, and I have quite a bit of something which I THINK is Poa on my place. Trouble is, my region is infested with Serrated Tussock, and I'm buggered if i can tell the difference. Serrated is very fine and will look almost purplish is you catch it in a sideways light in Autumn when the seed heads are on it. Poa (in all it's guisdes) is a much more robust beast. BTW, if you have got serrated, get onto it in Spring or otherwise the mogrel will take over your block and end up strangling you in your bed. |
Grass gardens
"ant" wrote in message
... GreenieLeBrun wrote: ant wrote: loosecanon wrote: this site might help identifyng the serrated tussock http://www.dpi.vic.gov.au/dpi/nrenin...A3C187100128CA 256BCF0 00AD548ECC844336D72F0634A256DEA00293F8A Thanks. I've been to a weeds day, got a coloured sheet handout, all the stuff, and I'm still scratching my head. Nearest thing I can find in it is that the serrated tussock has purple bases. Haven't found any of those yet, but there's some things near the trees that develop long seed fronds in summer. thing is I don't want to be ripping out good grass mistakenly thinking it's serrated tussock. Maybe I should volunteer my place for the next weed day. Looking at the site though, all the big stuff down near the trees may well be serrated tussock.Great! Take a look at http://www.weeds.crc.org.au/document...ed_tussock.pdf They refer to the Tasmanian DPI's checklist for identifying ST and that states that " "The leaf cases are more tightly packed and more slender than other tussocks and are a whitish colour - never purplr or blue-green" argh. they say never purple, but hte previous site said the fluffy seed-mess is purple! It isn't a full on purple people eater type purple, more a tinge of purple if you look at it side on and get a good lot of it to see at one time - Autumn is the best tiem for this. I could send you a sample if you'd like :-)) |
Grass gardens
Back to your original question........
Have you thought of putting in some Stipa grasses? They are quite elegant and there are soem wild hereabouts. |
Grass gardens
Farm1 wrote:
"ant" wrote in message ... Farm1 wrote: Just how much Poa do you want? You can stop by the roadside on the way to Cooma and dig out as much Poa as you like. true, and I have quite a bit of something which I THINK is Poa on my place. Trouble is, my region is infested with Serrated Tussock, and I'm buggered if i can tell the difference. Serrated is very fine and will look almost purplish is you catch it in a sideways light in Autumn when the seed heads are on it. Poa (in all it's guisdes) is a much more robust beast. BTW, if you have got serrated, get onto it in Spring or otherwise the mogrel will take over your block and end up strangling you in your bed. That's the paterson's curse! I spray it with everything going, and always there's a few taht survive. There's about an acre of it, with the thistles, just lurking and riding the frosts, waiting for it to warm up. I'm going to hit it hard this spring, had enough of it. The purple thing is what I always remember from the various info sheets about Serrated. I just haven't seen it here, but still... and it's so hard to nuke, it's a bit like bamboo. Meanwhile, I very much like poa, especially snowgrass. The local nurseries all flog the Blue Fescue, which worked well in my miniture version, but I have aspirations to something a bit more exotic. -- ant |
Grass gardens
Farm1 wrote:
Back to your original question........ Have you thought of putting in some Stipa grasses? They are quite elegant and there are soem wild hereabouts. Never heard of it. Is it fine like Snowgrass, or more whippy? A neighbour grows the various grasses for landscaping, and I'm planning on tackling him this weekend. Not sure if punters can buy his stuff or if it's just for landscapers. He has an amazing range of stuff though. -- ant |
Grass gardens
"ant" wrote in message
Farm1 wrote: Have you thought of putting in some Stipa grasses? They are quite elegant and there are soem wild hereabouts. Never heard of it. Is it fine like Snowgrass, or more whippy? I don't know Snowgrass. Stipa is all the range in UK gardening magazines but it grows wild and naturally around this region and is a lovely clumping grass which isn't invasive but gets really nice seed heads on it. Stips Gigantea is the one I keep seeing referred to int he UK mags. Micheal McCoy (the Aus dry garden bloke) uses it to great effect. Here's some info on all sorts of grasses including Stipa http://www.acsgarden.com/article_item.aspx?id=46 http://www.abc.net.au/gardening/stories/s787872.htm http://www.abc.net.au/gardening/stories/s1063711.htm |
Grass gardens
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Grass gardens
Farm1 wrote:
"ant" wrote in message The purple thing is what I always remember from the various info sheets about Serrated. I just haven't seen it here, but still... and it's so hard to nuke, it's a bit like bamboo. It's not if you do it in the Spring and use a mixture of Roundup and Target. I've just got to confirm that it's Serrated first! I don't want to kill the good stuff. -- ant |
Grass gardens
Farm1 wrote:
"ant" wrote in message Farm1 wrote: Have you thought of putting in some Stipa grasses? They are quite elegant and there are soem wild hereabouts. Never heard of it. Is it fine like Snowgrass, or more whippy? I don't know Snowgrass. Snowgrass is the poa that grows up in the alpine areas, the snowfields. Very dense clumpy low poa. Very soft, too. Stipa is all the range in UK gardening magazines but it grows wild and naturally around this region and is a lovely clumping grass which isn't invasive but gets really nice seed heads on it. Looks like Pampas Grass!!!!! Stips Gigantea is the one I keep seeing referred to int he UK mags. Micheal McCoy (the Aus dry garden bloke) uses it to great effect. Here's some info on all sorts of grasses including Stipa http://www.acsgarden.com/article_item.aspx?id=46 http://www.abc.net.au/gardening/stories/s787872.htm http://www.abc.net.au/gardening/stories/s1063711.htm Those are useful sites, thanks. -- ant |
Grass gardens
"ant" wrote in message
Farm1 wrote: "ant" wrote in message The purple thing is what I always remember from the various info sheets about Serrated. I just haven't seen it here, but still... and it's so hard to nuke, it's a bit like bamboo. It's not if you do it in the Spring and use a mixture of Roundup and Target. I've just got to confirm that it's Serrated first! I don't want to kill the good stuff. :-)) As I said before, if you need a sample, I'd be happy to send you one or more (VBG). |
Grass gardens
"ant" wrote in message
... Farm1 wrote: "ant" wrote in message Farm1 wrote: Have you thought of putting in some Stipa grasses? They are quite elegant and there are soem wild hereabouts. Never heard of it. Is it fine like Snowgrass, or more whippy? I don't know Snowgrass. Snowgrass is the poa that grows up in the alpine areas, the snowfields. Very dense clumpy low poa. Very soft, too. Stipa is all the range in UK gardening magazines but it grows wild and naturally around this region and is a lovely clumping grass which isn't invasive but gets really nice seed heads on it. Looks like Pampas Grass!!!!! Nah, it's way too small! Stips Gigantea is the one I keep seeing referred to int he UK mags. Micheal McCoy (the Aus dry garden bloke) uses it to great effect. Here's some info on all sorts of grasses including Stipa http://www.acsgarden.com/article_item.aspx?id=46 http://www.abc.net.au/gardening/stories/s787872.htm http://www.abc.net.au/gardening/stories/s1063711.htm Those are useful sites, thanks. I was reading Beth Chattos "Gravel Garden" book last night and it has some of the grasses but lots of other good ideas for a dry and foully, gravelly soil with only a 24 inch rainfall with lots of wind - the photo of the "soil" she planted into is amazing - more rocks of up to fist size than soil but then she ends up with a stunning garden as only Poms seem to be able to achieve (sigh). If you are a keen gardener then I'd recommend buying it but if you are only looking for ideas then I would recommend borrowing it through al library even if you ahve to shel out the $3.50 for the interlibrary loan fee. |
Grass gardens
Farm1 wrote:
"ant" wrote in message Farm1 wrote: "ant" wrote in message The purple thing is what I always remember from the various info sheets about Serrated. I just haven't seen it here, but still... and it's so hard to nuke, it's a bit like bamboo. It's not if you do it in the Spring and use a mixture of Roundup and Target. I've just got to confirm that it's Serrated first! I don't want to kill the good stuff. :-)) As I said before, if you need a sample, I'd be happy to send you one or more (VBG). erk. I think I just go dig around in my suspect clumps, looking for purple. And lay in supplies for the Paterson's, it's sneaking around everywhere. I had a wondeful backpack silver squirt thing (my block is steep), but got a bit too ambitious and kept spraying too far into spring one year. It was a warm, humid heavy day, a snake day, and I was in the middle of a huge colony of Paterson's, keeping a hard eye on everything on the ground, and there is was, lying under a small tree, a brown, just looking at me. Well, me and the backpack parted company and neither of us touched the ground for about 30 seconds. I swear I levitated out of that mass of Patersons. Phobic about snakes. The backpack spent the summer there, and now the seals are buggered and it doesn't work any more. Bloody snakes. -- ant |
Grass gardens
Farm1 wrote:
I was reading Beth Chattos "Gravel Garden" book last night and it has some of the grasses but lots of other good ideas for a dry and foully, gravelly soil with only a 24 inch rainfall with lots of wind - the photo of the "soil" she planted into is amazing - more rocks of up to fist size than soil You've just described my place! We had to kangahammer holes for the piers for the house (42 of them), through the shale and some bigger rock. You'd end up with a lot more rock than earth. the piles of rubble are still there under the house next to each pier. A lot of the dirt is gone, leaving just the chips and rock. The wind isn't as bad as it was, due to the 50 Lleylandii cypress we planted in a giant mass to the west. Need more though. but then she ends up with a stunning garden as only Poms seem to be able to achieve (sigh). If you are a keen gardener then I'd recommend buying it but if you are only looking for ideas then I would recommend borrowing it through al library even if you ahve to shel out the $3.50 for the interlibrary loan fee. Sounds like a nice book, even just to read. but sounds like it'd be useful. I'll ferret it out. My mother is a horticulturalist and very successful nursery owner, but she's always been into English style gardens and just doesn't understand my hydrophobic soil, the wind, the dryness. she put a bloody fernery under my eastern deck for goddsake. Tattered struggling things they are. Then she planted a camellia next to it. Words fail me. There are lovely dry gardens in our area... the sculpture garden down at the National Gallery, for instance, and over at the Botanical Gardens there's a real beauty. My mother thinks a grass garden is a mass of grass that'll catch fire. I see a grass garden as sort of minature landscape, with paving, rocks placed carefully, gravel, and grasses. A book would help, pictures showing what can be done. I'll check it out. Thanks! -- ant |
Grass gardens
"ant" wrote in message
erk. I think I just go dig around in my suspect clumps, looking for purple. There must be someone around you who could identify it for you. Any farers near you? They usually know their weeds And lay in supplies for the Paterson's, it's sneaking around everywhere. I had a wondeful backpack silver squirt thing (my block is steep), but got a bit too ambitious and kept spraying too far into spring one year. It was a warm, humid heavy day, a snake day, and I was in the middle of a huge colony of Paterson's, keeping a hard eye on everything on the ground, and there is was, lying under a small tree, a brown, just looking at me. Well, me and the backpack parted company and neither of us touched the ground for about 30 seconds. I swear I levitated out of that mass of Patersons. Phobic about snakes. The backpack spent the summer there, and now the seals are buggered and it doesn't work any more. Bloody snakes. You have my sympathies. I have a brown that lives somewhere near my front door and a tiger that lives somewhere near my back door. I asked for a shotugn for Xmas and my dopy husband bought me a camera. I fail to understand how he could possibly mix up my comment about wanting to shoot something in such a way. |
Grass gardens
"ant" wrote in message
Farm1 wrote: but then she ends up with a stunning garden as only Poms seem to be able to achieve (sigh). If you are a keen gardener then I'd recommend buying it but if you are only looking for ideas then I would recommend borrowing it through al library even if you ahve to shel out the $3.50 for the interlibrary loan fee. Sounds like a nice book, even just to read. but sounds like it'd be useful. I'll ferret it out. My mother is a horticulturalist and very successful nursery owner, but she's always been into English style gardens and just doesn't understand my hydrophobic soil, the wind, the dryness. she put a bloody fernery under my eastern deck for goddsake. Tattered struggling things they are. Then she planted a camellia next to it. Words fail me. LOL. Take heart. I started in this place with some very rotten dirt and the hydophobic soil too. It took me a long time of using manure and mulch but each year things do get better. I now have worms and instead of being a pale calf sht yellow colour I now have soem areas of rich brown soil. I found a neighbour who has horses and no garden. I now get ute loads of manure and spread it fresh and then mulch over the poop. I don't have time to age it and I find that it doesn't seem to make any difference to the ornamental plants. For the veg, I just spread it on the beds at the beginning of winter anf fallow them with leaf or lucerns straw mucl on top - come spring it's lovely. BTW, not all English style plants are a failure in our area - it just means choosing the right ones. Tell your mother to give you some Euphorbia s - they do reasonably well in rotten soilb ut do brilliantly in better soil. I buy 2 English gardenign mags - "Garedens Illustrated" and "The English Garden" as I find that the ideas are so good int hem for design and mass planting but then I have to choose the local do good plants. There are lovely dry gardens in our area... the sculpture garden down at the National Gallery, for instance, and over at the Botanical Gardens there's a real beauty. Yes they are lovely, especially the sculpture garden. But go for a walk through the ANU at sometime - good ideas there. Also go off to some fo the open gardesn roudn here - lots of good ones round here. Try to get to Michelago if it's ever open. My mother thinks a grass garden is a mass of grass that'll catch fire. I see a grass garden as sort of minature landscape, with paving, rocks placed carefully, gravel, and grasses. A book would help, pictures showing what can be done. I'll check it out. Thanks! Sa'llright. Don't neglect to think about using sawdust - it is great if you can find bulk manure to mix it with. |
Grass gardens
ant
I've been thinking about your situation and since I've been there and have the T-shirt I thought you might have some interest in my experiences or some advice. Ignore if it doesn't interest you. My first piece of advice is the old military adage: "time spent in reconaissance is never wasted". By that I mean that you should visit as many Open Gardens in the Monaro/Cooma/Taralga/Goulburn/Yass/Gundaroo (Dick Smith's garden at Gundaroo is well worth a visit if/when it's open again) etc districts as you can. Don't bother with Canberra as it is no longer the old hard and hungry Limestone Plains. 30 years ago it was impossible to grow normal azaleas in Canberra. If one wanted azaleas it was the deciduous Mollis Azaleas or nothing. Now normal azaleas are common as the climate has changed. Those other places I mention are still hard and hungry and good gardens in those places (and there are a surpring number of them) will teach you heaps. Take lots of photos if you do go and refer to them later as you will see new things each time and take a notebook as well and note what is growing well. If you can't get to open gardens when they are open then take the family/yourself for a drive to any of those places and squizz over fences. Even a shopping trip to Cooma can be used as a learning experience by doing that (I'm a great fence-over-squizzer and so often as I'm doing it I've been invited in by the owners for a look [once they know I'm not up to no good] gardeners love to show off their gardens). Advice 2 - use your Mum. She may not yet understand the requirements of your garden but she should be a great source for you for finding plants - the tough ones that are often not available in local nurseries but which do well in our hard and hungry conditions. For example, she should know about places like Lambley Nursery etc that specialises in dry plants. Once you increase your knowledge of what will grow she may also be able to help you inboth identifying and sourcing such things. Some books I love. The old (and I mean really old) editions of "The Canberra Gardener". The new one is shit IMHO but the old ones from the early 60s etc are great (even though they are a bit anal in the neatness, orderliness way). Another local book which I would not lend to anyone is "The Indolent Kitchen Gardener" by Libby Smith. It has advice and information in it that I have never seen elsewhere and it's applicable beyond the kitchen garden. Now some 'doing' advice. I've had soil that was the colour of the sort of shit a calf does when it has the scours (pale yellow) and set like concrete. It was so bad that I'd spend an hour with a pick putting 2.5 cm dents in the soil and would then water for 2 hours and go back the next day and do another hour putting the same sized dents in the soil etc ad nauseum. This same soil is now full of worms and dark brown and friable till I reach what I now call the 'real' sub soil (it's still all really subsoil but its now good enough to be considered topsoil). It could still do with improvement but it gets better each year. So, after the chip, water, chip, water etc routine, what I did was just keep working at it till I could break it into huge clods (about the size of a big fork head). I'd then fertilize it with anything I had ranging from chook poo straight from under the roosts to Dynamic Lifter, cow plops etc. I'd then loosely cover it with straw and water it regualry and leave it for a while and the go back a few weeks later and pull off the mulch and rework it etc. (Mind you this was in a "Rose Bed" where the sodding garden designer who did the garden for the previous owner had put 70 roses under weed mat - the only worms I found were above the weed mat in the pine bark mulch - it took me years about 10 years to get through this whole bed and the worst thing was getting rid of the mulch and the weed mat - God knows how any of the poor roses survived but they did.). Now that I have access to huge quantities of horse poo, I use that straight as I get it - sometimes it's almost steaming but I've found that the plants don't seem to mind that and the worms seem to love it. All the epxerts say to "age" it - I dont' have the time or the energy. By the time I've loaded it into the ute, I'm so stuffed that I just want to dump it a squcikly and as easily as possible. It does mean more weeding but the soil is improved by it so much that the weeds aren't a problem to remove. Contrary to the accepted advice given by the "experts" in our area, be very wary of mulching heavily. Unless you can deliver copious and regualr quantities of water in the summer then you'll find that you are constantly having to pull off the mulch and water deeply and then put it all back. I've found that only a thin layer of mulch used as a shading and wind desiccation protection device works best. In winter when the rains are good I mulch more heavily and by spring the worms have got it to about the right level for summer. Worms. Concentrate on feeding them and breeding them up and forget about the plants or soil fertility or anything else. What the worms love will be THE best way to build the soil, but let the worms do your work for you. They love lucerne - it's expensive in both the bale form or as the horse food chaff version but worth every penny of the money spent on it. I buy bales of lucerne and then "spoil" them. (also a good technique for plain old straw which makes great temporay beds - just plant straight into a spoiled bale) . I buy lucerne bales as I have spare money (seldom) and then leave then lying around the garden in contact with the soil where I know there are worms. I water then and turn them over onto a new side regualrly. Whent he outside is a nice brown colour they are great for then breaking up into biscuits and then fluffinf out as mulch. Sometimes they go to the almost rotting back into the soil stage because I';ve forgotten them and at that time they are almost good enough to eat. When you get to this stage you'll find whole colonies of worms infesting them. I buy the lucerne chaff (horse feed) when I want a muclh aroudn small existing plants and the lucerne hay is to big and bulky. If you have to, use temporary wind shelters of shade cloth strung off star pickets - not elegant but it sure works while the pioneer plants are establishing - wattles are great pioneer plants especially Acacia floribunda which does well even in windy spots. I also use violets as pioneer plants. They are surprisingly tough and I just rip them out by the bucket load when I then want to use an area where they are. Some plant's I'd recommend (but bear in mind htat I too love the English cottage garden look, [hate camellias but have some as I'm not the only one involved in this garden] but I've learned that I have to use tough plants to get it. Lambs ears (stachys byzantica or perhaps it's now named something else maybe stachys lanata, but it's certainly stachys). Tough as old boots as many grey leaved plants are - has survived here without watering through all our years of drought. Cistus - good tough shrub - pink or whit flowers. Chaenomeles (spelling?) "Flowering Quince" is it's common name red or white flowered shrub. Wallflowers. The Winter Iris - has blue flowers that grow to about ankle height although the leaves grow to about 30 cm - will grow in a dry packed path - flowering now. "Bears Breeches"/"Oyster Plant" (Acnathus Mollis) - tall and architectural doesn't need muchh care or water but does even better with both. Agapanthus. Many more but the brain has gone dry. Just tremembered. African Daisy - I think it is called something like osteospernum????? Spreda and flowers and can be totally ignored. Photinia robusta are also good but will sulk for about 4 yrears from planting but will then suddenly take off like rockets. Sedums "Autumn Joy" - your Mum will know it. Succulents - I have a gorgeous one which spreads by creeping - has amall red flowers which the bees love and it completly carpets the soil and excludes all weeds - I just rip it up when I want to plant where it's spread. A few ideas - hope some of it is of assistance. |
Grass gardens
Farm1 wrote:
You have my sympathies. I have a brown that lives somewhere near my front door and a tiger that lives somewhere near my back door. I asked for a shotugn for Xmas and my dopy husband bought me a camera. I fail to understand how he could possibly mix up my comment about wanting to shoot something in such a way. There's a giant eastern brown in my rock wall, and it doesn't care about me at all. Whenever I see it, I borrow the family's .22, naturally I don't see the snake again for months. I've been thinking next time I see it sliding into the wall, I should pour some kero or something in there, and chuck in a match. I hate those things. I encourage the magpies and kookaburras, but that snake is way too big for them to tackle. A brown and a tiger, yuck. You see a lot of tigers up on in the Snowy in the summer, I just can't walk up there in summer any more. I've seen a giant black here, but the rest are eastern browns. -- ant |
Grass gardens
Farm1 wrote:
LOL. Take heart. I started in this place with some very rotten dirt and the hydophobic soil too. It took me a long time of using manure and mulch but each year things do get better. I now have worms and instead of being a pale calf sht yellow colour I now have soem areas of rich brown soil. The top few inches is often quite good, stuff that's built up over the rock and shale. But it's shallow, and it is quite hydrophobic. If I plant a tree, I make a little saucer around the base for it, to retain the water. I planted some argyle apples (not my favourite gum) in deep holes, and they just took off. crazed trees, never seen anything like it. I give every new tree a green 2 year plant pill. BTW, not all English style plants are a failure in our area - it just means choosing the right ones. Tell your mother to give you some Euphorbia s - they do reasonably well in rotten soilb ut do brilliantly in better soil. I buy 2 English gardenign mags - "Garedens Illustrated" and "The English Garden" as I find that the ideas are so good int hem for design and mass planting but then I have to choose the local do good plants. One of the best trees here is Oaks, so lots of english things are ok.... the buxus hedge is doing well (silly fussy little thing it is, the roos take leaps over it). Roses love it. Many herbs (woody ones) do really well. Chinese elms! There are lovely dry gardens in our area... the sculpture garden down at the National Gallery, for instance, and over at the Botanical Gardens there's a real beauty. Yes they are lovely, especially the sculpture garden. But go for a walk through the ANU at sometime - good ideas there. Yes, I saw their paving and grasses a year ago, and that's probably what really got me motivated. Also go off to some fo the open gardesn roudn here - lots of good ones round here. Try to get to Michelago if it's ever open. Micelago is a great garden, I love those pipes made into pillars for the wisteria walk. Just down the hill from me some people have their garden open every spring. Huge trees, which are the bones of the garden, it is quite magnificent. -- ant |
Grass gardens
Holy crap! That is impressive. It is a tough environment and yes, down in
canberra is quite a different kettle of fish nowadays. The soil here really isn't that bad, and it's carpeted with roo poo. It was a sheep farm, the bloody farmers knocked down the trees which have hardened into iron where they lie. It's just that the soil is a few inches deep. then you get that yellow stuff you mentioned, and often big slabs of rock so that the water runs down it, under the soil! the weirdest thing. The varieties you've listed are interesting, I have some of them. I'm an iris freak, and used to love those winter iris at home, always associated them with damp though. I grow tall bearded up here (tempo two mainly), they are wonderful. Must dig out a few winter iris from down in Canberra and try them here, even without the flowers the plant clumps are lovely. Mother planted those japonica things (the red flowers), and they do their thing. I'm just reading all the rest of what you wrote... the wind is the biggie. Farm1 wrote: ant I've been thinking about your situation and since I've been there and have the T-shirt I thought you might have some interest in my experiences or some advice. Ignore if it doesn't interest you. My first piece of advice is the old military adage: "time spent in reconaissance is never wasted". By that I mean that you should visit as many Open Gardens in the Monaro/Cooma/Taralga/Goulburn/Yass/Gundaroo (Dick Smith's garden at Gundaroo is well worth a visit if/when it's open again) etc districts as you can. Don't bother with Canberra as it is no longer the old hard and hungry Limestone Plains. 30 years ago it was impossible to grow normal azaleas in Canberra. If one wanted azaleas it was the deciduous Mollis Azaleas or nothing. Now normal azaleas are common as the climate has changed. Those other places I mention are still hard and hungry and good gardens in those places (and there are a surpring number of them) will teach you heaps. Take lots of photos if you do go and refer to them later as you will see new things each time and take a notebook as well and note what is growing well. If you can't get to open gardens when they are open then take the family/yourself for a drive to any of those places and squizz over fences. Even a shopping trip to Cooma can be used as a learning experience by doing that (I'm a great fence-over-squizzer and so often as I'm doing it I've been invited in by the owners for a look [once they know I'm not up to no good] gardeners love to show off their gardens). Advice 2 - use your Mum. She may not yet understand the requirements of your garden but she should be a great source for you for finding plants - the tough ones that are often not available in local nurseries but which do well in our hard and hungry conditions. For example, she should know about places like Lambley Nursery etc that specialises in dry plants. Once you increase your knowledge of what will grow she may also be able to help you inboth identifying and sourcing such things. Some books I love. The old (and I mean really old) editions of "The Canberra Gardener". The new one is shit IMHO but the old ones from the early 60s etc are great (even though they are a bit anal in the neatness, orderliness way). Another local book which I would not lend to anyone is "The Indolent Kitchen Gardener" by Libby Smith. It has advice and information in it that I have never seen elsewhere and it's applicable beyond the kitchen garden. Now some 'doing' advice. I've had soil that was the colour of the sort of shit a calf does when it has the scours (pale yellow) and set like concrete. It was so bad that I'd spend an hour with a pick putting 2.5 cm dents in the soil and would then water for 2 hours and go back the next day and do another hour putting the same sized dents in the soil etc ad nauseum. This same soil is now full of worms and dark brown and friable till I reach what I now call the 'real' sub soil (it's still all really subsoil but its now good enough to be considered topsoil). It could still do with improvement but it gets better each year. So, after the chip, water, chip, water etc routine, what I did was just keep working at it till I could break it into huge clods (about the size of a big fork head). I'd then fertilize it with anything I had ranging from chook poo straight from under the roosts to Dynamic Lifter, cow plops etc. I'd then loosely cover it with straw and water it regualry and leave it for a while and the go back a few weeks later and pull off the mulch and rework it etc. (Mind you this was in a "Rose Bed" where the sodding garden designer who did the garden for the previous owner had put 70 roses under weed mat - the only worms I found were above the weed mat in the pine bark mulch - it took me years about 10 years to get through this whole bed and the worst thing was getting rid of the mulch and the weed mat - God knows how any of the poor roses survived but they did.). Now that I have access to huge quantities of horse poo, I use that straight as I get it - sometimes it's almost steaming but I've found that the plants don't seem to mind that and the worms seem to love it. All the epxerts say to "age" it - I dont' have the time or the energy. By the time I've loaded it into the ute, I'm so stuffed that I just want to dump it a squcikly and as easily as possible. It does mean more weeding but the soil is improved by it so much that the weeds aren't a problem to remove. Contrary to the accepted advice given by the "experts" in our area, be very wary of mulching heavily. Unless you can deliver copious and regualr quantities of water in the summer then you'll find that you are constantly having to pull off the mulch and water deeply and then put it all back. I've found that only a thin layer of mulch used as a shading and wind desiccation protection device works best. In winter when the rains are good I mulch more heavily and by spring the worms have got it to about the right level for summer. Worms. Concentrate on feeding them and breeding them up and forget about the plants or soil fertility or anything else. What the worms love will be THE best way to build the soil, but let the worms do your work for you. They love lucerne - it's expensive in both the bale form or as the horse food chaff version but worth every penny of the money spent on it. I buy bales of lucerne and then "spoil" them. (also a good technique for plain old straw which makes great temporay beds - just plant straight into a spoiled bale) . I buy lucerne bales as I have spare money (seldom) and then leave then lying around the garden in contact with the soil where I know there are worms. I water then and turn them over onto a new side regualrly. Whent he outside is a nice brown colour they are great for then breaking up into biscuits and then fluffinf out as mulch. Sometimes they go to the almost rotting back into the soil stage because I';ve forgotten them and at that time they are almost good enough to eat. When you get to this stage you'll find whole colonies of worms infesting them. I buy the lucerne chaff (horse feed) when I want a muclh aroudn small existing plants and the lucerne hay is to big and bulky. If you have to, use temporary wind shelters of shade cloth strung off star pickets - not elegant but it sure works while the pioneer plants are establishing - wattles are great pioneer plants especially Acacia floribunda which does well even in windy spots. I also use violets as pioneer plants. They are surprisingly tough and I just rip them out by the bucket load when I then want to use an area where they are. Some plant's I'd recommend (but bear in mind htat I too love the English cottage garden look, [hate camellias but have some as I'm not the only one involved in this garden] but I've learned that I have to use tough plants to get it. Lambs ears (stachys byzantica or perhaps it's now named something else maybe stachys lanata, but it's certainly stachys). Tough as old boots as many grey leaved plants are - has survived here without watering through all our years of drought. Cistus - good tough shrub - pink or whit flowers. Chaenomeles (spelling?) "Flowering Quince" is it's common name red or white flowered shrub. Wallflowers. The Winter Iris - has blue flowers that grow to about ankle height although the leaves grow to about 30 cm - will grow in a dry packed path - flowering now. "Bears Breeches"/"Oyster Plant" (Acnathus Mollis) - tall and architectural doesn't need muchh care or water but does even better with both. Agapanthus. Many more but the brain has gone dry. Just tremembered. African Daisy - I think it is called something like osteospernum????? Spreda and flowers and can be totally ignored. Photinia robusta are also good but will sulk for about 4 yrears from planting but will then suddenly take off like rockets. Sedums "Autumn Joy" - your Mum will know it. Succulents - I have a gorgeous one which spreads by creeping - has amall red flowers which the bees love and it completly carpets the soil and excludes all weeds - I just rip it up when I want to plant where it's spread. A few ideas - hope some of it is of assistance. -- ant |
Grass gardens
"ant" wrote in message
... Farm1 wrote: You have my sympathies. I have a brown that lives somewhere near my front door and a tiger that lives somewhere near my back door. I asked for a shotugn for Xmas and my dopy husband bought me a camera. I fail to understand how he could possibly mix up my comment about wanting to shoot something in such a way. There's a giant eastern brown in my rock wall, and it doesn't care about me at all. Whenever I see it, I borrow the family's .22, naturally I don't see the snake again for months. I've been thinking next time I see it sliding into the wall, I should pour some kero or something in there, and chuck in a match. I hate those things. Yeah me too - much too edgy a snake, but the major number of bites are from Tigers apparently. I've tried to kill the Tiger with an air rifle but I've decided that the only way to do it is a shotgun - I'm not a good enough shot to kill it without a scattering pellet effect. I encourage the magpies and kookaburras, but that snake is way too big for them to tackle. A brown and a tiger, yuck. You see a lot of tigers up on in the Snowy in the summer, I just can't walk up there in summer any more. I've seen a giant black here, but the rest are eastern browns. We have a giant black that lives under the house at our other farm but I don't mind them - they are a fairly gentle snake. |
Grass gardens
"ant" wrote in message
Farm1 wrote: LOL. Take heart. I started in this place with some very rotten dirt and the hydophobic soil too. It took me a long time of using manure and mulch but each year things do get better. I now have worms and instead of being a pale calf sht yellow colour I now have soem areas of rich brown soil. The top few inches is often quite good, stuff that's built up over the rock and shale. But it's shallow, and it is quite hydrophobic. I once asked the 666 guru if I could use wetta soil in the garden because I didn't want it to damage worms. He reckoned it'd be OK but I still ahve doubts and ahve never used it. I fidn that if I can improve the humus level and don't elt it dry out too much, then it's not so hydrophobic. If I plant a tree, I make a little saucer around the base for it, to retain the water. I planted some argyle apples (not my favourite gum) in deep holes, and they just took off. crazed trees, never seen anything like it. I give every new tree a green 2 year plant pill. Must try those for some fruit trees I've jsut planted. BTW, not all English style plants are a failure in our area - it just means choosing the right ones. Tell your mother to give you some Euphorbia s - they do reasonably well in rotten soilb ut do brilliantly in better soil. I buy 2 English gardenign mags - "Garedens Illustrated" and "The English Garden" as I find that the ideas are so good int hem for design and mass planting but then I have to choose the local do good plants. One of the best trees here is Oaks, so lots of english things are ok.... the buxus hedge is doing well (silly fussy little thing it is, the roos take leaps over it). Roses love it. Many herbs (woody ones) do really well. Chinese elms! Well that's a good list. Also go off to some fo the open gardesn roudn here - lots of good ones round here. Try to get to Michelago if it's ever open. Micelago is a great garden, I love those pipes made into pillars for the wisteria walk. Yes, it's brialliant. Just down the hill from me some people have their garden open every spring. Huge trees, which are the bones of the garden, it is quite magnificent. Name? Or is that asking too much given the lack of privacy involved. |
Grass gardens
"ant" wrote in message
... The varieties you've listed are interesting, I have some of them. I'm an iris freak, and used to love those winter iris at home, always associated them with damp though. The winter Iris seem to grow anywhere and I've seen them in moist spots too. I have some that grow in path and some that grow beside the drive and have not been watered in probalby the 3 years (or more??) since I put them there. I grow tall bearded up here (tempo two mainly), they are wonderful. Yes - always good doers. I still have some sitting a a styrofoam box from where my daughter dug them up and dumped them here after she moved out of a scumbag rental place - she wasn't going to leave anything to the slum landlord that she'd planted - they must have been there now for about 14 months and although they have no soil other than what is cinging to the roots they still live - I must plant them when I can find the time. Must dig out a few winter iris from down in Canberra and try them here, even without the flowers the plant clumps are lovely. Mother planted those japonica things (the red flowers), and they do their thing. I'm just reading all the rest of what you wrote... the wind is the biggie. I had to go to Cooma today and as I was driving along I noticed the Verbasums along the side of the road. Ask your mother if she can get you some. Tough as old boots and give good height and tough - Michael McCoy the dry garden bloke uses them well. I love them. I should also have mentioned Russian sage Yes those sodding winds! I put my veggie garden facing westward on a slope - those blasted winds!!!!!. Dumb but the only place for it to go. I then had to put up a fence with shade cltoh and a whole lot of wattles on the windward side - it's now a lovely place to work. |
Grass gardens
Farm1 wrote:
Name? Or is that asking too much given the lack of privacy involved. It's on Radcliffe Circuit, in Carwoola. a macro garden, mainly trees and lawn, with a few micro thingies. but it's impressive, especially when you look at the surrounds. I look down onto it. They had a bore from day one, and used it intensively, from what they said. Magnificent result though. -- ant |
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