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Old 03-01-2007, 02:50 PM posted to aus.gardens
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Default i wrote...

.... a really immoderate rant about water restrictions (and/or lack thereof).

and especially about the nsw govt, and how cross it makes me that the garden
hose police get around busting people for watering their gardens on the
wrong day, but the authorities seem not to care(?!) how much
drinking-quality water people flush down their dunnies and showers and
generally waste _inside_ the home where they'll never be caught, and where
govts seem unwilling to encourage change in people's ludicrous, wasteful
behaviour.

inside the home, many people on town water are heedless, greedy ninnies, but
that's ok. it's quite all right to flush 20 litres down the drain because
you did a wee, but god forbid you give the veggies or the flowers a bit of a
squirt with the hose. it's quite all right to have a bazillion-litre shower
when you're not even dirty, but god forfend you water a tree so it doesn't
die.

being on my own water supply, i'm probably well out of it. if i were in town
now, getting crosser & crosser about the whole thing, i'd probably be
shouting "i heard that!!!" at the neighbours every time they flush the loo.
g

where are the community service announcements? where is the thinking and
discussion on a better way to harvest and allocate and charge for water, so
that people can use it how they think best, but knowing they only have their
little allocation and at its true cost, so they better think carefully?
there are simply no immediate _consequences_ for wasting water (that people
can see) - it's just an endless, clean, cheap, lovely supply that will never
run out. if it ever does run out, the consequences would be horrendous - but
the "waste not, want not" philosophy is clearly not foremost in enough
people's minds. all that is happening is people's lovely, health-giving
gardens are dying, & the nsw govt has its head up its arse, and the liberals
are even more useless (so that's no use).

.... but anyway, i deleted it & posted this much more civilised rant instead.
sorry to bring this subject up again, but really - this is a problem that's
not going to go away. people need information & leadership & greywater
systems & tanks & the knowledge of where they are going wrong. but all they
get is the ****ing garden hose police. it makes me want to scream.
:-)
kylie


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Old 03-01-2007, 08:58 PM posted to aus.gardens
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Default i wrote...

that's about it kylie,

been my argument for a long time also, there is no community
re-education on being water-wise being done.

even flushing the toilet at all is in this day and age sheer waste of
a limited resource needed for drinking and food production, there is
absolutely no sense of sustainability in our communities and ther
won't be until the time they turn a tap on and only dust emmits.

and the same with power until they turn a switch and nothing happens
it is all easy come easy go, you can't eat or drink money the sheer
waste of power over this festive season for the absolute folly of the
better than the joneses excercise of christmas light pagents in
private gardens all for the glory of a tin pot award and to get ones'
name mentioned in the media.

oh don't forget the sheer exhobitance of public type toilets running
uncontrolled whilst us home vege' gardeners have to desist from using
water.

On Wed, 03 Jan 2007 13:50:47 GMT, "0tterbot" wrote:

snipped
With peace and brightest of blessings,

len

--
"Be Content With What You Have And
May You Find Serenity and Tranquillity In
A World That You May Not Understand."

http://www.lensgarden.com.au/
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Old 03-01-2007, 10:03 PM posted to aus.gardens
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Default i wrote...


"gardenlen" wrote in message
...
that's about it kylie,

been my argument for a long time also, there is no community
re-education on being water-wise being done.

even flushing the toilet at all is in this day and age sheer waste of
a limited resource needed for drinking and food production, there is
absolutely no sense of sustainability in our communities and ther
won't be until the time they turn a tap on and only dust emmits.

and the same with power until they turn a switch and nothing happens
it is all easy come easy go, you can't eat or drink money the sheer
waste of power over this festive season for the absolute folly of the
better than the joneses excercise of christmas light pagents in
private gardens all for the glory of a tin pot award and to get ones'
name mentioned in the media.

oh don't forget the sheer exhobitance of public type toilets running
uncontrolled whilst us home vege' gardeners have to desist from using
water.

On Wed, 03 Jan 2007 13:50:47 GMT, "0tterbot" wrote:

snipped
With peace and brightest of blessings,

len

--
"Be Content With What You Have And
May You Find Serenity and Tranquillity In
A World That You May Not Understand."

http://www.lensgarden.com.au/


I'm with you both on this one. Our whole attitude for so long has been 'Just
use, don't think'. This goes for pretty much everything. And people who
rebel and try to do something about it get laughed at for being tree hugging
hippies, and given names like 'ferals'. One day they'll be the only ones
laughing, as they'll be the only ones with their own power from solar
panels, water from tanks and greaywater, and cheap food from sustainable
gardens. I hate having to live the way we do now; renting, house in town,
town water, blah blah blah. One day...we're looking at houses with a bit of
land now. Can't wait....but I am *not* having goats.
We're lucky in Cairns to have plenty of water, but we still have water
restrictions in the garden. Our council seems to be using it's brain in some
things at least, be stupid not too really, considering stuff happening down
south. Now if they'd just get better public transport....


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Old 04-01-2007, 04:22 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Posts: 735
Default i wrote...

"0tterbot" wrote in message
... a really immoderate rant about water restrictions (and/or lack

thereof).

and especially about the nsw govt, and how cross it makes me that

the garden
hose police get around busting people for watering their gardens on

the
wrong day, but the authorities seem not to care(?!) how much
drinking-quality water people flush down their dunnies and showers

and
generally waste _inside_ the home where they'll never be caught, and

where
govts seem unwilling to encourage change in people's ludicrous,

wasteful
behaviour.


:-)) Having just spend Xmas in Sydney, the same thing applies to more
than just water.

I cannot believe the rampant and unbelievably unecessary consumption
there - for example, 1 family of 2 drivers with 2 large 4x4s in
Coogee!!!!! - not a bloody dirt road withing cooeee!!! and $9,000
spent for glass pool fencing for a minute distance to replace lace
pool fencing that had nothing wrong with it (and then there was the
cost of the garden 'landscaping' that had to go in round the pool
fencing and all it was was about 3 varieties of very common old plants
and some mulch and all that cost several arms and legs too!).

We both noticed the foubies as we drove up but the amount spent on the
fence was found out AFTER my husband and the man of this household
agreed about how appalling household air conditioning was. The Coogee
husband agreed but that does stop him having the ridiculous fourbies
and putting in lovely looking but totally unnecesary glass pool
fencing. What blood resources does he think it takes to make both
these rampant bits of consumerism?

Then we went to the next place and the pool (which hasn't been used by
either of the residents for at least 4 years) has concrete cancer so
30,000 litres of water is to be dumped in the drain before $14,000 is
spent fixing the concrete cancer!

These people have more money then brains or sense of social
responsibility.

inside the home, many people on town water are heedless, greedy

ninnies, but
that's ok. it's quite all right to flush 20 litres down the drain

because
you did a wee,


Yep, If it's brown, flush it down, if it's yellow, let it mellow.

but god forbid you give the veggies or the flowers a bit of a
squirt with the hose. it's quite all right to have a bazillion-litre

shower
when you're not even dirty, but god forfend you water a tree so it

doesn't
die.

being on my own water supply, i'm probably well out of it. if i were

in town
now, getting crosser & crosser about the whole thing, i'd probably

be
shouting "i heard that!!!" at the neighbours every time they flush

the loo.
g


Agree totally, but it's much more than just water - it's all the other
throw out, use it up mentality of city people too.

where are the community service announcements? where is the thinking

and
discussion on a better way to harvest and allocate and charge for

water, so
that people can use it how they think best, but knowing they only

have their
little allocation and at its true cost, so they better think

carefully?
there are simply no immediate _consequences_ for wasting water (that

people
can see) - it's just an endless, clean, cheap, lovely supply that

will never
run out. if it ever does run out, the consequences would be

horrendous - but
the "waste not, want not" philosophy is clearly not foremost in

enough
people's minds. all that is happening is people's lovely,

health-giving
gardens are dying, & the nsw govt has its head up its arse, and the

liberals
are even more useless (so that's no use).

... but anyway, i deleted it & posted this much more civilised rant

instead.
sorry to bring this subject up again, but really - this is a problem

that's
not going to go away. people need information & leadership &

greywater
systems & tanks & the knowledge of where they are going wrong. but

all they
get is the ****ing garden hose police. it makes me want to scream.
:-)


Yep, but I'd add lots more to that rant. Don't get me started on
people who think they need new ktichens or bathrooms or computers or
TVs.............. You can see how I am about glass pool fencing and
fourbies in the Eastern suburbs...............


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Old 04-01-2007, 06:40 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Default i wrote...

On Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:22:13 +1100, "Farm1" please@askifyouwannaknow
wrote:
snip snip


systems & tanks & the knowledge of where they are going wrong. but

all they
get is the ****ing garden hose police. it makes me want to scream.
:-)


Yep, but I'd add lots more to that rant. Don't get me started on
people who think they need new ktichens or bathrooms or computers or


^^^^^^^^^
And you wrote this newsgroup post on ?? a note that you gave to abird
to deliver into the ether ??

TVs.............. You can see how I am about glass pool fencing and
fourbies in the Eastern suburbs...............




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Old 04-01-2007, 07:20 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Default i wrote...

In article ,
"0tterbot" wrote:

... a really immoderate rant about water restrictions (and/or lack thereof).

and especially about the nsw govt, and how cross it makes me that the garden
hose police get around busting people for watering their gardens on the
wrong day, but the authorities seem not to care(?!) how much
drinking-quality water people flush down their dunnies and showers and
generally waste _inside_ the home where they'll never be caught, and where
govts seem unwilling to encourage change in people's ludicrous, wasteful
behaviour.


You aren't alone, from the tenor of letters to the Herald on the subject. I
haven't yet seen anyone who thinks that the desalination plant is a good idea,
let alone tapping Sydney's underground water.

where are the community service announcements? where is the thinking and
discussion on a better way to harvest and allocate and charge for water, so
that people can use it how they think best, but knowing they only have their
little allocation and at its true cost, so they better think carefully?
there are simply no immediate _consequences_ for wasting water (that people
can see) - it's just an endless, clean, cheap, lovely supply that will never
run out.


I would like to see industrial water usage being looked at. There is a heck
of a lot of water wasted in industry, I suspect.

What I'd like to see is an allocation of water to households at a moderate
price, based on the number of people who live there. Once you go over
allocation, you get hit with an excess usage charge. That would allow
families with 8 children to still bathe regularly.

if it ever does run out, the consequences would be horrendous - but
the "waste not, want not" philosophy is clearly not foremost in enough
people's minds. all that is happening is people's lovely, health-giving
gardens are dying, & the nsw govt has its head up its arse, and the liberals
are even more useless (so that's no use).


Peter "Of course I'm sane" Debnam! Biggest vote winner Morris has!

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

"Parenthood is like the modern stone washing process for denim jeans. You may
start out crisp, neat and tough, but you end up pale, limp and wrinkled."
Kerry Cue
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Old 04-01-2007, 07:28 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Default i wrote...

In article ,
"Farm1" please@askifyouwannaknow wrote:

I cannot believe the rampant and unbelievably unecessary consumption
there - for example, 1 family of 2 drivers with 2 large 4x4s in
Coogee!!!!! - not a bloody dirt road withing cooeee!!! and $9,000


Hah. The real problem is that I have to share the road with idiots like them.

spent for glass pool fencing for a minute distance to replace lace
pool fencing that had nothing wrong with it (and then there was the
cost of the garden 'landscaping' that had to go in round the pool
fencing and all it was was about 3 varieties of very common old plants
and some mulch and all that cost several arms and legs too!).


It's important to have a pool in Coogee; it's such a long way from the beach
:-/

but god forbid you give the veggies or the flowers a bit of a
squirt with the hose. it's quite all right to have a bazillion-litre
shower when you're not even dirty, but god forfend you water a tree so it
doesn't die.


Well, to be truthful, you need a heck of a lot of water to substitute for a
shower of rain. Squirts with the hose are pretty useless -- you need to water
for a couple of hours to do any good.

Agree totally, but it's much more than just water - it's all the other
throw out, use it up mentality of city people too.


Not quite all of us! There are a few people outside the cities who behave
like that too. It's the population density that decreases, not the idiot
density. Though I suspect that there *are* a lot of idiots living in those
TUscanised mansions in teh Hills District...

Have just been reading "Lawns into Lunch" today, which is a set of case
studies of urban permaculture. These urban greenies have usually found their
neighbours to be supportive (particularly after the fresh eggs and tomatoes
change hands...).

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

"Parenthood is like the modern stone washing process for denim jeans. You may
start out crisp, neat and tough, but you end up pale, limp and wrinkled."
Kerry Cue
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Old 04-01-2007, 10:29 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Default i wrote...

wrote in message
On Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:22:13 +1100, "Farm1"

please@askifyouwannaknow
wrote:
snip snip


systems & tanks & the knowledge of where they are going wrong.

but
all they
get is the ****ing garden hose police. it makes me want to

scream.
:-)


Yep, but I'd add lots more to that rant. Don't get me started on
people who think they need new ktichens or bathrooms or computers

or

^^^^^^^^^
And you wrote this newsgroup post on ?? a note that you gave to

abird
to deliver into the ether ??


Didn't you notice the word "new"? This computer is so old it's just
about steam driven. I made the comment at a lunch recently about
saving something to my floppy and everyone fell about laughing. I
didn't even know that floppys had been superceded. They still work
for me, but it's just about time this poor old thing went to the
museum.


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Old 04-01-2007, 11:12 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Default i wrote...

"Chookie" wrote in message
...
You aren't alone, from the tenor of letters to the Herald on the subject.
I
haven't yet seen anyone who thinks that the desalination plant is a good
idea,
let alone tapping Sydney's underground water.


i forgot to say (in my less-immoderate rant - in the full-blown version it
was there ;-) that what set me off was yesterday's smh article saying the
nsw govt has decided sydney peeps "would not accept" recycled water - hence
it's desalinators full steam ahead, no discussion. ARGH.

I would like to see industrial water usage being looked at. There is a
heck
of a lot of water wasted in industry, I suspect.

What I'd like to see is an allocation of water to households at a moderate
price, based on the number of people who live there. Once you go over
allocation, you get hit with an excess usage charge. That would allow
families with 8 children to still bathe regularly.


EXACTLY. and if everyone got an allocation, it would be up to them what to
do with it & make sure it lasts else pay the price (literally). if they want
a huge green lawn & no showers at all, all power to them, i say! but for teh
govt to act like little hitlers about watering and car washing while doing
absolutely NOTHING about other water use is just moronic, insulting and
rather cross-making. i know that veggie-types are getting increasingly up in
arms because they don't get extra water to grow their food with, yet growing
one's own food is clearly an extreme benefit to everyone.

are even more useless (so that's no use).


Peter "Of course I'm sane" Debnam! Biggest vote winner Morris has!


with peter howling at the moon, morris does not even have to TRY to get his
head out of his arse. i have no intention of voting for either of them,
quite frankly!! (it's just a question of which one to put stone motherless
last).
kylie


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Old 04-01-2007, 11:15 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Default i wrote...

"Chookie" wrote in message
...

but god forbid you give the veggies or the flowers a bit of a
squirt with the hose. it's quite all right to have a bazillion-litre
shower when you're not even dirty, but god forfend you water a tree so
it
doesn't die.


Well, to be truthful, you need a heck of a lot of water to substitute for
a
shower of rain. Squirts with the hose are pretty useless -- you need to
water for a couple of hours to do any good.


well, clearly i was exaggerating in both directions :-) (most people don't
have a bazillion-litre shower either. except perhaps in coogee & the hills
district ;-)
kylie




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Old 04-01-2007, 11:19 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Default i wrote...

"Farm1" please@askifyouwannaknow wrote in message
...
the same thing applies to more
than just water.

I cannot believe the rampant and unbelievably unecessary consumption
there -


in truth, rampant consumption of all kinds is my bugbear. i was set off by a
water article, but it's all the same thing really, isn't it? people feeling
entitled to just use and use and use, regardless of teh consequences. in a
gardening group though, i'd at least start off with water & go from there
g
kylie


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Old 04-01-2007, 02:46 PM posted to aus.gardens
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Default i wrote...

On Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:29:25 +1100, "Farm1" please@askifyouwannaknow
wrote:

wrote in message
On Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:22:13 +1100, "Farm1"

please@askifyouwannaknow
wrote:
snip snip


systems & tanks & the knowledge of where they are going wrong.

but
all they
get is the ****ing garden hose police. it makes me want to

scream.
:-)

Yep, but I'd add lots more to that rant. Don't get me started on
people who think they need new ktichens or bathrooms or computers

or

^^^^^^^^^
And you wrote this newsgroup post on ?? a note that you gave to

abird
to deliver into the ether ??


Didn't you notice the word "new"? This computer is so old it's just


Now I just "New" you would pick me up on that...... As a matter of
fact I actually did see the word written there, but it must have been
"New" at some stage of it's life....

about steam driven. I made the comment at a lunch recently about
saving something to my floppy and everyone fell about laughing. I
didn't even know that floppys had been superceded. They still work
for me, but it's just about time this poor old thing went to the
museum.


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Old 05-01-2007, 03:04 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Default i wrote...

wrote in message
...

Yep, but I'd add lots more to that rant. Don't get me started on
people who think they need new ktichens or bathrooms or computers

or

^^^^^^^^^
And you wrote this newsgroup post on ?? a note that you gave to

abird
to deliver into the ether ??


Didn't you notice the word "new"? This computer is so old it's just


Now I just "New" you would pick me up on that...... As a matter of
fact I actually did see the word written there, but it must have been
"New" at some stage of it's life....


clearly you are just trying to be annoying, but the clear implication in
what farm said ("they _think_ they need new..." [my emphasis] ) is that they
don't NEED a new whatever at all. the old is perfectly good. they THINK they
"need" a new one when they merely _want_ a new one because they are dull,
unimaginative, or wasteful.

believe it or not, "new" is a word with multiple shades of meaning. consult
your dictionary, not your harvey norman catalogue g
kylie


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Old 05-01-2007, 03:24 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Default i wrote...

On Wed, 03 Jan 2007 19:58:04 GMT, gardenlen wrote:

oh don't forget the sheer exhobitance of public type toilets running
uncontrolled whilst us home vege' gardeners have to desist from using
water.


Don't take this as a product push - not affiliated, yada yada - but I
encountered this stuff in a urinal in Dungog. It does away with the need
to flush urine away, by using microbes to eat the nutrients that make it
smelly. I'd never been to such an odourless public loo before, nor
since.

http://www.desert.com.au/

Bloody marvellous, those little microbes!
--
Ross McKay, Toronto, NSW Australia
The planet is in a pickle, but fermenting will help save us
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Old 05-01-2007, 04:08 AM posted to aus.gardens
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Posts: 735
Default i wrote...

wrote in message
On Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:29:25 +1100, "Farm1"

please@askifyouwannaknow
wrote:
wrote in message
On Thu, 4 Jan 2007 14:22:13 +1100, "Farm1"

please@askifyouwannaknow
wrote:
snip snip

systems & tanks & the knowledge of where they are going wrong.

but
all they
get is the ****ing garden hose police. it makes me want to

scream.
:-)

Yep, but I'd add lots more to that rant. Don't get me started

on
people who think they need new ktichens or bathrooms or

computers
or

^^^^^^^^^
And you wrote this newsgroup post on ?? a note that you gave to

abird
to deliver into the ether ??


Didn't you notice the word "new"? This computer is so old it's

just

Now I just "New" you would pick me up on that......


:-)) In that case, and given that the thread is about rampant
consumption, I'm surprised that you didn't say something different or
perhaps just differently provocative.

As a matter of
fact I actually did see the word written there, but it must have

been
"New" at some stage of it's life....


I can't think of anything that wasn't "new" at one stage. I think
this thread is about getting the longest life one can out of
everything and that includes jars or hoses or water or even computers.
These days even in the country, it's hard to live without a computer
but I keep reminding anyone who laughs at this old beast that I have
more computing power in front of me that was used in order to send man
to the moon. I still find that fact to be totally astounding.



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