We're just about to embark on our first-ever veggie patch and I wondered
if anyone might have some tips for us? The reason we haven't started
before is that our block is boggy and spongy when the winter rains come,
yet arid and awful in the heat of summer. It finally dawned on me that a
raised (about 60cm or more) bed might be the answer! So, that's what
we'd like to do: build up a well-raised bed and then see if we can
reduce the grocery bill by growing some veggies.

I've read lots of material about permaculture and no-dig gardens (they
come with a recipe for layering that seems pretty impossible - I mean, I
don't know any sheep, so I won't be getting sheep-poo any time soon...)
My thoughts were to lay something drainy ('aggregate'? chitter? etc?)
and then pile on some organic mix soil (purchased at Great Cost from a
local bloke who sells it). We've got some recycled planks to make the
walls of the garden and a few years' worth of rotted grass clippings for
mulching.

Is there anything else I should know? What can I plant nowish (within,
say, the next month)? And is there anything mentioned above that sounds
wrong? I'd be *really* grateful for any feedback you can offer and hope
this might prompt a bit of a discussion on the ways in which others have
started their gardens.


--
Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia

"Trish Brown" wrote in message
node...
We're just about to embark on our first-ever veggie patch and I wondered
if anyone might have some tips for us? The reason we haven't started
before is that our block is boggy and spongy when the winter rains come,
yet arid and awful in the heat of summer. It finally dawned on me that a
raised (about 60cm or more) bed might be the answer! So, that's what
we'd like to do: build up a well-raised bed and then see if we can
reduce the grocery bill by growing some veggies.


Sounds good to me. What is your native soil like? How much sand? How much
clay?

I've read lots of material about permaculture and no-dig gardens (they
come with a recipe for layering that seems pretty impossible - I mean, I
don't know any sheep, so I won't be getting sheep-poo any time soon...)

How far are your from the racecourse or any riding stables? Horse manure and
stable bedding can be excellent cheap sources of organic material. Yes they
can have seeds but so can anything that is not hot composted. What about
gathering grass and clippings from your neighbours? Any tree loppers around?
Look around you and picture cheap sources of organic matter - some person's
rubbish may be your treasure.

My thoughts were to lay something drainy ('aggregate'? chitter? etc?)

I wouldn't put in any non organic aggrgates, you want it all to rot down in
the end and some of your veges will put down very long roots.

and then pile on some organic mix soil (purchased at Great Cost from a
local bloke who sells it). We've got some recycled planks to make the
walls of the garden and a few years' worth of rotted grass clippings for
mulching.


Check out the options. Buying in bags will always be more expensive than in
bulk. Buying ready-to-go will be more than getting the components and
waiting.

Is there anything else I should know? What can I plant nowish (within,
say, the next month)?

Not a very good time, most of your winter veges should be in by now and
established. Particularly if waiting for things to rot I would wait a few
months and start with your summer veges in spring - say early September in a
frost-free area..

And is there anything mentioned above that sounds
wrong? I'd be *really* grateful for any feedback you can offer and hope
this might prompt a bit of a discussion on the ways in which others have
started their gardens.



Some general hints

1) In one small volume a great starting book:
The Australian Fruit and Vegetable Garden - Clive Blazey & Jane Varkulevicius
(Digger Club)

2) Join Hunter Organic Growers Society (HOGS) The next meeting (free) is
Saturday 14th June on Kooragang Island. I will give you details if you are
interested.

David

David Hare-Scott wrote:

snip

Some general hints

1) In one small volume a great starting book:
The Australian Fruit and Vegetable Garden - Clive Blazey & Jane Varkulevicius
(Digger Club)

2) Join Hunter Organic Growers Society (HOGS) The next meeting (free) is
Saturday 14th June on Kooragang Island. I will give you details if you are
interested.

David




Ooo! Is this group in any way connected to the community garden on Ash
Island? That's what got me thinking I could do this. What an effort! I
was especially taken by the pyramidal garden built up with railway
sleepers. We were going to try that at first, but soon realised the cost
would be far more than the benefits (to us, at least). Also, after many
heated arguments about whether to build up a square or triangular plot,
we finally realised the end result would give the same growable area in
the end. Hence, we agreed on a flat rectangle. But the built-up pyramid
is *great* to look at!

For those who haven't seen it: a square plot was laid out with old
railway sleepers. Next, another square, offset to form a diamond, was
laid on top. Two more squares, each graduated in size, were laid atop
the first two, forming triangular pockets in which the various veggies
grow. The tallest plants (eg. sweet corn) are in the bottom beds while
herbs are in the topmost ones. The whole area would only be about two
metres square!

What sorts of things happen at HOGS meetings, David? I've never belonged
to a gardening group, but would be interested to hear about it. I'm
feeling very much a novice, despite having been a keen pot-gardener for
most of my life. (Hm. That read funny. I meant 'gardener of potted
plants', not the other...)

--
Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia

"Trish Brown" wrote in message
node...
David Hare-Scott wrote:

snip

Some general hints

1) In one small volume a great starting book:
The Australian Fruit and Vegetable Garden - Clive Blazey & Jane
Varkulevicius
(Digger Club)

2) Join Hunter Organic Growers Society (HOGS) The next meeting (free) is
Saturday 14th June on Kooragang Island. I will give you details if you
are
interested.

David




Ooo! Is this group in any way connected to the community garden on Ash
Island? That's what got me thinking I could do this. What an effort! I
was especially taken by the pyramidal garden built up with railway
sleepers. We were going to try that at first, but soon realised the cost
would be far more than the benefits (to us, at least). Also, after many
heated arguments about whether to build up a square or triangular plot,
we finally realised the end result would give the same growable area in
the end. Hence, we agreed on a flat rectangle. But the built-up pyramid
is *great* to look at!

For those who haven't seen it: a square plot was laid out with old
railway sleepers. Next, another square, offset to form a diamond, was
laid on top. Two more squares, each graduated in size, were laid atop
the first two, forming triangular pockets in which the various veggies
grow. The tallest plants (eg. sweet corn) are in the bottom beds while
herbs are in the topmost ones. The whole area would only be about two
metres square!

What sorts of things happen at HOGS meetings, David? I've never belonged
to a gardening group, but would be interested to hear about it. I'm
feeling very much a novice, despite having been a keen pot-gardener for
most of my life. (Hm. That read funny. I meant 'gardener of potted
plants', not the other...)

--
Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia

HOGS meetings are at organic growing establishments all around the Hunter.
Some are private homes on a small block, some are mixed farms, orchards, worm
farms, deer farms etc. The Island is a kind of home base where we go to do
things appropriate to most gardens, like make compost, prune fruit trees, make
new gardens.

We assemble at noon and have lunch together (BYO). The meeting starts at 1PM,
we have afternoon tea about 3 and it breaks up about 4-4:30. Bring surplus
produce, if you have any, to share or swap.

To get the next meeting at the City Farm, turn on to Ash island bridge on the
Hunter, from the New England Highway at Sandgate (near MacDonalds). Follow a
twisty road across the island for a few kms, there will be "HOGS" signs to
guide you.

They are a friendly bunch who don't mind beginners and they will answer all
your questions. Anybody can turn up at meetings but if you join you also get
a quarterly magazine, the use of the library etc.

David

"Trish Brown" wrote in message
node...
We're just about to embark on our first-ever veggie patch and I wondered
if anyone might have some tips for us? The reason we haven't started
before is that our block is boggy and spongy when the winter rains come,
yet arid and awful in the heat of summer. It finally dawned on me that a
raised (about 60cm or more) bed might be the answer! So, that's what we'd
like to do: build up a well-raised bed and then see if we can reduce the
grocery bill by growing some veggies.

I've read lots of material about permaculture and no-dig gardens (they
come with a recipe for layering that seems pretty impossible - I mean, I
don't know any sheep, so I won't be getting sheep-poo any time soon...) My
thoughts were to lay something drainy ('aggregate'? chitter? etc?) and
then pile on some organic mix soil (purchased at Great Cost from a local
bloke who sells it). We've got some recycled planks to make the walls of
the garden and a few years' worth of rotted grass clippings for mulching.

Is there anything else I should know?

you'll work it out over the next 50 years g!

with veggie gardening (ime) you learn fast but you _will_ make loads of
mistakes (some of which you will post to this group, & others keep firmly
under your hat ;-). but mistakes are better for learning imho.

mostly it is straightforward & common sense. read lots of veggie books
(there are millions - use the library & 2nd hand books too). one common
theme among them is to keep feeding the soil.. always keeping the soil
covered is another "rule" (but then there are people who remove mulch for
winter or spring, bla bla, so no rule is cast in iron & you have to be
prepared to learn & be surprised.)

What can I plant nowish (within,
say, the next month)?

winter spinach, spring onions, some other types of winter onions (actually,
if you plant onions for sowing in winter into punnets now (today), they can
be something to put in shortly, when they are big enough), and several types
of peas i believe should be ok in newcastle to go in in winter. mizuna in
punnets now! mizuna will NOT let you down & can be sown all year. and check
what else in your new veggie books ;-) well-progressed seedlings of lettuce
& stuff maybe, if you want to get seedlings at the nursery.
you probably can't plant much but you can take the opportunity to plan for
spring. :-)

And is there anything mentioned above that sounds
wrong?

not "wrong" but i'm thinking 60cm is a lot for a raised bed if you're going
to have a few of them! if you raise the bed less (i'm boggling at the
expense you must be incurring with 60cm planned!) for drainage, you
shouldn't need to allow for the entire length of the plants' roots, but
rather, a decent amount at the top so some or most of the plants' roots can
still breathe when weather is wet. most veg have lots of near-to-surface
roots to breathe with. i'm not sure if i'd use aggregate underneath or not;
the plants will have roots going down into the original soil, too, & not
sure what pebbles would achieve in terms of drainage when you think about it
that way.

I'd be *really* grateful for any feedback you can offer and hope
this might prompt a bit of a discussion on the ways in which others have
started their gardens.

any time i go a-gardening i just jump into it (none of your "planning" for
spring for me! ;-) so i guess that's how my garden started. :-)

how big will the garden be?
kylie

0tterbot wrote:


you'll work it out over the next 50 years g!

Fnf! I've not long achieved the first fifty, so go easy, eh? ;-D


with veggie gardening (ime) you learn fast but you _will_ make loads of
mistakes (some of which you will post to this group, & others keep firmly
under your hat ;-). but mistakes are better for learning imho.

mostly it is straightforward & common sense. read lots of veggie books
(there are millions - use the library & 2nd hand books too). one common
theme among them is to keep feeding the soil.. always keeping the soil
covered is another "rule" (but then there are people who remove mulch for
winter or spring, bla bla, so no rule is cast in iron & you have to be
prepared to learn & be surprised.)

What can I plant nowish (within,
say, the next month)?

winter spinach, spring onions, some other types of winter onions (actually,
if you plant onions for sowing in winter into punnets now (today), they can
be something to put in shortly, when they are big enough), and several types
of peas i believe should be ok in newcastle to go in in winter. mizuna in
punnets now! mizuna will NOT let you down & can be sown all year. and check
what else in your new veggie books ;-) well-progressed seedlings of lettuce
& stuff maybe, if you want to get seedlings at the nursery.
you probably can't plant much but you can take the opportunity to plan for
spring. :-)

Hmmm... I like the sound of spinach! My unnatural daughter wants
brussels sprouts (bleargh!) And sadly, I'm allergic to onions and most
of their family. Leeks, I can just keep down, but even the smell of
onions cooking on a barbie or of garlic in anything - watch out! Part of
the fun of this is going to be trying the new varieties of veggies we
can grow.

And is there anything mentioned above that sounds
wrong?

not "wrong" but i'm thinking 60cm is a lot for a raised bed if you're going
to have a few of them! if you raise the bed less (i'm boggling at the
expense you must be incurring with 60cm planned!)

It's an access issue. I just can't get down to ground level to maintain
the garden, so I've saved up for this one. 60cm is a good height for me
and will work in a number of ways. For example: we have a bull terrier
who just loves the smell and feel of freshly turned soil. But she can't
jump, so she won't be visiting the caulies in my garden. I reckon I can
fill it at least half-way with ordinary soil dug from another patch on
our block and then pay for the good gear to go at the top. Our soil is
good: nice dark and loamy with lots of organic matter and billions of
worms. I've got violets and camellias rioting away out the front, but
sadly I don't want my veggies there, I want them out the back.

for drainage, you
shouldn't need to allow for the entire length of the plants' roots, but
rather, a decent amount at the top so some or most of the plants' roots can
still breathe when weather is wet. most veg have lots of near-to-surface
roots to breathe with. i'm not sure if i'd use aggregate underneath or not;
the plants will have roots going down into the original soil, too, & not
sure what pebbles would achieve in terms of drainage when you think about it
that way.

Our local council generously tar-sealed the lane behind our place. Ever
since, the water drains down into our block and the neighboring ones
instead of off into the culvert on the opposite side of the lane. Winter
is a real headache with significant quantities of backyard soil washing
down to my back step and even the grass drowns until the rain dries up
toward spring!

I'd be *really* grateful for any feedback you can offer and hope
this might prompt a bit of a discussion on the ways in which others have
started their gardens.

any time i go a-gardening i just jump into it (none of your "planning" for
spring for me! ;-) so i guess that's how my garden started. :-)

Hmm... I've tried that in the past, but never had this #(%&$^@$#
drainage problem before. What's worse is, every rose bush I've tried to
grow has first succumbed to vile phungus diseases and then drowned (glub
glub glub) in its first winter. If I can get the veggies to happen, next
will be a flower garden!

how big will the garden be?
kylie


Starting off at 2m by 1m with the option to branch out if (when) things
succeed. I've no idea how things crop or even how much of stuff my lot
will eat, once I've grown it. It's going to be great fun finding out, I
think. Also, my daughter is a Scout and has been *longing* to earn her
Agriculture badge by starting a garden. Brussels sprouts, she wants!
Eurgh! =:-0

--
Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia

g'day trish,

take a look at how we do our gardens at our site. lots of step by step
pic's, would recommend same for you in those boggy situations, we also
ahve details on an agricultural drain in case that might help you
improve that drainage. alos into doing things along the permaculture
philosophy.

not sure where you live but up our way it is brassica and potato time,
along with garlic and onions.

On Mon, 26 May 2008 07:04:19 +1000, Trish Brown
wrote:
snipped
With peace and brightest of blessings,

len & bev

--
"Be Content With What You Have And
May You Find Serenity and Tranquillity In
A World That You May Not Understand."

http://www.lensgarden.com.au/

"Trish Brown" wrote in message
node...
0tterbot wrote:


you'll work it out over the next 50 years g!

Fnf! I've not long achieved the first fifty, so go easy, eh? ;-D

the best gardeners are the old farts who've been doing it forever - it's
just the way it is ;-)

winter spinach, spring onions, some other types of winter onions
(actually, if you plant onions for sowing in winter into punnets now
(today), they can be something to put in shortly, when they are big
enough), and several types of peas i believe should be ok in newcastle to
go in in winter. mizuna in punnets now! mizuna will NOT let you down &
can be sown all year. and check what else in your new veggie books ;-)
well-progressed seedlings of lettuce & stuff maybe, if you want to get
seedlings at the nursery.
you probably can't plant much but you can take the opportunity to plan
for spring. :-)

Hmmm... I like the sound of spinach!

i like the taste of it, too!! "medina" is one you can plant all winter long
& is pretty quick to grow.

My unnatural daughter wants
brussels sprouts (bleargh!)

don't worry - my son likes them too(!). it's bizarre. notwithstanding that,
i've found them just too difficult (couldn't get them to make proper heads -
they were just weird leafy little things)so i've ditched the idea for now.
anyway, it's far too late in the season. plant b-sprout seeds in punnets
towards the end of next summer ;-)

And sadly, I'm allergic to onions and most
of their family. Leeks, I can just keep down, but even the smell of onions
cooking on a barbie or of garlic in anything - watch out! Part of the fun
of this is going to be trying the new varieties of veggies we can grow.

was just checking my digger's planting chart; also included for planting
"any time" are pak choy (! not sure about that), cabbage (not ALL kinds, i'm
sure, but i grow red drumhead all year), radishes, rocket, tatsoi (wtf is
that?); and some others which are ok to plant now in a warm area include
broad beans (those are good - no effort, big crops!), various carrots, kale
(which is pretty good value, i must say) and so forth. bugger it, get a
digger's planting chart - they're good!

It's an access issue. I just can't get down to ground level to maintain
the garden, so I've saved up for this one. 60cm is a good height for me
and will work in a number of ways. For example: we have a bull terrier who
just loves the smell and feel of freshly turned soil. But she can't jump,
so she won't be visiting the caulies in my garden. I reckon I can fill it
at least half-way with ordinary soil dug from another patch on our block
and then pay for the good gear to go at the top. Our soil is good: nice
dark and loamy with lots of organic matter and billions of worms. I've got
violets and camellias rioting away out the front, but sadly I don't want
my veggies there, I want them out the back.

i see! using your own soil as well is a good idea i reckon (even if not so
good, it does become so). and cheaper.


for drainage, you shouldn't need to allow for the entire length of the
plants' roots, but rather, a decent amount at the top so some or most of
the plants' roots can still breathe when weather is wet. most veg have
lots of near-to-surface roots to breathe with. i'm not sure if i'd use
aggregate underneath or not; the plants will have roots going down into
the original soil, too, & not sure what pebbles would achieve in terms of
drainage when you think about it that way.

Our local council generously tar-sealed the lane behind our place. Ever
since, the water drains down into our block and the neighboring ones
instead of off into the culvert on the opposite side of the lane. Winter
is a real headache with significant quantities of backyard soil washing
down to my back step and even the grass drowns until the rain dries up
toward spring!

you might need to put in some drainage trenches. nobody wants to hear that,
but even so...

was also thinking it might be worthwhile to break up the ground under the
new bed with a mattock.

I'd be *really* grateful for any feedback you can offer and hope
this might prompt a bit of a discussion on the ways in which others have
started their gardens.

any time i go a-gardening i just jump into it (none of your "planning"
for spring for me! ;-) so i guess that's how my garden started. :-)

Hmm... I've tried that in the past, but never had this #(%&$^@$# drainage
problem before. What's worse is, every rose bush I've tried to grow has
first succumbed to vile phungus diseases and then drowned (glub glub glub)
in its first winter. If I can get the veggies to happen, next will be a
flower garden!

how big will the garden be?
kylie
Starting off at 2m by 1m with the option to branch out if (when) things
succeed. I've no idea how things crop or even how much of stuff my lot
will eat, once I've grown it. It's going to be great fun finding out, I
think. Also, my daughter is a Scout and has been *longing* to earn her
Agriculture badge by starting a garden. Brussels sprouts, she wants!
Eurgh! =:-0

i can promise you you're going to find 2x1m just too small pretty quickly
g! although with a high, nutritious bed you can plant closely & that will
help. and anyway, all the experts say to take it steady so you don't
overwhelm yourself. damn experts! ;-)
have fun. i just love veggie gardening, exasperating though it can sometimes
be.
kylie

len gardener wrote:
g'day trish,

take a look at how we do our gardens at our site. lots of step by step
pic's, would recommend same for you in those boggy situations, we also
ahve details on an agricultural drain in case that might help you
improve that drainage. alos into doing things along the permaculture
philosophy.

not sure where you live but up our way it is brassica and potato time,
along with garlic and onions.
With peace and brightest of blessings,

len & bev

--
"Be Content With What You Have And
May You Find Serenity and Tranquillity In
A World That You May Not Understand."

http://www.lensgarden.com.au/

Hey, thanks, Len! Great site and lots of good advice! ;-D

--
Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia

David Hare-Scott wrote:

HOGS meetings are at organic growing establishments all around the Hunter.
Some are private homes on a small block, some are mixed farms, orchards, worm
farms, deer farms etc. The Island is a kind of home base where we go to do
things appropriate to most gardens, like make compost, prune fruit trees, make
new gardens.

We assemble at noon and have lunch together (BYO). The meeting starts at 1PM,
we have afternoon tea about 3 and it breaks up about 4-4:30. Bring surplus
produce, if you have any, to share or swap.

To get the next meeting at the City Farm, turn on to Ash island bridge on the
Hunter, from the New England Highway at Sandgate (near MacDonalds). Follow a
twisty road across the island for a few kms, there will be "HOGS" signs to
guide you.

They are a friendly bunch who don't mind beginners and they will answer all
your questions. Anybody can turn up at meetings but if you join you also get
a quarterly magazine, the use of the library etc.

David



Thanks, David. Dunno whether we'll make this meeting (Scouting
commitments are nearly every weekend at the moment), but maybe another one?

--
Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia

"Trish Brown" wrote in message
...


Thanks, David. Dunno whether we'll make this meeting (Scouting
commitments are nearly every weekend at the moment), but maybe another one?

--
Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia

Meetings are the second Saturday of the month, I don't have the magazine handy
so I cannot say where the July one is. If you might be OK for 12th July I
will find out for you.

David

David Hare-Scott wrote:
"Trish Brown" wrote in message
...

Thanks, David. Dunno whether we'll make this meeting (Scouting
commitments are nearly every weekend at the moment), but maybe another one?

--
Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia

Meetings are the second Saturday of the month, I don't have the magazine handy
so I cannot say where the July one is. If you might be OK for 12th July I
will find out for you.

David



Not sure at this stage, David. If you let me know where it's going to
be, I might manage to rock up, though.

--
Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia

In article ,
Trish Brown wrote:

We're just about to embark on our first-ever veggie patch and I wondered
if anyone might have some tips for us? The reason we haven't started
before is that our block is boggy and spongy when the winter rains come,
yet arid and awful in the heat of summer. It finally dawned on me that a
raised (about 60cm or more) bed might be the answer! So, that's what
we'd like to do: build up a well-raised bed and then see if we can
reduce the grocery bill by growing some veggies.

Very good ideas!

I've read lots of material about permaculture and no-dig gardens (they
come with a recipe for layering that seems pretty impossible - I mean, I
don't know any sheep, so I won't be getting sheep-poo any time soon...)
My thoughts were to lay something drainy ('aggregate'? chitter? etc?)
and then pile on some organic mix soil (purchased at Great Cost from a
local bloke who sells it). We've got some recycled planks to make the
walls of the garden and a few years' worth of rotted grass clippings for
mulching.

Frankly, I'd just bung in what you have. I'm sure all that lucerne, straw,
sheep poo etc is wonderful but it's just too expensive for a Sydney gardener
to manage, especially considering there are cheaper/free materials that will
work just as well without requiring further greenhouse gas emissions to bring
in!

If you are building the bed on grass, put lots of layers of newspaper at the
bottom. Right now is a good time to do this as rain is expected along the
coast all week. A few *years'* worth of rotted grass clippings is probably a
beautiful friable soil by now, under the top 10cm. Use the top bit for the
mulch. It's good to have manure in there as well. And probably a good
sprinkle of lime. You will see people say that dolomite is "better" than
builder's lime; for our purposes that's nonsense. We just need to raise the
pH a bit, and if builder's lime is cheaper than the garden one, go for it.
You'd need maybe four cups for your little bed.

I see you are starting with a 2mx1m bed. That's good to start with if you are
unsure of yourself, but I can guarantee that you'll have started a second bed
within the next year unless you literally don't have any land to put it on.
Growing vegies is addictive!

Oh, and have the long side of the bed facing north/south and the short sides
east/west. Northern sun warms your vegies; western sun cooks them. Pop a
trellis on the southern side of the bed and put in your peas (snow peas or
sugar snap peas if you'd rather, but ordinary peas are easiest to grow).

Is there anything else I should know? What can I plant nowish (within,
say, the next month)? And is there anything mentioned above that sounds
wrong? I'd be *really* grateful for any feedback you can offer and hope
this might prompt a bit of a discussion on the ways in which others have
started their gardens.

You can see a nice free list here, updated monthly:
http://www.global-garden.com.au/plnttemp.htm

Sydney, and, I imagine, Newcastle are temperate.

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

http://chookiesbackyard.blogspot.com/

Chookie wrote:

Frankly, I'd just bung in what you have. I'm sure all that lucerne, straw,
sheep poo etc is wonderful but it's just too expensive for a Sydney gardener
to manage, especially considering there are cheaper/free materials that will
work just as well without requiring further greenhouse gas emissions to bring
in!

Geez, I can remember when lucerne hay cost a mere $5 a bale! I'm afraid
if I had a source of cheap hay, I'd be handing it to my sister to feed
her horses with! It seems like such a waste to chuck good clean hay onto
the garden when there's gobs of grass clippings going begging.

If you are building the bed on grass, put lots of layers of newspaper at the
bottom. Right now is a good time to do this as rain is expected along the
coast all week. A few *years'* worth of rotted grass clippings is probably a
beautiful friable soil by now, under the top 10cm. Use the top bit for the
mulch. It's good to have manure in there as well.

You're right! I dug down a few inches and sure enough it's all blackened
and composted! I thought it'd be a heap of nice shaggy mulch, but I
think the compost is going to be more useful! Hooray! ;-D

The centre of the heap is quite hot to the touch. Is that OK?

And probably a good
sprinkle of lime. You will see people say that dolomite is "better" than
builder's lime; for our purposes that's nonsense. We just need to raise the
pH a bit, and if builder's lime is cheaper than the garden one, go for it.
You'd need maybe four cups for your little bed.

I see you are starting with a 2mx1m bed. That's good to start with if you are
unsure of yourself, but I can guarantee that you'll have started a second bed
within the next year unless you literally don't have any land to put it on.
Growing vegies is addictive!

I'm already planning and plotting the shape of the extensions, but I
want to get something in and growing before I commit any more energy etc
to the project. AND, I've promised my son he can have a flower bed. (NB.
My son is 32 and autistic and he *loves* gardening and flowers. What's
easy to grow that makes good cut specimens?)


Oh, and have the long side of the bed facing north/south and the short sides
east/west. Northern sun warms your vegies; western sun cooks them. Pop a
trellis on the southern side of the bed and put in your peas (snow peas or
sugar snap peas if you'd rather, but ordinary peas are easiest to grow).

I've got a bit of reo hanging on the southern fence and the ultimate
plan is to do peas and beans. You put those in during spring, right?

You can see a nice free list here, updated monthly:
http://www.global-garden.com.au/plnttemp.htm

Hey, thanks for the info and especially the positive reinforcement! The
bed is built and waiting for a rain-free day for us to fill it. I've
weeded away all the grass and have plenty of fridge cartons and
newspaper for the base. My sister has ploughed up three rooms of quarry
tiles (!) and has promised to deliver them during this week, so that'll
be my 'drainy' layer. After that, nice garden soil and some grass
compost, after that, my purchased soil and the grassy mulch on top. I
guess it'd be sensible to wait a week or two to see how things settle
before planting?

Sydney, and, I imagine, Newcastle are temperate.

Bloody frigid at the moment! Brrrr! ;-

--
Trish {|:-} Newcastle, NSW, Australia

In article ,
Trish Brown wrote:

A few *years'* worth of rotted grass clippings is probably a
beautiful friable soil by now, under the top 10cm. Use the top bit for the
mulch. It's good to have manure in there as well.

You're right! I dug down a few inches and sure enough it's all blackened
and composted! I thought it'd be a heap of nice shaggy mulch, but I
think the compost is going to be more useful! Hooray! ;-D

The centre of the heap is quite hot to the touch. Is that OK?

Perfectly fine. Throwing it in to the garden bed will probably cool it down a
bit, but it would have to be pretty darn hot to burn seeds at this time of
year. Just remember the lime.

AND, I've promised my son he can have a flower bed. (NB.
My son is 32 and autistic and he *loves* gardening and flowers. What's
easy to grow that makes good cut specimens?)

Hmm, depends if he's got motor difficulties. If he has, try either big seeds
like nasturtiums, sunflowers and sweet peas (though this month, I'd only try
to plant nasturtium seeds) or seedlings in those 'cellular' punnets -- I'd
pick poppies, stocks, wallflowers, calendulas or maybe penstemons. Anything
sturdy.

I've got a bit of reo hanging on the southern fence and the ultimate
plan is to do peas and beans. You put those in during spring, right?

Not quite! Peas are a winter crop; you can plant them now (but not into
waterlogged soil -- they rot). Plant climbing beans in very early spring,
before the heat gets them, or in late summer. French (dwarf) beans (which I
find most reliable) are a warm-weather crop that you can plant from ~September
onwards. Broad beans are also a winter crop and can be planted now, but they
don't need a trellis -- instead, they need a few stakes and some rope to stop
them blowing over.

Happy gardening :-)

--
Chookie -- Sydney, Australia
(Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply)

http://chookiesbackyard.blogspot.com/