Casuarina roots
 

I have three young casuarinas near my fence line. I'm thinking of adding
more garden beds along there, but that would entail piling about 40cm
more soil on top of the casuarina roots to build up the beds. My husband
reckons this will kill them. Since the trees are now about fifteen feet
tall and doing well, I'd rather not do that. But I want my garden beds too!

Any ideas? Solutions? Comments?

--
Trish Brown {|:-}

Newcastle, NSW, Australia

Casuarina roots
 

Trish Brown wrote:
I have three young casuarinas near my fence line. I'm thinking of
adding more garden beds along there, but that would entail piling
about 40cm more soil on top of the casuarina roots to build up the beds.
My
husband reckons this will kill them. Since the trees are now about
fifteen feet tall and doing well, I'd rather not do that. But I want
my garden beds too!
Any ideas? Solutions? Comments?

I have seen this kill trees. I cannot say if it kills all trees or if
casuarinas are particularly susceptible or not.

David

Casuarina roots
 

On Mon, 02 Nov 2009 08:43:46 +1100, Trish Brown wrote:

I have three young casuarinas near my fence line. I'm thinking of adding
more garden beds along there, but that would entail piling about 40cm
more soil on top of the casuarina roots to build up the beds. My husband
reckons this will kill them. Since the trees are now about fifteen feet
tall and doing well, I'd rather not do that. But I want my garden beds
too!

Any ideas? Solutions? Comments?

IME it will not affect casuarinas in the slightest. They will quite
happily suck up everything you throw on the garden.

Casuarina roots
 

terryc wrote:
On Mon, 02 Nov 2009 08:43:46 +1100, Trish Brown wrote:

I have three young casuarinas near my fence line. I'm thinking of adding
more garden beds along there, but that would entail piling about 40cm
more soil on top of the casuarina roots to build up the beds. My husband
reckons this will kill them. Since the trees are now about fifteen feet
tall and doing well, I'd rather not do that. But I want my garden beds
too!

Any ideas? Solutions? Comments?

IME it will not affect casuarinas in the slightest. They will quite
happily suck up everything you throw on the garden.


I kinda hoped that would be the case, being that casuarinas are riverine
trees and suffer inundantion and changing soil depths all the time. I
hope there's someone out there who's actually done something like this?
It'd feel a lot better knowing someone had been successful with it, y'know?

--
Trish Brown {|:-}

Newcastle, NSW, Australia

Casuarina roots
 

On Mon, 02 Nov 2009 12:03:53 +1100, Trish Brown wrote:


I kinda hoped that would be the case, being that casuarinas are riverine
trees and suffer inundantion and changing soil depths all the time. I
hope there's someone out there who's actually done something like this?
It'd feel a lot better knowing someone had been successful with it,
y'know?

Well, we had one in the back garden that a bit taller and it hasn't
suffered one little bit from the 1' of raised vege garden bed running
across half its root zone. Those roots grew just nicely. Now all I need
is a good recipe for them {:-).

Casuarina roots
 

g'day trish,

yes this can kill trees, have seen it happen on many occassions.

would recommend against doing it for that reason and that if it
doesn't kill the trees then the roots will invade the garden beds.
400mm is a lot of fill to put on top of the tree roots. at best lay
some compost/mulch to about 100mm to 200mm and plant some understory
type plants could be natives or annuals.


On Mon, 02 Nov 2009 08:43:46 +1100, Trish Brown
wrote:

snipped
With peace and brightest of blessings,

len & bev

--
"Be Content With What You Have And
May You Find Serenity and Tranquillity In
A World That You May Not Understand."

http://www.lensgarden.com.au/

Casuarina roots
 

"Trish Brown" wrote in message
...
I have three young casuarinas near my fence line. I'm thinking of adding
more garden beds along there, but that would entail piling about 40cm more
soil on top of the casuarina roots to build up the beds. My husband reckons
this will kill them. Since the trees are now about fifteen feet tall and
doing well, I'd rather not do that. But I want my garden beds too!

Any ideas? Solutions? Comments?

my first thought is that if they're the kind of casuarina that grow
incredibly tall, always look awful, drop seeds everywhere for people to skid
on & break their necks, drop needles constantly & defend their root zone,
what on earth do you want 3 of them in your yard for, anyway? g

my second thought is that the trees are far more likely to ruin the beds
than the beds are to ruin the casuarinas. unless (or indeed, even if) the
entire root zone is buried, i imagine it's not a problem for the vast
majority of established trees. if most of the root zone would be covered,
think twice. to keep roots out of raised beds you probably want a proper
barrier at ground level.

mainly, i wouldn't do it because i can't see it working, with one thing &
another - if you can't choose between the trees & the beds, nature will
probably do it for you. although, you've probably gathered that i don't
think casuarinas are a good idea for backyard trees anyway. (i'd chop them
down now while they're still small ;-)

having said all that, i read recently (and i can't remember where!) that
longstem planting is surprisingly effective for more trees than you would
think, & i imagine being water-loving river trees that casuarinas would
adapt perfectly well to finding themselves buried more deeply than usual -
they would most likely just begin sending roots out from higher up. an
example of a tree that will never prosper buried deeper, are those with
grafts. a hardy native tree should be ok. but as i said, i'm not convinced
the beds would prosper. they might be ok, though. if the beds are for a few
sturdy perennials, perhaps no problem. if they're for veg, i'd say do it
elsewhere & give the veg a better chance.
kylie

Casuarina roots
 

"0tterbot" wrote in message
...
"Trish Brown" wrote in message
...
I have three young casuarinas near my fence line. I'm thinking of adding
more garden beds along there, but that would entail piling about 40cm more
soil on top of the casuarina roots to build up the beds. My husband
reckons this will kill them. Since the trees are now about fifteen feet
tall and doing well, I'd rather not do that. But I want my garden beds
too!

Any ideas? Solutions? Comments?

my first thought is that if they're the kind of casuarina that grow
incredibly tall, always look awful, drop seeds everywhere for people to
skid on & break their necks, drop needles constantly & defend their root
zone, what on earth do you want 3 of them in your yard for, anyway? g

my second thought is that the trees are far more likely to ruin the beds
than the beds are to ruin the casuarinas. unless (or indeed, even if) the
entire root zone is buried, i imagine it's not a problem for the vast
majority of established trees. if most of the root zone would be covered,
think twice. to keep roots out of raised beds you probably want a proper
barrier at ground level.

mainly, i wouldn't do it because i can't see it working, with one thing &
another - if you can't choose between the trees & the beds, nature will
probably do it for you. although, you've probably gathered that i don't
think casuarinas are a good idea for backyard trees anyway. (i'd chop them
down now while they're still small ;-)

having said all that, i read recently (and i can't remember where!) that
longstem planting is surprisingly effective for more trees than you would
think, & i imagine being water-loving river trees that casuarinas would
adapt perfectly well to finding themselves buried more deeply than usual -
they would most likely just begin sending roots out from higher up. an
example of a tree that will never prosper buried deeper, are those with
grafts. a hardy native tree should be ok. but as i said, i'm not convinced
the beds would prosper. they might be ok, though. if the beds are for a
few sturdy perennials, perhaps no problem. if they're for veg, i'd say do
it elsewhere & give the veg a better chance.
kylie
Why not gamble and find out.
My gut feling is that it wouldn't hurt them one little bit, as the roots
would compensate by growing into the garden beds.
Despite what is said, plants aren't suicidal, and can adept.

Casuarina roots
 

Jonno wrote:

"0tterbot" wrote in message
...
"Trish Brown" wrote in message
...
I have three young casuarinas near my fence line. I'm thinking of
adding more garden beds along there, but that would entail piling
about 40cm more soil on top of the casuarina roots to build up the
beds. My husband reckons this will kill them. Since the trees are now
about fifteen feet tall and doing well, I'd rather not do that. But I
want my garden beds too!

Any ideas? Solutions? Comments?

my first thought is that if they're the kind of casuarina that grow
incredibly tall, always look awful, drop seeds everywhere for people
to skid on & break their necks, drop needles constantly & defend their
root zone, what on earth do you want 3 of them in your yard for,
anyway? g

my second thought is that the trees are far more likely to ruin the
beds than the beds are to ruin the casuarinas. unless (or indeed, even
if) the entire root zone is buried, i imagine it's not a problem for
the vast majority of established trees. if most of the root zone would
be covered, think twice. to keep roots out of raised beds you probably
want a proper barrier at ground level.

mainly, i wouldn't do it because i can't see it working, with one
thing & another - if you can't choose between the trees & the beds,
nature will probably do it for you. although, you've probably gathered
that i don't think casuarinas are a good idea for backyard trees
anyway. (i'd chop them down now while they're still small ;-)

having said all that, i read recently (and i can't remember where!)
that longstem planting is surprisingly effective for more trees than
you would think, & i imagine being water-loving river trees that
casuarinas would adapt perfectly well to finding themselves buried
more deeply than usual - they would most likely just begin sending
roots out from higher up. an example of a tree that will never prosper
buried deeper, are those with grafts. a hardy native tree should be
ok. but as i said, i'm not convinced the beds would prosper. they
might be ok, though. if the beds are for a few sturdy perennials,
perhaps no problem. if they're for veg, i'd say do it elsewhere & give
the veg a better chance.
kylie
Why not gamble and find out.
My gut feling is that it wouldn't hurt them one little bit, as the roots
would compensate by growing into the garden beds.
Despite what is said, plants aren't suicidal, and can adept.

Thanks for the intelligent discussion! I'm going to take the gamble and
see what happens. I only wanted to grow a few annuals in the beds, just
for flowers indoors. Oh, and some dear old geraniums against the ugly fence.

Kylie, I hear what you say about not liking casuarinas, but I do! The
sound the wind makes as it blows through their needles is so relaxing.
The sound made by cockies as they gobble up the nuts isn't quite so
relaxing, but I like it anyway. And if they drop their needles, oh well.
Thing is, my husband (*not* a gardener) fell in love with these trees
and bought the three on special. They're 'his' contribution to the
garden, so - y'know - I hope they survive. I'll let you know whichever
way. All in the course of furthering the collective knowledge, eh? ;-D

--
Trish Brown {|:-}

Newcastle, NSW, Australia

Casuarina roots
 

On Wed, 04 Nov 2009 09:03:21 +0000, 0tterbot wrote:


my first thought is that if they're the kind of casuarina that grow
incredibly tall, always look awful, drop seeds everywhere for people to
skid on & break their necks, drop needles constantly & defend their root
zone, what on earth do you want 3 of them in your yard for, anyway? g

The sound of the breezes through them is just wonderful.

Casuarina roots
 

"0tterbot" wrote in message

having said all that, i read recently (and i can't remember where!) that
longstem planting is surprisingly effective for more trees than you would
think,

It was certainly featured on one of the Gardening Australia programs.
amazing really as it goes against the grain after all those years of being
told to plant at the level the plant was in the pot.

Casuarina roots
 

"Trish Brown" wrote in message

Kylie, I hear what you say about not liking casuarinas, but I do! The
sound the wind makes as it blows through their needles is so relaxing.

:-)) I too love that sound, but then I also agree with Otterbot about the
looks of casuarinas - not a favourite in terms of good looks TMWOT. But,
having said that, I also hate the look of Pinus radiata but they certainly
do have their uses.

Casuarina roots
 

"FarmI" ask@itshall be given wrote in message
. au...
"0tterbot" wrote in message

having said all that, i read recently (and i can't remember where!) that
longstem planting is surprisingly effective for more trees than you would
think,

It was certainly featured on one of the Gardening Australia programs.
amazing really as it goes against the grain after all those years of being
told to plant at the level the plant was in the pot.

They also said it may not work for some trees.
Casuarinas sound pretty tough trees so I wouldn't worry...

See here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casuarina

Casuarina roots
 

"Jonno" wrote in message
...

"FarmI" ask@itshall be given wrote in message
. au...
"0tterbot" wrote in message

having said all that, i read recently (and i can't remember where!) that
longstem planting is surprisingly effective for more trees than you
would think,

It was certainly featured on one of the Gardening Australia programs.
amazing really as it goes against the grain after all those years of
being told to plant at the level the plant was in the pot.

They also said it may not work for some trees.
Casuarinas sound pretty tough trees so I wouldn't worry...

See here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casuarina

This part would worry me though if you built a garden bed under or near it
The plants are strongly suspected of having allelopathic properties, as
evidenced by the near absence of understory once a mat of litter
develops around the plants.
Allelopathy is a biological phenomenon that is characteristic of some
plants, algae, bacteria, coral and fungi by which they produce certain
biochemicals that influence the growth and development of other
organisms. The biochemicals, called allelochemicals can have a beneficial
or detrimental effect on neighbouring organisms.

Casuarina roots
 

On Thu, 05 Nov 2009 08:54:03 +0000, Jonno wrote:


This part would worry me though if you built a garden bed under or near
it
The plants are strongly suspected of having allelopathic properties,
as evidenced by the near absence of understory once a mat of litter
develops around the plants.

Naah, no probs, the chief gardnere produced a crop of spuds under ours
this year. The major problem is you are watering the tree as well as the
garden.

Casuarina roots
 

"terryc" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 05 Nov 2009 08:54:03 +0000, Jonno wrote:


This part would worry me though if you built a garden bed under or near
it
The plants are strongly suspected of having allelopathic properties,
as evidenced by the near absence of understory once a mat of litter
develops around the plants.

Naah, no probs, the chief gardnere produced a crop of spuds under ours
this year. The major problem is you are watering the tree as well as the
garden.

Wouldn't you be doing that if you watered the garden and the roots are
located under the garden?

Casuarina roots
 

On Thu, 05 Nov 2009 16:26:50 +0000, Jonno wrote:


Wouldn't you be doing that if you watered the garden and the roots are
located under the garden?

I said before, if you dump soil above casuarina roots, then they grow up
into it much more voraciously than gum trees do. Makes a bit of a mockery
of no-dig gardens as you have to dig a patch to give seedlings a starting
edge.

If the roots stayed below, then they would be just picking up the excess,
which is no problem.

The other problem is that the tree leaves a rain (less) shadow.

Casuarina roots
 

"Trish Brown" wrote in message
...

Why not gamble and find out.
My gut feling is that it wouldn't hurt them one little bit, as the roots
would compensate by growing into the garden beds.
Despite what is said, plants aren't suicidal, and can adept.

Thanks for the intelligent discussion! I'm going to take the gamble and
see what happens. I only wanted to grow a few annuals in the beds, just
for flowers indoors. Oh, and some dear old geraniums against the ugly
fence.

Kylie, I hear what you say about not liking casuarinas, but I do!

of course you do! i like them in their place, i should say. well, i don't
LIKE them (visually), but they belong there! i was just being an opinionated
cow :-)

The
sound the wind makes as it blows through their needles is so relaxing. The
sound made by cockies as they gobble up the nuts isn't quite so relaxing,
but I like it anyway. And if they drop their needles, oh well. Thing is,
my husband (*not* a gardener) fell in love with these trees and bought the
three on special. They're 'his' contribution to the garden, so - y'know -
I hope they survive. I'll let you know whichever way. All in the course of
furthering the collective knowledge, eh? ;-D

in light of everyone (at your house)'s strong preference for the casuarinas
over whatever might end up in the beds, you might as well go for it! i'm
pretty sure that the casuarinas won't suffer, so if you're not attached to
whatever you want to put in the beds, do it & see how it goes.

if you wanted veg or something in the beds, where they need care & it's an
emotional & water/nutritional investment, that would be different (&
probably not recommended).

mind you, if you follow our advice here & it all goes bung, you don't get to
whinge later, orright? g
kylie

Casuarina roots
 

"FarmI" ask@itshall be given wrote in message
. au...
"0tterbot" wrote in message

having said all that, i read recently (and i can't remember where!) that
longstem planting is surprisingly effective for more trees than you would
think,

It was certainly featured on one of the Gardening Australia programs.
amazing really as it goes against the grain after all those years of being
told to plant at the level the plant was in the pot.

yes, that's it. it was in a copy of g.a. magazine (which i don't buy, but my
mum sends me her used ones). i found it right after i posted (isn't that
always the way).

for the information of anyone else, someone called bill hicks was
experimenting with longstem planting of aust. natives, to repair & prevent
erosion (i.e. if the trees are deep, and making adventitious roots from the
buried part, they tend to grow well without any extra water or care, and
much less likely to be washed away by flooding, etc).

he found not all species will live like this, but many of them do. and also,
those which thrive on teh technique get really big, really fast, which is
what you want to repair erosion.
kylie

Casuarina roots
 

0tterbot wrote:

snip

mind you, if you follow our advice here & it all goes bung, you don't get to
whinge later, orright? g
kylie


ROTFLMAO!!! I reserve the right to my whinge anyway. A body always feels
better after a bijou whingette!

Just an update on me embryonic garden:

I've discovered ebay! Did you know you can buy seeds and cuttings and
even plants on ebay? I've got an entire collection of violets (I do love
violets!) from there at an average cost of about five dollars each. It
always works out cheaper if you buy multiple items from one seller, as
combining postage is well worth it. Probably the most unusual thing I've
bought is a perfectly gorgeous purple-leaved hoya, about 60cm tall and
packed ingeniously in cardboard and bubble-wrap.

The violets came variously in polystyrene cups and gladwrap over wet
paper towel, but all are thriving and just today I was able to divide
some of them for the first time. I have nine varieties now!

Orchids also lend themselves to ebay shopping, since they only need some
damp medium to kick on for a few days. Most sellers post on Mondays to
enable the quickest possible delivery and prevent things having to
weekend in a stuffy post office. All in all, my experiences have been
great so far.

Of the funny items I've seen for sale in the gardening section, the best
has been the plethora of mature Cocos and Alexandra palms for sale. The
vast majority of these have been from private sellers who were silly
enough to plant their indoor palm outdoors and then got a surprise when
it grew up. LOL!

Prices vary from 'Free to anyone who will come and remove' to
(Hnyahahahahahahahahahahahaha! Pardon my guffaw!) $1,000 starting bid
for a ten-year-old specimen. IMHO, you would need to pay the buyer to
remove the blessed things, rather than try to fob one off on some poor
unsuspecting bloke for money.

Anyway, if you haven't checked out ebay for plants, do! It's fun just
browsing what's available, even if you don't want to buy.

--
Trish Brown {|:-}

Newcastle, NSW, Australia

Casuarina roots
 

Tomatoes grow better if you do the same thing.
Plant them deep.....


"0tterbot" wrote in message
...
"FarmI" ask@itshall be given wrote in message
. au...
"0tterbot" wrote in message

having said all that, i read recently (and i can't remember where!) that
longstem planting is surprisingly effective for more trees than you
would think,

It was certainly featured on one of the Gardening Australia programs.
amazing really as it goes against the grain after all those years of
being told to plant at the level the plant was in the pot.

yes, that's it. it was in a copy of g.a. magazine (which i don't buy, but
my mum sends me her used ones). i found it right after i posted (isn't
that always the way).

for the information of anyone else, someone called bill hicks was
experimenting with longstem planting of aust. natives, to repair & prevent
erosion (i.e. if the trees are deep, and making adventitious roots from
the buried part, they tend to grow well without any extra water or care,
and much less likely to be washed away by flooding, etc).

he found not all species will live like this, but many of them do. and
also, those which thrive on teh technique get really big, really fast,
which is what you want to repair erosion.
kylie

Casuarina roots OT
 

Sorry guys but this thread keeps going. I have tried to resist but???? When
I first saw this I said to SWMBO about a sweet young girl we knew out west,
I bet her father hopes she doesn't. The reply I got was "she most certainly
does" Once again sorry guys & gals.

Casuarina roots OT
 

"SG1" wrote in message
...
Sorry guys but this thread keeps going. I have tried to resist but????
When I first saw this I said to SWMBO about a sweet young girl we knew out
west, I bet her father hopes she doesn't. The reply I got was "she most
certainly does" Once again sorry guys & gals.

And why not. Everyone else knows in the end.