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Old 17-11-2003, 07:42 PM
dalecochoy
 
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Default [IBC] Brazilian Raintree/ Texas Ebony revisited

The other day during our TE discussion I mentioned I didn't THINK they were same family, and I was QUICKLY corrected that both were Pithecellobium.
I mentioned to Bart ( offline) that I thought this because I thought I'd remembered Jim Moody/Carolyn Carver calling them by another name.
Soooo, I was interested enough to look up my Jupiter order form, and sure enough, Jim calls it "Samanea Saman" ( I told Bart I thought it was something like that) and TE is listed as Pithecellobium flexicaule.
Jim Moody is pretty much accepted as the person to introduce BR to Florida as bonsai stock. I seem to recall he told me that he got some seeds sent him by someone in South America, Some Floridians probably know the story better than me for sure!
Anyway, I did a search of the Samanea name and bingo, all kinds of Mimosa, raintree, etc. stuff came up.
What's the story guys. Is this a case of more than one name commonly given to a tree ( ala "kingsvilles" as per last week) or are there a couple different types of "Brazilian Raintree".
Brent, any ideas?

Regards,
Dale " always curious, but not enough to research it!" Cochoy

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Old 17-11-2003, 09:42 PM
Jim Lewis
 
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Default [IBC] Brazilian Raintree/ Texas Ebony revisited

Dale wrote:

What's the story guys. Is this a case of more than one name
commonly given to a tree ( ala "kingsvilles" as per last week)
or are there a couple different types of "Brazilian Raintree".
Brent, any ideas?
================================================== ===============
==========


Dale:

I went to the Legume database.

We were both wrong. They ARE in the same family: Leguminosae

And while they're both known in some circles as Pithecellobium
XXXX, I fell into my own trap and didn't check further than my
older references. At some point, the rain tree was moved to
Samanea (or it is an earlier name that had precedance).

This stuff is all too common.

If anyone wants to know the very LATEST about Legume taxonomy, go
he http://www.ildis.org/.

Below is the history.

Jim Lewis - - Tallahassee, FL - The phrase
'sustainable growth' is an oxymoron. - Stephen Viederman

Here are all of the known synonyms for the Texas ebony (note that
Pithecellobium and Samanea are both represented, but neither is
the preferred name:

Ebenopsis ebano (Berland.)Barneby & Grimes
-----------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Status: Accepted
Genus: Ebenopsis Britton & Rose
Tribe: Ingeae
References: [2986]
-----------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Other names:

Acacia flexicaulis Benth. [Synonym] [1494][2327]
Calliandra geniculata Benth. [Synonym] [2986]
Chloroleucon ebano (Berland.)L.Rico [Synonym] [2986][2327]
Ebenopsis flexicaulis (Benth.)Britton & Rose [Synonym]
Hoopesia arborea Buckley [Synonym] [2986]
Mimosa ebano Berland. [Synonym] [1494][2327]
Pithecellobium ebano (Berland.)C.H.Muller [Synonym] [2327]
Pithecellobium flexicaule (Benth.)Coulter [Synonym] [1494][2327]
Pithecellobium texense Coulter [Synonym] [2327][1494]
Pithecolobium flexicaule (Benth.)Coulter [Orthographic] [2986]
Pithecolobium texense Coulter [Orthographic] [2986]
Samanea flexicaulis (Benth.)Macbr. [Synonym] [2986]
Siderocarpos flexicaulis (Benth.)Small [Synonym] [2986]
Zygia flexicaulis (Benth.)Sudw. [Synonym] [2986]
-----------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Common Names:

Acte (Huasteco) [2986]
Ebano (Mexico) [2986]
Texas Ebony (Texas, USA) [2986]
-----------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Descriptors:

Habit:
Tree
Lifespan: Perennial
-----------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Geographical Distribution:

Central America
Mexico(North & Central, Tamaulipas
Mexico(South East) Yucatan
North America: United States, Florida Texas
-----------------------------------------------------------------
---------------


And here are the references for the rain tree. Again, both names
are represented.

Samanea saman (Jacq.)Merr.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Status: Accepted
Genus: Samanea (Benth.)Merr.
Tribe: Ingeae
References: [3][1056][2986]
-----------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Other names:

Acacia propinqua A.Rich. [Synonym] [1604]
Albizia saman (Jacq.)Merr. [Synonym] [1604]
Albizzia saman (Jacq.)Merr. [Orthographic] [2986]
Calliandra saman (Jacq.)Griseb. [Synonym] [1604]
Enterolobium saman (Jacq.)Prain [Synonym] [1][1442][1604][1056]
Feuilleea saman (Jacq.)Kuntze [Synonym] [1604]
Inga cinerea Willd. [Synonym] [1604]
Inga salutaris Kunth [Synonym] [1604]
Inga saman (Jacq.)Willd. [Synonym] [2986]
Mimosa pubifera Poiret [Synonym] [1604]
Mimosa saman Jacq. [Synonym] [1292][1360][1408][1442][1604][1645]
Pithecellobium cinereum Benth. [Synonym] [1604]
Pithecellobium saman (Jacq.)Benth. [Synonym] [1]
Pithecellobium saman (Jacq.)Benth. Var. saman [Synonym]
Pithecolobium saman (Jacq.)Benth. [Orthographic] [2986]
Zygia saman (Jacq.)A.Lyons [Synonym] [2986]
-----------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Common Names:
Acacia Preta [4]
Algarrobo (Cuba) [2986]
Arbor de Lluvia (Sp) [2986]
Arbre . la Pluie [1915]
Campano (Venezuela & Colombia) [2986]
Carabeli (Venezuela) [2986]
Carreto (C.Amer.) [2986]
CenĄzaro [2304]
Cenicero (C.Amer.) [2986]
Chorona (Port) [2986]
Coco Tamarind (Grenada) [2986]
Couji (Venezuela) [2986]
Cow Tamarind (Grenada) [2986]
Dormiląn
Dormilon (C.Amer.) [2986]
French Tamarind (Guyana) [2986]
GenĄzaro [2304]
Giant Thibet
Goango [1915]
Guango (Jamatea) [2986]
Guannegoul [2157]
Guannegoule (Haiti) [2986]
Inga Saman [4]
Lara (Venezuela) [2986]
Marsave
Monkey Pod [2264] [2968]
Rain Tree [1941] [2986] [2264] [2968] [1902] [1056] [1]
Sam n [1902] [2013]
Saman [1941]
Saman (Venezuela & Colombia) [2986]
Sirsa [2264]
Urero (Venezuela) [2986]
Vaivai Ni Vavalagi [2264]
Zaman (Venezuela & Colombia) [2986]
Zarza (C.Amer.) [2986]
-----------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Descriptors:
Habit: Tree
Lifespan: Perennial
-----------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Geographical Distribution:

Africa, Benin , Gambia The , Ghana, Kenya, Nigeria, Sao Tome &
Principe, Sierra Leone, Sudan, Tanzania, Togo, Uganda, Zaire,
Zambia

Asia: Bhutan, Cambodia, India, Indonesia-ISO, Irian Jaya, Laos,
Malaysia-ISO, Philippines, Sri Lanka, Thailand, Vietnam,
Australasia: Australia, Queensland, Papua New Guinea,
Caribbean: Antigua-Barbuda, Barbados, Cuba, Dominica, Dominican
Republic, Grenada, Guadeloupe, Haiti, Jamaica, Martinique,
Montserrat, Puerto Rico, St Lucia, St Vincent
Central America: Belize, Costa Rica, El Salvador, Guatemala,
Honduras, Mexico(South East): Nicaragua Panama,
Indian Ocean: Madagascar, Maldives, Mauritius, Reunion,
Seychelles,
Pacific Ocean: Fiji, Hawaii, Marshall Is, Niue, Northern
Marianas, Society Is
South America Brazil, Colombia, French Guiana, Guyana, Peru,
Surinam, Venezuela

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Old 18-11-2003, 03:12 PM
Bart Thomas
 
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Default [IBC] Brazilian Raintree/ Texas Ebony revisited

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Lewis"

I went to the Legume database.

We were both wrong. They ARE in the same family: Leguminosae

And while they're both known in some circles as Pithecellobium
XXXX, I fell into my own trap and didn't check further than my
older references. At some point, the rain tree was moved to
Samanea (or it is an earlier name that had precedance).


Sheesh!

You ask "What time is it?", and you get a history of Switzerland!

Thanks, Jim, for a definitive answer. It's going into my file right next to
the identity of Lohengrin's mother!

and THAT is a compliment!

How will we replace your taxonomic expertise?

Regards,

Bart (Who's NOT volunteering!)

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Old 18-11-2003, 03:42 PM
Jim Lewis
 
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Default [IBC] Brazilian Raintree/ Texas Ebony revisited

and THAT is a compliment!

How will we replace your taxonomic expertise?


Hey! I'm not leaving the list! Just the work!

But thanks.

Jim Lewis - - Tallahassee, FL - VEGETARIAN:
An Indian word meaning "lousy hunter." (Borrowed from a sig by
fellow listowner, Scott Peterson)

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+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++


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