In article ,
Wilson wrote:

sometime in the recent past AndyS posted this:

Penelope wrote:
Food cans are usually tin or aluminum. There are far better and less
toxic ways to get trace minerals into your soil.


Andy writes:

That's incorrect. You can tell by using a magnet. Beer cans are
aluminum.
NOTHING is made of "tin", since tin is much much more expensive than
iron...So
is aluminum , for that matter.

We burn our trash here. When the cans are dumped onto the ground,
and it rains a couple times, they are covered with rust --- iron
oxide.
THAT is the iron bearing nutrient that leaches into the soil for the
plants.,

Bones are heavy in calcium, and do not need to "decompose". They
are
already in the form needed by the plants. Just a little leaching .

Regarding botulism..... Botulism does not appear from the air
"magically".
Meat does not naturally contain botulism, and the only source would be
from
the dirt. If the dirt contains botulism spores anyway, a piece of
chicken won't
matter...

I think you are too cautious in your approach.

Andy in Eureka, Texas
Most composting frowns on using fatty meat bits as they attract flies &
other vermin besides all that protein breakdown problems. IF you put chicken
bones in your garden, you will attract dogs, skunks, raccoons, bears and any
other host of critters. Been there & done that. I suggest some bone meal as
in Rose food if you want to go the bone way, otherwise, roast the bones,
crush them up and go that way.

Pressure cooking is even more efficient for making bones soft enough to
crush, plus it has two other perks. You get to make stock, and the
bones are sterilized. ;-)

For all practical purposes, a pressure cooker is an autoclave...

I currently make ALL soups and stocks in the pressure cooker to resolve
the cooling issue that can happen with large batches. Prevents food
poisoning. I can leave the pressure cooker, still fully sealed, on the
stove top for several hours to cool stuff to room temp. before decanting
and refrigeration.

Pressure cooked bones can be crushed by hand. Chicken being the fastest
and easiest. Generally takes about 1 hour. Beef or pork take twice as
long!

Back when we used to keep poultry, we'd crush the bones and mix up the
stock remains and feed them to the chickens. The LOVED it.


Tin cans, now that's just silly. Research the Fe needs of your vegetables
and you'll find most will do nicely without it. It is usually added to help
make your soil more acid - remember 'Mir-Acid?'

Why not just purchase and use blood and bone meal if you are after Iron
and Calcium phosphate? It's not like it's expensive or anything...
--
Peace! Om

"Any ship can be a minesweeper. Once." -- Anonymous

On Jan 10, 11:36*am, Omelet wrote:
In article
,



*AndyS wrote:
Andy asks:

* * This coming spring, when I am transplanting Celebrity tomatoes
from
the little flats I get from Home Deopt into my garden, I plan to do
the
following:

* * Dig a larger and deeper hole than normal by about 6 inches.

* *In the bottom of the hold put a rusty, flattened tin can and some
chicken scraps, with bone, from the table.

* *Put *on potting soil or compost for an inch or two, then the tomato
plant as per normal......

* *The idea behind this is that the rusty tin can will add trace
elements
of iron, and the chicken scraps will rot and provide nitrogen and
calcium
as the roots grow deeper.

* * Has anyone tried anything like this, and can anyone comment on
whether this is a reasonable idea ?

* * Just experimenting,

* * * * * * * * * * Andy in Eureka, Texas

Native americans used fish for corn and beans.
--
Peace! Om

"Any ship can be a minesweepter. Once." -- Anonymous

Hi Andy, My dad was a soil chemist(agronomist) at Purdue, PennSt,
Umass & Rutgers. He planted tomatoes this way: dig a hole about 1 ft
deep, drop a small handful of 10-10-10 in with about 1 - 3 inches of
soil on top of it, mix the soil and fert, pack it down put more loose
soil in and plant tomatoes up to their bottom leaves. Water well. When
the roots reach that fertilizer they take off growing. The submerged
stem up to the bottom leaves will also sprout roots. It makes for a
healthy plant with a good headstart. Good luck with the 'mater!!!!
Nan in DE

"AndyS" wrote in message
...
Andy asks:

This coming spring, when I am transplanting Celebrity tomatoes
from
the little flats I get from Home Deopt into my garden, I plan to do
the
following:

Dig a larger and deeper hole than normal by about 6 inches.

In the bottom of the hold put a rusty, flattened tin can and some
chicken scraps, with bone, from the table.

Chicken scraps with some bones? You better not have dogs or possums or other
such animals where you live. If you do you're likely to find your little
tomatoes ripped up as they dig up the bones and scraps.



Put on potting soil or compost for an inch or two, then the tomato
plant as per normal......

Well rotted compost. Excellent idea.



The idea behind this is that the rusty tin can will add trace
elements
of iron, and the chicken scraps will rot and provide nitrogen and
calcium
as the roots grow deeper.

Has anyone tried anything like this, and can anyone comment on
whether this is a reasonable idea ?

You need to skip the meat and bones unless animals can't get to your garden.
Also the rotting of fresh bones and meaty waste can harm the roots of many
plants. Better to bury such stuff in the fall and let it rot away all
winter.



Just experimenting,

Andy in Eureka, Texas

"phorbin" wrote in message
...
In article 8bbfb6a4-9846-4e8a-b200-
, says...


...... besides, if I have a fish, why would I need corn and
beans.???.. :)))))

Because a fish will feed you for a day and dried corn, beans and squash,
along with the fish you've preserved will feed you in midwinter?


They dried the fish for winter. I read somewhere they used the fish heads
and entrails for fertilizer, not the entire fish unless they had a real
glut.

"Wilson" wrote in message
...

Most composting frowns on using fatty meat bits as they attract flies &
other vermin besides all that protein breakdown problems. IF you put
chicken bones in your garden, you will attract dogs, skunks, raccoons,
bears and any other host of critters. Been there & done that.

Ditto! Never again. I found compost scattered everywhere as they picked out
the bones and meat scraps.

In article , says...

"phorbin" wrote in message
...
In article 8bbfb6a4-9846-4e8a-b200-
, says...


...... besides, if I have a fish, why would I need corn and
beans.???.. :)))))

Because a fish will feed you for a day and dried corn, beans and squash,
along with the fish you've preserved will feed you in midwinter?


They dried the fish for winter. I read somewhere they used the fish heads
and entrails for fertilizer, not the entire fish unless they had a real
glut.

I was trying out a smart-ass reformulation of "Teach a man to fish...".

IIRC you are correct, though my recollection goes back 40mumble
something+ years to grade school history.

In article ,
"D. Arlington" wrote:

"Wilson" wrote in message
...

Most composting frowns on using fatty meat bits as they attract flies &
other vermin besides all that protein breakdown problems. IF you put
chicken bones in your garden, you will attract dogs, skunks, raccoons,
bears and any other host of critters. Been there & done that.

Ditto! Never again. I found compost scattered everywhere as they picked out
the bones and meat scraps.

My dad would save the bones and then burn them. I have a protected
pile which vultures visit. What goes around comes around.

New Electric India 5:13 Shadowfax & G.E. Stinson What Goes Around:
The Best of Shadowfax Jazz

Bill

--
Garden in shade zone 5 S Jersey USA

In article ,
Bill wrote:

In article ,
"D. Arlington" wrote:

"Wilson" wrote in message
...

Most composting frowns on using fatty meat bits as they attract flies &
other vermin besides all that protein breakdown problems. IF you put
chicken bones in your garden, you will attract dogs, skunks, raccoons,
bears and any other host of critters. Been there & done that.

Ditto! Never again. I found compost scattered everywhere as they picked out
the bones and meat scraps.

My dad would save the bones and then burn them. I have a protected
pile which vultures visit. What goes around comes around.

Cool. :-) We have lots of turkey vultures around here.
Beautiful birds that do a very necessary job.


New Electric India 5:13 Shadowfax & G.E. Stinson What Goes Around:
The Best of Shadowfax Jazz

Bill
--
Peace! Om

"Any ship can be a minesweeper. Once." -- Anonymous

On Sat, 10 Jan 2009 15:29:51 -0600, Omelet wrote:

:In article ,
: "Steve Peek" wrote:
:
: "Heidi H" wrote in message
: ...
: hi group.. mind my posting?
: MY dogs would have all the tomatoes dug up....
: as well as other scavengers (coyotes, skunks, raccoons, opossums, etc.,
: etc...) Leave out the chicken IMHO.
: Steve
:
:Or add the chicken after it's properly composted. ;-)
:
:That is what composting is for imho.

Mainly what I do is dig out all the soil of my tomato bed down about 2
feet (yes, I don't rotate my crops), put the soil out on my concrete
patio, I sprinkle a little 5-10-5 or similar and mix it all up with a
generous pile of my homemade compost and refill the trench. Been getting
bumper crops consistently.

On Sun, 11 Jan 2009 18:06:10 -0500, "Robert Lewis"
wrote:

:Perhaps. I've buried lots of rotting chicken parts in my garden & have had
:zero problems. Maybe I just have a cast iron stomach. :-)
:
:Robert in the hills of Tennessee

The soil is a good place to decompose things. I don't have a shredder
and put some fairly coarse things in my compost pile and if they haven't
decomposed by planting time I just work them into the ground regardless.
By next season they have decomposed and can't be found, consumed by soil
organisms and my plants.