I have recently spent a great deal of money setting up raised beds to allow me to begin growing my own vegetables, something I have always wanted to do but never had the chance. However, having got everything ready including seeds etc I have been told that I cannot use the beds because there are old Railway sleepers below them, which have very likely seeped oil and other nasties into the ground.

Obviously I don't want to end up growing veg that will make us sick, so I need to know if this really does mean that these beds are only good for flowers etc or whether I have any chance of growing veg safely there?

(I bought the house with the sleepers in place so they have been there for anything from 5 to 10 years.)

In article ,
Jolyn wrote:

I have recently spent a great deal of money setting up raised beds to
allow me to begin growing my own vegetables, something I have always
wanted to do but never had the chance. However, having got everything
ready including seeds etc I have been told that I cannot use the beds
because there are old Railway sleepers below them, which have very
likely seeped oil and other nasties into the ground.

Potential creosote issue. A human carcinogen. Get an on site opinion.

Obviously I don't want to end up growing veg that will make us sick, so
I need to know if this really does mean that these beds are only good
for flowers etc or whether I have any chance of growing veg safely
there?

Flowers sound reasonable alternative in not suitable for food crops..

(I bought the house with the sleepers in place so they have been there
for anything from 5 to 10 years.)

Hope it works out OK!

Bill

--
Garden in shade zone 5 S Jersey USA

Bill wrote:
In article ,
Jolyn wrote:

I have recently spent a great deal of money setting up raised beds to
allow me to begin growing my own vegetables, something I have always
wanted to do but never had the chance. However, having got everything
ready including seeds etc I have been told that I cannot use the beds
because there are old Railway sleepers below them, which have very
likely seeped oil and other nasties into the ground.

Potential creosote issue. A human carcinogen. Get an on site
opinion.

Agreed, you need some real data not a guess.


Obviously I don't want to end up growing veg that will make us sick,
so I need to know if this really does mean that these beds are only
good for flowers etc or whether I have any chance of growing veg
safely there?

Flowers sound reasonable alternative in not suitable for food crops..

(I bought the house with the sleepers in place so they have been
there for anything from 5 to 10 years.)


There may not be enough of anything left to do any harm but you don't know.
Get somebody who can determine this.

David

In article ,
"David Hare-Scott" wrote:

Potential creosote issue. A human carcinogen. Get an on site
opinion.

Agreed, you need some real data not a guess.
And you, David, need a basis for your presumption that Bill was making a
guess.

The thing is, David, as a relative newbie to this group, you may be
unaware that this subject has been done, over and over again, in the
past and it always boils down to "its' a bad idea" to use railroad ties,
telephone posts, or pressure treated lumber in conjunction with edible
gardens.

http://herbgardens.about.com/od/gard...HerbSafety.htm

or you could look at a material safety data sheet (MSDS) from a
company that produces creosote (presumably they would want to put the
best face on it):
http://www.thompsonindustries.net/KM...osote_MSDS.pdf

In the future, David, you may want to ask for citations, if you are so
dull as to not be able to "google" it yourself, but you may want to
think twice before you accuse a poster of guessing.
--

Billy
Democrat and Republican Leaders Behind Bars
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7843430.stm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KVTf...ef=patrick.net

Thanks to all of you for your views. I'm sorry if there was somehere else on this forum that I could have found the info required, but having looked I couldn't find what I really needed.

Just to clarify my new raised beds are NOT made out of sleepers and had I had the option right from the start would never have used such in a garden, but I purchased the house with these things already laid. I unfortunately placed wooden raised beds (constructed with apropriately treated timber) right above the sleepers and as now filed with soil etc I cannot move them.

Anyway I understand from what all have said that it would be foolhardy to use these for vegetables now, unless as suggested I get the lot tested somehow to be sure, so it looks like I will have a large plant bed instead.

Many thanks again.

Billy wrote:
In article ,
"David Hare-Scott" wrote:

Potential creosote issue. A human carcinogen. Get an on site
opinion.

Agreed, you need some real data not a guess.
And you, David, need a basis for your presumption that Bill was
making a guess.


I did no such thing.

The thing is, David, as a relative newbie to this group, you may be
unaware that this subject has been done, over and over again, in the
past and it always boils down to "its' a bad idea" to use railroad
ties, telephone posts, or pressure treated lumber in conjunction with
edible gardens.

http://herbgardens.about.com/od/gard...HerbSafety.htm

or you could look at a material safety data sheet (MSDS) from a
company that produces creosote (presumably they would want to put the
best face on it):
http://www.thompsonindustries.net/KM...osote_MSDS.pdf

In the future, David, you may want to ask for citations, if you are so
dull as to not be able to "google" it yourself, but you may want to
think twice before you accuse a poster of guessing.

I have no idea where all this hostility is from, I didn't accuse anybody of
anything. I agreed with Bill an on site opinion is worthwhile. I said to
the OP you need data. That there is creosote on the timber is an
assumption, one can get sleepers that have not been used in a railway or not
treated at all. Creosote may have been done to death before we don't know
there is creosote present yet. I don't need your lessons on how to google
thanks very much for the offer.

David

In article , Charlie wrote:

On Sat, 28 Feb 2009 10:22:43 -0800, Billy
wrote:

In article ,
"David Hare-Scott" wrote:

Potential creosote issue. A human carcinogen. Get an on site
opinion.

Agreed, you need some real data not a guess.
And you, David, need a basis for your presumption that Bill was making a
guess.

The thing is, David, as a relative newbie to this group, you may be
unaware that this subject has been done, over and over again, in the
past and it always boils down to "its' a bad idea" to use railroad ties,
telephone posts, or pressure treated lumber in conjunction with edible
gardens.

http://herbgardens.about.com/od/gard...HerbSafety.htm

or you could look at a material safety data sheet (MSDS) from a
company that produces creosote (presumably they would want to put the
best face on it):
http://www.thompsonindustries.net/KM...osote_MSDS.pdf

In the future, David, you may want to ask for citations, if you are so
dull as to not be able to "google" it yourself, but you may want to
think twice before you accuse a poster of guessing.


Are you always this grumpy and cantankerous on Bone Night? Not Happy
Hour yet?

(pssssssstttt.........David is no newbie, nor is he one of the "bad
guys".)

Well, look who's gone all milk and honey ;O) Damit, Charlie, that was a
perfectly good harangue. Don't you have some dishes to wash? You
can't leave them all for Lovely. An what you wastin' time on the
computer for? Gotta stop loafin' around an' get to work.

Your recommendation for happy hour (more like 10 minutes) is duly noted.
Now where is my margarita bucket?
--

Billy
Democrat and Republican Leaders Behind Bars
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7843430.stm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KVTf...ef=patrick.net

In article ,
"David Hare-Scott" wrote:

Billy wrote:
In article ,
"David Hare-Scott" wrote:

Potential creosote issue. A human carcinogen. Get an on site
opinion.

Agreed, you need some real data not a guess.
And you, David, need a basis for your presumption that Bill was
making a guess.


I did no such thing.

The thing is, David, as a relative newbie to this group, you may be
unaware that this subject has been done, over and over again, in the
past and it always boils down to "its' a bad idea" to use railroad
ties, telephone posts, or pressure treated lumber in conjunction with
edible gardens.

http://herbgardens.about.com/od/gard...HerbSafety.htm

or you could look at a material safety data sheet (MSDS) from a
company that produces creosote (presumably they would want to put the
best face on it):
http://www.thompsonindustries.net/KM...osote_MSDS.pdf

In the future, David, you may want to ask for citations, if you are so
dull as to not be able to "google" it yourself, but you may want to
think twice before you accuse a poster of guessing.

I have no idea where all this hostility is from, I didn't accuse anybody of
anything. I agreed with Bill an on site opinion is worthwhile. I said to
the OP you need data. That there is creosote on the timber is an
assumption, one can get sleepers that have not been used in a railway or not
treated at all. Creosote may have been done to death before we don't know
there is creosote present yet. I don't need your lessons on how to google
thanks very much for the offer.

David

You need a comma after "google", otherwise not bad.

You shouldn't be sooo touchy about a little constructive criticism.
Pfffff.
--

Billy
Democrat and Republican Leaders Behind Bars
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7843430.stm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KVTf...ef=patrick.net

In article , Charlie wrote:

So, I thought I would pick up me stick and see ifn's anyone needed a
poke in the eye, and lo and beshit, I find me favorite Billy needin' a
jab. ;-)

Ah, so that's the way it is then. Well, when the jeering mob comes for
ya with their pitchforks reflecting the grey glint of the light of the
torches (ye'll be rememberin' last year, an' the year before that),
ye'll be on yer own. And ye know that they'll be comin', ye ol'
anarchist. Then yu'll be wishin' fer a Billy to watch yer back. But I
won't see a thing, 'cause some damn fool poked me in the I for
protecting our muse. A damn fine job, Charlie, a damn fine job.
--

Billy
Democrat and Republican Leaders Behind Bars
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7843430.stm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KVTf...ef=patrick.net

In article , Charlie wrote:

Du är välkommen.

Mein Gott, you have finally found the "du". Not in the language
that I was expecting, but you found it none the less. You really got to
stay away from "iGoogle". Sie is formal "you", singular and plural (and
other stuff that we needn't get into now).
Friends and family address each other as "du" (singular) or ihr (plural).

Schlafst gut.
--

Billy
Democrat and Republican Leaders Behind Bars
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7843430.stm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KVTf...ef=patrick.net

In article ,
Jolyn wrote:

I have recently spent a great deal of money setting up raised beds to
allow me to begin growing my own vegetables, something I have always
wanted to do but never had the chance. However, having got everything
ready including seeds etc I have been told that I cannot use the beds
because there are old Railway sleepers below them, which have very
likely seeped oil and other nasties into the ground.

Obviously I don't want to end up growing veg that will make us sick, so
I need to know if this really does mean that these beds are only good
for flowers etc or whether I have any chance of growing veg safely
there?

(I bought the house with the sleepers in place so they have been there
for anything from 5 to 10 years.)

I thought best to post from original. Flame war starting up.

One can build above ground garden containers with solid bottoms to grow
most vegetable plants safely. Build the containers table high with
drainage holes and screens that allow water to leave and hold in the
soil. The boxes could be on legs. Create your own safe organic soil
mixtures. I have seen four foot high garden beds made with bricks from
the ground up that also looks great. Raised garden beds made with large
rocks can also look great and be functional.

You will have to search yourself for plans to make such things. The
table types will need to be strong and durable with food safe materials
(if such materials exist). Also rock walls that hold up even in the
winter. Just hope you have lots of moneys, such things are not cheap.

Do not not let the flame war keep you down! Above is just another idea.
Just keep on dreaming and hope it all works out.

Enjoy Life ... Dan

--
Garden in Zone 5 South East Michigan.

Dan

Thanks for your response. Your reply has given me some useful ideas which I will follow up.

I must say that after the first couple of responses I thought I had posted onto something other than a gardening site.

Again Dan thanks for the info very helpful.

Regards

Jo

In article , Charlie wrote:

On Sat, 28 Feb 2009 22:38:50 -0800, Billy
wrote:

In article , Charlie wrote:

So, I thought I would pick up me stick and see ifn's anyone needed a
poke in the eye, and lo and beshit, I find me favorite Billy needin' a
jab. ;-)

Ah, so that's the way it is then. Well, when the jeering mob comes for
ya with their pitchforks reflecting the grey glint of the light of the
torches (ye'll be rememberin' last year, an' the year before that),
ye'll be on yer own. And ye know that they'll be comin', ye ol'
anarchist. Then yu'll be wishin' fer a Billy to watch yer back. But I
won't see a thing, 'cause some damn fool poked me in the I for
protecting our muse. A damn fine job, Charlie, a damn fine job.

Mon Dieu, j'ai percé mes propres yeux!! Je vous prie d'excuser mon
insouciance.

It appears I have disregarded me dear mother's advice and gone running
about with a sharp stick and poked me own eye out, much to me own
detriment. And now you take a well deserved jab at the other!

Speaking of eyeballs, I trust yours are working well now?

Charlie

Oh, the things that I should have to hear ;O)
--

Billy
Democrat and Republican Leaders Behind Bars
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7843430.stm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KVTf...ef=patrick.net

In article
,
Billy wrote:

In article , Charlie wrote:

On Sat, 28 Feb 2009 22:38:50 -0800, Billy
wrote:

In article , Charlie wrote:

So, I thought I would pick up me stick and see ifn's anyone needed a
poke in the eye, and lo and beshit, I find me favorite Billy needin' a
jab. ;-)

Ah, so that's the way it is then. Well, when the jeering mob comes for
ya with their pitchforks reflecting the grey glint of the light of the
torches (ye'll be rememberin' last year, an' the year before that),
ye'll be on yer own. And ye know that they'll be comin', ye ol'
anarchist. Then yu'll be wishin' fer a Billy to watch yer back. But I
won't see a thing, 'cause some damn fool poked me in the I for
protecting our muse. A damn fine job, Charlie, a damn fine job.

Mon Dieu, j'ai percé mes propres yeux!! Je vous prie d'excuser mon
insouciance.

It appears I have disregarded me dear mother's advice and gone running
about with a sharp stick and poked me own eye out, much to me own
detriment. And now you take a well deserved jab at the other!

Speaking of eyeballs, I trust yours are working well now?

Charlie

Oh, the things that I should have to hear ;O)

Small snit

So large at times it seems till the sun is high
Then with the work about
A shout is just for help in harvest.

In good times..... in poor to ward off.

Bill waxing sore from snow stuff at cccoldddd temps. 9 f with wind an
the thermocouple on our gas fireplace failed today. Karma but the
heater is cranking and the stove is cookin so I guess previous life was
reasonable .

--
Garden in shade zone 5 S Jersey USA