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Old 03-04-2011, 09:35 PM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Default Fish Fertilizer and saving fish stock


Strange thought entered my mind concerning the tragedy in Japan. With
the higher levers do radiation entering the ocean. With this make the
fish unsuitable for harvesting and will this enable the fish populations
to have a long respite ?
Anyone know about the ramifications ?

--
Bill S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade garden

Unemployment is capitalism's way of getting you to plant a garden.
- Orson Scott Card





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Old 03-04-2011, 10:26 PM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Default Fish Fertilizer and saving fish stock

Good question! I'm glad I bought a couple of extra bottles of fish emulsion
last fall when they were on sale.
Steve
"Bill who putters" wrote in message
...

Strange thought entered my mind concerning the tragedy in Japan. With
the higher levers do radiation entering the ocean. With this make the
fish unsuitable for harvesting and will this enable the fish populations
to have a long respite ?
Anyone know about the ramifications ?

--
Bill S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade garden

Unemployment is capitalism's way of getting you to plant a garden.
- Orson Scott Card







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Old 04-04-2011, 12:11 AM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Default Fish Fertilizer and saving fish stock

In article ,
Bill who putters wrote:

Strange thought entered my mind concerning the tragedy in Japan. With
the higher levers do radiation entering the ocean. With this make the
fish unsuitable for harvesting and will this enable the fish populations
to have a long respite ?
Anyone know about the ramifications ?


The way they fish now, there is a lot of collateral damage. It's the
collateral damage that ends up in fish emulsion. I'd buy organic.

As for the marketable fish, as is already the case, predator fish
concentrate the most toxins, be it PCBs, polybrominated diphenyl ethers,
or strontium-90.

In my conspiratorial outlook, I doubt the government would tell us
anything, if it was low level chronic exposure. If it was acute
poisoning, and instantly caused you to drop stone dean, they would
probably put out a PSA advising prudence and cautioning against
excessive consumption.

Bush's 3rd term: Obama
--
- Billy
Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. This is not a way of life at all in any true sense. Under the clouds of war, it is humanity hanging on a cross of iron.
- Dwight D. Eisenhower, 16 April 1953
http://wn.com/black_panther_party
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_vN0--mHug

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Old 04-04-2011, 04:16 AM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Default Fish Fertilizer and saving fish stock

Obviously, since this has never happened before, no one knows the
ramifications. Duh.



"Bill who putters" wrote in message
...

Strange thought entered my mind concerning the tragedy in Japan. With
the higher levers do radiation entering the ocean. With this make the
fish unsuitable for harvesting and will this enable the fish populations
to have a long respite ?
Anyone know about the ramifications ?

--
Bill S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade garden

Unemployment is capitalism's way of getting you to plant a garden.
- Orson Scott Card







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Old 04-04-2011, 06:11 PM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Posts: 110
Default Fish Fertilizer and saving fish stock

Bill who putters wrote:

Strange thought entered my mind concerning the tragedy in Japan. With
the higher levers do radiation entering the ocean. With this make the
fish unsuitable for harvesting and will this enable the fish populations
to have a long respite ?


Probably not. The ocean is too big so dilution works. The isotopes
have short enough halflives that the radiation will fade very quickly.
The current situation is a huge mess but the effects will remain more
local than what happened at Chernobyl. There will be more of a move
farther away from shore by Japanese fishermen but that's nothing new -
They are hunting whales in the Antarctic Ocean already now.

Approaches that work for DDT and mercury will work exactly the same
way for the small amounts of long life isotopes - Eat lower on the food
chain. Plant eating fish over predator fish, squid over fish, small
critters over large critters. Conveniently this approach also helps
fish populations.

Anyone know about the ramifications ?


Far more likely to have impact on land industry than sea industry. No
shift from fossil fuel to nuclear so increased strip mining in coal
belts. Increased CO2 release. And no change in the exponential growth
curve of installed solar cells so the good promise on that front is not
effected. Given how industrious the Japanese have been in the past they
will recover, rebuild and be back near the top sooner than most expect.


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Old 04-04-2011, 10:32 PM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Default Fish Fertilizer and saving fish stock

In article ,
Doug Freyburger wrote:

Bill who putters wrote:

Strange thought entered my mind concerning the tragedy in Japan. With
the higher levers do radiation entering the ocean. With this make the
fish unsuitable for harvesting and will this enable the fish populations
to have a long respite ?


Probably not. The ocean is too big so dilution works. The isotopes
have short enough halflives that the radiation will fade very quickly.
The current situation is a huge mess but the effects will remain more
local than what happened at Chernobyl. There will be more of a move
farther away from shore by Japanese fishermen but that's nothing new -
They are hunting whales in the Antarctic Ocean already now.

Approaches that work for DDT and mercury will work exactly the same
way for the small amounts of long life isotopes - Eat lower on the food
chain. Plant eating fish over predator fish, squid over fish, small
critters over large critters. Conveniently this approach also helps
fish populations.

Anyone know about the ramifications ?


Far more likely to have impact on land industry than sea industry. No
shift from fossil fuel to nuclear so increased strip mining in coal
belts. Increased CO2 release. And no change in the exponential growth
curve of installed solar cells so the good promise on that front is not
effected. Given how industrious the Japanese have been in the past they
will recover, rebuild and be back near the top sooner than most expect.


Old news but be sure to look at the radio nuclide issues down in the
article. Deals with increase of back ground radiation.

http://www.edwardgoldsmith.org/page37.html

--
Bill S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade garden

Unemployment is capitalism's way of getting you to plant a garden.
- Orson Scott Card





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Old 04-04-2011, 11:10 PM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Posts: 2,438
Default Fish Fertilizer and saving fish stock

In article ,
Bill who putters wrote:

In article ,
Doug Freyburger wrote:

Bill who putters wrote:

Strange thought entered my mind concerning the tragedy in Japan. With
the higher levers do radiation entering the ocean. With this make the
fish unsuitable for harvesting and will this enable the fish populations
to have a long respite ?


Probably not. The ocean is too big so dilution works. The isotopes
have short enough halflives that the radiation will fade very quickly.
The current situation is a huge mess but the effects will remain more
local than what happened at Chernobyl. There will be more of a move
farther away from shore by Japanese fishermen but that's nothing new -
They are hunting whales in the Antarctic Ocean already now.

Approaches that work for DDT and mercury will work exactly the same
way for the small amounts of long life isotopes - Eat lower on the food
chain. Plant eating fish over predator fish, squid over fish, small
critters over large critters. Conveniently this approach also helps
fish populations.

Anyone know about the ramifications ?


Far more likely to have impact on land industry than sea industry. No
shift from fossil fuel to nuclear so increased strip mining in coal
belts. Increased CO2 release. And no change in the exponential growth
curve of installed solar cells so the good promise on that front is not
effected. Given how industrious the Japanese have been in the past they
will recover, rebuild and be back near the top sooner than most expect.


Old news but be sure to look at the radio nuclide issues down in the
article. Deals with increase of back ground radiation.

http://www.edwardgoldsmith.org/page37.html


Got Hope? Got Seed? Got a Clue?

So, are you better off now than you were 10 years ago?
Are you better off now than you were 30 years ago, when we were
introduced to the "Laugher's Curve"?

Me neither.
--
- Billy
Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. This is not a way of life at all in any true sense. Under the clouds of war, it is humanity hanging on a cross of iron.
- Dwight D. Eisenhower, 16 April 1953
http://wn.com/black_panther_party
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_vN0--mHug

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Old 04-04-2011, 11:16 PM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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First recorded activity by GardenBanter: May 2009
Posts: 1,085
Default Fish Fertilizer and saving fish stock

In article
,
Billy wrote:

In article ,
Bill who putters wrote:

In article ,
Doug Freyburger wrote:

Bill who putters wrote:

Strange thought entered my mind concerning the tragedy in Japan. With
the higher levers do radiation entering the ocean. With this make the
fish unsuitable for harvesting and will this enable the fish
populations
to have a long respite ?

Probably not. The ocean is too big so dilution works. The isotopes
have short enough halflives that the radiation will fade very quickly.
The current situation is a huge mess but the effects will remain more
local than what happened at Chernobyl. There will be more of a move
farther away from shore by Japanese fishermen but that's nothing new -
They are hunting whales in the Antarctic Ocean already now.

Approaches that work for DDT and mercury will work exactly the same
way for the small amounts of long life isotopes - Eat lower on the food
chain. Plant eating fish over predator fish, squid over fish, small
critters over large critters. Conveniently this approach also helps
fish populations.

Anyone know about the ramifications ?

Far more likely to have impact on land industry than sea industry. No
shift from fossil fuel to nuclear so increased strip mining in coal
belts. Increased CO2 release. And no change in the exponential growth
curve of installed solar cells so the good promise on that front is not
effected. Given how industrious the Japanese have been in the past they
will recover, rebuild and be back near the top sooner than most expect.


Old news but be sure to look at the radio nuclide issues down in the
article. Deals with increase of back ground radiation.

http://www.edwardgoldsmith.org/page37.html


Got Hope? Got Seed? Got a Clue?

So, are you better off now than you were 10 years ago?
Are you better off now than you were 30 years ago, when we were
introduced to the "Laugher's Curve"?

Me neither.


What is the "Laughers Curve" ?

--
Bill S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade garden

Unemployment is capitalism's way of getting you to plant a garden.
- Orson Scott Card





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Old 04-04-2011, 11:22 PM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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First recorded activity by GardenBanter: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,438
Default Fish Fertilizer and saving fish stock

In article ,
Doug Freyburger wrote:

Bill who putters wrote:

Strange thought entered my mind concerning the tragedy in Japan. With
the higher levers do radiation entering the ocean. With this make the
fish unsuitable for harvesting and will this enable the fish populations
to have a long respite ?


Probably not. The ocean is too big so dilution works. The isotopes
have short enough halflives that the radiation will fade very quickly.


Except for Iodine-131 (8.02 days), most of the rest have half lives of
30 years and up.

The current situation is a huge mess but the effects will remain more
local than what happened at Chernobyl. There will be more of a move
farther away from shore by Japanese fishermen but that's nothing new -
They are hunting whales in the Antarctic Ocean already now.

Approaches that work for DDT and mercury will work exactly the same
way for the small amounts of long life isotopes - Eat lower on the food
chain. Plant eating fish over predator fish, squid over fish, small
critters over large critters. Conveniently this approach also helps
fish populations.

Anyone know about the ramifications ?


Far more likely to have impact on land industry than sea industry. No
shift from fossil fuel to nuclear so increased strip mining in coal
belts. Increased CO2 release. And no change in the exponential growth
curve of installed solar cells so the good promise on that front is not
effected. Given how industrious the Japanese have been in the past they
will recover, rebuild and be back near the top sooner than most expect.


I don't share your optimism.

All countries are trying to lock up energy sources, for their own
benefit, and as a cudgel against others.

Jobs Not Guns.
--
- Billy
Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. This is not a way of life at all in any true sense. Under the clouds of war, it is humanity hanging on a cross of iron.
- Dwight D. Eisenhower, 16 April 1953
http://wn.com/black_panther_party
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_vN0--mHug

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Old 05-04-2011, 01:01 AM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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First recorded activity by GardenBanter: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,438
Default Fish Fertilizer and saving fish stock

In article ,
Bill who putters wrote:

In article
,
Billy wrote:

In article ,
Bill who putters wrote:

In article ,
Doug Freyburger wrote:

Bill who putters wrote:

Strange thought entered my mind concerning the tragedy in Japan.
With
the higher levers do radiation entering the ocean. With this make
the
fish unsuitable for harvesting and will this enable the fish
populations
to have a long respite ?

Probably not. The ocean is too big so dilution works. The isotopes
have short enough halflives that the radiation will fade very quickly.
The current situation is a huge mess but the effects will remain more
local than what happened at Chernobyl. There will be more of a move
farther away from shore by Japanese fishermen but that's nothing new -
They are hunting whales in the Antarctic Ocean already now.

Approaches that work for DDT and mercury will work exactly the same
way for the small amounts of long life isotopes - Eat lower on the food
chain. Plant eating fish over predator fish, squid over fish, small
critters over large critters. Conveniently this approach also helps
fish populations.

Anyone know about the ramifications ?

Far more likely to have impact on land industry than sea industry. No
shift from fossil fuel to nuclear so increased strip mining in coal
belts. Increased CO2 release. And no change in the exponential growth
curve of installed solar cells so the good promise on that front is not
effected. Given how industrious the Japanese have been in the past
they
will recover, rebuild and be back near the top sooner than most expect.

Old news but be sure to look at the radio nuclide issues down in the
article. Deals with increase of back ground radiation.

http://www.edwardgoldsmith.org/page37.html


Got Hope? Got Seed? Got a Clue?

So, are you better off now than you were 10 years ago?
Are you better off now than you were 30 years ago, when we were
introduced to the "Laugher's Curve"?

Me neither.


What is the "Laughers Curve" ?


It's the economic joke that Reagan pulled on the U.S. Sometimes spelled
by the less humorous as "Laffers Curve", it is supposed to justify
"Trickle Down" economics, a.k.a. "VooDoo economics". The theory was that
there was an optimum level that would generate the most revenue. The
irony is that America was at its most prosperous between 1947 and 1964
when progressive tax rates went as high as 91% to 70%.



Bush's 3rd term: Obama




If you like weekends (8 hr./day & 40 hr./week), then thank a labor union.
They paid for it in blood.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haymarket_affair

Jobs not Wars
===
--
- Billy
Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. This is not a way of life at all in any true sense. Under the clouds of war, it is humanity hanging on a cross of iron.
- Dwight D. Eisenhower, 16 April 1953
http://wn.com/black_panther_party
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_vN0--mHug



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Old 05-04-2011, 07:43 AM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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First recorded activity by GardenBanter: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,072
Default [OT] c'mon billy grow some historical perspective (was FishFertilizer and saving fish stock

Billy wrote:
Bill who putters wrote:

....

What is the "Laughers Curve" ?


It's the economic joke that Reagan pulled on the U.S. Sometimes spelled
by the less humorous as "Laffers Curve", it is supposed to justify
"Trickle Down" economics, a.k.a. "VooDoo economics". The theory was that
there was an optimum level that would generate the most revenue. The
irony is that America was at its most prosperous between 1947 and 1964
when progressive tax rates went as high as 91% to 70%.


c'mon, i expect more brains from you billy.

study a small amount of history and note that
the USoA from 1945 on was perhaps the only major
industrial country that didn't suffer damage to
it's manufacturing infrastructure.

given the state of the rest of the world we had
no place to go but up. you can tax that sort of
system heavily and not kill it. taxing a weak
growth system (like we have now) with many other
issues and it's not going to perform very well.


songbird
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Old 05-04-2011, 03:08 PM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Posts: 150
Default Fish Fertilizer and saving fish stock


"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Bill who putters wrote:

In article
,
Billy wrote:

In article ,
Bill who putters wrote:

In article ,
Doug Freyburger wrote:

Bill who putters wrote:

Strange thought entered my mind concerning the tragedy in Japan.
With
the higher levers do radiation entering the ocean. With this
make
the
fish unsuitable for harvesting and will this enable the fish
populations
to have a long respite ?

Probably not. The ocean is too big so dilution works. The
isotopes
have short enough halflives that the radiation will fade very
quickly.
The current situation is a huge mess but the effects will remain
more
local than what happened at Chernobyl. There will be more of a
move
farther away from shore by Japanese fishermen but that's nothing
new -
They are hunting whales in the Antarctic Ocean already now.

Approaches that work for DDT and mercury will work exactly the same
way for the small amounts of long life isotopes - Eat lower on the
food
chain. Plant eating fish over predator fish, squid over fish,
small
critters over large critters. Conveniently this approach also
helps
fish populations.

Anyone know about the ramifications ?

Far more likely to have impact on land industry than sea industry.
No
shift from fossil fuel to nuclear so increased strip mining in coal
belts. Increased CO2 release. And no change in the exponential
growth
curve of installed solar cells so the good promise on that front is
not
effected. Given how industrious the Japanese have been in the past
they
will recover, rebuild and be back near the top sooner than most
expect.

Old news but be sure to look at the radio nuclide issues down in the
article. Deals with increase of back ground radiation.

http://www.edwardgoldsmith.org/page37.html

Got Hope? Got Seed? Got a Clue?

So, are you better off now than you were 10 years ago?
Are you better off now than you were 30 years ago, when we were
introduced to the "Laugher's Curve"?

Me neither.


What is the "Laughers Curve" ?


It's the economic joke that Reagan pulled on the U.S. Sometimes spelled
by the less humorous as "Laffers Curve", it is supposed to justify
"Trickle Down" economics, a.k.a. "VooDoo economics". The theory was that
there was an optimum level that would generate the most revenue. The
irony is that America was at its most prosperous between 1947 and 1964
when progressive tax rates went as high as 91% to 70%.



And government spending was 10% of now.


  #13   Report Post  
Old 05-04-2011, 03:37 PM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Posts: 150
Default Fish Fertilizer and saving fish stock


"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Doug Freyburger wrote:

Bill who putters wrote:

Strange thought entered my mind concerning the tragedy in Japan. With
the higher levers do radiation entering the ocean. With this make the
fish unsuitable for harvesting and will this enable the fish
populations
to have a long respite ?


Probably not. The ocean is too big so dilution works. The isotopes
have short enough halflives that the radiation will fade very quickly.


Except for Iodine-131 (8.02 days), most of the rest have half lives of
30 years and up.

The current situation is a huge mess but the effects will remain more
local than what happened at Chernobyl. There will be more of a move
farther away from shore by Japanese fishermen but that's nothing new -
They are hunting whales in the Antarctic Ocean already now.

Approaches that work for DDT and mercury will work exactly the same
way for the small amounts of long life isotopes - Eat lower on the food
chain. Plant eating fish over predator fish, squid over fish, small
critters over large critters. Conveniently this approach also helps
fish populations.

Anyone know about the ramifications ?


Far more likely to have impact on land industry than sea industry. No
shift from fossil fuel to nuclear so increased strip mining in coal
belts. Increased CO2 release. And no change in the exponential growth
curve of installed solar cells so the good promise on that front is not
effected. Given how industrious the Japanese have been in the past they
will recover, rebuild and be back near the top sooner than most expect.


I don't share your optimism.





Neither do I . I'm betting Japan within 50 miles of the reactor will
never be rehabitated. As of right now. They have already said some
cities are off limits for " tens of years " A big typhoon could wipe the
whole island out. With radiation. The problem is ingestion of radioactive
particles. . Not radiation levels from the air or background. As the news
is telling you. Radiation levels are irrelevant. Ingest the smallest
particle and its a guarantee of something bad. it will go somewhere in your
body and do damage.
The US is completely covered. They are dumping it (water ) in the
ocean. And cant stop it. The water solution was a waste of time and foolish.
It didn't cool anything. Because its just sitting there. They are talking
about the concrete solution which may or may not work. Its more likely to
explode. MOX cant never get away from you .You cant ever let it get away.
There is no way to stop it. Its under there , melted down. Molten with the
concrete. If its not in the earth. The politically correct term "cracks"
may mean its melted a hole in it. And you cant do nothing about it. They
tried to plug it and its not working.

The only real solution is too put an A bomb in each reactor and blowing
it off and hope it vaporizes the fuel. As screwed up as that sounds . It
would be the best solution.

The japs are also arrogant and didn't want to lose face so they
dragged ass .And used water. So as not to admit defeat. Radiation levels
are trillions and trillions of times a safe level.

The fishing industry is hosed. Manufacturing is hosed. farming is hosed,
The ocean is hosed. Toyota is hosed. They are in fact. finished.




  #14   Report Post  
Old 05-04-2011, 03:43 PM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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First recorded activity by GardenBanter: Jan 2011
Posts: 410
Default Fish Fertilizer and saving fish stock

"DogDiesel" wrote:
"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Bill who putters wrote:

In article
,
Billy wrote:

In article ,
Bill who putters wrote:

In article ,
Doug Freyburger wrote:

Bill who putters wrote:

Strange thought entered my mind concerning the tragedy in Japan.
With
the higher levers do radiation entering the ocean. With this
make
the
fish unsuitable for harvesting and will this enable the fish
populations
to have a long respite ?

Probably not. The ocean is too big so dilution works. The
isotopes
have short enough halflives that the radiation will fade very
quickly.
The current situation is a huge mess but the effects will remain
more
local than what happened at Chernobyl. There will be more of a
move
farther away from shore by Japanese fishermen but that's nothing
new -
They are hunting whales in the Antarctic Ocean already now.

Approaches that work for DDT and mercury will work exactly the same
way for the small amounts of long life isotopes - Eat lower on the
food
chain. Plant eating fish over predator fish, squid over fish,
small
critters over large critters. Conveniently this approach also
helps
fish populations.

Anyone know about the ramifications ?

Far more likely to have impact on land industry than sea industry.
No
shift from fossil fuel to nuclear so increased strip mining in coal
belts. Increased CO2 release. And no change in the exponential
growth
curve of installed solar cells so the good promise on that front is
not
effected. Given how industrious the Japanese have been in the past
they
will recover, rebuild and be back near the top sooner than most
expect.

Old news but be sure to look at the radio nuclide issues down in the
article. Deals with increase of back ground radiation.

http://www.edwardgoldsmith.org/page37.html

Got Hope? Got Seed? Got a Clue?

So, are you better off now than you were 10 years ago?
Are you better off now than you were 30 years ago, when we were
introduced to the "Laugher's Curve"?

Me neither.

What is the "Laughers Curve" ?


It's the economic joke that Reagan pulled on the U.S. Sometimes spelled
by the less humorous as "Laffers Curve", it is supposed to justify
"Trickle Down" economics, a.k.a. "VooDoo economics". The theory was that
there was an optimum level that would generate the most revenue. The
irony is that America was at its most prosperous between 1947 and 1964
when progressive tax rates went as high as 91% to 70%.



And government spending was 10% of now.


And Europe and Asia was rebuilding their nations and buying lots of US made
goods during the post war years. I see the world and within the US as a
zero sum game. Others misery is a blessing to others. However, the planets
resources is past the breaking point so I see greater misery for many.

Now I will double and triple check my sources of vitamins. Fish and fish
oils vitamins from the North Atlantic will be my first choice. Many vitamin
manufactures are from Japan.

--
Enjoy Life... Nad R (Garden in zone 5a Michigan)
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Old 05-04-2011, 03:59 PM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Posts: 410
Default Fish Fertilizer and saving fish stock

"DogDiesel" wrote:

The only real solution is too put an A bomb in each reactor and blowing
it off and hope it vaporizes the fuel. As screwed up as that sounds . It
would be the best solution.


NOOOOO!!!!!
Each of those reactors have about one hundred tons of spent fuel rods. That
is equivalent, I read somewhere, to 400 Hiroshima's radioactive material.

Let's just hope those mega concrete pump trucks the US gave Japan can bury
the the things. However I see TEMPCO CEO's as bad as BP CEO's... Reckless
and belong in prison.

--
Enjoy Life... Nad R (Garden in zone 5a Michigan)
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