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Old 10-12-2013, 10:50 AM
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Default Victoria Plum Trees

Hi

I have a number of Victoria Plum trees in my garden that are very tall the first branches start at around ten feet and are very long so it is impossible to reach the fruit. How severe a prune can give them? and when is the best time?
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Old 11-12-2013, 12:23 AM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Default Victoria Plum Trees

David Ellis wrote:
Hi

I have a number of Victoria Plum trees in my garden that are very tall
the first branches start at around ten feet and are very long so it is
impossible to reach the fruit. How severe a prune can give them? and
when is the best time?


You could take off one third without a problem, perhaps more. Prune when
they are dormant, in spring just before budding is good. If the fungus is
prevalent in your area you should spray for peach leaf curl at that time
with one of the copper-based fungicidal sprays.

The question is why are they so tall and leggy, are they in full sun? If
they are reaching for the sun this will be a recurrent problem and they will
not crop well.

David

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Old 12-12-2013, 09:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Hare-Scott[_2_] View Post
David Ellis wrote:
Hi

I have a number of Victoria Plum trees in my garden that are very tall
the first branches start at around ten feet and are very long so it is
impossible to reach the fruit. How severe a prune can give them? and
when is the best time?


You could take off one third without a problem, perhaps more. Prune when
they are dormant, in spring just before budding is good. If the fungus is
prevalent in your area you should spray for peach leaf curl at that time
with one of the copper-based fungicidal sprays.

The question is why are they so tall and leggy, are they in full sun? If
they are reaching for the sun this will be a recurrent problem and they will
not crop well.

David
Hi Thanks for the reply, I bought the property a few years ago, the old lady had not done anything with the garden for years it was a small holding years ago.

It was not just overgrown it was thick with young trees which we cleared leaving the fruit trees. So I guess they were reaching for sunlight.
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Old 13-12-2013, 08:46 AM
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Location: Kent
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick View Post
On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 09:25:02 +0100, David Ellis
wrote:


'David Hare-Scott[_2_ Wrote:
;996339']David Ellis wrote:-
Hi

I have a number of Victoria Plum trees in my garden that are very tall
the first branches start at around ten feet and are very long so it is
impossible to reach the fruit. How severe a prune can give them? and
when is the best time?-

You could take off one third without a problem, perhaps more. Prune
when
they are dormant, in spring just before budding is good. If the fungus
is
prevalent in your area you should spray for peach leaf curl at that time

with one of the copper-based fungicidal sprays.

The question is why are they so tall and leggy, are they in full sun?
If
they are reaching for the sun this will be a recurrent problem and they
will
not crop well.

David


Hi Thanks for the reply, I bought the property a few years ago, the old
lady had not done anything with the garden for years it was a small
holding years ago.

It was not just overgrown it was thick with young trees which we cleared
leaving the fruit trees. So I guess they were reaching for sunlight.


I agree with David that taking about 1/3rd of the growth or a bit more
is the traditional method. However branches starting at 10 feet is a
real problem if you want the fruit. I think I would try a stump
graft, at least on one or a few of the trees. You can do a search for
technique. (of course you don't have to do them all at once!)

Basically in early spring when the buds have formed but not opened cut
the tree down with a chain saw. Cut higher than you would normally
fell the tree. Now if you have not cut fair sized trees down and do
not know what you are doing, this is probably a job for a
professional. Have them cut the stump off at about 3 feet (1 meter)
at a -very- slight angle. just enough for the rain to run off. Select
two or three or more "scions" which is just a short piece of branch
with several good buds from a one to two year old branch (brown not
green bark) that is about an inch (2.5 cm) or two in diameter. It
sounds like the tree you cut down with have a LOT of these.

A technique called the cleft graft is the best for working with a tree
stump. This is also one of the easiest types of grafts for beginners
to attempt. The first step is to prepare the stump to accept the
scion. Hammer a chisel into the stump, creating a split, or cleft
about 6 inches deep. Then whittle the scion wood to a 6-inch wedge so
that it easily inserts into the new cleft, making sure to leave bark
on the two sides of the wedge. Your tree sounds like it will have a
pretty big stump, so you may need to carve out a section of the stump
rather than a simple split. Leave the bark!!!


Once the scions are wedged and ready, insert them into the cleft of
the stump. It is usually necessary to use a small pry bar or grafting
tool to separate the cleft far enough to accept the scion wedges. You
want it tight! Place the scions on the two outer edges of the cleft
so that the bark of the scion matches up with the bark of the stump.
It is this lining up of bark rather than lining up rings as with many
other more complicated methods that makes the cleft graft such an
excellent technique for beginning grafters to attempt. The trick is
to get the bark of the stump over the bark of the scions so they will
heal together and the graft will grow. For a stump the size I
envision yours to be, I would place four or more scions.

The final step to completing the fruit tree graft is to apply a
grafting compound. There are a number of options for this, the most
common of which are a petroleum-based paste and a wax. Spread the
compound over the entire wound to protect and seal it Including the
top of the stump, therefore protecting it from disease and
encouraging quick growth.


If you decided to put four or so scions in the stump, after the first
year when the branches are all growing you can begin to trim and prune
the tree into a plum "bush"- very earsy to spray and pick fruit. If
you place two scions, the traditional method is to cut off the weaker
scion after a year and make the stronger you new leader for a new
tree. If you decide to try this I would start with a shorter stump so
the branches don't get to high.
Wow that sound a bit complicated for me, who would be able to to that? Not something for the avarage tree surgeon I would guess.

Dave
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Old 13-12-2013, 10:36 PM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Default Victoria Plum Trees

David Ellis wrote:
Rick;996374 Wrote:
On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 09:25:02 +0100, David Ellis
wrote:
-

'David Hare-Scott[_2_ Wrote: -
;996339']David Ellis wrote:-
Hi

I have a number of Victoria Plum trees in my garden that are very
tall the first branches start at around ten feet and are very long
so it is impossible to reach the fruit. How severe a prune can give
them? and when is the best time?-

You could take off one third without a problem, perhaps more. Prune
when
they are dormant, in spring just before budding is good. If the
fungus
is
prevalent in your area you should spray for peach leaf curl at that
time

with one of the copper-based fungicidal sprays.

The question is why are they so tall and leggy, are they in full sun?
If
they are reaching for the sun this will be a recurrent problem and
they
will
not crop well.

David-

Hi Thanks for the reply, I bought the property a few years ago, the
old lady had not done anything with the garden for years it was a
small holding years ago.

It was not just overgrown it was thick with young trees which we
cleared
leaving the fruit trees. So I guess they were reaching for sunlight.-

I agree with David that taking about 1/3rd of the growth or a bit
more is the traditional method. However branches starting at 10
feet is a real problem if you want the fruit. I think I would try a
stump graft, at least on one or a few of the trees. You can do a
search for technique. (of course you don't have to do them all at
once!)

Basically in early spring when the buds have formed but not opened
cut the tree down with a chain saw. Cut higher than you would
normally fell the tree. Now if you have not cut fair sized trees
down and do not know what you are doing, this is probably a job for a
professional. Have them cut the stump off at about 3 feet (1 meter)
at a -very- slight angle. just enough for the rain to run off.
Select two or three or more "scions" which is just a short piece of
branch with several good buds from a one to two year old branch
(brown not green bark) that is about an inch (2.5 cm) or two in
diameter. It sounds like the tree you cut down with have a LOT of
these.

A technique called the cleft graft is the best for working with a
tree stump. This is also one of the easiest types of grafts for
beginners to attempt. The first step is to prepare the stump to
accept the scion. Hammer a chisel into the stump, creating a split,
or cleft about 6 inches deep. Then whittle the scion wood to a
6-inch wedge so that it easily inserts into the new cleft, making
sure to leave bark on the two sides of the wedge. Your tree sounds
like it will have a pretty big stump, so you may need to carve out a
section of the stump rather than a simple split. Leave the bark!!!


Once the scions are wedged and ready, insert them into the cleft of
the stump. It is usually necessary to use a small pry bar or grafting
tool to separate the cleft far enough to accept the scion wedges. You
want it tight! Place the scions on the two outer edges of the cleft
so that the bark of the scion matches up with the bark of the stump.
It is this lining up of bark rather than lining up rings as with many
other more complicated methods that makes the cleft graft such an
excellent technique for beginning grafters to attempt. The trick is
to get the bark of the stump over the bark of the scions so they will
heal together and the graft will grow. For a stump the size I
envision yours to be, I would place four or more scions.

The final step to completing the fruit tree graft is to apply a
grafting compound. There are a number of options for this, the most
common of which are a petroleum-based paste and a wax. Spread the
compound over the entire wound to protect and seal it Including the
top of the stump, therefore protecting it from disease and
encouraging quick growth.


If you decided to put four or so scions in the stump, after the first
year when the branches are all growing you can begin to trim and
prune the tree into a plum "bush"- very earsy to spray and pick
fruit. If you place two scions, the traditional method is to cut
off the weaker scion after a year and make the stronger you new
leader for a new tree. If you decide to try this I would start with
a shorter stump so the branches don't get to high.


Wow that sound a bit complicated for me, who would be able to to that?
Not something for the avarage tree surgeon I would guess.

Dave


While a stump graft is a solution it does seem a bit much to ask for
somebody who is starting from the point of not knowing when or how to prune
at all. If you top them they will shoot from lower down and you ought to be
able to establish some shape to the growth over a few years. Since you have
several it is not so critical that every one is a success so maybe if you
are very severe and start some with just a stump you will get some right and
some will die, or they might all live. That's better than what you have.

D


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