Damned Leaf Spot
 

Sigh. It seems that I get a second year of tomato leaf spot.

At least I think I recognized it earlier this year than last. The
plants still look vibrant. And I know not to get lax about respraying
like I did last year. I had the thought to do a preemptive spraying
of copper sulfate when I set them out. I should have followed through
with that.

Unfortunately we were out of town last week, and I was recovering
from exhaustion for the beginning of the week. Otherwise, I might
have figured it out sooner.


On the up side, I ate the first tomato and first cucumber of the
year yesterday.

I had thinned the cucumber cages to about half the density of last
year, and I'm thinking they may still be too crowded. I had to
weave the vines onto the cages yesterday, since they'd sprawled
about 4 feet instead of climbing.

--
Drew Lawson
"Please understand that we are considerably less interested
in you than you are."
-- Madeleine Page, on the deep truths of alt.folklore.urban

Damned Leaf Spot
 

Drew Lawson wrote:
Sigh. It seems that I get a second year of tomato leaf spot.

At least I think I recognized it earlier this year than last. The
plants still look vibrant. And I know not to get lax about respraying
like I did last year. I had the thought to do a preemptive spraying
of copper sulfate when I set them out. I should have followed through
with that.

Unfortunately we were out of town last week, and I was recovering
from exhaustion for the beginning of the week. Otherwise, I might
have figured it out sooner.


On the up side, I ate the first tomato and first cucumber of the
year yesterday.

I had thinned the cucumber cages to about half the density of last
year, and I'm thinking they may still be too crowded. I had to
weave the vines onto the cages yesterday, since they'd sprawled
about 4 feet instead of climbing.

That's what my tomato plants look like ! Copper sulphate , you say ? Mine
are pretty bad , look like stems with a few leaves . Gotta get some of that
stuff , I was told it was likely spotted leaf wilt , a viral problem .
Will dusting with sulphur help ?
--
Snag

Damned Leaf Spot
 

In article
"Terry Coombs" writes:
Drew Lawson wrote:
Sigh. It seems that I get a second year of tomato leaf spot.

That's what my tomato plants look like ! Copper sulphate , you say ? Mine
are pretty bad , look like stems with a few leaves . Gotta get some of that
stuff , I was told it was likely spotted leaf wilt , a viral problem .
Will dusting with sulphur help ?

I don't think sulphur will help with viruses, but I don't know.
I'm mostly familiar with it as a fungicide.

Tomato leaf spot is a fungal problem, with spores splashed from
infected leaves to uninfected, so the problem mostly climbs up as
the plant grows. The copper sulphate worked well on it last year,
but my experience is that it suppresses the spread rather than
killing off the problem. So this year, I will keep spraying for
the rest of the season. What I have is a powder/dust, and I mix
it in a 1500ml hand sprayer.

I'm a tree-hugging sort, but don't mess with my tomatoes.

--
Drew Lawson So risk all or don't risk anything
You can lose all the same

Damned Leaf Spot
 

Drew Lawson wrote:
In article
"Terry Coombs" writes:
Drew Lawson wrote:
Sigh. It seems that I get a second year of tomato leaf spot.

That's what my tomato plants look like ! Copper sulphate , you say ?
Mine are pretty bad , look like stems with a few leaves . Gotta get
some of that stuff , I was told it was likely spotted leaf wilt , a
viral problem . Will dusting with sulphur help ?

I don't think sulphur will help with viruses, but I don't know.
I'm mostly familiar with it as a fungicide.

Tomato leaf spot is a fungal problem, with spores splashed from
infected leaves to uninfected, so the problem mostly climbs up as
the plant grows. The copper sulphate worked well on it last year,
but my experience is that it suppresses the spread rather than
killing off the problem. So this year, I will keep spraying for
the rest of the season. What I have is a powder/dust, and I mix
it in a 1500ml hand sprayer.

I'm a tree-hugging sort, but don't mess with my tomatoes.

I have a bottle of Spinosad at my right elbow as I sit here ... it's
supposed to control thrips , which are supposedly the vector for this tomato
spotted wilt virus . They were beginning to improve but in the last day or
three seem to have taken a turn for the worse . I was counting on these
tomatoes for a winter's plus supply for sauce and paste .

--
Snag

Damned Leaf Spot
 

Derald wrote:
http://vegetablemdonline.ppath.corne...omLeafKey.html

http://www.missouribotanicalgarden.o...20Problems.pdf

http://www.ext.colostate.edu/pubs/Garden/02949.html

http://aggie-horticulture.tamu.edu/v...solver/leaves/

http://pods.dasnr.okstate.edu/docush...PP-7625web.pdf

http://erec.ifas.ufl.edu/tomato-scou...ease-key.shtml

http://www.gardeningknowhow.com/edib...o-diseases.htm

That first link is the one that led me to believe this is the spotted wilt
virus , but I don't have the charactristic discoloration on the fruit . Now
I'm even more confused .

--
Snag

Damned Leaf Spot
 

Terry Coombs wrote:
....
I'm even more confused .

:) do you have fruit on the plants that is fairly
good sized already?


songbird

Damned Leaf Spot
 

In article
"Terry Coombs" writes:
Derald wrote:
http://vegetablemdonline.ppath.corne...omLeafKey.html

That first link is the one that led me to believe this is the spotted wilt
virus , but I don't have the charactristic discoloration on the fruit . Now
I'm even more confused .

Just wanted to comment that their pictures for tomato leaf spot
(Septoria) are very good, exactly what I'm dealing with. I don't
know whether that translates to good quality on all their pages.

It is frustrating that there are so many things that kill tomato
leaves. In retrospect, I've been very lucky that I went so many
years without having a problem.

--
Drew Lawson | I'd like to find your inner child
| and kick its little ass

Damned Leaf Spot
 

songbird wrote:
Terry Coombs wrote:
...
I'm even more confused .

:) do you have fruit on the plants that is fairly
good sized already?


songbird

Yes , and some has been picked , more is ready/almost ready .

--
Snag

Damned Leaf Spot
 

Drew Lawson wrote:
In article
"Terry Coombs" writes:
Derald wrote:
http://vegetablemdonline.ppath.corne...omLeafKey.html

That first link is the one that led me to believe this is the
spotted wilt virus , but I don't have the charactristic
discoloration on the fruit . Now I'm even more confused .

Just wanted to comment that their pictures for tomato leaf spot
(Septoria) are very good, exactly what I'm dealing with. I don't
know whether that translates to good quality on all their pages.

It is frustrating that there are so many things that kill tomato
leaves. In retrospect, I've been very lucky that I went so many
years without having a problem.

I suspect part of my problem is the varieties I chose , all heirlooms .

--
Snag

Damned Leaf Spot
 

In article
"Terry Coombs" writes:
Drew Lawson wrote:
In article
"Terry Coombs" writes:
Derald wrote:
http://vegetablemdonline.ppath.corne...omLeafKey.html

That first link is the one that led me to believe this is the
spotted wilt virus , but I don't have the charactristic
discoloration on the fruit . Now I'm even more confused .

Just wanted to comment that their pictures for tomato leaf spot
(Septoria) are very good, exactly what I'm dealing with. I don't
know whether that translates to good quality on all their pages.

It is frustrating that there are so many things that kill tomato
leaves. In retrospect, I've been very lucky that I went so many
years without having a problem.

I suspect part of my problem is the varieties I chose , all heirlooms .

As are mine. Now that I have the fungus in my garden, it will
probably be a problem for at least several years. I have to get
much better about controlling weeds that can be extra hosts.

I realized while spraying that I probably also need to space the
cages about twice as far apart as I did this year (which is slightly
farther than last year), to reduce how much gets spread between plants.

--
|Drew Lawson | If you're not part of the solution |
| | you're part of the precipitate. |

Damned Leaf Spot
 

Derald wrote:
You may benefit from a closer look at the Missouri Botanical Garden's
document. Photos are excellent and it lists "lookalikes" and points
out (some of) their differences.

I did look at it , came away with the same diagnosis . Sometimes a patch
just sucks . I had my squashes/cukes/melons in that patch last year . Lost
almost everything to squash stem root rot , a fungal infection aggravated by
excess rain . Which we had , both last year and this . Sometimes ya gotta
just suck it up and go on .

--
Snag

Damned Leaf Spot
 

Terry Coombs wrote:
songbird wrote:
Terry Coombs wrote:
...
I'm even more confused .

:) do you have fruit on the plants that is fairly
good sized already?

Yes , and some has been picked , more is ready/almost ready .

then you're at least going to get a harvest,
those that are big enough can be set aside in
the garage or someplace and they'll eventually
ripen. not quite as good as vine ripened but
usually acceptable for sauces or ...

we've done that some years when the plants
have dropped their leaves due to blights. i've
never bothered to spray, but mulching to prevent
leaf splash and removing leaves from the lower
part of the plants didn't make any difference.

the challenge was finding enough space to set
them out (on old towels so they'd not rot) in the
garage, but most come through just fine in time.
a few might rot anyways. we'd go through them
once in a while to find them and get them off
the tables.

Ma had the idea that we should set them in the
sun, but that is not a good idea once the tomato
is off the plant. she still does it by setting
them on the window sill... ah well, can't change
habits of some folks sometimes. :)


songbird

Damned Leaf Spot
 

Once upon a time on usenet Derald wrote:
http://vegetablemdonline.ppath.corne...omLeafKey.html

http://www.missouribotanicalgarden.o...20Problems.pdf

http://www.ext.colostate.edu/pubs/Garden/02949.html

http://aggie-horticulture.tamu.edu/v...solver/leaves/

http://pods.dasnr.okstate.edu/docush...PP-7625web.pdf

http://erec.ifas.ufl.edu/tomato-scou...ease-key.shtml

http://www.gardeningknowhow.com/edib...o-diseases.htm

Thanks for the links.
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)

Damned Leaf Spot
 

Once upon a time on usenet Derald wrote:
"~misfit~" wrote:

Thanks for the links
Hope you find the information useful. Use with caution: Those
sorts of guides can easily lead to confusion. Concentrating on the
visuals only can be misleading. It is important also to be aware of
contributing factors such as season, prevailing weather conditions,
soil conditions, nutrient levels, etc. etc.

Understood. Thanks again.
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)

Damned Leaf Spot
 

On Thu, 30 Jul 2015 15:17:20 +1200, "~misfit~"
wrote:

Once upon a time on usenet Derald wrote:
"~misfit~" wrote:

Thanks for the links
Hope you find the information useful. Use with caution: Those
sorts of guides can easily lead to confusion. Concentrating on the
visuals only can be misleading. It is important also to be aware of
contributing factors such as season, prevailing weather conditions,
soil conditions, nutrient levels, etc. etc.

Understood. Thanks again.


I have found that another variable is tomato variety, too. Over and
above the specific ones that are wilt-resistant, some are just overly
sensitive to it.

I have found that Pink Berkeley Tie-Dye are highly susceptible to
fungal attack...also to scald and blossom end rot. Damn fine tomatoes
if they make it through, though.

I am growing a lot of different varieties this year, each in large
tubs, each in exactly the same growing medium. The different tubs are
being treated as similarly as one can do under home gardening
conditions, so I really believe some of what I am seeing is variety
based.

Damned Leaf Spot
 

On Thu, 30 Jul 2015 11:41:28 -0400, Derald wrote:

Boron Elgar wrote:

I have found that another variable is tomato variety, too. Over and
above the specific ones that are wilt-resistant, some are just overly
sensitive to it.

+1


snip

I am growing a lot of different varieties this year, each in large
tubs, each in exactly the same growing medium. The different tubs are
being treated as similarly as one can do under home gardening
conditions, so I really believe some of what I am seeing is variety
based.

So:
What's your climate like?
What varieties?
What are you seeing? :-)


I am in northern NJ. Sometimes designated zone 6b, sometimes 7a.

I have been at this a long time and known blight/spot/wilt and the
variations pretty well. I am trying Serenade this year, as it is a
biofungicide, but probably waited too long.

This has been a highly productive, relatively dry year for tomatoes in
the area, with minimal problems that can come from a wet season, and
I will have oodles to use and give away from many other varieties.

I had higher hopes for the Tie Dyes, though. Ah well. I got the
seedlings in LA in April and brought them east.. Next year I will try
them from seed.

Or maybe I will get some from the Lomita Tomato Lady.

http://heirloomtomatoplants.com/

Damned Leaf Spot
 

Once upon a time on usenet Boron Elgar wrote:
On Thu, 30 Jul 2015 15:17:20 +1200, "~misfit~"
wrote:

Once upon a time on usenet Derald wrote:
"~misfit~" wrote:

Thanks for the links
Hope you find the information useful. Use with caution: Those
sorts of guides can easily lead to confusion. Concentrating on the
visuals only can be misleading. It is important also to be aware of
contributing factors such as season, prevailing weather conditions,
soil conditions, nutrient levels, etc. etc.

Understood. Thanks again.


I have found that another variable is tomato variety, too. Over and
above the specific ones that are wilt-resistant, some are just overly
sensitive to it.

I have found that Pink Berkeley Tie-Dye are highly susceptible to
fungal attack...also to scald and blossom end rot. Damn fine tomatoes
if they make it through, though.

I am growing a lot of different varieties this year, each in large
tubs, each in exactly the same growing medium. The different tubs are
being treated as similarly as one can do under home gardening
conditions, so I really believe some of what I am seeing is variety
based.

Handy to know. I wonder if that information is out there somewhere? Last
year I decided to just grow Grosse Lisse as the previous year they were my
favourites. However we had a wet season and they lost all their lower leaves
first then the stems rotted. A later crop I put in was too late.

I've never sprayed tomatoes before, just figured if I get a crop then that's
great. However as finances get tighter and mobility more limited I can't
afford to put the effort in for little or no return so will have to learn to
work out what the trouble is (if any) and sort it out this year.

Cheers,
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)

Damned Leaf Spot
 

~misfit~ wrote:
....
I've never sprayed tomatoes before, just figured if I get a crop then that's
great. However as finances get tighter and mobility more limited I can't
afford to put the effort in for little or no return so will have to learn to
work out what the trouble is (if any) and sort it out this year.

i would try cherry tomatoes and varieties geared
towards patio growers. as of yet the cherry tomato
variety sweet 100 has been reliable. last year was
our worst for the large tomato harvest, but the
sweet 100s did ok. the plants do get big, but they
flop down if you don't stake them up so you can
work from the side or underneath if you have to.


songbird

Damned Leaf Spot
 

On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 12:48:37 +1200, "~misfit~"
wrote:

Once upon a time on usenet Boron Elgar wrote:
On Thu, 30 Jul 2015 15:17:20 +1200, "~misfit~"
wrote:

Once upon a time on usenet Derald wrote:
"~misfit~" wrote:

Thanks for the links
Hope you find the information useful. Use with caution: Those
sorts of guides can easily lead to confusion. Concentrating on the
visuals only can be misleading. It is important also to be aware of
contributing factors such as season, prevailing weather conditions,
soil conditions, nutrient levels, etc. etc.

Understood. Thanks again.


I have found that another variable is tomato variety, too. Over and
above the specific ones that are wilt-resistant, some are just overly
sensitive to it.

I have found that Pink Berkeley Tie-Dye are highly susceptible to
fungal attack...also to scald and blossom end rot. Damn fine tomatoes
if they make it through, though.

I am growing a lot of different varieties this year, each in large
tubs, each in exactly the same growing medium. The different tubs are
being treated as similarly as one can do under home gardening
conditions, so I really believe some of what I am seeing is variety
based.

Handy to know. I wonder if that information is out there somewhere? Last
year I decided to just grow Grosse Lisse as the previous year they were my
favourites. However we had a wet season and they lost all their lower leaves
first then the stems rotted. A later crop I put in was too late.

I've never sprayed tomatoes before, just figured if I get a crop then that's
great. However as finances get tighter and mobility more limited I can't
afford to put the effort in for little or no return so will have to learn to
work out what the trouble is (if any) and sort it out this year.

Cheers,

I am as close to organic as one can get - at least when the bugs are
OUTSIDE my house, but Serenade (way overpriced bottle of liquid it is,
too), being a biological, doesn't offend me instantly.

I recommend putting in as wide a variety of tomatoes as you can
accommodate, and include a few cherrys. Even when the weather
decimates the large fruit plants, I always manage to get some harvest
from the cherries. Makes for odd sandwiches, but they are tasty.

Yesterday's pickings:

http://i62.tinypic.com/jphkxz.jpg

Damned Leaf Spot
 

On Thu, 30 Jul 2015 21:27:46 -0400, songbird
wrote:

~misfit~ wrote:
...
I've never sprayed tomatoes before, just figured if I get a crop then that's
great. However as finances get tighter and mobility more limited I can't
afford to put the effort in for little or no return so will have to learn to
work out what the trouble is (if any) and sort it out this year.

i would try cherry tomatoes and varieties geared
towards patio growers. as of yet the cherry tomato
variety sweet 100 has been reliable. last year was
our worst for the large tomato harvest, but the
sweet 100s did ok. the plants do get big, but they
flop down if you don't stake them up so you can
work from the side or underneath if you have to.


songbird


Gotta laugh...I did not read ahead, but posted to Misfit and
recommended the same solution.

Damned Leaf Spot
 

Once upon a time on usenet songbird wrote:
~misfit~ wrote:
...
I've never sprayed tomatoes before, just figured if I get a crop
then that's great. However as finances get tighter and mobility more
limited I can't afford to put the effort in for little or no return
so will have to learn to work out what the trouble is (if any) and
sort it out this year.

i would try cherry tomatoes and varieties geared
towards patio growers. as of yet the cherry tomato
variety sweet 100 has been reliable. last year was
our worst for the large tomato harvest, but the
sweet 100s did ok. the plants do get big, but they
flop down if you don't stake them up so you can
work from the side or underneath if you have to.

Thanks. Most years I grow at least one cherry tomato plant but last year
didn't. I won't make that mistake again. (I have seeds that I've kept from
previous years and have been trying to grow some inside under lights - as
I've been talking about in another thread.)
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)

Damned Leaf Spot
 

Once upon a time on usenet Boron Elgar wrote:
On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 12:48:37 +1200, "~misfit~"
wrote:

Once upon a time on usenet Boron Elgar wrote:
On Thu, 30 Jul 2015 15:17:20 +1200, "~misfit~"
wrote:

Once upon a time on usenet Derald wrote:
"~misfit~" wrote:

Thanks for the links
Hope you find the information useful. Use with caution: Those
sorts of guides can easily lead to confusion. Concentrating on
the visuals only can be misleading. It is important also to be
aware of contributing factors such as season, prevailing weather
conditions, soil conditions, nutrient levels, etc. etc.

Understood. Thanks again.


I have found that another variable is tomato variety, too. Over and
above the specific ones that are wilt-resistant, some are just
overly sensitive to it.

I have found that Pink Berkeley Tie-Dye are highly susceptible to
fungal attack...also to scald and blossom end rot. Damn fine
tomatoes if they make it through, though.

I am growing a lot of different varieties this year, each in large
tubs, each in exactly the same growing medium. The different tubs
are being treated as similarly as one can do under home gardening
conditions, so I really believe some of what I am seeing is variety
based.

Handy to know. I wonder if that information is out there somewhere?
Last year I decided to just grow Grosse Lisse as the previous year
they were my favourites. However we had a wet season and they lost
all their lower leaves first then the stems rotted. A later crop I
put in was too late.

I've never sprayed tomatoes before, just figured if I get a crop
then that's great. However as finances get tighter and mobility more
limited I can't afford to put the effort in for little or no return
so will have to learn to work out what the trouble is (if any) and
sort it out this year.

Cheers,

I am as close to organic as one can get - at least when the bugs are
OUTSIDE my house, but Serenade (way overpriced bottle of liquid it is,
too), being a biological, doesn't offend me instantly.

I try to be as organic as possible but finances especially dictate that I
compromise from time to time. However if and when I do compromise I try to
use older 'tried and true' low-impact substances.

I recommend putting in as wide a variety of tomatoes as you can
accommodate, and include a few cherrys. Even when the weather
decimates the large fruit plants, I always manage to get some harvest
from the cherries. Makes for odd sandwiches, but they are tasty.

True. I usually grow three or four varieties including a cherry tomato but,
as the previous year the Grosse Lisse was by far my favourite and I'm having
to cut back a bit on non-tree food growing (essentially 'soil working') I
decided to just grow the Grosee Lisse last year. Lesson learned.

Yesterday's pickings:

http://i62.tinypic.com/jphkxz.jpg

Nice! :)
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)

Damned Leaf Spot
 

On Sat, 1 Aug 2015 12:58:29 +1200, "~misfit~"
wrote:


I am as close to organic as one can get - at least when the bugs are
OUTSIDE my house, but Serenade (way overpriced bottle of liquid it is,
too), being a biological, doesn't offend me instantly.

I try to be as organic as possible but finances especially dictate that I
compromise from time to time. However if and when I do compromise I try to
use older 'tried and true' low-impact substances.

I recommend putting in as wide a variety of tomatoes as you can
accommodate, and include a few cherrys. Even when the weather
decimates the large fruit plants, I always manage to get some harvest
from the cherries. Makes for odd sandwiches, but they are tasty.

True. I usually grow three or four varieties including a cherry tomato but,
as the previous year the Grosse Lisse was by far my favourite and I'm having
to cut back a bit on non-tree food growing (essentially 'soil working') I
decided to just grow the Grosee Lisse last year. Lesson learned.

Spring is a gardener's season on hope, late summer is one of distress.

I have squirrels or chipmunks raiding the tomatoes. Lost a lot this
week.

I will set some mouse traps around a few plants, but who knows what
approach the critters are using.