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Old 23-06-2004, 09:06 PM
Jerome R. Long
 
Posts: n/a
Default Imidacloprid (Merit 75) safety

Organic purists will blanch at this entry....sorry.
In my climate/location adjacent to a 500 acre pasture on a hill in Southwest
Virginia I find gardening by strict organic rules to be a non-starter although
I have much sympathy for organic purism and have subscribed to OG for 37 years.
The topic I wish to broach is judicious use of Bayer's Merit 75 imidacloprid
insecticide on fruit and vegetable crops.
For first rate information see the following Cornell U. site

http://pmep.cce.cornell.edu/profiles...athion/imidacl
oprid-ext.html
and also the Bayer site
http://intranet.risd.edu/envirohealt...rMerit75WP.pdf

Imidacloprid is a systemic insecticide found to be a godsend in control of
such things as the Japanese beetle grub in turfgrasses as well as the adult
beetle infestations of ornamentals such as roses. I have been using it on my
60 hybrid tea roses for about four years. Imidacloprid is certified for use
on turf grasses and ornamentals. It is not certified for use on food crops as
far as I can tell.
However one finds in the Cornell site the following:
Imidacloprid is a systemic, chloro-nicotinyl insecticide with soil, seed and
foliar uses for the control of sucking insects including rice hoppers, aphids,
thrips, whiteflies, termites, turf insects, soil insects and some beetles. It
is most commonly used on rice, cereal, maize, potatoes, vegetables, sugar
beets, fruit, cotton, hops and turf, and is especially systemic when used as a
seed or soil treatment. The chemical works by interfering with the transmission
of stimuli in the insect nervous system. Specifically, it causes a blockage in
a type of neuronal pathway (nicotinergic) that is more abundant in insects than
in warm-blooded animals (making the chemical selectively more toxic to insects
than warm-blooded animals). This blockage leads to the accumulation of
acetylcholine, an important neurotransmitter, resulting in the insect's
paralysis, and eventually death. It is effective on contact and via stomach
action (3).

While I have used Merit 75 imidacloprid to control the Japanese beetle on my
roses, the horrible beasts have continued to ravage my raspberries and my
grapes.
A bit of simple math shows it may be OK to use Merit 75 on those grapes and
raspberries.
One of the first things one learns in using Merit 75 is how very little is
needed for control. Merit 75 comes as a water soluble powder in a 2 oz bottle
used at the rate of 1/8 tsp per gallon of water. This works out to be roughly
one gram of imidacloprid in three gallons of water. A generous spraying of a
half gallon mixture on a 30 foot long row of five foot high raspberries then
works out to be no more than 100 mg imidacloprid on the entire row of plants.
The imidacloprid is absorbed systemically so that all parts of the plant become
most effectively toxic to the Japanese beetles.
But the raspberry output for an excellent crop producing 10 to 15 gallons of
berries is at most some 2% by mass of the plants. In the very worst case, this
implies a residual of 0.2 mg imidacloprid per gallon of berries, with the
chances being that there is less than 0.1 mg per gallon.
Thus, we might expect a glutinous consumption of a full gallon of berries
so treated might involve also ingesting about 0.1 mg imidacloprid.
In tests on rats it is found that half the rats are fatally dosed (LD50) if
they ingest 450 mg per killogram of body mass. Translated to a 75 kg (165 lb)
person, the tests on rats suggest a 50% killing dose of 34,000 mg.
Thus, to ingest a gallon of red raspberries from plants previously treated with
a generous spraying of Merit 75 suggests one has ingested about 0.0003 % of
an LD50 dose...at most. Similar numbers would apply to grapes.
One further learns (Cornell site) that "Imidacloprid is a systemic,
chloro-nicotinyl insecticide with soil, seed and foliar uses for the control of
sucking insects including rice hoppers, aphids, thrips, whiteflies, termites,
turf insects, soil insects and some beetles. It is most commonly used on rice,
cereal, maize, potatoes, vegetables, sugar beets, fruit, cotton, hops and turf,
and is especially systemic when used as a seed or soil treatment. The chemical
works by interfering with the transmission of stimuli in the insect nervous
system. Specifically, it causes a blockage in a type of neuronal pathway
(nicotinergic) that is more abundant in insects than in warm-blooded animals
(making the chemical selectively more toxic to insects than warm-blooded
animals). This blockage leads to the accumulation of acetylcholine, an
important neurotransmitter, resulting in the insect's paralysis, and eventually
death. It is effective on contact and via stomach action (3).

The Cornell site also says:
Imidacloprid is quickly and almost completely absorbed from the
gastrointestinal tract, and eliminated via urine and feces (70-80% and 20-30%,
respectively, of the 96% of the parent compound administered within 48 hours).
and
The half-life of imidacloprid in soil is 48-190 days, depending on the amount
of ground cover (it breaks down faster in soils with plant ground cover than in
fallow soils) (9). Organic material aging may also affect the breakdown rate of
imidacloprid. Plots treated with cow manure and allowed to age before sowing
showed longer persistence of imidacloprid in soils than in plots where the
manure was more recently applied, and not allowed to age (10). Imidacloprid is
degraded stepwise to the primary metabolite 6-chloronicotinic acid, which
eventually breaks down into carbon dioxide (11). There is generally not a high
risk of groundwater contamination with imidacloprid if used as directed.

As another indication of the very low toxicity of imidacloprid to warm blooded
animals, one should note that your vetinarian sells monthly use vials of
the stuff that you squeeze out on the spine of the dog. I don't know the dose,
but it is sold in about four sizes that scale up with the weight of the dog..
It is absorbed through the dog's skin and is death to any flea or tick that
bites that dog. There do not appear to be any negative consequences. A one year
feeding study on dogs fed a regular diet with 1.8 parts per thousand of
imidacloprid produced no observable effect. That gallon of raspberries with its
0.1 mg of possible imidacloprid corresponds to about 0.00002 parts per thousand
for that one item,whereas the dogs were fed at the rate 1.8 parts per thousand
on a day in day out basis for a full year.

SO I SAY TO YOU, WHY NOT VERY JUDICIOUSLY USE THIS stuffto prevent our grapes
and raspberries from being converted to brown lace.




  #2   Report Post  
Old 26-06-2004, 08:04 PM
JRYezierski
 
Posts: n/a
Default Imidacloprid (Merit 75) safety

Have you tried to use milky spore for the jap beetles in the lawn?
For the twenty bucks or so for a decent size container of the spore and
spread it "farmer style"(by hand broadcasting )in a part of the lawn that is
near yhour raspberrys/grapes I know you will see a differnece next summer.
I know the stuff works as beetles would be a black fog on my lawn.Now we
have very very few of them.And I have farm fields on three sides of me.
"Jerome R. Long" wrote in message
...
Organic purists will blanch at this entry....sorry.
In my climate/location adjacent to a 500 acre pasture on a hill in

Southwest
Virginia I find gardening by strict organic rules to be a non-starter

although
I have much sympathy for organic purism and have subscribed to OG for 37

years.
The topic I wish to broach is judicious use of Bayer's Merit 75

imidacloprid
insecticide on fruit and vegetable crops.
For first rate information see the following Cornell U. site


http://pmep.cce.cornell.edu/profiles...athion/imidacl
oprid-ext.html
and also the Bayer site

http://intranet.risd.edu/envirohealt...rMerit75WP.pdf

Imidacloprid is a systemic insecticide found to be a godsend in control of
such things as the Japanese beetle grub in turfgrasses as well as the

adult
beetle infestations of ornamentals such as roses. I have been using it on

my
60 hybrid tea roses for about four years. Imidacloprid is certified for

use
on turf grasses and ornamentals. It is not certified for use on food crops

as
far as I can tell.
However one finds in the Cornell site the following:
Imidacloprid is a systemic, chloro-nicotinyl insecticide with soil, seed

and
foliar uses for the control of sucking insects including rice hoppers,

aphids,
thrips, whiteflies, termites, turf insects, soil insects and some beetles.

It
is most commonly used on rice, cereal, maize, potatoes, vegetables, sugar
beets, fruit, cotton, hops and turf, and is especially systemic when used

as a
seed or soil treatment. The chemical works by interfering with the

transmission
of stimuli in the insect nervous system. Specifically, it causes a

blockage in
a type of neuronal pathway (nicotinergic) that is more abundant in insects

than
in warm-blooded animals (making the chemical selectively more toxic to

insects
than warm-blooded animals). This blockage leads to the accumulation of
acetylcholine, an important neurotransmitter, resulting in the insect's
paralysis, and eventually death. It is effective on contact and via

stomach
action (3).

While I have used Merit 75 imidacloprid to control the Japanese beetle on

my
roses, the horrible beasts have continued to ravage my raspberries and my
grapes.
A bit of simple math shows it may be OK to use Merit 75 on those grapes

and
raspberries.
One of the first things one learns in using Merit 75 is how very little is
needed for control. Merit 75 comes as a water soluble powder in a 2 oz

bottle
used at the rate of 1/8 tsp per gallon of water. This works out to be

roughly
one gram of imidacloprid in three gallons of water. A generous spraying of

a
half gallon mixture on a 30 foot long row of five foot high raspberries

then
works out to be no more than 100 mg imidacloprid on the entire row of

plants.
The imidacloprid is absorbed systemically so that all parts of the plant

become
most effectively toxic to the Japanese beetles.
But the raspberry output for an excellent crop producing 10 to 15 gallons

of
berries is at most some 2% by mass of the plants. In the very worst case,

this
implies a residual of 0.2 mg imidacloprid per gallon of berries, with the
chances being that there is less than 0.1 mg per gallon.
Thus, we might expect a glutinous consumption of a full gallon of berries
so treated might involve also ingesting about 0.1 mg imidacloprid.
In tests on rats it is found that half the rats are fatally dosed (LD50)

if
they ingest 450 mg per killogram of body mass. Translated to a 75 kg (165

lb)
person, the tests on rats suggest a 50% killing dose of 34,000 mg.
Thus, to ingest a gallon of red raspberries from plants previously treated

with
a generous spraying of Merit 75 suggests one has ingested about 0.0003 %

of
an LD50 dose...at most. Similar numbers would apply to grapes.
One further learns (Cornell site) that "Imidacloprid is a systemic,
chloro-nicotinyl insecticide with soil, seed and foliar uses for the

control of
sucking insects including rice hoppers, aphids, thrips, whiteflies,

termites,
turf insects, soil insects and some beetles. It is most commonly used on

rice,
cereal, maize, potatoes, vegetables, sugar beets, fruit, cotton, hops and

turf,
and is especially systemic when used as a seed or soil treatment. The

chemical
works by interfering with the transmission of stimuli in the insect

nervous
system. Specifically, it causes a blockage in a type of neuronal pathway
(nicotinergic) that is more abundant in insects than in warm-blooded

animals
(making the chemical selectively more toxic to insects than warm-blooded
animals). This blockage leads to the accumulation of acetylcholine, an
important neurotransmitter, resulting in the insect's paralysis, and

eventually
death. It is effective on contact and via stomach action (3).

The Cornell site also says:
Imidacloprid is quickly and almost completely absorbed from the
gastrointestinal tract, and eliminated via urine and feces (70-80% and

20-30%,
respectively, of the 96% of the parent compound administered within 48

hours).
and
The half-life of imidacloprid in soil is 48-190 days, depending on the

amount
of ground cover (it breaks down faster in soils with plant ground cover

than in
fallow soils) (9). Organic material aging may also affect the breakdown

rate of
imidacloprid. Plots treated with cow manure and allowed to age before

sowing
showed longer persistence of imidacloprid in soils than in plots where the
manure was more recently applied, and not allowed to age (10).

Imidacloprid is
degraded stepwise to the primary metabolite 6-chloronicotinic acid, which
eventually breaks down into carbon dioxide (11). There is generally not a

high
risk of groundwater contamination with imidacloprid if used as directed.

As another indication of the very low toxicity of imidacloprid to warm

blooded
animals, one should note that your vetinarian sells monthly use vials of
the stuff that you squeeze out on the spine of the dog. I don't know the

dose,
but it is sold in about four sizes that scale up with the weight of the

dog..
It is absorbed through the dog's skin and is death to any flea or tick

that
bites that dog. There do not appear to be any negative consequences. A one

year
feeding study on dogs fed a regular diet with 1.8 parts per thousand of
imidacloprid produced no observable effect. That gallon of raspberries

with its
0.1 mg of possible imidacloprid corresponds to about 0.00002 parts per

thousand
for that one item,whereas the dogs were fed at the rate 1.8 parts per

thousand
on a day in day out basis for a full year.

SO I SAY TO YOU, WHY NOT VERY JUDICIOUSLY USE THIS stuffto prevent our

grapes
and raspberries from being converted to brown lace.






  #3   Report Post  
Old 30-06-2004, 11:05 PM
Beecrofter
 
Posts: n/a
Default Imidacloprid (Merit 75) safety

Merit kills pollinators.
No pollinators, no raspberries, no matter how pretty the leaves look.
Systemics on a food crop? you must be a corporation.
  #5   Report Post  
Old 09-07-2004, 12:02 AM
Beecrofter
 
Posts: n/a
Default Imidacloprid (Merit 75) safety

(Jerome R. Long) wrote in message ...
In article ,
says...

Merit kills pollinators.
No pollinators, no raspberries, no matter how pretty the leaves look.
Systemics on a food crop? you must be a corporation.


Did you make any attempt to work through the numbers given in my post?
I am not a corporation, nor do I use chemicals without misgivings, but the
numbers as I see it would appear to support cautious use of imidacloprid
on some food crops. One thing against my idea is the question of the systemic
in blossom nectar. Bees extract negligible nectar from raspberries, I think.
but don't know. I believe most systemics reside in the green leaves and are
very effective agains chewing insects that take in lots of leaf matter. That is
why the stuff works on beetles so well. If, on the other hand, the systemic
has significant concentration in nectar, then spraying of ornamentals that
the bees visit would be a problem. In my neighborhood, several neighbors retain
lawngreen services that spray the lawn with systemics. There is quite a lot of
white clover in some of those lawns, but I observe no effect of all that on my
four bee hives. I would not consider spraying the raspberries once flowering
begins.


It is easy to lie with numbers, ppm ppb and such don't tell you what is
going on inside an organism.
Are you familliar with the problems beekeepers in France have with the
imidacacloprid appled to suflower crops? The evidence suggests that small
exposures cause the bees to lose the ability to navigate and as a result
instead of piling up dead on the bottom board their bodies are more or less
distributed over several hundreds of acres. How convenient for Bayer.
For the past several years I have kept about 30 hives and divided my
efforts between making up nucs for the guys who lost all of their bees and
taking a crop of honey. This year I am facing the prospect of using
checkmite strips as the mites seem tolerant to fluvalinate.


  #7   Report Post  
Old 14-07-2004, 10:02 PM
Beecrofter
 
Posts: n/a
Default Imidacloprid (Merit 75) safety

(Jerome R. Long) wrote in message ...
In article ,
says...

Merit kills pollinators.
No pollinators, no raspberries, no matter how pretty the leaves look.
Systemics on a food crop? you must be a corporation.


Did you make any attempt to work through the numbers given in my post?
I am not a corporation, nor do I use chemicals without misgivings, but the
numbers as I see it would appear to support cautious use of imidacloprid
on some food crops. One thing against my idea is the question of the systemic
in blossom nectar. Bees extract negligible nectar from raspberries, I think.
but don't know. I believe most systemics reside in the green leaves and are
very effective agains chewing insects that take in lots of leaf matter. That is
why the stuff works on beetles so well. If, on the other hand, the systemic
has significant concentration in nectar, then spraying of ornamentals that
the bees visit would be a problem. In my neighborhood, several neighbors retain
lawngreen services that spray the lawn with systemics. There is quite a lot of
white clover in some of those lawns, but I observe no effect of all that on my
four bee hives. I would not consider spraying the raspberries once flowering
begins.


It is easy to lie with numbers, ppm ppb and such don't tell you what is
going on inside an organism.
Are you familliar with the problems beekeepers in France have with the
imidacacloprid appled to suflower crops? The evidence suggests that small
exposures cause the bees to lose the ability to navigate and as a result
instead of piling up dead on the bottom board their bodies are more or less
distributed over several hundreds of acres. How convenient for Bayer.
For the past several years I have kept about 30 hives and divided my
efforts between making up nucs for the guys who lost all of their bees and
taking a crop of honey. This year I am facing the prospect of using
checkmite strips as the mites seem tolerant to fluvalinate.
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