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Old 27-07-2003, 07:02 AM
D&M
 
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Default amazon sword sizing

I have a few swords that I bought quite a while back, nicely large leafed,
etc. The shouts have sprouted off, and I've snipped months ago, but they're
growing different to the parent plants. They're more shrubby. One plant has
20-30 leaves and only 4" high. Do I have to prune leaves to get the others
to grow larger? I use a standard aquarium .15-0-0 enriched fertilizer. (BTW,
how often is a person supposed to add the fertilizer?)

Also, how much light do they need? I currently give them 6-10 hours
power-glo lighting, 6 or so hours darkness, the rest of lighting comes from
indirect sunlight, ambiant from room lighting.

Thanks.



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Old 27-07-2003, 07:23 AM
Pierre-Normand Houle
 
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Default amazon sword sizing


"D&M" wrote in message ...
I have a few swords that I bought quite a while back, nicely large leafed,
etc. The shouts have sprouted off, and I've snipped months ago, but they're
growing different to the parent plants. They're more shrubby. One plant has
20-30 leaves and only 4" high. Do I have to prune leaves to get the others
to grow larger? I use a standard aquarium .15-0-0 enriched fertilizer. (BTW,
how often is a person supposed to add the fertilizer?)


Your 15-0-0 provides potassium and, I suppose, iron and trace elements. Depending on
fish load you might need to supplement nitrates also. For an amazon sword this might
be furnished in the form of root spikes, such as Jobe's for palms and ferns (16-2-6),
which will also provide some more potassium (16%) and even some phosphates (2%).

You need to add enough fertilizer to get 0.1ppm of iron in the water column, or nor
much more. But you might not be getting enough potassium that way. That's another
reason for the root spikes.

But really these recommendations might be way off. What is your tank size? What is
the lighting wattage? What are the other plants? What sort of substrate is in there?
What is the fish load? I don't suppose you are injecting CO2?

Also, how much light do they need? I currently give them 6-10 hours
power-glo lighting, 6 or so hours darkness, the rest of lighting comes from
indirect sunlight, ambiant from room lighting.

Thanks.




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Old 27-07-2003, 08:23 AM
D&M
 
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Default amazon sword sizing


Your 15-0-0 provides potassium and, I suppose, iron and trace elements.

I use "Plant-Gro"
-0.15% nitogen
-0.26% iron
-0.05% manganese
-0.003% zinc
-0.0005% boron
-0.0005% copper
-0.0007% molybdate

treatment is 5ml/10g... no instruction on how often to add, so I add every
couple weeks after I do a 25% water change.

What is your tank size?


90g

What is the lighting wattage?


42" 40w Power-Glo Flourescent.

What are the other plants?


No idea what the names of the other plants are, here's a pictu

http://www.execulink.com/~sharp01/plants.jpg

The fern like one I've called "fish food". Can't keep it alive in the tank,
all the fish eat it. Put in all the suplements (wafers, etc.) I want, but
the fish prefer the real thing.

What's labelled in the picture as an amazon is not the amazons I'm working
with. It's actually some other type of sword I bought a while back that
resembles an amazon, but slimmer leaves, sold under a different name as
well.

If you have names for the other plants, feel free to fill in the blanks. I'm
just starting to get into aquaplants, really adds to the appearance of the
tank, and would love to learn about the plants I keep.


What sort of substrate is in there?


I'm still using designer gravel, haven't grown up enough to move to sand (to
lazy to change over is more like it)

What is the fish load?


4 med. bala's, 12 tiger barbs (reg&greeny's), 1 pim. cat, 8 loaches (3
clowns, 2 yoyo's, 2 zebra, 1 "tiger"), 7 assorted cory's (pandas, peppered,
albino), 7 otos, 1 clown pleco, 4 serpae tetras

I don't suppose you are injecting CO2?


Not yet, looking into a good system as I got fairly high pH, kill two birds
with one stone, so to say.


What I'd really like to know is how to make the "Big" leaves like the parent
amazon plants have. Do I have to prune some of the leaves off to encourage
larger ones to grow?


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Old 27-07-2003, 08:34 AM
D&M
 
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Default amazon sword sizing

btw, the plant in the middle of the picture, whatever it is, the red tailed
shark LOVES it the most. He's chewed most the leaves off that one.

Eventually hoping I can get enoguh plants loaded into the tank that the fish
damage will lower as they won't keep eating the same one.


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Old 27-07-2003, 09:52 AM
Pierre-Normand Houle
 
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Default amazon sword sizing


"D&M" wrote in message ...

Your 15-0-0 provides potassium and, I suppose, iron and trace elements.

I use "Plant-Gro"
-0.15% nitogen
-0.26% iron
-0.05% manganese
-0.003% zinc
-0.0005% boron
-0.0005% copper
-0.0007% molybdate


Oh! Then I was mixing up the numbers for nitrate and potassium. (This means that
Jobe's spikes for ferns and palms are actually 16% nitrate, 2% phosphate, and 6%
potassium)

The nitrogen in Plant-Gro is only used as a chelating agent for the traces. So it's
"0.15"-0-0 which is not the same as 15-0-0. It is essentially 0-0-0.

treatment is 5ml/10g... no instruction on how often to add, so I add every
couple weeks after I do a 25% water change.


The recommended dosage amounts to adding 0.3ppm (=0.3mg/liter) of iron. That may be a
bit much. 0.1ppm is usually recommended here as a target. (Much more than this can
lead to algae problems, especially if there is also an excess nitrate.)

Assuming zero iron intake you'd need to add 1/12 of that doze after each water change
to maintain 0.1ppm but that's an unrealistic lower bound. If you add 0.1ppm after
each water change (1/3 the recommended dose) then, (still assuming zero intake,) your
iron concentration will stabilize at 0.4ppm which is not catastrophic. So you could
safely start with that and monitor your plants for signs of iron deficiency.

Check this useful article on Chuck Gadd's page for a table of nutrient deficiency
symptoms:

http://www.csd.net/~cgadd/aqua/art_plant_nutrient.htm

What is your tank size?


90g

What is the lighting wattage?


42" 40w Power-Glo Flourescent.

What are the other plants?


No idea what the names of the other plants are, here's a pictu

http://www.execulink.com/~sharp01/plants.jpg


This might be elodea densa or hydrilla verticillata on the left, I am unsure. The
other one : hygrophila? ludwigia? Both seem to be fast growing stem plants that
would normally need a steady source of macronutrients (K, NO3, PO4) to do well but
you lighting is very low. So maybe your fish load (+Plant-Gro) is sufficient to
provide all they need. You could also burry half a spike or root tab, deep in the
substrate, bellow each bunch of stem plants, every two months or so.

I'm still using designer gravel, haven't grown up enough to move to sand (to
lazy to change over is more like it)


So am I. I only fertilize the water column and use a few spikes. However I have high
lighting and CO2 injection. One drawback of a poor substrate in these conditions is
that stem plants produce lots of roots at the nodes to get nutrients from the water
column and this is somewhat unaesthetic.

What is the fish load?


4 med. bala's, 12 tiger barbs (reg&greeny's), 1 pim. cat, 8 loaches (3
clowns, 2 yoyo's, 2 zebra, 1 "tiger"), 7 assorted cory's (pandas, peppered,
albino), 7 otos, 1 clown pleco, 4 serpae tetras


Under your lighting conditions this is probably sufficient to provide enough nitrate
for your plants. It is certainly sufficient to provide enough phosphate. If you see
pinholes appearing in the older leaves of your plants then you will have to
supplement potassium, which is the most likely macronutrient to become depleted in a
fish tank, even under low light. The target for this is 20ppm and it does not promote
algae growth.

I don't suppose you are injecting CO2?


Not yet, looking into a good system as I got fairly high pH, kill two birds
with one stone, so to say.


You might want to look into improving your lighting, also, if you want to seriously
get into plants. It is frustrating to put care into this only to see them slowly
whither away and disappear into fish and snail.

What I'd really like to know is how to make the "Big" leaves like the parent
amazon plants have. Do I have to prune some of the leaves off to encourage
larger ones to grow?


I'll let people who are more knowledgeable about amazons answer this.




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