Substrate Heating Power Supply
I'm getting back into the hobby after being away for a while and I
decided to set up a 6'x2'x2' planted freshwater tank with substrate heating cables. I've been reading everything I can look up on The Krib and other sources and I decided to go with the 250 watt Dupla cables (Duplaflex 1000), even though they cost an arm and a leg. Now the decision is the power supply. Does anyone know of any good sources for one that is sufficient to power these cables that won't cost my other arm and leg or should I have to bite the bullet and spend another $200 for the Dupla one (http://www.floridadriftwood.com)? Even though I don't have much electrical engineering experience, I'm open to trying some of the DIY options I've read about. Anybody have any recent experience with that? Anybody know of any good places to get low voltage/high current (24 V @ 11+ A) step down transformers? If I do end up going with the Dupla transformer, does anyone know if that will only connect to the Dupla temperature controller or can I use some other controller (Neptune's AquaController II, for example)? Thanks for any info on the subject! - Allan |
In article MPG.1bd65c6ac2a9eb7f989682@news-server, ty1xlnf02
@sneakemail.removethis.com says... ... Even though I don't have much electrical engineering experience, I'm open to trying some of the DIY options I've read about. Anybody have any recent experience with that? Anybody know of any good places to get low voltage/high current (24 V @ 11+ A) step down transformers? Tortran ( www.tortran.com ) makes nice toroidal transformers in that range. They have a 300VA version and another at 500VA. (VA and watts are equal for a heater.) These have two secondaries of 12V each, so you would connect them in series to get 24V output. The 500VA model is only $67, but comes without a box or anything, just a large transformer with wires brought out. If you want to put one in a box (recommended to protect your connections from getting wet) be sure to get the mounting hardware. If you like ebay you could possibly find one there too. 120V input, 24V output transformers with high current ratings are fairly common. |
Allan wrote in message news:MPG.1bd65c6ac2a9eb7f989682@news-server...
I'm getting back into the hobby after being away for a while and I decided to set up a 6'x2'x2' planted freshwater tank with substrate heating cables. I've been reading everything I can look up on The Krib and other sources and I decided to go with the 250 watt Dupla cables (Duplaflex 1000), even though they cost an arm and a leg. Now the decision is the power supply. Does anyone know of any good sources for one that is sufficient to power these cables that won't cost my other arm and leg or should I have to bite the bullet and spend another $200 for the Dupla one (http://www.floridadriftwood.com)? Even though I don't have much electrical engineering experience, I'm open to trying some of the DIY options I've read about. Anybody have any recent experience with that? Anybody know of any good places to get low voltage/high current (24 V @ 11+ A) step down transformers? If I do end up going with the Dupla transformer, does anyone know if that will only connect to the Dupla temperature controller or can I use some other controller (Neptune's AquaController II, for example)? Thanks for any info on the subject! - Allan I'd suggest you not add a cable system at all. I've never found them after 10 or so years(I've had 7 over the years by Dupla and others)to be of any use. Do they hurt? No, do they help? No. I'd work on the substrate by using Flourite or Onyx, add some mulm from another tank, about 8-10 handfuls of ground peat and add 3-4"f these syubstrates on top of the mulm and peat. Then you are done. Nothing else needed. You can search the APD for my arguments on cables and find some back and forth between George and myself over the years. No one to date has even come close to answering my questions concerning them nor shown any evidence that they work. I think "faith" has more to do with it than actual help to the plants.:) It will work if you believe it works:) You will find a significant difference with a good substrate like I suggested though. Regards, Tom Barr Regards, Tom Barr |
I would check with dupla and make sure another power supply will work.
I really am not sure about this with their thermic sets heating. Usually as long as the power settings are the same and the end piece is you wouldnt have a problem Marc __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _______ Want to win a FREE new co2 system or a lighting system check out our forum for our newest contest coming up http://www.fish-forums.com Http://www.aquatic-store.com On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 03:28:58 GMT, Allan wrote: I'm getting back into the hobby after being away for a while and I decided to set up a 6'x2'x2' planted freshwater tank with substrate heating cables. I've been reading everything I can look up on The Krib and other sources and I decided to go with the 250 watt Dupla cables (Duplaflex 1000), even though they cost an arm and a leg. Now the decision is the power supply. Does anyone know of any good sources for one that is sufficient to power these cables that won't cost my other arm and leg or should I have to bite the bullet and spend another $200 for the Dupla one (http://www.floridadriftwood.com)? Even though I don't have much electrical engineering experience, I'm open to trying some of the DIY options I've read about. Anybody have any recent experience with that? Anybody know of any good places to get low voltage/high current (24 V @ 11+ A) step down transformers? If I do end up going with the Dupla transformer, does anyone know if that will only connect to the Dupla temperature controller or can I use some other controller (Neptune's AquaController II, for example)? Thanks for any info on the subject! - Allan |
In article , sales@aquatic-
store.com says... I would check with dupla and make sure another power supply will work. I really am not sure about this with their thermic sets heating. Usually as long as the power settings are the same and the end piece is you wouldnt have a problem Marc I'll check, but I'm not sure Dupla would really give me an honest answer to this question if their goal is to sell their own transformer? |
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Tom, I had previously read your post when I was doing my research and I
agree that no one has proven beyond a doubt that cable heating is critical for a planted tank, but going off the anecdotal reports of a couple of other people that said they were going strong for 12 to 18 months and then growth tapered off mysteriously. I haven't done much research on Flourite, but I'll bone up on it prior to making a final decision. Thanks for your reply, though. -- Allan Uhmm. there is no mystery as to why a tank's plant growth slows down, there are 3 main components and if you address these, you will not have slow down or otherwise any monkey business with plants at all. Growth is driven by 3 main things in tanks: Light, CO2 and nutrients. 3 things. Cables are not one of them. I think the real issue is that the tank slows down due to other factors, low CO2, less light(bulbs change color over time and intensity), nutrient status etc. If these are not addressed, then there is no test and it is pure speculation. I'm one that does do critical approaches to plant growth. If you devise a test to answer a question, you need to make certain the test is not influenced by otherwise factors, things like CO2, lights, Nutrients. You wish to test only one dependent variable, any other things like light/CO2/Nutrients variations must be in good shape or will invalidate the test and you must start over again. I got good at maintaining the water column, the light/CO2 are rather easy once you figure that out. So then you can go about testing much more critically and see if there is any merit to a method/device/idea/theory. You also can see how much interaction it has with other methods. You can simply go down the line and test each nutrient, light set up, substrate methods, etc one at time and not have it be influenced by the other parameters. Any hobbyist can do this and prove things to themselves, which I've always told folks to do if they really care that much about the issue. I also suggest folks look critically in the background research and be careful to look for research that is directly as possible applicable to the given situation. I did RFUG's, cables and no flow series(plain old flourite and no mechanical flow) through substrates over the years, I have about 10 years in each method. I have a long background both experimentally, practical, and academic in specifically dealing with substrates. George is a smart guy and nice guy BTW. Still, he's considered switching to Flourite as well. So...... You might consider adding flourite to a cable system also. I've not done this combo, but I get better growth than anyone with cables as it is so I really don't find the need. I stick to the core basics, light, CO2 and nutrients. Still, the question is will cables hurt? Nope. So you are not making any mistake, just wasting your $ is all. If you add ferts to the substrate, cables will oxidize them faster than no flow set ups. Likewise a RFUG will oxidize them even more so. Anyu increase in the flux will increase the redox levels(further oxidizing the nutrients) and providing faster bacteria to use the nutrients. I've argued that these aerobic bacteria are the main driving factor in cycling besides the plants. But.......plants still kick the bacteria's butt on uptake of NO3, PO4 etc. So it still gets back to the big 3, light, CO2 and nutrients. Take care of the plants, the rest is not an issue. Regards, Tom Barr |
In article MPG.1bd8f28faa06c35c989685@news-server, ty1xlnf02
@sneakemail.removethis.com says... In article , says... In article MPG.1bd65c6ac2a9eb7f989682@news-server, ty1xlnf02 @sneakemail.removethis.com says... ... Even though I don't have much electrical engineering experience, I'm open to trying some of the DIY options I've read about. Anybody have any recent experience with that? Anybody know of any good places to get low voltage/high current (24 V @ 11+ A) step down transformers? Tortran ( www.tortran.com ) makes nice toroidal transformers in that range. They have a 300VA version and another at 500VA. (VA and watts are equal for a heater.) These have two secondaries of 12V each, so you would connect them in series to get 24V output. The 500VA model is only $67, but comes without a box or anything, just a large transformer with wires brought out. If you want to put one in a box (recommended to protect your connections from getting wet) be sure to get the mounting hardware. If you like ebay you could possibly find one there too. 120V input, 24V output transformers with high current ratings are fairly common. George, Here's my thread with a contact at Tortran: ... Is that worth the extra dough, or would it be easy enough for a layman to by the bare transformer and build a box with $15 worth of Radio Shack components? Sorry for the late response. The wiring is very simple and you should not have any trouble building it yourself. Instead of a thermal cutout, which protects against transformer overheating from too great a load, you can just put a fuse in series with the transformer primary. A 3A, 250 volt slow-blow would be about right for your 300W application. Whatever you do, please be sure to take some steps to prevent water from getting in your box and defeating the insulation. I use a GFI in the wall but would also ground the box if it is metal. |
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