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#16
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"Bob Alston" wrote in message
news:9poQd.13251$Zr.10304@okepread03... 50% weekly water changes will help a lot. Bob unless there is phosphate in the replacement water or the dechlorinator spiral, check the phosphates in your tap water if that is what you use. Also, do you use anything like neutral regulator or ph right, etc...? -- Margolis http://web.archive.org/web/200302152...qs/AGQ2FAQ.htm http://www.unrealtower.org/faq |
#17
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No actually I quit using pH 7.0 about 6 months ago. I saw a post about
phosphate buffers and sure enough.... the stuff was a phosphate buffer. Currently I use NO chemicals at all and about 1 teaspoon of phosphate free carbon (Black Diamond) in only one of the filters. I am doing a 30% water change with a vacuum every Saturday just to stay ahead of the BGA while I try different things. I am going to test my tap (well) water tonight, thank you. I have tried blackout... it works but only temporarily. My problem is pretty advanced. In 3-4 days I have a good covering, primarily on the right side of the tank. This is the side with only two java ferns and the whisper filter. My plants are primarily on the left. I would say my tank maintenence is pretty good although I am still learning. I will NOT start the tank over. What will I learn from that? It may very well be coming from my tap water.... that'll be great. my aquarium page, info and pics at: www.geocities.com/spiral_72/Spirals_page.html |
#18
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Margolis wrote:
"Bob Alston" wrote in message news:9poQd.13251$Zr.10304@okepread03... 50% weekly water changes will help a lot. Bob unless there is phosphate in the replacement water or the dechlorinator spiral, check the phosphates in your tap water if that is what you use. Also, do you use anything like neutral regulator or ph right, etc...? Agree it is possible. But in my experience more likely from the flake food and overfeeding. Bob |
#19
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In article .com,
spiral_72 wrote: Hey, I think I just found out last night why I am growing so much BGA. I stopped by the LFS on the way home from work and bought a phosphate test kit. From what I have read it should be 0-1mg/L..... The test kit measured 0-5mg/L....... clear to blue. Mine registered off the scale..... It was a deep purple. Guess I need to take some steps to fix that ASAP. I figure I can buy those phosphate absorbing pills or add A LOT more plants...... or both. What do y'all think? I think you havn't been changing water enough. The absorbing pillow will take longer than you want to wait to work. Change 80% of the weater till it's gone then doweekly 50% changes. Test your tapwatrer for phosphatre. What do you fed? (some foods are higher in PO4 than others) Do you use carbon? (It can leech phosphate) -- Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org http://www.mbz.org | Mercedes Mailing lists: http://lists.mbz.org 633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | Killies, killi.net, Crypts, aquaria.net 1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Old wris****ches http://watches.list.mbz.org |
#20
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I feed TetraMin flakes for tropical fish and four sinking cat pellets
once a day about 7pm. Also about every week and a half I feed frozen blood worms to replace the flake. I do use carbon, Black Diamond (pakage says phosphate free)..... a very small amount (1 tsp) in one filter bag replaced monthly. my aquarium page, info and pics at: www.geocities.com/spiral_72/Spirals_page.html |
#21
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spiral_72 wrote:
I feed TetraMin flakes for tropical fish and four sinking cat pellets once a day about 7pm. Also about every week and a half I feed frozen blood worms to replace the flake. I do use carbon, Black Diamond (pakage says phosphate free)..... a very small amount (1 tsp) in one filter bag replaced monthly. my aquarium page, info and pics at: www.geocities.com/spiral_72/Spirals_page.html To test for phosphates in your carbon, set up your phosphate test with distilled or RO water and drop a few grains of carbon into it. (Reefkeepers' trick). I believe you're right that Black Diamond does actually test phosphate free but it can't hurt to try. -- __ Elaine T __ __' http://eethomp.com/fish.html '__ |
#22
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"Bob Alston" wrote in message
news:yvqQd.13255$Zr.12796@okepread03... Agree it is possible. But in my experience more likely from the flake food and overfeeding. I can't see how overfeeding could get it to go off the scale. Even a whole can of flake with a high phosphorous content wouldn't get it that high I wouldn't think. -- Margolis http://web.archive.org/web/200302152...qs/AGQ2FAQ.htm http://www.unrealtower.org/faq |
#23
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I tested my tap water last night.... 0.25mg/L of phosphate
I wasn't real sure what to do. I cleaned the tank again last night. The stuff is growing at a tremendous rate. It has attacked my java ferns, driftwood, rock and gravel but for the most part it has left my Amazon Swords alone. I can't get over it grows primarily on the right side. I will test my carbon tonight. I use so little of it, I doubt that's it. I really do clean quite well, so I doubt it is fish/food waste. I am scared it will be my substrate. It doesn't really make any sense to have an outbreak after a year of being setup though. my aquarium page, info and pics at: www.geocities.com/spiral_72/Spirals_page.html |
#24
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Oh, I am running a blackout starting last night. With any luck I can
get regain some control of this thing. What do you think? I read in a book (I think) that algae can only take advantage of a long period of light, while plants can take some advantage of several shorter periods. Any experience with that? Could I run my lights for just two hours several times a day and cut down on algae growth? my aquarium page, info and pics at: www.geocities.com/spiral_72/Spirals_page.html |
#25
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Spiral,
Rather than going 5 different directions about algae, focus on the dang plants! Take care of their needs. The PO4 issue could be the test kit, you are relying all the issue on that, that has NOTHING to do with BGA or outbreaks of algae unless it's too low. Tell me, anyone, what is the difference between 2ppm of PO4 and say 5ppm of PO4 regarding algae, will one cause algae ansd the other will not? I've dosed 1-2ppm of PO4 in my tanks for oh..........about 15 years ..........where is my algae? I'll tell you, it's not there and PO4 excess does not cause algae in a well planted tank. Now poor CO2, lack of NO3, K, traces, GH, PO4 etc sure will................... It';s simply much easier and straight forward for a new person to focus on the plant's needs. I am over playing the notion of NOT using antibiotics because it's an easy solution to a more complicated issue. KNO3 is what the tank is lacking, not antibiotics. Blackout and antiobiotics merely kill what's there, it does NOT solve your issue. Ask your self this: why do I have algae? Poor plant growth. When the plants are growing well, you have no algae. So focus on the plants. Any plant can handle a 3 day blackout, if you fail to add the KNO3 back, the BGa will come back in a few days, if you fail to add the KNO3 doing the antiobiotic, it'll come back in 1-2 months, perhaps longer if you feed more etc or somehow start adding more Nitrogen. The blackout allows you to repeat the KNO3 test and shows you rather quickly that the lack of KNO3 encourages a BGA bloom. It would have taken me years to figure that out using antibiotics.............so pills don't teach you much either. Stay healthy and you don't get sick and need pills/algae fix, Copper etc, so keep your plants healthy. Rather than the quick fix, look at the long term solution, then folks can get back to talking about plants and not algae ......... This is much easier and actually deceptively simple. Regards, Tom Barr |
#26
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In article .com,
wrote: Tell me, anyone, what is the difference between 2ppm of PO4 and say 5ppm of PO4 regarding algae, will one cause algae ansd the other will not? I've dosed 1-2ppm of PO4 in my tanks for oh..........about 15 years ..........where is my algae? It's here in one of my tanks. Do you want me to mail it to you or something? *******. -- Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org http://www.mbz.org | Mercedes Mailing lists: http://lists.mbz.org 633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | Killies, killi.net, Crypts, aquaria.net 1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Old wris****ches http://watches.list.mbz.org |
#27
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Sure. Send it, I'll tell you the species too.
My pioint is really, if the algae likes excess, why don't we see it in tank with obvious excess levels of NO3 and PO4, light, CO2, Fe/traces, K+, Ca, Mg ?????? Surely excess is 2ppm of orthophosphate(DIP) which is the most bioavailable form of PO4. How is that different than say 5ppm? How much is too much PO4? I have no practical reason to dose more than 2ppm but I'd like to know what range causes problems... I really do not know of an upper limit. If you have some concrete data, that would be interesting. Regards, Tom Barr |
#28
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Well, as much as all that hurt my feelings...... You might have a
point. With the exception of my banana plant, my plant growth is slow to almost stopped. "How much is too much PO4?" I've not seen any concrete data either, but since the test measures 0-5mg/L and assuming the manufacturer is the expert (Hagen) I figgered 5 was way too much..... and about 2.5 was acceptable (middle of the test range), while 0 or 2.5 was ideal. Is that a ridiculous assumption? After all, what good is a gauge if it reads something other than an ideal or expected quantity? Just for the record I changed about 30% water in my 55g this weekend with 0.25mg/L tap water. Before and after the water change, the test measured purple (off the scale.) I soaked a handful of my carbon (new, out of the can) in 16oz of clean tap water... The water was 0.25mg/L PO4 before and after I mixed the carbon. I tested my peat (new) using the same method.... no change in PO4 before and after. I broke off a small piece of the substrate fertilizer I use.... No change. Therefore, it appears PO4 is leeching from my substrate or I have decaying fish waste laying everywhere (which I don't.) The way I figure it, I can: 1.Sell everything, and give up. 2.Continue to clean the tank twice a week and hope things clear up. 3.Buy lots of plants and/or some PO4 "sponge" and wait. 4.Take Tom Barr's suggestion and: dose (KNO3) Potassium Nitrate (How do you know mine is low?) "Now poor CO2, lack of NO3, K, traces, GH, PO4 etc sure will............." (NO3) Nitrates is zero. With my low fish load. it's to be expected. Lots of people run a very low fish load planted tank. You can't dose Nitrates. Can you? Nitrates are generated by bacteria breaking down.....forms of organic waste. GH is 7d(125ppm) a little on the soft side. PO4 is very high.... that's what I am concerned with CO2 by calculation is about 8ppm. Not too bad right?.... a little low (K) Potassium.... I have no idea. So, not to start a fight...... What is wrong with this picture? I ask questions to learn. The phosphates are the only thing I can find that are out of the ordinary. I don't have a test kit for everything. That would cost hundreds of dollars. While I agree that low plant growth must be an indicator of something, I expect to run some extra CO2 and they will flourish. No? Maybe not. Do I purchase some leaf fertilezer with iron and all the trace elements and give that a shot? I think I am going about finding a solution fairly methodically. I sure hope when this is all finished, someone can search for BGA in Google and find this trial with a solution. my aquarium page, info and pics at: www.geocities.com/spiral_72/Spirals_page.html |
#29
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spiral_72 wrote: dose (KNO3) Potassium Nitrate (How do you know mine is low?) Use a nitrate, NO3, test kit. KNO3 is a molecule composed of elements O, N and K. You knew that, anyway, yes? "Now poor CO2, lack of NO3, K, traces, GH, PO4 etc sure will............." NO3 is a constituent of KNO3, so is K. (NO3) Nitrates is zero. With my low fish load. it's to be expected. That's your problem. The plants can't use up any further P if N is zero, hence your high PO4 or P. Your plants are craving for nitrogen! Lots of people run a very low fish load planted tank. You can't dose Nitrates. Can you? Nitrates are generated by bacteria breaking down.....forms of organic waste. What? Nitrates = NO3. Dosing KNO3 is dosing your tank with nitrates, plus some potassium. I don't think the plants really care about its source. Nikki |
#30
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"spiral_72" wrote in news:1109008752.449041.270760
@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com: Well, as much as all that hurt my feelings...... You might have a point. With the exception of my banana plant, my plant growth is slow to almost stopped. ....... "Now poor CO2, lack of NO3, K, traces, GH, PO4 etc sure will............." (NO3) Nitrates is zero. With my low fish load. it's to be expected. Lots of people run a very low fish load planted tank. You can't dose Nitrates. Can you? Nitrates are generated by bacteria breaking down.....forms of organic waste. GH is 7d(125ppm) a little on the soft side. PO4 is very high.... that's what I am concerned with CO2 by calculation is about 8ppm. Not too bad right?.... a little low (K) Potassium.... I have no idea. Hey spiral, just a quick note a fellow aquarist who had a similar problem... Tom's is the way go to. I've been down the limiting ferts route, especially phosphates, and it never really worked and if it did work the plants didn't do well. Now I actually still have little visable traces of algae around in my tank, so I know I'm not clean and it could grow, but it just doesn't. It still took me a little tweaking of using lots of fert and CO2 to get it working. I have a larger than usual for a fully planted tank (at least compaired to the pics you see on the web) so I personally use less NO3 and I vacuum my gravel whenever I move plants from that spot. The nice thing is while you are working on getting the balance right, even if you have algae at least your plants are going gangbusters and that's encouraging.... that PO4 will probably get sucked up by the plants (it's just amazing) and just disappear unless you got a real hard PO4 source in your gravel. I'll let Tom do the work and give you the details but I'll tell you right now that CO2 is way way low. I'm around upper 20s to 30ppm CO2. There's a note on most charts saying above 20 is bad but I haven't seen a hint of a problem. Luck, don't give up Pete. PS. if that banana plant is anything like mine, once you get your tank really running it will take over. It turned into one of those giant ferns people use in the corned of their office.. it's massive. |
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