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Old 06-09-2005, 12:31 AM
Wolf Kirchmeir
 
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Default Growing grapes from seeds - help please.

We bought some locally grown grapes at the farmers' market. Sour little
things, but my wife made a cobbler with them that tastes very good (she
added apples.) The grapes also make an excellent jelly.

I've saved some of the seeds, and would like some advice on growing
grapevines of my own using these seeds.

TIA.

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Old 06-09-2005, 01:31 AM
David Ross
 
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Wolf Kirchmeir wrote:

We bought some locally grown grapes at the farmers' market. Sour little
things, but my wife made a cobbler with them that tastes very good (she
added apples.) The grapes also make an excellent jelly.

I've saved some of the seeds, and would like some advice on growing
grapevines of my own using these seeds.

TIA.


The usual way to propagate grapes is from cuttings, not from seed.
That is the only way for seedless grapes. But even grapes with
seeds might not reproduce true to their parents.

--
David E. Ross
Climate: California Mediterranean
Sunset Zone: 21 -- interior Santa Monica Mountains with some ocean
influence (USDA 10a, very close to Sunset Zone 19)
Gardening pages at URL:http://www.rossde.com/garden/
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Old 06-09-2005, 02:30 PM
Greysky
 
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"Wolf Kirchmeir" wrote in message
...
We bought some locally grown grapes at the farmers' market. Sour little
things, but my wife made a cobbler with them that tastes very good (she
added apples.) The grapes also make an excellent jelly.

I've saved some of the seeds, and would like some advice on growing
grapevines of my own using these seeds.

TIA.


Shouldn't be too hard. Around here, (northern calif.), grape plants come up
as seeds all the time. They are treated ass weeds, and pulled. I'd say just
stick the seed in the dirt and keep moist. You will probably see some action
next season... as to what fruit a wild grape will produce, is anyone's
guess. But give it a try - you might discover a new variety!



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Old 06-09-2005, 05:34 PM
Paul E. Lehmann
 
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Greysky wrote:


"Wolf Kirchmeir" wrote in message
...
We bought some locally grown grapes at the farmers' market. Sour little
things, but my wife made a cobbler with them that tastes very good (she
added apples.) The grapes also make an excellent jelly.

I've saved some of the seeds, and would like some advice on growing
grapevines of my own using these seeds.

TIA.


Shouldn't be too hard. Around here, (northern calif.), grape plants come
up
as seeds all the time. They are treated ass weeds, and pulled. I'd say
just stick the seed in the dirt and keep moist. You will probably see some
action next season... as to what fruit a wild grape will produce, is
anyone's guess. But give it a try - you might discover a new variety!


Grapes do not produce true from seed. That is why they are always grown
from cuttings. They can be grown from seed but it is anyone's guess as to
what will grow. Grape vines are not that expensive so if one finds a
variety that is desired, the best thing to do is buy a grafted cutting.
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Old 06-09-2005, 06:31 PM
zxcvbob
 
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Paul E. Lehmann wrote:
Greysky wrote:


"Wolf Kirchmeir" wrote in message
. ..

We bought some locally grown grapes at the farmers' market. Sour little
things, but my wife made a cobbler with them that tastes very good (she
added apples.) The grapes also make an excellent jelly.

I've saved some of the seeds, and would like some advice on growing
grapevines of my own using these seeds.

TIA.


Shouldn't be too hard. Around here, (northern calif.), grape plants come
up
as seeds all the time. They are treated ass weeds, and pulled. I'd say
just stick the seed in the dirt and keep moist. You will probably see some
action next season... as to what fruit a wild grape will produce, is
anyone's guess. But give it a try - you might discover a new variety!



Grapes do not produce true from seed. That is why they are always grown
from cuttings. They can be grown from seed but it is anyone's guess as to
what will grow. Grape vines are not that expensive so if one finds a
variety that is desired, the best thing to do is buy a grafted cutting.



I live so far north, there's not a lot of grape varieties to choose
from. I've found a few wild grape seedlings coming up in the flower
beds and I wonder how much they would produce if I transplanted them to
a trellis and pruned them properly?

How many years would it take before I got that first pitiful little
harvest so I could tell if the fruit was any good? If they were awful,
shouldn't I be able to graft a good variety onto the wild roots and have
bearing vines in another 2 years?

Best regards,
Bob


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Old 07-09-2005, 12:37 AM
DigitalVinyl
 
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Default

zxcvbob wrote:

Paul E. Lehmann wrote:
Greysky wrote:


"Wolf Kirchmeir" wrote in message
...

We bought some locally grown grapes at the farmers' market. Sour little
things, but my wife made a cobbler with them that tastes very good (she
added apples.) The grapes also make an excellent jelly.

I've saved some of the seeds, and would like some advice on growing
grapevines of my own using these seeds.

TIA.

Shouldn't be too hard. Around here, (northern calif.), grape plants come
up
as seeds all the time. They are treated ass weeds, and pulled. I'd say
just stick the seed in the dirt and keep moist. You will probably see some
action next season... as to what fruit a wild grape will produce, is
anyone's guess. But give it a try - you might discover a new variety!



Grapes do not produce true from seed. That is why they are always grown
from cuttings. They can be grown from seed but it is anyone's guess as to
what will grow. Grape vines are not that expensive so if one finds a
variety that is desired, the best thing to do is buy a grafted cutting.



I live so far north, there's not a lot of grape varieties to choose
from. I've found a few wild grape seedlings coming up in the flower
beds and I wonder how much they would produce if I transplanted them to
a trellis and pruned them properly?

How many years would it take before I got that first pitiful little
harvest so I could tell if the fruit was any good?

2nd or 3rd year from a cutting. I had no problem getting fruit in the
2nd season.

From my all too rough understanding, you get grapes on the
canes/branches that grew the previous season. I started with 2 year,
12-18" bare root vines(Burpee.com). The first year they just vined,
very healthly, and aggressive. The second year they grew excessively,
too much so as I constantly cut them and they still covered the little
back porch of the house. I got quite a few grapes, but too many
clusters and not fully developed. Also suffered a lot of powdery
mildew.

Some are finally sweetened. I could tell cause I have two or the
larger birds going after the fruit every day.

If they were awful,
shouldn't I be able to graft a good variety onto the wild roots and have
bearing vines in another 2 years?

Best regards,
Bob


DiGiTAL ViNYL (no email)
Zone 6b/7, Westchester Co, NY, 1 mile off L.I.Sound
3rd year gardener
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/royalf...=/2055&.src=ph
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Old 07-09-2005, 10:46 PM
David Ross
 
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zxcvbob wrote:

Paul E. Lehmann wrote:
Greysky wrote:


"Wolf Kirchmeir" wrote in message
. ..

We bought some locally grown grapes at the farmers' market. Sour little
things, but my wife made a cobbler with them that tastes very good (she
added apples.) The grapes also make an excellent jelly.

I've saved some of the seeds, and would like some advice on growing
grapevines of my own using these seeds.

TIA.

Shouldn't be too hard. Around here, (northern calif.), grape plants come
up
as seeds all the time. They are treated ass weeds, and pulled. I'd say
just stick the seed in the dirt and keep moist. You will probably see some
action next season... as to what fruit a wild grape will produce, is
anyone's guess. But give it a try - you might discover a new variety!



Grapes do not produce true from seed. That is why they are always grown
from cuttings. They can be grown from seed but it is anyone's guess as to
what will grow. Grape vines are not that expensive so if one finds a
variety that is desired, the best thing to do is buy a grafted cutting.


I live so far north, there's not a lot of grape varieties to choose
from. I've found a few wild grape seedlings coming up in the flower
beds and I wonder how much they would produce if I transplanted them to
a trellis and pruned them properly?

How many years would it take before I got that first pitiful little
harvest so I could tell if the fruit was any good? If they were awful,
shouldn't I be able to graft a good variety onto the wild roots and have
bearing vines in another 2 years?


It takes 2-3 years for started plants (bare root) to yield a small
crop. It takes another year or two for the plants to yield a full
crop. I would expect a seedling to take at least 3 years or maybe
even 4-5.

You need to get the vine growing to the extent there are horizontal
branches on a support. These form during a growing season. The
following winter or early spring, side growth on the horizontal
branches is pruned short but not removed. That growing season may
yield a small crop from shoots originated from the reduced side
growth. The pruning is repeated each winter, and the crop is
better each following growing season.

It's difficult to describe the pruning process for grapes. There
are actually two main pruing styles. Some grape varieties do
better with one, some with the other, and some equally well with
either pruning style. Try to find a book on pruning or grape
culture in your local library.

--
David E. Ross
Climate: California Mediterranean
Sunset Zone: 21 -- interior Santa Monica Mountains with some ocean
influence (USDA 10a, very close to Sunset Zone 19)
Gardening pages at URL:http://www.rossde.com/garden/
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Old 07-09-2005, 11:25 PM
Paul E. Lehmann
 
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Default

David Ross wrote:

zxcvbob wrote:

Paul E. Lehmann wrote:
Greysky wrote:


"Wolf Kirchmeir" wrote in message
. ..

We bought some locally grown grapes at the farmers' market. Sour
little things, but my wife made a cobbler with them that tastes very
good (she added apples.) The grapes also make an excellent jelly.

I've saved some of the seeds, and would like some advice on growing
grapevines of my own using these seeds.

TIA.

Shouldn't be too hard. Around here, (northern calif.), grape plants
come up
as seeds all the time. They are treated ass weeds, and pulled. I'd say
just stick the seed in the dirt and keep moist. You will probably see
some action next season... as to what fruit a wild grape will produce,
is anyone's guess. But give it a try - you might discover a new
variety!


Grapes do not produce true from seed. That is why they are always
grown
from cuttings. They can be grown from seed but it is anyone's guess as
to
what will grow. Grape vines are not that expensive so if one finds a
variety that is desired, the best thing to do is buy a grafted cutting.


I live so far north, there's not a lot of grape varieties to choose
from. I've found a few wild grape seedlings coming up in the flower
beds and I wonder how much they would produce if I transplanted them to
a trellis and pruned them properly?

How many years would it take before I got that first pitiful little
harvest so I could tell if the fruit was any good? If they were awful,
shouldn't I be able to graft a good variety onto the wild roots and have
bearing vines in another 2 years?


It takes 2-3 years for started plants (bare root) to yield a small
crop. It takes another year or two for the plants to yield a full
crop. I would expect a seedling to take at least 3 years or maybe
even 4-5.

You need to get the vine growing to the extent there are horizontal
branches on a support. These form during a growing season. The
following winter or early spring, side growth on the horizontal
branches is pruned short but not removed. That growing season may
yield a small crop from shoots originated from the reduced side
growth. The pruning is repeated each winter, and the crop is
better each following growing season.

It's difficult to describe the pruning process for grapes. There
are actually two main pruing styles. Some grape varieties do
better with one, some with the other, and some equally well with
either pruning style. Try to find a book on pruning or grape
culture in your local library.


Even if the OP does not intend to make wine, the best book I have found on
pruning (and VERY reasonably priced) is "From Vines to Wine" by Jeff Cox.
You can get it through Amazon or might even be able to find a used copy.
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Old 08-09-2005, 11:48 PM
ncstockguy
 
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What about muscadines grown from seeds? Won't those reproduce true?
Most muscadines are not hybrids, at least in the Carolinas.

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Old 09-09-2005, 02:04 AM
Paul E. Lehmann
 
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Default

ncstockguy wrote:

What about muscadines grown from seeds? Won't those reproduce true?
Most muscadines are not hybrids, at least in the Carolinas.


Don't know, but, if you have cuttings available, why would you want to waste
time.


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Old 14-09-2005, 04:56 PM
ncstockguy
 
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Did I say I had cuttings available. Sure didn't.

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Old 14-09-2005, 06:08 PM
Paul E. Lehmann
 
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ncstockguy wrote:

Did I say I had cuttings available. Sure didn't.


Then go get some The time spent going to get some would be well worth your
effort.

Think of it this way. There must be a reason why people all over the world
for thousands of years have been growing grapes from cuttings and not
seeds. If you want to start a new trend then by all means go for it. You
will NOT, however, be able to predict in any way what your grape vine(s)
from seed will produce.

Even vines from mail order nurseries are relatively inexpensive.
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Old 15-09-2005, 05:13 PM
ncstockguy
 
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Well since my vines from seed are now doing quite well I will check
back in and provide an update about this time next year.



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