(Yeesh, not sure I'm attaching this pic right... anyway...)

This is a pic of the tree in my new front yard. I'm not sure if
they're visible, but there're some fairly good sized Rhodies on the
other side of this tree, in all the whole thing is about 10 feet
across or so. The front of the house has railroad tie retaining walls
that are beginning to buckle outward, so an upgrade of those too, will
need to be done at a later date. I've always fancied rock walls with
things planted in the cervices, anyway, I was thinking of having some
big rock delivered and building a circular retaining wall, and then a
small one inside and above it, as well. I was wondering if anyone had
any ideas about that, or any other ideas for retaining walls they
might like to share. My husband and I are DIY's, and this seems like
the perfect small project for us, for a couple weekends or so... what
do you think?

As for plants, once the Rhodies are removed to better areas, I was
thinking of Callas and Hellebores in the top ring closest to the
trunk, and then St John's Wort and Vinca in the lower level. I live in
Snohomish, zone 8. I appreciate any thoughts, tips, or wisdom! Thanks!
~Lilly
Those who dream by day are cognizant of many things
which escape those who dream only by night.
"Eleonora"

On Fri, 04 Apr 2003 13:43:09 -0800, Lilly wrote:

(Yeesh, not sure I'm attaching this pic right... anyway...)

This is a pic of the tree in my new front yard. I'm not sure if
they're visible, but there're some fairly good sized Rhodies on the
other side of this tree, in all the whole thing is about 10 feet
across or so. The front of the house has railroad tie retaining walls
that are beginning to buckle outward, so an upgrade of those too, will
need to be done at a later date. I've always fancied rock walls with
things planted in the cervices, anyway, I was thinking of having some
big rock delivered and building a circular retaining wall, and then a
small one inside and above it, as well. I was wondering if anyone had
any ideas about that, or any other ideas for retaining walls they
might like to share. My husband and I are DIY's, and this seems like
the perfect small project for us, for a couple weekends or so... what
do you think?

As for plants, once the Rhodies are removed to better areas, I was
thinking of Callas and Hellebores in the top ring closest to the
trunk, and then St John's Wort and Vinca in the lower level. I live in
Snohomish, zone 8. I appreciate any thoughts, tips, or wisdom! Thanks!
~Lilly


DOH! Obviously didn't do this right. Anyway, it's your basic conifer
in the middle of a big, neglected, steep mound of dirt, with three
way-to-big Rhodies planted around it. (Can't imagine the tree likes
them much anyway.)
Feeling Mighty Dumb,
~Lilly


Those who dream by day are cognizant of many things
which escape those who dream only by night.
"Eleonora"

You should subscribe to "alt.binaries.pictures.gardens" and post the picture
there.
If you are talking about piling soil up arount the trunk of the tree DON'T
DO IT. It will eventually kill the tree.

--
Travis in Shoreline (just North of Seattle) Washington
USDA Zone 8b
Sunset Zone 5

(Yeesh, not sure I'm attaching this pic right... anyway...)

Do NOT post pictures to a non-binaries newsgroup. Subscribe to
alt.binaries.pictures.gardens and put it there or put it up on a website.

This is a pic of the tree in my new front yard. I'm not sure if
they're visible, but there're some fairly good sized Rhodies on the
other side of this tree, in all the whole thing is about 10 feet
across or so. The front of the house has railroad tie retaining walls
that are beginning to buckle outward, so an upgrade of those too, will
need to be done at a later date. I've always fancied rock walls with
things planted in the cervices, anyway, I was thinking of having some
big rock delivered and building a circular retaining wall, and then a
small one inside and above it, as well. I was wondering if anyone had
any ideas about that, or any other ideas for retaining walls they
might like to share. My husband and I are DIY's, and this seems like
the perfect small project for us, for a couple weekends or so... what
do you think?

As for plants, once the Rhodies are removed to better areas, I was
thinking of Callas and Hellebores in the top ring closest to the
trunk, and then St John's Wort and Vinca in the lower level. I live in
Snohomish, zone 8. I appreciate any thoughts, tips, or wisdom! Thanks!

I'd be interested in seeing the picture to use as a backdrop for your
posting -- something's not quiet meshing in your description. On the one
hand you're talking about 10 feet across, then you're talking about
building rings...?

FWIW, I would not recommend building a retaining wall out of stone. I have
a few of them here -- not fun, not fun at all. From your description, it
sounds like you might find it better to terrace the area a bit instead. I
also noted in your other post that the tree is in the middle of a mound of
dirt -- you start building retaining walls you may damage the root system
either directly or indirectly. Remember that the mound is a fully function
ecosphere of its own -- including the rhodies.

As for moving the Rhodies, be sure to move them to the right habitat --
they're a bit particular and I'm sure they very much like where they are
(acidic soil, kept that way by the tree's droppings, likely a decent amount
of shade, protection from wind, etc.).

It's usually best to try to work WITH the existing scape than making radical
alterations.

Just some food for thought.

James

On Fri, 04 Apr 2003 22:19:11 GMT, "Travis"
wrote:

You should subscribe to "alt.binaries.pictures.gardens" and post the picture
there.

My mistake, again, sorry.

If you are talking about piling soil up arount the trunk of the tree DON'T
DO IT. It will eventually kill the tree.

There already is soil piled up around the trunk, or maybe a better way
to put it, is that the tree is planted on top of a mound of soil. I'd
like to make it look a bit nicer, take out the big rhodies and replace
them with smaller plants.
~Lilly

Those who dream by day are cognizant of many things
which escape those who dream only by night.
"Eleonora"

On Fri, 4 Apr 2003 17:49:37 -0500, "JNJ" wrote:


Do NOT post pictures to a non-binaries newsgroup. Subscribe to
alt.binaries.pictures.gardens and put it there or put it up on a website.

Sorry, my mistake.

This is a pic of the tree in my new front yard. I'm not sure if
they're visible, but there're some fairly good sized Rhodies on the
other side of this tree, in all the whole thing is about 10 feet
across or so. The front of the house has railroad tie retaining walls
that are beginning to buckle outward, so an upgrade of those too, will
need to be done at a later date. I've always fancied rock walls with
things planted in the cervices, anyway, I was thinking of having some
big rock delivered and building a circular retaining wall, and then a
small one inside and above it, as well. I was wondering if anyone had
any ideas about that, or any other ideas for retaining walls they
might like to share. My husband and I are DIY's, and this seems like
the perfect small project for us, for a couple weekends or so... what
do you think?

As for plants, once the Rhodies are removed to better areas, I was
thinking of Callas and Hellebores in the top ring closest to the
trunk, and then St John's Wort and Vinca in the lower level. I live in
Snohomish, zone 8. I appreciate any thoughts, tips, or wisdom! Thanks!

I'd be interested in seeing the picture to use as a backdrop for your
posting -- something's not quiet meshing in your description. On the one
hand you're talking about 10 feet across, then you're talking about
building rings...?

I'm not sure what you're not sure of.
It's a circular mound about 10 feet across, with a tree in the center.
Planted around the tree are rhodies that have been there for years,
and are way to big for under that tree.

FWIW, I would not recommend building a retaining wall out of stone. I have
a few of them here -- not fun, not fun at all. From your description, it
sounds like you might find it better to terrace the area a bit instead. I
also noted in your other post that the tree is in the middle of a mound of
dirt -- you start building retaining walls you may damage the root system
either directly or indirectly. Remember that the mound is a fully function
ecosphere of its own -- including the rhodies.

I realize it may be a lot of work, but then I consider that kind of
stuff fun. Go figure. I'm sure that the rhodies that are already there
are damaging the trees roots. My idea was to replace the rhodies with
very small shallow plants.

As for moving the Rhodies, be sure to move them to the right habitat --
they're a bit particular and I'm sure they very much like where they are
(acidic soil, kept that way by the tree's droppings, likely a decent amount
of shade, protection from wind, etc.).

Yup, got plenty of other acidic places to plant em in.

It's usually best to try to work WITH the existing scape than making radical
alterations.

I wasn't going to make radical alterations. I wanted to add some rocks
to keep the existing soil in, and the above things I've mentioned
already.

Just some food for thought.

Thanks for your input.
~Lilly



Those who dream by day are cognizant of many things
which escape those who dream only by night.
"Eleonora"

Lilly wrote:
I realize it may be a lot of work, but then I consider that kind of
stuff fun. Go figure. I'm sure that the rhodies that are already there
are damaging the trees roots. My idea was to replace the rhodies with
very small shallow plants.

Rhododendrons have very shallow roots. What kind of tree is it? How long
have these things been planted on this mound? FYI sometimes a mound is
called a berm.

--
Travis in Shoreline (just North of Seattle) Washington
USDA Zone 8b
Sunset Zone 5

Lilly wrote:

On Fri, 4 Apr 2003 17:49:37 -0500, "JNJ" wrote:


I'd be interested in seeing the picture to use as a backdrop for your
posting -- something's not quiet meshing in your description. On the one
hand you're talking about 10 feet across, then you're talking about
building rings...?

I'm not sure what you're not sure of.
It's a circular mound about 10 feet across, with a tree in the center.
Planted around the tree are rhodies that have been there for years,
and are way to big for under that tree.

FWIW, I would not recommend building a retaining wall out of stone. I have
a few of them here -- not fun, not fun at all. From your description, it
sounds like you might find it better to terrace the area a bit instead. I
also noted in your other post that the tree is in the middle of a mound of
dirt -- you start building retaining walls you may damage the root system
either directly or indirectly. Remember that the mound is a fully function
ecosphere of its own -- including the rhodies.

I realize it may be a lot of work, but then I consider that kind of
stuff fun. Go figure. I'm sure that the rhodies that are already there
are damaging the trees roots. My idea was to replace the rhodies with
very small shallow plants.

More likely the other way around - the tree roots are probably stressing out the
rhodies. Rhododendrons have extremely shallow root systems, but lots of surface
feeder roots, as does the tree. Root systems are proportional to the size of the
plant - the large tree will have a far larger and more widespread root system
than the rhodies and also much more aggressive in terms of removing moisture and
nutrients from the soil.

If the rhodies are already well established, I wouldn't move them. The disruption
to both them and the tree from root disturbance could be severe. From a design
point of view, tiering down from larger plants - the tree to rhodies to
hellebores to gorundcovers, etc - to smaller plants is more visually appealing.
Also, neither the callas or hellbores will be happy in this dry shade situation.

pam - gardengal

On Sat, 05 Apr 2003 00:56:54 GMT, "Travis"
wrote:

Lilly wrote:
I realize it may be a lot of work, but then I consider that kind of
stuff fun. Go figure. I'm sure that the rhodies that are already there
are damaging the trees roots. My idea was to replace the rhodies with
very small shallow plants.

Rhododendrons have very shallow roots. What kind of tree is it? How long
have these things been planted on this mound? FYI sometimes a mound is
called a berm.

(LOL! Thanks... my husband says I have a terminal case of "thingie" in
describing objects.) I believe it's a Hemlock, and the Rhodies are
about 10 years old, or so the owners tell me. I believe they've been
planted on the berm for about 9 years.
~Lilly

Those who dream by day are cognizant of many things
which escape those who dream only by night.
"Eleonora"

On Sat, 05 Apr 2003 01:25:27 GMT, Pam wrote:


I realize it may be a lot of work, but then I consider that kind of
stuff fun. Go figure. I'm sure that the rhodies that are already there
are damaging the trees roots. My idea was to replace the rhodies with
very small shallow plants.

More likely the other way around - the tree roots are probably stressing out the
rhodies. Rhododendrons have extremely shallow root systems, but lots of surface
feeder roots, as does the tree. Root systems are proportional to the size of the
plant - the large tree will have a far larger and more widespread root system
than the rhodies and also much more aggressive in terms of removing moisture and
nutrients from the soil.

I see, that makes sense. Actually, the Rhodies haven't looked very
well since we've been here. The owners have about 5 Rhodies in tiny
planters and other places that are just terribly overgrown and need
more room. I have some perfect spots for them to go to, and I was
thinking of replacing some of them with Gardenias.

If the rhodies are already well established, I wouldn't move them. The disruption
to both them and the tree from root disturbance could be severe. From a design
point of view, tiering down from larger plants - the tree to rhodies to
hellebores to gorundcovers, etc - to smaller plants is more visually appealing.
Also, neither the callas or hellbores will be happy in this dry shade situation.

Ok, good to know. It's actually really moist there, I was thinking
because of all the rain (Pacific Northwest) and we haven't spent a
summer here yet. Well Hell's Bells, they're not doing well, but it
would be a shame to loose such old specimens. Maybe I should just cut
the Rhodies back? Argh...

~Lilly


Those who dream by day are cognizant of many things
which escape those who dream only by night.
"Eleonora"

Lilly wrote:

On Sat, 05 Apr 2003 01:25:27 GMT, Pam wrote:

I realize it may be a lot of work, but then I consider that kind of
stuff fun. Go figure. I'm sure that the rhodies that are already there
are damaging the trees roots. My idea was to replace the rhodies with
very small shallow plants.

More likely the other way around - the tree roots are probably stressing out the
rhodies. Rhododendrons have extremely shallow root systems, but lots of surface
feeder roots, as does the tree. Root systems are proportional to the size of the
plant - the large tree will have a far larger and more widespread root system
than the rhodies and also much more aggressive in terms of removing moisture and
nutrients from the soil.

I see, that makes sense. Actually, the Rhodies haven't looked very
well since we've been here. The owners have about 5 Rhodies in tiny
planters and other places that are just terribly overgrown and need
more room. I have some perfect spots for them to go to, and I was
thinking of replacing some of them with Gardenias.

If the rhodies are already well established, I wouldn't move them. The disruption
to both them and the tree from root disturbance could be severe. From a design
point of view, tiering down from larger plants - the tree to rhodies to
hellebores to gorundcovers, etc - to smaller plants is more visually appealing.
Also, neither the callas or hellbores will be happy in this dry shade situation.

Ok, good to know. It's actually really moist there, I was thinking
because of all the rain (Pacific Northwest) and we haven't spent a
summer here yet. Well Hell's Bells, they're not doing well, but it
would be a shame to loose such old specimens. Maybe I should just cut
the Rhodies back? Argh...

The rhodies are likely not doing well because they are being deprived of moisture and
nutrients by the more aggressive root system of the tree. It is only moist now because
of the season - summer in the PNW is extremely dry and any situation within the
dripline/root system of a large conifer is considered dry shade. Fertilize the rhodies
and water them well frequently during the summer months.

pam - gardengal

I haven't seen the photo, so I can't comment on the appropriateness of a
retaining wall around your tree, but *usually* it's not a good idea to
drastically alter the depth of roots by piling more soil on. Dry laid
retaining walls, if they are to hold any substantive amount of soil behind
them, need foundations, which also means potential messing with roots of the
tree. I'm emailing you a diagram of how to lay the stone properly. Good
luck,

Dave
Lilly wrote in message ...
(Yeesh, not sure I'm attaching this pic right... anyway...)

This is a pic of the tree in my new front yard. I'm not sure if
they're visible, but there're some fairly good sized Rhodies on the
other side of this tree, in all the whole thing is about 10 feet
across or so. The front of the house has railroad tie retaining walls
that are beginning to buckle outward, so an upgrade of those too, will
need to be done at a later date. I've always fancied rock walls with
things planted in the cervices, anyway, I was thinking of having some
big rock delivered and building a circular retaining wall, and then a
small one inside and above it, as well. I was wondering if anyone had
any ideas about that, or any other ideas for retaining walls they
might like to share. My husband and I are DIY's, and this seems like
the perfect small project for us, for a couple weekends or so... what
do you think?

As for plants, once the Rhodies are removed to better areas, I was
thinking of Callas and Hellebores in the top ring closest to the
trunk, and then St John's Wort and Vinca in the lower level. I live in
Snohomish, zone 8. I appreciate any thoughts, tips, or wisdom! Thanks!
~Lilly
Those who dream by day are cognizant of many things
which escape those who dream only by night.
"Eleonora"

err.. no I'm not, there is no email address associated with your post...

Lilly wrote in message ...
(Yeesh, not sure I'm attaching this pic right... anyway...)

This is a pic of the tree in my new front yard. I'm not sure if
they're visible, but there're some fairly good sized Rhodies on the
other side of this tree, in all the whole thing is about 10 feet
across or so. The front of the house has railroad tie retaining walls
that are beginning to buckle outward, so an upgrade of those too, will
need to be done at a later date. I've always fancied rock walls with
things planted in the cervices, anyway, I was thinking of having some
big rock delivered and building a circular retaining wall, and then a
small one inside and above it, as well. I was wondering if anyone had
any ideas about that, or any other ideas for retaining walls they
might like to share. My husband and I are DIY's, and this seems like
the perfect small project for us, for a couple weekends or so... what
do you think?

As for plants, once the Rhodies are removed to better areas, I was
thinking of Callas and Hellebores in the top ring closest to the
trunk, and then St John's Wort and Vinca in the lower level. I live in
Snohomish, zone 8. I appreciate any thoughts, tips, or wisdom! Thanks!
~Lilly
Those who dream by day are cognizant of many things
which escape those who dream only by night.
"Eleonora"

On Sat, 5 Apr 2003 16:30:06 -0500, "David J. Bockman"
wrote:

I haven't seen the photo, so I can't comment on the appropriateness of a
retaining wall around your tree, but *usually* it's not a good idea to
drastically alter the depth of roots by piling more soil on. Dry laid
retaining walls, if they are to hold any substantive amount of soil behind
them, need foundations, which also means potential messing with roots of the
tree. I'm emailing you a diagram of how to lay the stone properly. Good
luck,

I wasn't going to add much more dirt, but thanks for the email! Even
though I might not do this one currently, I have several other
projects that will involve retaining walls. Thanks again!
~Lilly



The most beautiful women in the world have a cat-like quality.
They slink, they purr; claws sheathed in silken fur. In the
privacy of their summer gardens, in the green depths of
forests, I believe they shed themselves of their attire, even to
their human flesh, and stretch their bodies to the sun and
their secret deity.
Storm Constantine, 'My Lady of the Hearth'

On Sat, 05 Apr 2003 03:10:37 GMT, Pam wrote:



The rhodies are likely not doing well because they are being deprived of moisture and
nutrients by the more aggressive root system of the tree. It is only moist now because
of the season - summer in the PNW is extremely dry and any situation within the
dripline/root system of a large conifer is considered dry shade. Fertilize the rhodies
and water them well frequently during the summer months.

Ok, thanks Pam!
~Lilly


The most beautiful women in the world have a cat-like quality.
They slink, they purr; claws sheathed in silken fur. In the
privacy of their summer gardens, in the green depths of
forests, I believe they shed themselves of their attire, even to
their human flesh, and stretch their bodies to the sun and
their secret deity.
Storm Constantine, 'My Lady of the Hearth'