Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

My wife sowed some apple seeds from a grocery store apple, which germinated
just fine. Would these things do ok in the Mid-Atlantic region? This was
more of an experiment for our young kids, but I am wondering if these things
are viable here.

Thanks.

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

On Sun, 3 Jun 2007 14:46:29 -0400, "Buck Turgidson"
wrote:

My wife sowed some apple seeds from a grocery store apple, which germinated
just fine. Would these things do ok in the Mid-Atlantic region? This was
more of an experiment for our young kids, but I am wondering if these things
are viable here.

Thanks.



Only way to know is to try them. They might be worthless, they might
be the next great thing. If you have the time, space, patience, then
why not let them grow?

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

as an aside, when I read mid-Atlantic my first thought was "Out in the
middle of the ocean?" Probably not what you had in mind.

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

middle of the ocean?" Probably not what you had in mind.


LOL. No dry land. Thanks.

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

Buck Turgidson wrote:
My wife sowed some apple seeds from a grocery store apple, which germinated
just fine. Would these things do ok in the Mid-Atlantic region? This was
more of an experiment for our young kids, but I am wondering if these things
are viable here.

Apples are grown everywhere, and they do well in the Mid-Atlantic region.

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

On Jun 3, 2:46 pm, "Buck Turgidson" wrote:
My wife sowed some apple seeds from a grocery store apple, which germinated
just fine. Would these things do ok in the Mid-Atlantic region? This was
more of an experiment for our young kids, but I am wondering if these things
are viable here.

Thanks.

The tree will grow but fruit depends a lot on the site. The mountains
of WV and VA are good apple producing regions. Other areas might not
be so good because of high humidity and lack of air drainage.

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

On Sun, 3 Jun 2007 14:46:29 -0400, "Buck Turgidson"
wrote:

My wife sowed some apple seeds from a grocery store apple, which germinated
just fine. Would these things do ok in the Mid-Atlantic region? This was
more of an experiment for our young kids, but I am wondering if these things
are viable here.

Maybe, but it is most likely that you will not be happy with the
result. Apples are grown on rootstock so that the rootstock
determines the growth habit of the tree and the variety is determined
by what is grafted to the root stock.

When you plant the seeds you get the variety of apple on that trees
rootstock which may not be suitable at all.

If you really want to grow apples I suggest that you decide which
variety you want and buy a tree from an nursery or supplier.

Be prepared for some serious pruning and pest control to get quality
apples.

My experience is that nearly everyone wants to grow their own apples
until they find out how much time and money must be invested to get
quality fruit. Then buying from a local orchard seems much more
acceptable to them.

Good luck,

John

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

On Sun, 03 Jun 2007 18:54:13 -0400, John Bachman
wrote:

On Sun, 3 Jun 2007 14:46:29 -0400, "Buck Turgidson"
wrote:

My wife sowed some apple seeds from a grocery store apple, which germinated
just fine. Would these things do ok in the Mid-Atlantic region? This was
more of an experiment for our young kids, but I am wondering if these things
are viable here.

Maybe, but it is most likely that you will not be happy with the
result. Apples are grown on rootstock so that the rootstock
determines the growth habit of the tree and the variety is determined
by what is grafted to the root stock.

When you plant the seeds you get the variety of apple on that trees
rootstock which may not be suitable at all.

If you really want to grow apples I suggest that you decide which
variety you want and buy a tree from an nursery or supplier.

Be prepared for some serious pruning and pest control to get quality
apples.

My experience is that nearly everyone wants to grow their own apples
until they find out how much time and money must be invested to get
quality fruit. Then buying from a local orchard seems much more
acceptable to them.

Good luck,

John


Clearly I don't know enough botany to understand this, but how does
the root stock genetics affect the new seed? I can see the pollen and
egg genes getting mixed in the new seeds, of if apples reproduce by
apomixis, then the top stock could show up in the new seeds, but I
can't figure out how the root stock would.

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

Waste of time and effort. The odds are that the resulting apples will be awful.

It's a genetic thing.

Sherwin D.

Buck Turgidson wrote:

My wife sowed some apple seeds from a grocery store apple, which germinated
just fine. Would these things do ok in the Mid-Atlantic region? This was
more of an experiment for our young kids, but I am wondering if these things
are viable here.

Thanks.

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

There is no 'might' about it. About the same odds as winning the jackpot lotto.
Why encourage these people to waste their time? If they had a one in ten chance
of
a decent apple, I might say try it, but the odds against it are more like 1 in
the tens
of thousands, or worse. People are going to reply that they had good luck with
certain stone fruits, etc., but these are different species of fruit with
different genetic
characteristics. Apples do not reproduce anything genetically close, directly
from
their seed. There are no shortcuts in growing apple trees. End of story.

Sherwin D.

Charles wrote:

On Sun, 3 Jun 2007 14:46:29 -0400, "Buck Turgidson"
wrote:

My wife sowed some apple seeds from a grocery store apple, which germinated
just fine. Would these things do ok in the Mid-Atlantic region? This was
more of an experiment for our young kids, but I am wondering if these things
are viable here.

Thanks.


Only way to know is to try them. They might be worthless, they might
be the next great thing. If you have the time, space, patience, then
why not let them grow?

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

On Sun, 03 Jun 2007 22:56:58 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:

There is no 'might' about it. About the same odds as winning the jackpot lotto.
Why encourage these people to waste their time? If they had a one in ten chance
of
a decent apple, I might say try it, but the odds against it are more like 1 in
the tens
of thousands, or worse. People are going to reply that they had good luck with
certain stone fruits, etc., but these are different species of fruit with
different genetic
characteristics. Apples do not reproduce anything genetically close, directly
from
their seed. There are no shortcuts in growing apple trees. End of story.

Sherwin D.



The apple tree I have in my yard is "Golden Dorset" or "Dorset
Golden", a chance seedling from Bermuda.

Unfortunately the people there didn't know as much as you, or they
would have eliminated it at the first opportunity.

Things with a one in a million probability happen every day in this
world, sometimes people even win the lottery.

I like my story better than yours. While I have lived with the idea of
never trying anything that I don't know the outcome, I don't recommend
it to others.

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

Charles wrote:

On Sun, 03 Jun 2007 18:54:13 -0400, John Bachman
wrote:

On Sun, 3 Jun 2007 14:46:29 -0400, "Buck Turgidson"
wrote:

My wife sowed some apple seeds from a grocery store apple, which germinated
just fine. Would these things do ok in the Mid-Atlantic region? This was
more of an experiment for our young kids, but I am wondering if these things
are viable here.

Maybe, but it is most likely that you will not be happy with the
result. Apples are grown on rootstock so that the rootstock
determines the growth habit of the tree and the variety is determined
by what is grafted to the root stock.

When you plant the seeds you get the variety of apple on that trees
rootstock which may not be suitable at all.

If you really want to grow apples I suggest that you decide which
variety you want and buy a tree from an nursery or supplier.

Be prepared for some serious pruning and pest control to get quality
apples.

My experience is that nearly everyone wants to grow their own apples
until they find out how much time and money must be invested to get
quality fruit. Then buying from a local orchard seems much more
acceptable to them.

Good luck,

John

Clearly I don't know enough botany to understand this, but how does
the root stock genetics affect the new seed? I can see the pollen and
egg genes getting mixed in the new seeds, of if apples reproduce by
apomixis, then the top stock could show up in the new seeds, but I
can't figure out how the root stock would.

Charles,

There is no genetic connection between an apple rootstock and the variety
of scion (branch from the apple tree you want to propagate). The rootstock
simply acts as a base to feed the scion the nutrients it needs to grow. Apples

do not reproduce by apomixis. They require pollination either from themselves
(self-fertile), or another tree. The reason apples cannot be successfully
grown
from seed is due to regression of the genetics. Almost all apple seeds carry
the
genetic information of some 'average' of it's parents with those of the
populations
these parents came from. Because apples usually require another apple tree to
pollinate them, these recessive genes are not weeded out from generation to
generation. Grafting on the other hand, is an exact genetic copy of the
original
apple. Peaches are usually self-pollinated, so these undesirable recessive
genes
have been weeded out. That's why you would have much better luck growing
a peach tree from it's seed.

Hope I haven't confused you with the genetics.

Sherwin D.

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

On Mon, 04 Jun 2007 00:55:59 -0500, sherwindu
wrote:



Charles wrote:

On Sun, 03 Jun 2007 18:54:13 -0400, John Bachman
wrote:

On Sun, 3 Jun 2007 14:46:29 -0400, "Buck Turgidson"
wrote:

My wife sowed some apple seeds from a grocery store apple, which germinated
just fine. Would these things do ok in the Mid-Atlantic region? This was
more of an experiment for our young kids, but I am wondering if these things
are viable here.

Maybe, but it is most likely that you will not be happy with the
result. Apples are grown on rootstock so that the rootstock
determines the growth habit of the tree and the variety is determined
by what is grafted to the root stock.

When you plant the seeds you get the variety of apple on that trees
rootstock which may not be suitable at all.

If you really want to grow apples I suggest that you decide which
variety you want and buy a tree from an nursery or supplier.

Be prepared for some serious pruning and pest control to get quality
apples.

My experience is that nearly everyone wants to grow their own apples
until they find out how much time and money must be invested to get
quality fruit. Then buying from a local orchard seems much more
acceptable to them.

Good luck,

John

Clearly I don't know enough botany to understand this, but how does
the root stock genetics affect the new seed? I can see the pollen and
egg genes getting mixed in the new seeds, of if apples reproduce by
apomixis, then the top stock could show up in the new seeds, but I
can't figure out how the root stock would.

Charles,

There is no genetic connection between an apple rootstock and the variety
of scion (branch from the apple tree you want to propagate). The rootstock
simply acts as a base to feed the scion the nutrients it needs to grow. Apples

do not reproduce by apomixis. They require pollination either from themselves
(self-fertile), or another tree. The reason apples cannot be successfully
grown
from seed is due to regression of the genetics. Almost all apple seeds carry
the
genetic information of some 'average' of it's parents with those of the
populations
these parents came from. Because apples usually require another apple tree to
pollinate them, these recessive genes are not weeded out from generation to
generation. Grafting on the other hand, is an exact genetic copy of the
original
apple. Peaches are usually self-pollinated, so these undesirable recessive
genes
have been weeded out. That's why you would have much better luck growing
a peach tree from it's seed.

Hope I haven't confused you with the genetics.

Sherwin D.



Thanks. You have confirmed what I thought was the case. What John
posted didn't make sense to me.

I still disagree with you in that I think it might be interesting to
grow trees from random seeds as long as not too much is invested in
the outcome.

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

On Mon, 04 Jun 2007 06:02:58 GMT, Charles
wrote:

snip
Thanks. You have confirmed what I thought was the case. What John
posted didn't make sense to me.

Oh man.......what a great setup!

I'm off to bed.

Care,
Charlie

--
Unemployment is capitalism's way of getting you to plant a garden.
~Orson Scott Card

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

John Bachman expounded:

Maybe, but it is most likely that you will not be happy with the
result.

Perhaps not.

Apples are grown on rootstock so that the rootstock
determines the growth habit of the tree and the variety is determined
by what is grafted to the root stock.

Somewhat true. The rootstock determines the size of the tree
heightwise.

When you plant the seeds you get the variety of apple on that trees
rootstock which may not be suitable at all.

This is so far wrong it's incredible.

Growing apples from seeds out of an apple you've eaten is definitely
just a fun experiment. You'll probably not get as good of an apple as
what you've eaten. Do it for fun, don't do it because you want to
start an orchard.

And definitely don't get your genetics lessons from John!
--
Ann, gardening in Zone 6a
South of Boston, Massachusetts
e-mail address is not checked
******************************

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

I agree that you wont get as good of an apple from a tree from a seed, but
they can still be canned, used as applesauce, and cooked in pies or
cobblers.

I have two in my yard started from seeds, a Fuji and a New Zealand rose. We
did it as an experiment, and both are not 7 to 8 feet tall. They wont
produce for another year or two. We also have a golden delicious and a Fuji
ordered from a catalog.

Your kids will love them, and I am glad Johnny Appleseed didn't have the
attitude that some of us have about starting trees from seeds. You cant do
worse than he did.

Dwayne


"Buck Turgidson" wrote in message
...
My wife sowed some apple seeds from a grocery store apple, which
germinated just fine. Would these things do ok in the Mid-Atlantic
region? This was more of an experiment for our young kids, but I am
wondering if these things are viable here.

Thanks.

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

"Dwayne" wrote in
:

Your kids will love them, and I am glad Johnny Appleseed didn't have
the attitude that some of us have about starting trees from seeds.
You cant do worse than he did.

You know he planted apple trees to make applejack, right?

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

Ann wrote:

John Bachman expounded:

Maybe, but it is most likely that you will not be happy with the
result.

Perhaps not.

Apples are grown on rootstock so that the rootstock
determines the growth habit of the tree and the variety is determined
by what is grafted to the root stock.

Somewhat true. The rootstock determines the size of the tree
heightwise.

When you plant the seeds you get the variety of apple on that trees
rootstock which may not be suitable at all.

This is so far wrong it's incredible.

Are you saying that there is a better chance the resultant apples will taste
good?
What's really incredible is that you believe that.



Growing apples from seeds out of an apple you've eaten is definitely
just a fun experiment. You'll probably not get as good of an apple as
what you've eaten.

We are talking big big odds that you won't get a good tasting apple.

Do it for fun, don't do it because you want to
start an orchard.

Why bother. There is no question that the seed would possibly produce
a tree. You do experiments when you don't know the outcome. If you
want to experiment, try grafting fruit onto a rootstock. At least you have

something useful when the experiment is over. Why not plant a peach seed
where you have a much better chance of success.

Sherwin D.



And definitely don't get your genetics lessons from John!
--
Ann, gardening in Zone 6a
South of Boston, Massachusetts
e-mail address is not checked
******************************

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

Dwayne wrote:

I agree that you wont get as good of an apple from a tree from a seed, but
they can still be canned, used as applesauce, and cooked in pies or
cobblers.

I have two in my yard started from seeds, a Fuji and a New Zealand rose. We
did it as an experiment, and both are not 7 to 8 feet tall. They wont
produce for another year or two.

These will be standard size apple trees, so don't expect fruit for several
more years.
Have lot's of sugar on hand for these spitters.

We also have a golden delicious and a Fuji
ordered from a catalog.

Your kids will love them, and I am glad Johnny Appleseed didn't have the
attitude that some of us have about starting trees from seeds. You cant do
worse than he did.

Sure can. Waste your time and efforts. Imagine kids growing up and tasting
these awful fruits and telling their parents "what were you thinking about
when you
planted this?".



Dwayne

"Buck Turgidson" wrote in message
...
My wife sowed some apple seeds from a grocery store apple, which
germinated just fine. Would these things do ok in the Mid-Atlantic
region? This was more of an experiment for our young kids, but I am
wondering if these things are viable here.

Thanks.

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

sherwindu expounded:

Are you saying that there is a better chance the resultant apples will taste
good?

No, I did not say that. Your rabid resistance to anyone having a bit
of fun growing an apple from seed makes you see it that way, however.

What's really incredible is that you believe that.

No, I don't and once again I never said that I notice you didn't
bother correcting John's ridiculous statement about the seeds being
the result of the rootstock and not the flowering part of the tree.
You go absolutely blind with fury every time anyone brings up trying
to grow an apple from seed. Calm down!

Now why don't you get down off your high horse and stop trying to
convince everyone how stupid they are for trying something for fun?
--
Ann, gardening in Zone 6a
South of Boston, Massachusetts
e-mail address is not checked
******************************

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

Ann wrote:

sherwindu expounded:

Are you saying that there is a better chance the resultant apples will taste
good?

No, I did not say that. Your rabid resistance to anyone having a bit
of fun growing an apple from seed makes you see it that way, however.

First of all, I suggest you stop trying to demonize me. I am not the
grinch who stole Christmas. I'm simply trying to dispell the belief that
someone can expect to get a reasonable tasting apple by planting a
tree from a seed. If people think it's fun to plant apple seeds to see if
they
will make an apple tree and wind up with a spitter, be my guest.



What's really incredible is that you believe that.

No, I don't and once again I never said that I notice you didn't
bother correcting John's ridiculous statement about the seeds being
the result of the rootstock and not the flowering part of the tree.
You go absolutely blind with fury every time anyone brings up trying
to grow an apple from seed. Calm down!

I suggest you check your language vs. mine. You are the one who
needs to calm down.



Now why don't you get down off your high horse and stop trying to
convince everyone how stupid they are for trying something for fun?

I guess some people don't like having the facts presented to them.

I would not give a chemistry set to a child if I thought they could
blow themselves up with it. There are many other gardening things
kids can do, which are much more rewarding.

Sherwin D.


--
Ann, gardening in Zone 6a
South of Boston, Massachusetts
e-mail address is not checked
******************************

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

sherwindu expounded:

I suggest you check your language vs. mine. You are the one who
needs to calm down.

Shall I go back and find all of your posts where you rail on about the
subject? Every time it comes up you belittle the inquirer, and it
gets old.

I guess some people don't like having the facts presented to them.

Not the way you present them.

I would not give a chemistry set to a child if I thought they could
blow themselves up with it. There are many other gardening things
kids can do, which are much more rewarding.

Growing an apple from seed is hardly deadly.....see? You're at it
again!
--
Ann, gardening in Zone 6a
South of Boston, Massachusetts
e-mail address is not checked
******************************

Apple Tree From Seed in Mid-Atlantic
 

Sure can. Waste your time and efforts. Imagine kids growing up and tasting
these awful fruits and telling their parents "what were you thinking about
when you
planted this?".


And some how life will still go on....

I inheritted an old apple tree 15-20 ft grown from seed from the previous owner and cut it down (due to small UK garden and space shortage) and left the old stump in intending to pour stump killer down holes I had drilled. My young daughter (18) was upset over me cutting it down as it was her favourite and some time later new growth started at the base and I left it. It has now re-grown to a tree about 8-10 ft and the old stump has almost completely rotted away. Will it ever recover fully and re-produce apples. I have not cut it down again out of a respect for its determination to survive but if it is completely useless and will never flower/produce fruit it will have to go. (Daughter is now 30). Any advice.