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Old 04-08-2007, 09:52 PM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Chrerry Tree Infested w/ Ants or Termites?

Hi, I've got a large cherry tree that's infested with either termites or
carpenter ants.
I noticed at the bottom of tree what appeared to be sawdust, cleaned it up
and the next day it was back.
Today I sprayed Bonide Termite and Carpenter Ant Killer into the two holes
they were using and the critters poured out of the tree. They appear to
have two parts to the body (part near the head is smaller than the part at
the rear and fairly large head wiith good sized pinchers. The Bonide spray
seems to work but I suspect they'll just burrow into the tree at a another
location how do I permantely get rid of them?

Thanks,

Mike



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Old 04-08-2007, 11:09 PM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Chrerry Tree Infested w/ Ants or Termites?


"Mike" wrote in message news:[email protected]..
Hi, I've got a large cherry tree that's infested with either termites or
carpenter ants.
I noticed at the bottom of tree what appeared to be sawdust, cleaned it up
and the next day it was back


Sounds like carpenter ants. The dust is from their galleries. They control
the environment inside the tree by limiting moisture. Too wet or too dry
stalls the decay pathogen. In this sense ants are a benefit for the tree.
They stay within boundaries set by the tree after wounding.



..
Today I sprayed Bonide Termite and Carpenter Ant Killer into the two holes
they were using and the critters poured out of the tree. They appear to
have two parts to the body (part near the head is smaller than the part at
the rear and fairly large head wiith good sized pinchers. The Bonide
spray seems to work but I suspect they'll just burrow into the tree at a
another location how do I permantely get rid of them?


Ants are good guys. Leave them alone. Even if you have them in your house,
the reason would be rotten wood in your house. They stall the rot process
in building materials as well.

termites also respect boundaries set by the tree. If you are in the south
many times the problem which caused the termites to be present was flush cut
pruning.

Your description does not sound like ants.

As far as your use of pesticides, user beware.

http://home.ccil.org/~treeman/spring.html the web site is down right now.
try later or go here

http://www.beyondpesticides.org/

You really need to let a professional diagnose your issue rather than
applying toxins and then asking questions.

Anyway, the cause of the issue with the presence or organisms is wounds to
the tree. Even termites follow wounds and stay in chemically altered wood
from the wound.


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Old 04-08-2007, 11:10 PM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Chrerry Tree Infested w/ Ants or Termites?

I forgot to sign what I wrote:

Sincerely,
John A. Keslick, Jr.
Arborist
http://home.ccil.org/~treeman
and www.treedictionary.com
Beware of so-called tree experts who do not understand tree biology.
Storms, fires, floods, earthquakes, and volcanic eruptions keep reminding us
that we are not the boss.

"symplastless" wrote in message
. ..

"Mike" wrote in message news:[email protected]..
Hi, I've got a large cherry tree that's infested with either termites or
carpenter ants.
I noticed at the bottom of tree what appeared to be sawdust, cleaned it
up and the next day it was back


Sounds like carpenter ants. The dust is from their galleries. They
control the environment inside the tree by limiting moisture. Too wet or
too dry stalls the decay pathogen. In this sense ants are a benefit for
the tree. They stay within boundaries set by the tree after wounding.



.
Today I sprayed Bonide Termite and Carpenter Ant Killer into the two
holes they were using and the critters poured out of the tree. They
appear to have two parts to the body (part near the head is smaller than
the part at the rear and fairly large head wiith good sized pinchers.
The Bonide spray seems to work but I suspect they'll just burrow into the
tree at a another location how do I permantely get rid of them?


Ants are good guys. Leave them alone. Even if you have them in your
house, the reason would be rotten wood in your house. They stall the rot
process in building materials as well.

termites also respect boundaries set by the tree. If you are in the south
many times the problem which caused the termites to be present was flush
cut pruning.

Your description does not sound like ants.

As far as your use of pesticides, user beware.

http://home.ccil.org/~treeman/spring.html the web site is down right
now. try later or go here

http://www.beyondpesticides.org/

You really need to let a professional diagnose your issue rather than
applying toxins and then asking questions.

Anyway, the cause of the issue with the presence or organisms is wounds to
the tree. Even termites follow wounds and stay in chemically altered wood
from the wound.



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Old 04-08-2007, 11:23 PM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Chrerry Tree Infested w/ Ants or Termites?

What I was trying to say is that you

1. Diagnose
2. Treat
3. Access

The problem you made was you treated, now you are trying to diagnose.

Sincerely,
John A. Keslick, Jr.
Consulting Arborist
http://home.ccil.org/~treeman
and www.treedictionary.com
Beware of so-called tree experts who do not understand tree biology.
Storms, fires, floods, earthquakes, and volcanic eruptions keep reminding us
that we are not the boss.


"symplastless" wrote in message
. ..
I forgot to sign what I wrote:

Sincerely,
John A. Keslick, Jr.
Arborist
http://home.ccil.org/~treeman
and www.treedictionary.com
Beware of so-called tree experts who do not understand tree biology.
Storms, fires, floods, earthquakes, and volcanic eruptions keep reminding
us that we are not the boss.

"symplastless" wrote in message
. ..

"Mike" wrote in message
news:[email protected]..
Hi, I've got a large cherry tree that's infested with either termites or
carpenter ants.
I noticed at the bottom of tree what appeared to be sawdust, cleaned it
up and the next day it was back


Sounds like carpenter ants. The dust is from their galleries. They
control the environment inside the tree by limiting moisture. Too wet or
too dry stalls the decay pathogen. In this sense ants are a benefit for
the tree. They stay within boundaries set by the tree after wounding.



.
Today I sprayed Bonide Termite and Carpenter Ant Killer into the two
holes they were using and the critters poured out of the tree. They
appear to have two parts to the body (part near the head is smaller than
the part at the rear and fairly large head wiith good sized pinchers.
The Bonide spray seems to work but I suspect they'll just burrow into
the tree at a another location how do I permantely get rid of them?


Ants are good guys. Leave them alone. Even if you have them in your
house, the reason would be rotten wood in your house. They stall the rot
process in building materials as well.

termites also respect boundaries set by the tree. If you are in the
south many times the problem which caused the termites to be present was
flush cut pruning.

Your description does not sound like ants.

As far as your use of pesticides, user beware.

http://home.ccil.org/~treeman/spring.html the web site is down right
now. try later or go here

http://www.beyondpesticides.org/

You really need to let a professional diagnose your issue rather than
applying toxins and then asking questions.

Anyway, the cause of the issue with the presence or organisms is wounds
to the tree. Even termites follow wounds and stay in chemically altered
wood from the wound.





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Old 04-08-2007, 11:27 PM posted to rec.gardens
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Posts: 1,318
Default Chrerry Tree Infested w/ Ants or Termites?

More important than the presence of organisms are the following. If you
have addressed these issues you should be in good shape.

Many tree problems are associated with the following: They are Case
Sensitive.

Troubles in the Rhizosphere
http://www.treedictionary.com/DICT2003/shigo/RHIZO.html

Unhealthy Trees from the Nursery / Improper Planting
http://home.ccil.org/~treeman/sub1.html
and
Look up "Tree Planting" http://www.treedictionary.com

Improper Mulching - http://home.ccil.org/~treeman/sub3.html
and
http://www.treedictionary.com/DICT2003/M/ Look up "Mulch"

Improper Pruning
http://www.treedictionary.com/DICT2003/tree_pruning

Improper Fertilization (See A Touch of Chemistry)
http://www.treedictionary.com/DICT2003/shigo/CHEM.html

Tree Farming and Related Problems
http://www.treedictionary.com/DICT2003/SOUND/

Sincerely,
John A. Keslick, Jr.
Arborist
http://home.ccil.org/~treeman
and www.treedictionary.com
Beware of so-called tree experts who do not understand tree biology.
Storms, fires, floods, earthquakes, and volcanic eruptions keep reminding us
that we are not the boss.




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Old 05-08-2007, 07:13 PM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Chrerry Tree Infested w/ Ants or Termites?

symplastless wrote:


Ants are good guys. Leave them alone. Even if you have them in your house,
the reason would be rotten wood in your house. They stall the rot process
in building materials as well.


I 100% agree in leaving ants alone if at all possible. I am skeptical
about your statement implying that they only come into your house if
there is rotting wood. I'm also skeptical that they halt the rotting
process. How does the formic acid ants exude do that? I'd think it
further breaks down the lignite in the wood - that is ants destroy wood
rather than make it last longer.

Near me there is an ancient Indian city named by the whites Chaco
Canyon. Abandoned by Indians due to changed climate (dried out) you can
go there and find large pieces of wood which were trees over 700 years
ago. The ranger there told me that the wood still exists because there
are no ants (no water) to digest the wood. Was that information wrong?

-paul
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Old 05-08-2007, 07:31 PM posted to rec.gardens
Lar Lar is offline
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Posts: 105
Default Chrerry Tree Infested w/ Ants or Termites?

Mike wrote:
Hi, I've got a large cherry tree that's infested with either termites or
carpenter ants.
I noticed at the bottom of tree what appeared to be sawdust, cleaned it up
and the next day it was back.
Today I sprayed Bonide Termite and Carpenter Ant Killer into the two holes
they were using and the critters poured out of the tree. They appear to
have two parts to the body (part near the head is smaller than the part at
the rear and fairly large head wiith good sized pinchers. The Bonide spray
seems to work but I suspect they'll just burrow into the tree at a another
location how do I permantely get rid of them?

Thanks,

Mike


could be a number of type of ants, but all of them are beneficial to the
tree...they are not killing your tree but excavating in already
diseased/rotted wood. They are just a symptom of another issue.


Lar
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Old 05-08-2007, 07:35 PM posted to rec.gardens
Lar Lar is offline
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Posts: 105
Default Chrerry Tree Infested w/ Ants or Termites?

symplastless wrote:



Ants are good guys. Leave them alone. Even if you have them in your house,
the reason would be rotten wood in your house. They stall the rot process
in building materials as well.



Thinking you are meaning carpenter ants here but even then 85%-90% of
all carpenter ant work I do in homes has nothing to do with wood at all
much less wet/rotting wood and the c-ant nest that I find around wood is
more so for the hollow void rather than it being wet. (hollow core doors
& crown molding are usually the culprits)

Lar
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Old 05-08-2007, 08:41 PM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Chrerry Tree Infested w/ Ants or Termites?

Ants stall decay by limiting moisture.


--
Sincerely,
John A. Keslick, Jr.
Consulting Arborist
http://home.ccil.org/~treeman
and www.treedictionary.com
Beware of so-called tree experts who do not understand tree biology.
Storms, fires, floods, earthquakes, and volcanic eruptions keep reminding us
that we are not the boss.

"Paul Cassel" wrote in message
...
symplastless wrote:


Ants are good guys. Leave them alone. Even if you have them in your
house, the reason would be rotten wood in your house. They stall the rot
process in building materials as well.


I 100% agree in leaving ants alone if at all possible. I am skeptical
about your statement implying that they only come into your house if there
is rotting wood. I'm also skeptical that they halt the rotting process.
How does the formic acid ants exude do that? I'd think it further breaks
down the lignite in the wood - that is ants destroy wood rather than make
it last longer.

Near me there is an ancient Indian city named by the whites Chaco Canyon.
Abandoned by Indians due to changed climate (dried out) you can go there
and find large pieces of wood which were trees over 700 years ago. The
ranger there told me that the wood still exists because there are no ants
(no water) to digest the wood. Was that information wrong?

-paul



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Old 06-08-2007, 02:01 AM posted to rec.gardens
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Posts: 6
Default Chrerry Tree Infested w/ Ants or Termites?


"Lar" wrote in message
...
Mike wrote:
Hi, I've got a large cherry tree that's infested with either termites or
carpenter ants.
I noticed at the bottom of tree what appeared to be sawdust, cleaned it
up and the next day it was back.
Today I sprayed Bonide Termite and Carpenter Ant Killer into the two
holes they were using and the critters poured out of the tree. They
appear to have two parts to the body (part near the head is smaller than
the part at the rear and fairly large head wiith good sized pinchers.
The Bonide spray seems to work but I suspect they'll just burrow into the
tree at a another location how do I permantely get rid of them?

Thanks,

Mike

could be a number of type of ants, but all of them are beneficial to the
tree...they are not killing your tree but excavating in already
diseased/rotted wood. They are just a symptom of another issue.


Lar





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Old 06-08-2007, 02:04 AM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Chrerry Tree Infested w/ Ants or Termites?


"Lar" wrote in message
...
Mike wrote:
Hi, I've got a large cherry tree that's infested with either termites or
carpenter ants.
I noticed at the bottom of tree what appeared to be sawdust, cleaned it
up and the next day it was back.
Today I sprayed Bonide Termite and Carpenter Ant Killer into the two
holes they were using and the critters poured out of the tree. They
appear to have two parts to the body (part near the head is smaller than
the part at the rear and fairly large head wiith good sized pinchers.
The Bonide spray seems to work but I suspect they'll just burrow into the
tree at a another location how do I permantely get rid of them?

Thanks,

Mike

could be a number of type of ants, but all of them are beneficial to the
tree...they are not killing your tree but excavating in already
diseased/rotted wood. They are just a symptom of another issue.


It gets worse in that I sprayed Bonide Termite and Carpenter Ant Killer
into an opening in the tree which caused the ants to rpidly exit the tree
and I suspect the carpenter ants won't ever return to inside the tree
because of the spray and the spray may hurt the tree. Is it possible that
fungus could be in the tree? Fungus is on the outside of the tree.


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Old 06-08-2007, 02:23 AM posted to rec.gardens
Lar Lar is offline
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Default Chrerry Tree Infested w/ Ants or Termites?

Mike wrote:



It gets worse in that I sprayed Bonide Termite and Carpenter Ant Killer
into an opening in the tree which caused the ants to rpidly exit the tree
and I suspect the carpenter ants won't ever return to inside the tree
because of the spray and the spray may hurt the tree. Is it possible that
fungus could be in the tree? Fungus is on the outside of the tree.



The Bonide Termite and Carpenter Ant Killer looks to be a couple of
pyrethroids, which breaks down so ants probably could be back in within
a couple of months, hard to say. Fungi infected wood probably was what
gave the ants a place to nest to begin with. The fungus will be in parts
of the wood that are staying wet, not sure if there any way to avoid
such areas in any large tree.

Lar
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Old 07-08-2007, 11:16 PM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Chrerry Tree Infested w/ Ants or Termites?

Why not just cut the tree down and be done with the ants?


--
Sincerely,
John A. Keslick, Jr.
Consulting Arborist
http://home.ccil.org/~treeman
and www.treedictionary.com
Beware of so-called tree experts who do not understand tree biology.
Storms, fires, floods, earthquakes, and volcanic eruptions keep reminding us
that we are not the boss.

"Lar" wrote in message
...
Mike wrote:



It gets worse in that I sprayed Bonide Termite and Carpenter Ant Killer
into an opening in the tree which caused the ants to rpidly exit the tree
and I suspect the carpenter ants won't ever return to inside the tree
because of the spray and the spray may hurt the tree. Is it possible
that fungus could be in the tree? Fungus is on the outside of the tree.



The Bonide Termite and Carpenter Ant Killer looks to be a couple of
pyrethroids, which breaks down so ants probably could be back in within a
couple of months, hard to say. Fungi infected wood probably was what gave
the ants a place to nest to begin with. The fungus will be in parts of the
wood that are staying wet, not sure if there any way to avoid such areas
in any large tree.

Lar



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Old 08-08-2007, 01:56 AM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Chrerry Tree Infested w/ Ants or Termites?


"symplastless" wrote in message
. ..
Why not just cut the tree down and be done with the ants?

Well, I think not when I can pour 5lbs of salt arounf the roots wait two
weeks then burn it then plow the ground.


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Old 08-08-2007, 01:59 AM posted to rec.gardens
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Default Chrerry Tree Infested w/ Ants or Termites?


"Lar" wrote in message
...
Mike wrote:

The Bonide Termite and Carpenter Ant Killer looks to be a couple of
pyrethroids, which breaks down so ants probably could be back in within a
couple of months, hard to say. Fungi infected wood probably was what gave
the ants a place to nest to begin with. The fungus will be in parts of the
wood that are staying wet, not sure if there any way to avoid such areas
in any large tree.

Lar


Several years ago, beofre I bought the house someone and trimmed it
resulting in several places on the trunk that are entrance points for the
ants.I think the tree has fungus inside and the ants were probably carrying
out the rotten wood.




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