CDC report: http://tinyurl.com/2h3f6x

.................

Taste from Salon.

"Since December, 12 meatpackers in Austin and two at a plant in Indiana
have reported fatigue, numbness and tingling in their arms and legs. A
few are severely disabled; others have returned to work.

Indiana health officials have declined to discuss the conditions of the
affected workers there or say where they were employed, citing patient
privacy laws.

All 14 employees worked near powerful compressed air systems that blow
brains out of pig heads at what is known as the head table. Both plants
have stopped using the process.

Lynfield said investigators are now looking for anyone who has worked
near Quality Pork's head table since 1997. That's difficult because the
plant employs about 1,200 workers, many of them immigrants, and turnover
is high."

--

Garden in shade zone 5 S Jersey USA
ICAO = KMIV Millville Weather

Bill wrote in

news.net:

Garden in shade zone 5 S Jersey USA
ICAO = KMIV Millville Weather

you live in Millville? you wouldn't, by any chance, know a guy
named Steve Jublou?
lee i may have spelled his surname wrong

In article ,
enigma wrote:

Bill wrote in

news.net:

Garden in shade zone 5 S Jersey USA
ICAO = KMIV Millville Weather

you live in Millville? you wouldn't, by any chance, know a guy
named Steve Jublou?
lee i may have spelled his surname wrong

Never heard of him but Millville is my local weather and is 20 miles
away. In between is the largest city in NJ Vineland area wise.

Bill

--

Garden in shade zone 5 S Jersey USA
ICAO = KMIV Millville Weather

In article
,
Bill wrote:

CDC report: http://tinyurl.com/2h3f6x

................

Taste from Salon.

"Since December, 12 meatpackers in Austin and two at a plant in Indiana
have reported fatigue, numbness and tingling in their arms and legs. A
few are severely disabled; others have returned to work.

Indiana health officials have declined to discuss the conditions of the
affected workers there or say where they were employed, citing patient
privacy laws.

All 14 employees worked near powerful compressed air systems that blow
brains out of pig heads at what is known as the head table. Both plants
have stopped using the process.

Lynfield said investigators are now looking for anyone who has worked
near Quality Pork's head table since 1997. That's difficult because the
plant employs about 1,200 workers, many of them immigrants, and turnover
is high."

The last book I read, "The Revolution Will Not Be Microwaved" by Sandor
Katz stated that 4 companies control 80% of the cattle market and 5
control 63% of the hog market. Their $500,000 slaughterhouses are
efficient and cruel, which matches the way the animals were raised.

Most of us are meat eaters. We accept that something has to die for us
to live but that doesn't mean that we condone torturing the animal,
whether it be a cage, where it can't turn around, or treatment in feed
lots and slaughterhouses.

Wild animals have a life with a dimension of freedom and some farmers do
raise their animals humanely, even though the animals will be killed.
"Real" free range animals have been shown to be healthier for us to eat
but corporate farms can, and do, play fast and loose the the term "free
range", until it means squat.

Normally small producers of meat can't legally sell their meat because
commercial meat has to be killed in one of the aforementioned $500,000
slaughterhouses (There is an exemption for chickens.). The way around
this is for the farmer to sell you part interest in the animal.

The whole idea, of course, is to keep the small producer out of the
marketplace. Joel Salatin of Polyface Farms
(http://www.polyfacefarms.com/) went so far as to send some of his
chickens and some from the local market to a lab for testing and the
supermarket chickens were 25 times higher in bacteria than his own!

Presently, our corporate shills (the government) are trying to separate
us even further from growing our own food by implementing the National
Animal Identification System (NAIS) that will require every animal owner
to register their animals (http://www.nonais.org/). The sweet part
(sarcasm) is that the fee is the same for one animal or a herd of
animals. (**** and moan about this to your representatives.)

But I digress, slaughterhouses are inhuman to both animals and people.

First a story about a California slaughterhouse that tortured "downer"
cattle to get them to pass USDA inspection. It's against health laws, if
not against moral laws.
http://www.latimes.com/news/educatio...,5209685.story

And lastly, from Sandor Katz's book, "How could mass production of
animal products be anything but ugly? The gruesome realities of the
industry that delivers cheap animal products to the supermarket are kept
far from public view, but every so often a new sensational expose
captures public attention. In 2003 Virgil Butler started an online blog
following his firing by Tyson Foods, the world's largest poultry
processor, from the job he had held for ten years at poultry processing
plants in Arkansas. Butler's graphic accounts of his job ³have
electrified animal-rights activists around the globe," according to the
Los Angeles Times. Here is an excerpt from his blog:

Here come the birds through the stunner into the killing
machine. It's time to get busy. You can expect to have to catch
every fifth one or so, many that are not stunned. Remember,
they come at you 182-186 per minute. There is blood every-
where, in the 3' x 3' x 20' trough beneath the machine, on your
face, your neck, your arms, all down your apron. You are covered
in it. Sometimes you have to wash off the clots of blood, without
taking your eyes off the line lest one slip by, which they will. . . .
The sheer amount of killing and blood can really get to you
after awhile, especially if you can't just shut down all emotion
completely and turn into a robot zombie of death. You feel like
part of a big death machine. Pretty much treated that way as
well. Sometimes weird thoughts will enter your head. It's just
you and the dying chickens. The surreal feelings grow into such
a horror of the barbaric nature of your behavior.

You are murdering helpless birds by the thousands (75,000 to
90,000 a night). You are a killer. You can't really talk to anyone
about this. The guys at work will think you are soft. Family and
friends don't want to know about this. It makes them uncomfortable
and unsure of and unsure of what to say or how to act. They can even
look at you a little weird. Some don't want much else to do with
you when they know what you do for a living. You are a killer.
Out of desperation you send your mind elsewhere so that you
don't end up like those guys that lose it. Like the guy that fell
on his knees praying to God for forgiveness. Or the guy they
hauled off to the mental hospital that kept having nightmares
that chickens were after him. I've had those, too. (Shudder)
Very creepy. You find something else to dwell on to try to
remove yourself from the situation. To keep your mind from
drowning in all those hundreds of gallons of blood you see.
Most people who work this room and work in the hanging cage
use some sort of stimulant to keep up the pace and some sort
of mellowing substance to escape reality. . . .

You shut down all emotions eventually. You just can't care
about anything. Because if you care about something, it opens
the gate to all those bad feelings that you can't afford to feel
and still do your job. You have bills to pay. You have to eat. But,
you don't want chicken. You have to be really hungry to eat
that. You know what goes into every bite. All the horror and
negativity. All the brutality. Concentrated into every bite. . . .
Welcome to the nightmare I escaped."


It doesn't have to be like this.
--

Billy

Bush & Cheney & Pelosi, Behind Bars
http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Sto...917874,00.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Movemen...George_W._Bush

Bill wrote in

news.net:

Never heard of him but Millville is my local weather and
is 20 miles
away. In between is the largest city in NJ Vineland area
wise.

ah well, i went to college with him at UNH. he was supposed
to be a business major & switched to art. i was an aggie
major.
he talked about Millville *all* the time.
lee

In article ,
enigma wrote:

Bill wrote in

news.net:

Never heard of him but Millville is my local weather and
is 20 miles
away. In between is the largest city in NJ Vineland area
wise.

ah well, i went to college with him at UNH. he was supposed
to be a business major & switched to art. i was an aggie
major.
he talked about Millville *all* the time.
lee

Millville is famous for three things that I know of. One is it was the
home of holly world which encouraged American Hollies. It had a museum
devoted to holly which is as hard as ebony. Was bought by a media
corporation and then fell into neglect. I have a few hollies about my
home Dr. Kelsan and another one or two whose name fails me.

Glass as art and beauty is #2 and Wheaton Village is worth a look .

Had the highest rate of VD at a local during WW2 is #3

Bill

--

Garden in shade zone 5 S Jersey USA
ICAO = KMIV Millville Weather

In article
,
Billy wrote:

In article
,
Bill wrote:

CDC report: http://tinyurl.com/2h3f6x

................

Taste from Salon.

"Since December, 12 meatpackers in Austin and two at a plant in Indiana
have reported fatigue, numbness and tingling in their arms and legs. A
few are severely disabled; others have returned to work.

Indiana health officials have declined to discuss the conditions of the
affected workers there or say where they were employed, citing patient
privacy laws.

All 14 employees worked near powerful compressed air systems that blow
brains out of pig heads at what is known as the head table. Both plants
have stopped using the process.

Lynfield said investigators are now looking for anyone who has worked
near Quality Pork's head table since 1997. That's difficult because the
plant employs about 1,200 workers, many of them immigrants, and turnover
is high."

The last book I read, "The Revolution Will Not Be Microwaved" by Sandor
Katz stated that 4 companies control 80% of the cattle market and 5
control 63% of the hog market. Their $500,000 slaughterhouses are
efficient and cruel, which matches the way the animals were raised.

Most of us are meat eaters. We accept that something has to die for us
to live but that doesn't mean that we condone torturing the animal,
whether it be a cage, where it can't turn around, or treatment in feed
lots and slaughterhouses.

Wild animals have a life with a dimension of freedom and some farmers do
raise their animals humanely, even though the animals will be killed.
"Real" free range animals have been shown to be healthier for us to eat
but corporate farms can, and do, play fast and loose the the term "free
range", until it means squat.

Normally small producers of meat can't legally sell their meat because
commercial meat has to be killed in one of the aforementioned $500,000
slaughterhouses (There is an exemption for chickens.). The way around
this is for the farmer to sell you part interest in the animal.

The whole idea, of course, is to keep the small producer out of the
marketplace. Joel Salatin of Polyface Farms
(http://www.polyfacefarms.com/) went so far as to send some of his
chickens and some from the local market to a lab for testing and the
supermarket chickens were 25 times higher in bacteria than his own!

Presently, our corporate shills (the government) are trying to separate
us even further from growing our own food by implementing the National
Animal Identification System (NAIS) that will require every animal owner
to register their animals (http://www.nonais.org/). The sweet part
(sarcasm) is that the fee is the same for one animal or a herd of
animals. (**** and moan about this to your representatives.)

But I digress, slaughterhouses are inhuman to both animals and people.

First a story about a California slaughterhouse that tortured "downer"
cattle to get them to pass USDA inspection. It's against health laws, if
not against moral laws.
http://www.latimes.com/news/educatio...,5209685.story

And lastly, from Sandor Katz's book, "How could mass production of
animal products be anything but ugly? The gruesome realities of the
industry that delivers cheap animal products to the supermarket are kept
far from public view, but every so often a new sensational expose
captures public attention. In 2003 Virgil Butler started an online blog
following his firing by Tyson Foods, the world's largest poultry
processor, from the job he had held for ten years at poultry processing
plants in Arkansas. Butler's graphic accounts of his job ³have
electrified animal-rights activists around the globe," according to the
Los Angeles Times. Here is an excerpt from his blog:

Here come the birds through the stunner into the killing
machine. It's time to get busy. You can expect to have to catch
every fifth one or so, many that are not stunned. Remember,
they come at you 182-186 per minute. There is blood every-
where, in the 3' x 3' x 20' trough beneath the machine, on your
face, your neck, your arms, all down your apron. You are covered
in it. Sometimes you have to wash off the clots of blood, without
taking your eyes off the line lest one slip by, which they will. . . .
The sheer amount of killing and blood can really get to you
after awhile, especially if you can't just shut down all emotion
completely and turn into a robot zombie of death. You feel like
part of a big death machine. Pretty much treated that way as
well. Sometimes weird thoughts will enter your head. It's just
you and the dying chickens. The surreal feelings grow into such
a horror of the barbaric nature of your behavior.

You are murdering helpless birds by the thousands (75,000 to
90,000 a night). You are a killer. You can't really talk to anyone
about this. The guys at work will think you are soft. Family and
friends don't want to know about this. It makes them uncomfortable
and unsure of and unsure of what to say or how to act. They can even
look at you a little weird. Some don't want much else to do with
you when they know what you do for a living. You are a killer.
Out of desperation you send your mind elsewhere so that you
don't end up like those guys that lose it. Like the guy that fell
on his knees praying to God for forgiveness. Or the guy they
hauled off to the mental hospital that kept having nightmares
that chickens were after him. I've had those, too. (Shudder)
Very creepy. You find something else to dwell on to try to
remove yourself from the situation. To keep your mind from
drowning in all those hundreds of gallons of blood you see.
Most people who work this room and work in the hanging cage
use some sort of stimulant to keep up the pace and some sort
of mellowing substance to escape reality. . . .

You shut down all emotions eventually. You just can't care
about anything. Because if you care about something, it opens
the gate to all those bad feelings that you can't afford to feel
and still do your job. You have bills to pay. You have to eat. But,
you don't want chicken. You have to be really hungry to eat
that. You know what goes into every bite. All the horror and
negativity. All the brutality. Concentrated into every bite. . . .
Welcome to the nightmare I escaped."


It doesn't have to be like this.

Gary Snyder spoke on breaking the body. This a sacred act.

I like the poem in which the chicken and he are two but that night they
are one.

"Real work" comes to mind but no one seems to to know of that vision
here as it internal.
So things are such as they are. Got some seeds today Malabar and
others.

Weird world no?

Gary is a fav of mine.

Bill

--

Garden in shade zone 5 S Jersey USA
ICAO = KMIV Millville Weather

In article
,
Bill wrote:

In article
,
Billy wrote:

In article
,
Bill wrote:

CDC report: http://tinyurl.com/2h3f6x

................

Taste from Salon.

"Since December, 12 meatpackers in Austin and two at a plant in Indiana
have reported fatigue, numbness and tingling in their arms and legs. A
few are severely disabled; others have returned to work.

Indiana health officials have declined to discuss the conditions of the
affected workers there or say where they were employed, citing patient
privacy laws.

All 14 employees worked near powerful compressed air systems that blow
brains out of pig heads at what is known as the head table. Both plants
have stopped using the process.

Lynfield said investigators are now looking for anyone who has worked
near Quality Pork's head table since 1997. That's difficult because the
plant employs about 1,200 workers, many of them immigrants, and turnover
is high."

The last book I read, "The Revolution Will Not Be Microwaved" by Sandor
Katz stated that 4 companies control 80% of the cattle market and 5
control 63% of the hog market. Their $500,000 slaughterhouses are
efficient and cruel, which matches the way the animals were raised.

Most of us are meat eaters. We accept that something has to die for us
to live but that doesn't mean that we condone torturing the animal,
whether it be a cage, where it can't turn around, or treatment in feed
lots and slaughterhouses.

Wild animals have a life with a dimension of freedom and some farmers do
raise their animals humanely, even though the animals will be killed.
"Real" free range animals have been shown to be healthier for us to eat
but corporate farms can, and do, play fast and loose the the term "free
range", until it means squat.

Normally small producers of meat can't legally sell their meat because
commercial meat has to be killed in one of the aforementioned $500,000
slaughterhouses (There is an exemption for chickens.). The way around
this is for the farmer to sell you part interest in the animal.

The whole idea, of course, is to keep the small producer out of the
marketplace. Joel Salatin of Polyface Farms
(http://www.polyfacefarms.com/) went so far as to send some of his
chickens and some from the local market to a lab for testing and the
supermarket chickens were 25 times higher in bacteria than his own!

Presently, our corporate shills (the government) are trying to separate
us even further from growing our own food by implementing the National
Animal Identification System (NAIS) that will require every animal owner
to register their animals (http://www.nonais.org/). The sweet part
(sarcasm) is that the fee is the same for one animal or a herd of
animals. (**** and moan about this to your representatives.)

But I digress, slaughterhouses are inhuman to both animals and people.

First a story about a California slaughterhouse that tortured "downer"
cattle to get them to pass USDA inspection. It's against health laws, if
not against moral laws.
http://www.latimes.com/news/educatio...,5209685.story

And lastly, from Sandor Katz's book, "How could mass production of
animal products be anything but ugly? The gruesome realities of the
industry that delivers cheap animal products to the supermarket are kept
far from public view, but every so often a new sensational expose
captures public attention. In 2003 Virgil Butler started an online blog
following his firing by Tyson Foods, the world's largest poultry
processor, from the job he had held for ten years at poultry processing
plants in Arkansas. Butler's graphic accounts of his job ³have
electrified animal-rights activists around the globe," according to the
Los Angeles Times. Here is an excerpt from his blog:

Here come the birds through the stunner into the killing
machine. It's time to get busy. You can expect to have to catch
every fifth one or so, many that are not stunned. Remember,
they come at you 182-186 per minute. There is blood every-
where, in the 3' x 3' x 20' trough beneath the machine, on your
face, your neck, your arms, all down your apron. You are covered
in it. Sometimes you have to wash off the clots of blood, without
taking your eyes off the line lest one slip by, which they will. . . .
The sheer amount of killing and blood can really get to you
after awhile, especially if you can't just shut down all emotion
completely and turn into a robot zombie of death. You feel like
part of a big death machine. Pretty much treated that way as
well. Sometimes weird thoughts will enter your head. It's just
you and the dying chickens. The surreal feelings grow into such
a horror of the barbaric nature of your behavior.

You are murdering helpless birds by the thousands (75,000 to
90,000 a night). You are a killer. You can't really talk to anyone
about this. The guys at work will think you are soft. Family and
friends don't want to know about this. It makes them uncomfortable
and unsure of and unsure of what to say or how to act. They can even
look at you a little weird. Some don't want much else to do with
you when they know what you do for a living. You are a killer.
Out of desperation you send your mind elsewhere so that you
don't end up like those guys that lose it. Like the guy that fell
on his knees praying to God for forgiveness. Or the guy they
hauled off to the mental hospital that kept having nightmares
that chickens were after him. I've had those, too. (Shudder)
Very creepy. You find something else to dwell on to try to
remove yourself from the situation. To keep your mind from
drowning in all those hundreds of gallons of blood you see.
Most people who work this room and work in the hanging cage
use some sort of stimulant to keep up the pace and some sort
of mellowing substance to escape reality. . . .

You shut down all emotions eventually. You just can't care
about anything. Because if you care about something, it opens
the gate to all those bad feelings that you can't afford to feel
and still do your job. You have bills to pay. You have to eat. But,
you don't want chicken. You have to be really hungry to eat
that. You know what goes into every bite. All the horror and
negativity. All the brutality. Concentrated into every bite. . . .
Welcome to the nightmare I escaped."


It doesn't have to be like this.

Gary Snyder spoke on breaking the body. This a sacred act.

I like the poem in which the chicken and he are two but that night they
are one.

The chicken would really have to be down with poetry to enjoy that one.

"Real work" comes to mind but no one seems to to know of that vision
here as it internal.
So things are such as they are. Got some seeds today Malabar and
others.
Pretty much got seeds for three times what I have in gardening space.
I've planed and re-planed the garden four times now. I'm getting antsy
and it is only February. At least it is a short month. At least we
shouldn't have any ordinances restricting water. We ave about twice
normal rain fall now and the snow pack in the Sierras is deeper than
normal.

Weird world no?

Gary is a fav of mine.
Not that familiar with him but he and Ginsburg were very big here in the
late 50's early 60's. I heard that Gary lived for once by going to the
docks and sweeping up rice spilled from cargos. Boy is that time long
gone.

Bill
--

Billy

Bush, Cheney & Pelosi, Behind Bars
http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Sto...917874,00.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Movemen...George_W._Bush

I read part of the headline and didn't need to go on.

"Investigation of Progressive Inflammatory Neuropathy ..."

The article wrote itself-- it's a bio of the Hillary and McCain voting
records.

In article
,
Bill wrote:

In article
,
Billy wrote:

In article
,
Bill wrote:

CDC report: http://tinyurl.com/2h3f6x

................

Taste from Salon.

"Since December, 12 meatpackers in Austin and two at a plant in Indiana
have reported fatigue, numbness and tingling in their arms and legs. A
few are severely disabled; others have returned to work.

Indiana health officials have declined to discuss the conditions of the
affected workers there or say where they were employed, citing patient
privacy laws.

All 14 employees worked near powerful compressed air systems that blow
brains out of pig heads at what is known as the head table. Both plants
have stopped using the process.

Lynfield said investigators are now looking for anyone who has worked
near Quality Pork's head table since 1997. That's difficult because the
plant employs about 1,200 workers, many of them immigrants, and turnover
is high."

The last book I read, "The Revolution Will Not Be Microwaved" by Sandor
Katz stated that 4 companies control 80% of the cattle market and 5
control 63% of the hog market. Their $500,000 slaughterhouses are
efficient and cruel, which matches the way the animals were raised.

Most of us are meat eaters. We accept that something has to die for us
to live but that doesn't mean that we condone torturing the animal,
whether it be a cage, where it can't turn around, or treatment in feed
lots and slaughterhouses.

Wild animals have a life with a dimension of freedom and some farmers do
raise their animals humanely, even though the animals will be killed.
"Real" free range animals have been shown to be healthier for us to eat
but corporate farms can, and do, play fast and loose the the term "free
range", until it means squat.

Normally small producers of meat can't legally sell their meat because
commercial meat has to be killed in one of the aforementioned $500,000
slaughterhouses (There is an exemption for chickens.). The way around
this is for the farmer to sell you part interest in the animal.

The whole idea, of course, is to keep the small producer out of the
marketplace. Joel Salatin of Polyface Farms
(http://www.polyfacefarms.com/) went so far as to send some of his
chickens and some from the local market to a lab for testing and the
supermarket chickens were 25 times higher in bacteria than his own!

Presently, our corporate shills (the government) are trying to separate
us even further from growing our own food by implementing the National
Animal Identification System (NAIS) that will require every animal owner
to register their animals (http://www.nonais.org/). The sweet part
(sarcasm) is that the fee is the same for one animal or a herd of
animals. (**** and moan about this to your representatives.)

But I digress, slaughterhouses are inhuman to both animals and people.

First a story about a California slaughterhouse that tortured "downer"
cattle to get them to pass USDA inspection. It's against health laws, if
not against moral laws.
http://www.latimes.com/news/educatio...,5209685.story

And lastly, from Sandor Katz's book, "How could mass production of
animal products be anything but ugly? The gruesome realities of the
industry that delivers cheap animal products to the supermarket are kept
far from public view, but every so often a new sensational expose
captures public attention. In 2003 Virgil Butler started an online blog
following his firing by Tyson Foods, the world's largest poultry
processor, from the job he had held for ten years at poultry processing
plants in Arkansas. Butler's graphic accounts of his job ³have
electrified animal-rights activists around the globe," according to the
Los Angeles Times. Here is an excerpt from his blog:

Here come the birds through the stunner into the killing
machine. It's time to get busy. You can expect to have to catch
every fifth one or so, many that are not stunned. Remember,
they come at you 182-186 per minute. There is blood every-
where, in the 3' x 3' x 20' trough beneath the machine, on your
face, your neck, your arms, all down your apron. You are covered
in it. Sometimes you have to wash off the clots of blood, without
taking your eyes off the line lest one slip by, which they will. . . .
The sheer amount of killing and blood can really get to you
after awhile, especially if you can't just shut down all emotion
completely and turn into a robot zombie of death. You feel like
part of a big death machine. Pretty much treated that way as
well. Sometimes weird thoughts will enter your head. It's just
you and the dying chickens. The surreal feelings grow into such
a horror of the barbaric nature of your behavior.

You are murdering helpless birds by the thousands (75,000 to
90,000 a night). You are a killer. You can't really talk to anyone
about this. The guys at work will think you are soft. Family and
friends don't want to know about this. It makes them uncomfortable
and unsure of and unsure of what to say or how to act. They can even
look at you a little weird. Some don't want much else to do with
you when they know what you do for a living. You are a killer.
Out of desperation you send your mind elsewhere so that you
don't end up like those guys that lose it. Like the guy that fell
on his knees praying to God for forgiveness. Or the guy they
hauled off to the mental hospital that kept having nightmares
that chickens were after him. I've had those, too. (Shudder)
Very creepy. You find something else to dwell on to try to
remove yourself from the situation. To keep your mind from
drowning in all those hundreds of gallons of blood you see.
Most people who work this room and work in the hanging cage
use some sort of stimulant to keep up the pace and some sort
of mellowing substance to escape reality. . . .

You shut down all emotions eventually. You just can't care
about anything. Because if you care about something, it opens
the gate to all those bad feelings that you can't afford to feel
and still do your job. You have bills to pay. You have to eat. But,
you don't want chicken. You have to be really hungry to eat
that. You know what goes into every bite. All the horror and
negativity. All the brutality. Concentrated into every bite. . . .
Welcome to the nightmare I escaped."


It doesn't have to be like this.

Gary Snyder spoke on breaking the body. This a sacred act.

I like the poem in which the chicken and he are two but that night they
are one.

"Real work" comes to mind but no one seems to to know of that vision
here as it internal.
So things are such as they are. Got some seeds today Malabar and
others.

Weird world no?

Gary is a fav of mine.

Bill

OK, I'll bite. Malabar? Have you had it before? What was your opinion of
it. Is this culinary or medicinal? Calls for full Sun but you claim
shade as your invironment. You've got some explainin' to do boy;-)

--
Bush Behind Bars

Billy
http://angryarab.blogspot.com/

In article ,
Billy wrote:

OK, I'll bite. Malabar? Have you had it before? What was your opinion of
it. Is this culinary or medicinal? Calls for full Sun but you claim
shade as your invironment. You've got some explainin' to do boy;-)

Malabar is sort of like spinach that doesn't bolt and grows as a vine.
There are two types I know of one is green the other reddish. Very
tasty !

http://www.johnnyseeds.com/catalog/s...rch&search=Mal
abar


or http://preview.tinyurl.com/269vp2

from above url

"Green Malabar Spinach
(Basella rubra)

Heat loving, frost sensitive.
Vigorous climbing vines grow through summer into fall. Glossy, thick,
savoyed leaves resemble spinach. Mild Swiss chard taste. Use leaves and
young stems sparingly in salads or stir-fries. Direct seed 1-2" apart,
1/4" deep, or start indoors and transplant outside after danger of
frost. Thin to 6" between plants, rows 12" apart. Provide trellis. Avg.
16,300 seeds/lb. Mini: 100 seeds.

Days to Maturity or Bloom: 85"

My flower gardening effort is more devoted to shade with a few
exceptions. Think hosta, Japanese maples, ferns, Day lilies etc.
We used to food garden at my dads as he had more light but he is
selling. So our food garden will be smaller and have less light here.
Looks like micro gardening with the sun an issue.
We have Chinese chives and other herbs scattered about the flower
gardens and basil is planted yearly.

I'd guess the flower garden is 85% perennial and surrounds our home.

Bill 28 F going to ~40 F

--

Garden in shade zone 5 S Jersey USA
ICAO = KMIV Millville Weather

In article
,
Bill wrote:

In article ,
Billy wrote:

OK, I'll bite. Malabar? Have you had it before? What was your opinion of
it. Is this culinary or medicinal? Calls for full Sun but you claim
shade as your invironment. You've got some explainin' to do boy;-)

Malabar is sort of like spinach that doesn't bolt and grows as a vine.
There are two types I know of one is green the other reddish. Very
tasty !

http://www.johnnyseeds.com/catalog/s...rch&search=Mal
abar


or http://preview.tinyurl.com/269vp2

from above url

"Green Malabar Spinach
(Basella rubra)

Heat loving, frost sensitive.
Vigorous climbing vines grow through summer into fall. Glossy, thick,
savoyed leaves resemble spinach. Mild Swiss chard taste. Use leaves and
young stems sparingly in salads or stir-fries. Direct seed 1-2" apart,
1/4" deep, or start indoors and transplant outside after danger of
frost. Thin to 6" between plants, rows 12" apart. Provide trellis. Avg.
16,300 seeds/lb. Mini: 100 seeds.

Days to Maturity or Bloom: 85"

My flower gardening effort is more devoted to shade with a few
exceptions. Think hosta, Japanese maples, ferns, Day lilies etc.
We used to food garden at my dads as he had more light but he is
selling. So our food garden will be smaller and have less light here.
Looks like micro gardening with the sun an issue.
We have Chinese chives and other herbs scattered about the flower
gardens and basil is planted yearly.

I'd guess the flower garden is 85% perennial and surrounds our home.

Bill 28 F going to ~40 F

Let me know how it does for you. Sun is also a issue in my garden. The
best I can do is 1 - 6 hours full Sun and because of an oak and bay
canopy, much of the yard gets no full Sun.

Last year. I grew Tromboncino (Zucchetta Rampicante), a kind of climbing
zuch, that tastes vaguely like artichokes.

The chives, are they garlic chives?
--

Billy

Bush, Cheney & Pelosi, Behind Bars
http://rachelcorriefoundation.org/site/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Movemen...George_W._Bush

In article
,
Billy wrote:


Last year. I grew Tromboncino (Zucchetta Rampicante), a kind of climbing
zuch, that tastes vaguely like artichokes.

So much I never heard of.

Thanks.

The chives, are they garlic chives?

Yes I like them for food and late flowers which can be eaten.

Bill who will be doing bitter melon again as I just heard they dry well.

--

Garden in shade zone 5 S Jersey USA
ICAO = KMIV Millville Weather

"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article

You shut down all emotions eventually. You just can't care
about anything. Because if you care about something, it opens
the gate to all those bad feelings that you can't afford to feel
and still do your job. You have bills to pay. You have to eat. But,
you don't want chicken. You have to be really hungry to eat
that. You know what goes into every bite. All the horror and
negativity. All the brutality. Concentrated into every bite. . . .
Welcome to the nightmare I escaped."



I'm sure that I don't know why this is in this group but I'll bite
anyway.

The writer needs to go out into the bush, with very little food,
and spend a week hiking or something that involves a lot of
physical activity, as I have. There is a difference between being
hungry, and I mean really hungry, and merely "politely interested
in the dainties of one's larder"

You will find out 2 things if you do this:

1) The human body can thrive on far, far, less food that we are
normally used to eating - all you need is water and exercise.

2) When you get truly hungry, and I mean truly hungry, you will
find out that you will have absolutely no compunction about ripping
the head off any animal you come across and cooking it and eating
it. And it will taste really, really good.

The only thing that separates human civilization from human
barbarianism is a full stomach.

Ted

In article ,
"Ted Mittelstaedt" wrote:

"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article

You shut down all emotions eventually. You just can't care
about anything. Because if you care about something, it opens
the gate to all those bad feelings that you can't afford to feel
and still do your job. You have bills to pay. You have to eat. But,
you don't want chicken. You have to be really hungry to eat
that. You know what goes into every bite. All the horror and
negativity. All the brutality. Concentrated into every bite. . . .
Welcome to the nightmare I escaped."



I'm sure that I don't know why this is in this group but I'll bite
anyway.
The reason is that this group is not just about boxwood hedges but food
production as well (gardens). As such the subject of nutrition as well
as industrial food production have had a place in this group. You will
also find farm animals occasionally referred to as sources of manure or
garden damage.

If you read the entire post, you will see that it had to do with the
abhorrence and, illegality, of torturing your food.

Survivalism wouldn't seem to have much relevance to gardening either,
since gardening is a civilized endeavor far removed from the life of a
hunter-gatherer, even if the practice of the former did arise from the
habits of the latter. Personally, I'd rather contemplate a freshly
sliced garden tomato, topped with a couple of basil leaves and a slice
of mozzarella. Whatever spins your wheels I guess.

The writer needs to go out into the bush, with very little food,
and spend a week hiking or something that involves a lot of
physical activity, as I have. There is a difference between being
hungry, and I mean really hungry, and merely "politely interested
in the dainties of one's larder"

You will find out 2 things if you do this:

1) The human body can thrive on far, far, less food that we are
normally used to eating - all you need is water and exercise.

2) When you get truly hungry, and I mean truly hungry, you will
find out that you will have absolutely no compunction about ripping
the head off any animal you come across and cooking it and eating
it. And it will taste really, really good.

The only thing that separates human civilization from human
barbarianism is a full stomach.

Very testosterone of you Ted. I'll walk down this path with you long
enough to reflect with you on the fate of the Donner party. Even when
down to eating their belts and shoes, some of them kept diaries.
Reflecting upon seeing a naked foot print in the snow, one of them
wrote, "If you wouldn't eat an Indian, you've never been hungry". It
apparently wasn't a great leap from that moral stance to eating your
traveling companions. As far as I know, though, they just ate them. They
didn't torture them first.

Ted
Bon appétit
--

Billy

Bush, Cheney & Pelosi, Behind Bars
http://rachelcorriefoundation.org/site/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Movemen...George_W._Bush