Hi all,

We have a problem area in our back yard that I would like to turn into a
nice garden this year.

First off, we're in Zone 5, Toronto area, Ontario Canada.

The house is about 10 years old, in a standard subdivision. Chain link
fence was just installed a couple of years ago to enclose the backyard.

The house basically sits on a "hill" or higher level, with the back yard
sloping down towards the back.

At the back, along the length of the fence, there is basically a "valley"
there that gets very wet and collects lots of water. It gets full sun.

There are neighbours on the left, right and along the back.

I would rather not get into any complicated installations, such as putting
in a French drain. I prefer to work with what I've got and turn the wet
area into a garden by planting it with perennials hardy to Zone 5.

Neighbours on the right have tried filling their wet area with soil and
planting "swamp cedars". They lasted one season before dying. I also tried
transplanting raspberries into that area - they died within weeks.

I have gone to monrovia.com and found a list of perennials that would be
better suited to the site. (Irises, etc.)

My questions a

1. Can I just fill this area in with soil? Do I need to put in a barrier
between the soil and the back fence (half is chainlink and the other half is
wood)? Should I put in a border of some type to contain the soil, like
wooden ties?

2. I couldn't find any evergreens suited to those conditions. Any
suggestions for winter interest plants that can tolerate soggy soil?

Thanks for any suggestions you can provide!
Sally

Bot Grl writes:

2. I couldn't find any evergreens suited to those conditions. Any
suggestions for winter interest plants that can tolerate soggy soil?

I would check the pH of the water there and see if it is perhaps too basic
for the cedars you may be limited elsewhere.

Irises which can be plants 4' high and cala lilies like bog conditions. They
can be planted both underwarer and with sub surface water. The larger Iris'
more resemble hedge than their smaller varieties. If you have significant
standing water, water lillies could work. It would be worth doing some local
research to see which varieties would be best in your area. Winter interest
may not be as interesting as it is in my more temperate area.


David Giunti email: unity
What is the question? Gertrude Stein's last words
No one mouth is big enough to utter the whole thing. Alan Watts

On Display in the UK http://www.web-gallery.co.uk

"Bot Grl" wrote in

2. I couldn't find any evergreens suited to those conditions. Any
suggestions for winter interest plants that can tolerate soggy soil?

Thanks for any suggestions you can provide!
Sally



I don't know if she-oaks would grow in your area, but they do OK in soggy
soil.

"Bot Grl" wrote:

At the back, along the length of the fence, there is basically a "valley"
there that gets very wet and collects lots of water. It gets full sun.

1. Can I just fill this area in with soil? Do I need to put in a barrier
between the soil and the back fence (half is chainlink and the other half is
wood)? Should I put in a border of some type to contain the soil, like
wooden ties?

2. I couldn't find any evergreens suited to those conditions. Any
suggestions for winter interest plants that can tolerate soggy soil?

Drive around and see what is growing naturally in the boggy
swampy areas of Ontario - something must grow well there. . Take
photos and then go to a nursery that specializes in native plants
for identification and to buy them.

Dig a coupleof pits in that area a few feet deep. Construction
crews often bury their trash along the rear lot lines, which
screws up drainage and pH.

Tsu

--
To doubt everything or to believe everything
are two equally convenient solutions; both
dispense with the necessity of reflection.
- Jules Henri Poincaré

On Mon, 24 Feb 2003 00:11:22 +1030, "silvasurfa"
wrote:

I don't know if she-oaks would grow in your area, but they do OK in soggy
soil.

What are she-oaks?

zhan

http://web.tampabay.rr.com/bog/

http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/bog/

https://www.atlsci.com/TESEO/wetinfo.htm

http://www.qnet.com/~johnsonj/Aquatic.htm

You get the idea!



On Sat, 22 Feb 2003 21:18:34 -0800, "Bot Grl"
wrote:

Hi all,

We have a problem area in our back yard that I would like to turn into a
nice garden this year.

First off, we're in Zone 5, Toronto area, Ontario Canada.

The house is about 10 years old, in a standard subdivision. Chain link
fence was just installed a couple of years ago to enclose the backyard.

The house basically sits on a "hill" or higher level, with the back yard
sloping down towards the back.

At the back, along the length of the fence, there is basically a "valley"
there that gets very wet and collects lots of water. It gets full sun.

There are neighbours on the left, right and along the back.

I would rather not get into any complicated installations, such as putting
in a French drain. I prefer to work with what I've got and turn the wet
area into a garden by planting it with perennials hardy to Zone 5.

Neighbours on the right have tried filling their wet area with soil and
planting "swamp cedars". They lasted one season before dying. I also tried
transplanting raspberries into that area - they died within weeks.

I have gone to monrovia.com and found a list of perennials that would be
better suited to the site. (Irises, etc.)

My questions a

1. Can I just fill this area in with soil? Do I need to put in a barrier
between the soil and the back fence (half is chainlink and the other half is
wood)? Should I put in a border of some type to contain the soil, like
wooden ties?

2. I couldn't find any evergreens suited to those conditions. Any
suggestions for winter interest plants that can tolerate soggy soil?

Thanks for any suggestions you can provide!
Sally

"zhanataya" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 24 Feb 2003 00:11:22 +1030, "silvasurfa"
wrote:

I don't know if she-oaks would grow in your area, but they do OK in soggy
soil.

What are she-oaks?

zhan

Aw hell, forgot they are Aussie natives and probably not much grown
elsewhere.

http://audit.ea.gov.au/ANRA/vegetati...nat_veg_fact08
..cfm

hope that link doesn't wrap badly, bit if it does, cut and paste etc

In article cbW5a.2894$xa.462705@localhost, "Bot Grl"
wrote:

Hi all,

We have a problem area in our back yard that I would like to turn into a
nice garden this year.

First off, we're in Zone 5, Toronto area, Ontario Canada.

The house is about 10 years old, in a standard subdivision. Chain link
fence was just installed a couple of years ago to enclose the backyard.

The house basically sits on a "hill" or higher level, with the back yard
sloping down towards the back.

At the back, along the length of the fence, there is basically a "valley"
there that gets very wet and collects lots of water. It gets full sun.

There are neighbours on the left, right and along the back.

I would rather not get into any complicated installations, such as putting
in a French drain. I prefer to work with what I've got and turn the wet
area into a garden by planting it with perennials hardy to Zone 5.

Neighbours on the right have tried filling their wet area with soil and
planting "swamp cedars". They lasted one season before dying. I also tried
transplanting raspberries into that area - they died within weeks.

I have gone to monrovia.com and found a list of perennials that would be
better suited to the site. (Irises, etc.)

My questions a

1. Can I just fill this area in with soil? Do I need to put in a barrier
between the soil and the back fence (half is chainlink and the other half is
wood)? Should I put in a border of some type to contain the soil, like
wooden ties?

2. I couldn't find any evergreens suited to those conditions. Any
suggestions for winter interest plants that can tolerate soggy soil?

Thanks for any suggestions you can provide!
Sally

A natural bog area can be a wonderful thing to be able to plant, & some
people go to great extremes to create artificial ones. One thing to bare
in mind for an artificial bog is it may be seasonal. If it is dry in high
summer & only flooded autumn & spring, it may actually be more suited to
prairie plants than to bog plants, which are used to very wet then very
dry conditions. So many plants won't do well without good drainage, so you
need to research each choice carefully beforehand to make sure it's going
to thrive in a great dea lof wet. Don't rely on places like Monrovia to
offer much more than a best-case sales pitch; get a couple books on bog
gardening. Also see if you can find out if you have a Native Plants
Society in your area -- most areas do -- & through them you can find out
species & sources of native ornamentals that will inevitably include some
of the most beautiful & appropriate shrubs & perennials for the spot
you're planting. Very few of even the best garden centers are seriously
serving bog gardeners so you need some alternatives such as provided by
native plant societies who'll know the specialized growers, arrange field
trips, & inevitably have a couple of helpful intensely radical leaders of
the society who'll rarely lead astray.

A very high number of excellent bog plants have dormant periods either in
summer or winter or both, which is another thing to bare in mind in
arranging specimens, or there'll be recurring homely stretches half the
year. Also an awful lot of true bog plants are also shade plants, & you
have full sun, whereas the spring-swamp prairie plants that need to dry
out later are sun-lovers. There's a lot to take into consideration before
making a choice.

Shifting some soil to form an "island" can create thrilling effects out of
the swampiest times of the year.

If your swampy area is created in large part by the run-off from
surrounding properties, pollution is very likely to be a problem. This can
often be mitigated by having a sedge barrier which functions as an organic
filter for run-off that passes through the sedge before reaching your bog.
Evergreen sedge can take over & force other things out, as can cattail,
which means extra work to keep it where it is needed, but without it the
area could become fouled or oil-slicked.

I don't know enough about Zone 5 gardening to have in mind many specific
plant suggestions, but for plants with year-round appeal & tasty fruit,
you should look into your area's native vacciniums to figure out which
ones are most bog-hardy. They have quite a range of appearance from small
woody groundcovers to upright shrubs.

-paghat

--
"Of what are you afraid, my child?" inquired the kindly teacher.
"Oh, sir! The flowers, they are wild," replied the timid creature.
-from Peter Newell's "Wild Flowers"
See the Garden of Paghat the Ratgirl: http://www.paghat.com/

Thanks! Those were quite helpful, especially the garden forum.

Sally
"animaux" wrote in message
...
http://web.tampabay.rr.com/bog/

http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/bog/

https://www.atlsci.com/TESEO/wetinfo.htm

http://www.qnet.com/~johnsonj/Aquatic.htm

You get the idea!



On Sat, 22 Feb 2003 21:18:34 -0800, "Bot Grl"

wrote:

Hi all,

We have a problem area in our back yard that I would like to turn into a
nice garden this year.

First off, we're in Zone 5, Toronto area, Ontario Canada.

The house is about 10 years old, in a standard subdivision. Chain link
fence was just installed a couple of years ago to enclose the backyard.

The house basically sits on a "hill" or higher level, with the back yard
sloping down towards the back.

At the back, along the length of the fence, there is basically a "valley"
there that gets very wet and collects lots of water. It gets full sun.

There are neighbours on the left, right and along the back.

I would rather not get into any complicated installations, such as
putting
in a French drain. I prefer to work with what I've got and turn the wet
area into a garden by planting it with perennials hardy to Zone 5.

Neighbours on the right have tried filling their wet area with soil and
planting "swamp cedars". They lasted one season before dying. I also
tried
transplanting raspberries into that area - they died within weeks.

I have gone to monrovia.com and found a list of perennials that would be
better suited to the site. (Irises, etc.)

My questions a

1. Can I just fill this area in with soil? Do I need to put in a
barrier
between the soil and the back fence (half is chainlink and the other half
is
wood)? Should I put in a border of some type to contain the soil, like
wooden ties?

2. I couldn't find any evergreens suited to those conditions. Any
suggestions for winter interest plants that can tolerate soggy soil?

Thanks for any suggestions you can provide!
Sally

Try adding some leaves or leaf mold instead of adding more soil. Lots of
prairie plants do well in intermittently wet/dry locations. Be wary of
grasses. If they burn and you have a frame house or just a burnable house, you
can have real trouble.
Mosquitoes can be a problem. so you need to think about this. Lots of leaf
mold on top would still hold lots of water, but may be less encouraging to the
little buggers.