Converting a lawn into a garden
 

Hi,

I have a fairly small (abt 15' x 12') fenced-in area in my back yard
which I would like to use as a garden. It was presumably a vegetable
garden earlier, fenced in because of a high deer population. But now
it's covered with grass and weeds. I'd like to use it for a vegetable
garden now, but I'm not sure of the best way to convert it. I'm sure
that renting a roto-tiller and tilling it is part of the solution, but
I'm not sure if that will kill all the grass and weeds. The roots tend
to go down 6"-1' -- maybe I have Zoysia :(. The soil is also fairly
rocky, but I doubt there's anything I can do about that except to avoid
planting carrots and other tubers.

Also, can anyone recommend a good and cheap landscaping barrier to put
around the garden and keep the lawn out?

Thanks,
Topher

Converting a lawn into a garden
 

topher wrote in
:

Hi,

I have a fairly small (abt 15' x 12') fenced-in area in my back yard
which I would like to use as a garden. It was presumably a vegetable
garden earlier, fenced in because of a high deer population. But now
it's covered with grass and weeds. I'd like to use it for a vegetable
garden now, but I'm not sure of the best way to convert it. I'm sure
that renting a roto-tiller and tilling it is part of the solution, but
I'm not sure if that will kill all the grass and weeds. The roots tend
to go down 6"-1' -- maybe I have Zoysia :(. The soil is also fairly
rocky, but I doubt there's anything I can do about that except to avoid
planting carrots and other tubers.

Also, can anyone recommend a good and cheap landscaping barrier to put
around the garden and keep the lawn out?

Thanks,
Topher



You have a couple of options. #1 you could use a product to kill
everything (like Round Up) wait a couple of weeks and then plant. #2 You
can cover the entire area with several layers of newspaper and wait. This
will kill everything but you won't be able to plant until next year. #3
You could pull, cut all the weeds, turn the soil and mulch well after
planting to retard weed growth. This requires some weeding but it will
minimize the work.


Chris

Converting a lawn into a garden
 

topher wrote:

I have a fairly small (abt 15' x 12') fenced-in area in my back yard
which I would like to use as a garden. It was presumably a vegetable
garden earlier, fenced in because of a high deer population. But now
it's covered with grass and weeds. I'd like to use it for a vegetable
garden now, but I'm not sure of the best way to convert it.

Spray everything thoroughly with Roundup, wiat for it to start to
dir then weedwhack it all. Then lay layers of newspaper 10-15
sheets thick over the mess and wet them. Spread a 3-4 inch thick
layer of some sort of compost, mulch, wood chips,or clean straw
(or all of the above) wet it all thoroughly and let it sit for a
while. pullany weeds that emerge,of course.

Then start setting out your plants right through the mulch and
paper and just keep adding mulch as the old stuff decomposes.



Tsu

--
To doubt everything or to believe everything
are two equally convenient solutions; both
dispense with the necessity of reflection.
- Jules Henri Poincaré

Converting a lawn into a garden
 

wasted ill guided step in an otherwise intelligent post



On Mon, 05 May 2003 15:17:55 -0700, Tsu Dho Nimh
wrote:


Spray everything thoroughly with Roundup



"Nature, left alone, is in perfect balance.
Harmful insects and plant diseases are always present,
but do not occur in nature to an extent which requires the use of poisonous chemicals.
The sensible approach to disease and insect control is to grow sturdy crops in a healthy environment."

Masanobu Fukuoka, One Straw Revolution--1978

Converting a lawn into a garden
 

"topher" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I have a fairly small (abt 15' x 12') fenced-in area in my back yard
which I would like to use as a garden. .... but I'm not sure of the best
way to convert it. I'm sure
that renting a roto-tiller and tilling it is part of the solution, but
I'm not sure if that will kill all the grass and weeds.

Remove the grass with a sod cutter, for the most weed free result.

Bob

Converting a lawn into a garden
 

A pretty labor-less solution was described to me at a seminar last weekend.
Cover the grass with 4 to 5 sheets of newspaper followed by 4 inches of
hardwood mulch. Plant 6 weeks later through the mulch and paper. By leaving
the decomposing grass in place - as opposed to removing sod - you're jump
starting the soil with a rich nutrient base. I'm going to try this technique
this weekend.

BP.

Converting a lawn into a garden
 

AuralFeast wrote:

A pretty labor-less solution was described to me at a seminar last weekend.
Cover the grass with 4 to 5 sheets of newspaper followed by 4 inches of
hardwood mulch. Plant 6 weeks later through the mulch and paper. By leaving
the decomposing grass in place - as opposed to removing sod - you're jump
starting the soil with a rich nutrient base. I'm going to try this technique
this weekend.

This is what I've been doing, except I use the free leaf mold that the
county provides instead of hardwood mulch. However, I wait a minimum of
6 months, and normally a year before planting.

Suja

Converting a lawn into a garden
 

not to mention if you till or even remove the sod the seeds that were buried will now
germinate. Ingrid

(AuralFeast) wrote:

A pretty labor-less solution was described to me at a seminar last weekend.
Cover the grass with 4 to 5 sheets of newspaper followed by 4 inches of
hardwood mulch. Plant 6 weeks later through the mulch and paper. By leaving
the decomposing grass in place - as opposed to removing sod - you're jump
starting the soil with a rich nutrient base. I'm going to try this technique
this weekend.

BP.



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Converting a lawn into a garden
 

not to mention if you till or even remove the sod the seeds that were buried
will now
germinate.

I have had good results with removing sod, planting whatever I am going to
plant, and then topping with at least 10 cm. of bark mulch.

Converting a lawn into a garden
 

Bill Spohn wrote:

not to mention if you till or even remove the sod the seeds that were buried
will now
germinate.



I have had good results with removing sod, planting whatever I am going to
plant, and then topping with at least 10 cm. of bark mulch.


Converting lawn to garden is not easy unless you dig it all out and
replace it with new soil, too many roots and seeds. There are are couple
thing you can do if you don't want replace everything, till it
frequently turn the seeds up let them germinate, till them under till
more up. Step 2, cover garden with black plastic, remove, till, replace.
Now IF you feel you have to plant this year get ready for continuous
weedy, do not plan a vacation this year, you'll be in this
grass-WEEDING. You can cut down by mulching or black plastic the rows
and/or between the hills.

Wait a year and you'll have a lot easier time of it.

Kevin

Converting a lawn into a garden
 

wrote in message
...
not to mention if you till or even remove the sod the seeds that were
buried will now
germinate. Ingrid

You can always use Preen or the generic equivalent.

Converting a lawn into a garden
 

On Wed, 07 May 2003 15:52:15 GMT, wrote:

if you till or even remove the sod the seeds that were buried will now
germinate.


you mean you let your grass grow tall enough to seed? In fescue that
8-14 inches.


"Nature, left alone, is in perfect balance.
Harmful insects and plant diseases are always present,
but do not occur in nature to an extent which requires the use of poisonous chemicals.
The sensible approach to disease and insect control is to grow sturdy crops in a healthy environment."

Masanobu Fukuoka, One Straw Revolution--1978

Converting a lawn into a garden
 

Hi,

Thanks to all for the input. I see there are lots of ways to do it. I
also see that I should have done this last Fall... Oh, well. I think
I'll try overturning the soil, mulching it well, planting, and prepare
for a lot of weeding.

No, I never let the grass grow more than about 5-6 inches, but there's a
lot more than just grass in that plot. :-( I also tried rolling up the
sod with a shovel but quickly abandoned the attempt since my efforts
were not rewarded.

Other questions: How do I let my own plants come up through the mulch?
I guess I'd make divets down to the soil and plant "accurately" within
them? Also, is it better in this case to overturn the soil with a
shovel or with a roto-tiller?

Thanks again,
Topher

Tom Jaszewski wrote:
On Wed, 07 May 2003 15:52:15 GMT, wrote:


if you till or even remove the sod the seeds that were buried will now
germinate.



you mean you let your grass grow tall enough to seed? In fescue that
8-14 inches.


"Nature, left alone, is in perfect balance.
Harmful insects and plant diseases are always present,
but do not occur in nature to an extent which requires the use of poisonous chemicals.
The sensible approach to disease and insect control is to grow sturdy crops in a healthy environment."

Masanobu Fukuoka, One Straw Revolution--1978

Converting a lawn into a garden
 

Converting lawn to garden is not easy unless you dig it all out and
replace it with new soil, too many roots and seeds.

There is no gurantee bringing in soil will be better, and in many
cases it can be a lot worse, they've done something to it.

Bryan

Converting a lawn into a garden
 

topher wrote:

Hi,

Snip to questions



Other questions: How do I let my own plants come up through the
mulch? I guess I'd make divets down to the soil and plant
"accurately" within them? Also, is it better in this case to overturn
the soil with a shovel or with a roto-tiller?

Either both are a lot of work. With a tiller start LOW and increase the
depth making repeated passes.

Turning the soil by hand is best done with a digging fork (IMHO)((also
see thread on NO TIME FOR POOR QUALITY TOOLS) short version; buy a
craftsman fork so when you break it, you can REPLACE it).
The advantage to digging is you can seperate out most of the root. You
also can do what is called double digging. That is where you dig down
about 2', but that can also be done for next year when you have more
time. Some plants need to have the soil loosened to greater depth. I
have DUG my gardens for years. You have to do it a little at a time.
Turn a quarter of it and plant the earliest things you have. Put
plastic or mulch the rows immediately. For vine corps form the hills
with a cupped tops to collect the water, cover with plastic, cut holes
in the plastic at the top of the hill, and plant through the plastic.
As soon a you have an empty space this fall double dig it and cover with
plastic.



Thanks again,
Topher