On 09 Mar 2015, snotbottom wrote in
rec.gardens:

Lurker I'd grant you... Troll I'd take exception to.

You might be taken more seriously if you learned to quote who you're
replying to. As it is, your contextless posts make no sense.

I'm in the inland northwest. Far different than the coastal areas or western valleys. The Cascade Mountains stop most of the rain so we only average about 12" per year, most of that occurring in the fall and winter when the prevailing winds shift slightly to bring the weather in around the mountains. We get four distinct seasons, with the summers betting very hot and dry, so irrigation is critical, and very little water is wasted. Winters are normally just a few degrees below freezing, although we have dropped to double-digit negatives a few times.

I grow quite a variety of stuff. Plenty of paste tomatoes every year to put up sauces (spaghetti, salsa, and whatever else inspires me), so plenty of peppers and other stuff to go into the sauces too. Because of the heat, blossom end rot can be troublesome at times. I grow my own herbs to use well.. In fact, everything I use in my preserving I grow myself or buy from someone local.

I also grow a lot of winter squash and root crops that I keep through the winter. One of the happiest memories I have is making borscht for the first time and finding that the family loved it! It's the only reason I'm allowed to grow beets now (although I do sneak in a batch of pickles every year).. Speaking of pickles, I also grow cukes to make hot dill pickles and my grandmothers lime pickle that are so crunchy and sweet.

We have an assortment of fruit trees and vines and bushes that we freeze, dry, or otherwise preserve. I made Concorde grape pie filling 2 years ago for the first time and even though it's difficult, it will be made every year from now on. So delicious!

I grow fingerling potatoes and leeks. I dont generally grow other potatoes or onions because those are readily available around here at a price lower than I could ever grow them for. Many times you can find a grower that will let you go into the fields after they've harvested them and pick what's left and that price is hard to beat. Sweet corn is available for a nickel an ear when its in season, so I don't grow that either, but I do grow popcorn and the kids think that's a blast

In finishing up some of what's left in the cellar, I just made a couple more batches of red onion jam. So good on roasts, hamburgers, or whatever. This is also one that gets made every year.

There's a lot more that goes on around here, but perhaps I'll share more as time goes on.

On Monday, March 9, 2015 at 5:54:49 PM UTC-7, Nil wrote:
On 09 Mar 2015, snotbottom snotbottom wrote in
rec.gardens:

Lurker I'd grant you... Troll I'd take exception to.

You might be taken more seriously if you learned to quote who you're
replying to. As it is, your contextless posts make no sense.


Yeah. Just noticed the mobile version of Google groups doesn't quote the post you're replying to. Sorry about that.

On 09 Mar 2015, snotbottom wrote in
rec.gardens:

On Monday, March 9, 2015 at 5:54:49 PM UTC-7, Nil wrote:

You might be taken more seriously if you learned to quote who
you're replying to. As it is, your contextless posts make no
sense.

Yeah. Just noticed the mobile version of Google groups doesn't
quote the post you're replying to. Sorry about that.

Thank you.

shit stirrers is as good a name as any for a good
gardener.




Speaking of stirring... Reminds me that it's time to clean out the chicken coop and get it ready to go on the garden.

On Monday, March 9, 2015 at 5:15:42 PM UTC-7, songbird wrote:
what do you normally grow? where abouts are you?


songbird


I'm in the inland northwest. Far different than the coastal areas or western valleys. The Cascade Mountains stop most of the rain so we only average about 12" per year, most of that occurring in the fall and winter when the prevailing winds shift slightly to bring the weather in around the mountains. We get four distinct seasons, with the summers betting very hot and dry, so irrigation is critical, and very little water is wasted. Winters are normally just a few degrees below freezing, although we have dropped to double-digit negatives a few times.

I grow quite a variety of stuff. Plenty of paste tomatoes every year to put up sauces (spaghetti, salsa, and whatever else inspires me), so plenty of peppers and other stuff to go into the sauces too. Because of the heat, blossom end rot can be troublesome at times. I grow my own herbs to use well.. In fact, everything I use in my preserving I grow myself or buy from someone local.

I also grow a lot of winter squash and root crops that I keep through the winter. One of the happiest memories I have is making borscht for the first time and finding that the family loved it! It's the only reason I'm allowed to grow beets now (although I do sneak in a batch of pickles every year).. Speaking of pickles, I also grow cukes to make hot dill pickles and my grandmothers lime pickle that are so crunchy and sweet.

We have an assortment of fruit trees and vines and bushes that we freeze, dry, or otherwise preserve. I made Concorde grape pie filling 2 years ago for the first time and even though it's difficult, it will be made every year from now on. So delicious!

I grow fingerling potatoes and leeks. I dont generally grow other potatoes or onions because those are readily available around here at a price lower than I could ever grow them for. Many times you can find a grower that will let you go into the fields after they've harvested them and pick what's left and that price is hard to beat. Sweet corn is available for a nickel an ear when its in season, so I don't grow that either, but I do grow popcorn and the kids think that's a blast

In finishing up some of what's left in the cellar, I just made a couple more batches of red onion jam. So good on roasts, hamburgers, or whatever. This is also one that gets made every year.

There's a lot more that goes on around here, but perhaps I'll share more as time goes on.

Following that logic discussion of growing potatos and corn would be banned
because some people here passionately (and repeatedly) declare that eating
any carbohydrates is bad for your health.

Isn't dealing with aberant weather patterns gardening advice?


Yes it would be. But that isn't what the article was taking about. The purpose of the article wasn't about climate change, the latest findings, or current conditions. It was the celebration of one of the voices of the opposition being scandalized.

I'm all for science... These articles didn't have any.

On 03/09/2015 12:50 PM, Drew Lawson wrote:
In article
T writes:

Are your tomato beds well drained? Tomatoes love to be
drenched (they are from the Amazon), but do not like
their roots in standing/stagnant water.

Tomatoes originated in the Andes, not the Amazon.
Aside from the initial letter, the two have little in common.

Hi Drew,

Tomatoes were originally cultivated by the Incas which
inhabited the Andes. But they came from the Amazon rain
forest. Peru, which contains both the Andes and Incas,
also contains part of the Amazon rain forest. I think
you are mixing the origin of the plant (the rain forest)
with the origin of who originally cultivated it (the
Incas and Aztecs), but I could be wrong.

Amazon Facts:
http://rfadventures.com/amazon_facts.htm

"At least 80% of the developed world's diet originated
in the tropical rainforest. Its bountiful gifts to the
world include fruits like avocados, coconuts, figs,
oranges, lemons, grapefruit, bananas, guavas, pineapples,
mangos and *tomatoes*; vegetables including corn, potatoes,
rice, winter squash and yams; spices like black pepper,
cayenne, chocolate, cinnamon, cloves, ginger, sugar cane,
turmeric, coffee and vanilla and nuts including Brazil
nuts and cashews. At least 3000 fruits are found in
the rainforests; of these only 200 are now in use in
the Western World. The Indians of the rainforest use
over 2,000.

Wow. A lot of stuff came from the Amazon!

A quick look at a typical fragile tomato plant tells
you it did not originate in the freezing cold, high
altitude deserts of the Andes.

Now back to my point. These plants come from the Amazon
rain forest. They are accustomed and evolved to expect
a daily drenching from thunderstorms. So, I was trying to
find out if Higgs was recreating these ideal conditions:
Humid, drenched and drained. (Not high altitude, freezing
nights, and very low moisture.)

This is actually information I am relaying from a local
CSA greenhouse. Their incredible organic tomatoes
were in wet, humid, drained green houses. And EVERY
tomato was incredible: both heirlooms and hybrids
alike.

Do you have tips for her? I hate it that she can't get a
decent tomato. As far as my experience goes, it is all
about the soil.

-T

"David Hare-Scott" writes:

Brooklyn1 wrote:
Stronzo Bestiale wrote:
Fran Farmer wrote:
Stronzo Bestiale wrote:
Fran Farmer wrote:
snotbottom wrote:
It's been nice to see some life in the group again. Let's not
kill it by getting political. I'd rather just read about the
gardening advice and experiences from others and take the
divisive stuff somewhere else.

Climate Change has an impact on those of us who do bother to
garden and who also try to have productive gardens. That makes
climate change on topic here. Climate change only becomes a
divisive issue here when those who can't read for comprehension
try to deny that it is a reality.

He's right. You and Sara are getting political.

It's science.

Oh, you a scientist?

Climate has been changing for a Billion years, so imperceptively
slowly that it has zero effect on a lifetime of gardening, not even
100 life times of gardening.

Factoid not in evidence.

All anyone who gardens need do regarding
climate change is to check their daily weather report and even that is
wrong at least 50% of the time. The people here who insist on arguing
climate change are those pinheads who do not garden, not a one of
those shit stirrers has ever shown pictures of their garden... it's
all their fantasy... the closest they come to gardening is shopping
Walmart's produce.

Utter nonsense, you have seen pictures of my garden and Songbird's at
least. Do you think it funny to say things that simply are not true or
is your mind so stewed that you don't know the difference?

David, it's Brooklyn. Why ask such silly questions.
He lives to insult. Probably confirms his sense of self worth.

As I said before, disgusting.

--
Dan Espen

On 10/03/2015 12:12 AM, Stronzo Bestiale wrote:
On 3/9/2015 3:37 AM, Fran Farmer wrote:
On 9/03/2015 9:09 AM, Stronzo Bestiale wrote:
On 3/8/2015 5:50 PM, Fran Farmer wrote:
On 9/03/2015 8:19 AM, snotbottom wrote:
It's been nice to see some life in the group again. Let's not kill it
by getting political. I'd rather just read about the gardening advice
and experiences from others and take the divisive stuff somewhere
else.

Climate Change has an impact on those of us who do bother to garden and
who also try to have productive gardens. That makes climate change on
topic here. Climate change only becomes a divisive issue here when
those who can't read for comprehension try to deny that it is a
reality.



He's right. You and Sara are getting political.

It's science.



Oh, you a scientist?

Are you a politician?

On 10/03/2015 12:31 AM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
Stronzo Bestiale wrote:
Fran Farmer wrote:
Stronzo Bestiale wrote:
Fran Farmer wrote:
snotbottom wrote:
It's been nice to see some life in the group again. Let's not kill it
by getting political. I'd rather just read about the gardening advice
and experiences from others and take the divisive stuff somewhere else.

Climate Change has an impact on those of us who do bother to garden and
who also try to have productive gardens. That makes climate change on
topic here. Climate change only becomes a divisive issue here when
those who can't read for comprehension try to deny that it is a reality.

He's right. You and Sara are getting political.

It's science.

Oh, you a scientist?

Climate has been changing for a Billion years, so imperceptively
slowly that it has zero effect on a lifetime of gardening, not even
100 life times of gardening. All anyone who gardens need do regarding
climate change is to check their daily weather report and even that is
wrong at least 50% of the time. The people here who insist on arguing
climate change are those pinheads who do not garden, not a one of
those shit stirrers has ever shown pictures of their garden... it's
all their fantasy... the closest they come to gardening is shopping
Walmart's produce.


LOL. Sheldon, you never fail to make me laugh because you are such a
bilious old curmudgeon.

On 10/03/2015 2:25 AM, songbird wrote:
Brooklyn1 wrote:
...
wrong at least 50% of the time. The people here who insist on arguing
climate change are those pinheads who do not garden, not a one of
those shit stirrers has ever shown pictures of their garden... it's
all their fantasy... the closest they come to gardening is shopping
Walmart's produce.

shit stirrers is as good a name as any for a good
gardener.

LOL. Ain't that the truth! The best poop I ever scored was elephant
poop when the circus came to a town near me. It is like giant horse poo
and horse poo is one of my favourite poos.

On 10/03/2015 9:08 AM, David Hare-Scott wrote:
Brooklyn1 wrote:
Stronzo Bestiale wrote:
Fran Farmer wrote:
Stronzo Bestiale wrote:
Fran Farmer wrote:
snotbottom wrote:
It's been nice to see some life in the group again. Let's not
kill it by getting political. I'd rather just read about the
gardening advice and experiences from others and take the
divisive stuff somewhere else.

Climate Change has an impact on those of us who do bother to
garden and who also try to have productive gardens. That makes
climate change on topic here. Climate change only becomes a
divisive issue here when those who can't read for comprehension
try to deny that it is a reality.

He's right. You and Sara are getting political.

It's science.

Oh, you a scientist?

Climate has been changing for a Billion years, so imperceptively
slowly that it has zero effect on a lifetime of gardening, not even
100 life times of gardening.

Factoid not in evidence.

All anyone who gardens need do regarding
climate change is to check their daily weather report and even that is
wrong at least 50% of the time. The people here who insist on arguing
climate change are those pinheads who do not garden, not a one of
those shit stirrers has ever shown pictures of their garden... it's
all their fantasy... the closest they come to gardening is shopping
Walmart's produce.

Utter nonsense, you have seen pictures of my garden and Songbird's at
least. Do you think it funny to say things that simply are not true or
is your mind so stewed that you don't know the difference?

I've been reading Sheldon's posts for aobut 15 year both here and in
other groups and he's never changed in all that time. He enjoys his
sprays and never let's anyone's posting history get in the way when he's
in the mood. He just says the first thing that comes into his head
despite any posting history evidence to the contrary. His spray about
the pictorial evidence posted by others is particularly amusing given
how often he's posted pics here of his meals (plain) and his "garden"
(grass, pot plants and some trees). He does know how to grow grass.

On 10/03/2015 3:59 AM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
On Mon, 09 Mar 2015 11:41:46 -0400, Dan Espen
wrote:

songbird writes:

Brooklyn1 wrote:
...
wrong at least 50% of the time. The people here who insist on arguing
climate change are those pinheads who do not garden, not a one of
those shit stirrers has ever shown pictures of their garden... it's
all their fantasy... the closest they come to gardening is shopping
Walmart's produce.

shit stirrers is as good a name as any for a good
gardener.

Also good to have a nice catchy insult you can deliver while
sitting behind your keyboard.

Those kind of replies obviously mean you don't garden.

Sheldon we've seen many pics of your "garden" so by your own definition,
that must make you a shit stirrer.

A shit stirrer who grows nice grass.

On 10/03/2015 10:24 AM, songbird wrote:
Fran Farmer wrote:
...
Climate Change has an impact on those of us who do bother to garden and
who also try to have productive gardens. That makes climate change on
topic here. Climate change only becomes a divisive issue here when
those who can't read for comprehension try to deny that it is a reality.

looks like a few random trolls to me, neither of
those folks seem to have posted here before much at
all and funny they both pop up on a topic that
they complain about being OT.

I don't recall ever seeing either name before this thread.

to have credibility it would help them if they
actually posted about gardening.

anyways, here is a way that CC will affect many
out west in the USoA, the snowpack this year is
miniscule, affecting 1/3 of the water supply that
many millions of people rely upon.

a fair amount of that snowpack is gone from
an obvious lack of precipitation, but it is made
much worse because the water systems out there
are built around using that snow pack as their
water storage. currently most of the areas seem
to be running at 10-20% of average.

what happens when the snows no longer fall as
snow, but end up as rain or when the snows are
sublimated off due to higher temperatures, well
that is a part of what we are getting now. the
water infrastructure is not built around rain
on the mountains.

to change that one aspect of the water systems
out there will cost many billions of dollars, they're
going to need bigger reservoirs to capture storm
water and store it to get them through the summer
months.

this will pretty much affect anyone out west who
wants to have a garden if they are trying to rely
upon water from the irrigation systems. and it
isn't going to be cheap.

some folks are drilling wells and supplementing
their irrigation by ground water. the problem
there is that everyone else around them is doing
the same thing and the ground water levels are
rapidly falling. prices for drilling? many
thousands of $ for how deep they have to go now
in some places and they don't even know how long
those wells will last. nothing out there is
measured, proven or regulated as of yet, they
are all taking more than is being recharged.

luckily, the past few weeks have improved the
snow pack in the Colorado River Basin (instead of
well below average most are now 10-20% from average,
some are even above average *whew* with some time
yet to go where we can get some more storms to
build up even more snow pack -- that would be great
as the reservoirs on the Colorado River are
approaching points where water will be reduced or
cut off to the most junior water rights holders).
yet another expense is required to build intakes
from Lake Mead to get water to Las Vegas, because
the lake is getting so low.

and as for the question about being a scientist,
yes, i am. nobody is paying me other than myself.

:-)) And less snow for water for the populace is only one of the signs
you've written about...... I keep wondering if it will take famine
conditions in the first world before some people finally manage to join
the dots.