On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 02:33:59 GMT, (Pete Cresswell) wrote:


RE/
If you HAVE to run, then you had better know your wild edible plants, of
which there are more than 1800 species in North America, because trapping
and hunting will SERIOUSLY slow you down...

Think of how old you are.

Now pick a number: the number of estimated years between you and a natural,
inevitable death from old age.

Life is sweet - albiet much too short - and either one of us could wake up dead
tomorrow - heart attack, virus, drunk driver...or just plain stupidity.


Sure.

Stop thinking about the end of the world and enjoy what you have left



I am not thinking about the end of the world. But of the end of an incredibly
destructive culture that MUST die, and soon, or there will be no life on
Earth.

Sorry buddy, reality won't go away just because you don't choose to think
about it.

What I hear you saying is: Well, there's a 99% chance of rain today, but
I am going to leave my raincoat and umbrella behind because it depresses
me to think about the rain.


If you stick your head in the sand, something nasty may very well come along
and **** you in the ass.

And you DESERVE it.

(by-the-way, I think Industrial-Capitalism STINKS and not only enjoy thinking
about another way to live, but find the subject fascinating)



AC

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 02:33:59 GMT, (Pete Cresswell) wrote:


RE/
If you HAVE to run, then you had better know your wild edible plants, of
which there are more than 1800 species in North America, because trapping
and hunting will SERIOUSLY slow you down...

Think of how old you are.

Now pick a number: the number of estimated years between you and a natural,
inevitable death from old age.

Life is sweet - albiet much too short - and either one of us could wake up dead
tomorrow - heart attack, virus, drunk driver...or just plain stupidity.


Sure.

Stop thinking about the end of the world and enjoy what you have left



I am not thinking about the end of the world. But of the end of an incredibly
destructive culture that MUST die, and soon, or there will be no life on
Earth.

Sorry buddy, reality won't go away just because you don't choose to think
about it.

What I hear you saying is: Well, there's a 99% chance of rain today, but
I am going to leave my raincoat and umbrella behind because it depresses
me to think about the rain.


If you stick your head in the sand, something nasty may very well come along
and **** you in the ass.

And you DESERVE it.

(by-the-way, I think Industrial-Capitalism STINKS and not only enjoy thinking
about another way to live, but find the subject fascinating)



AC

In article ,
says...

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 00:28:29 GMT, Alan Connor wrote:



In North America at present, including Canada, there are about 500,000
square
miles of mountain forests that are removed from major population centers
and in a climate that is cold-temperate or better.

Assuming 300,000,000 people in the U.S. and Canada, and that 5% of those
people can make it to, or are already in, the Rockies (etc.), that gives
these
areas a post-Collapse population density of approximately 30 people per
square mile, or about 20 acres apiece, back-to-back.

(your neighbor will be able to hit your house with a thrown rock from
their
front porch)


(these areas include a lot of grasslands, too, but are predominantly
forested)


In these conditions, only a survival group that can remain inconspicuous
will
have a chance of avoiding continual battles with refugees or roving
bandits,
or continually running from them, and the only way to accomplish this is
to
have a plant-based lifestyle.



If you HAVE to run, then you had better know your wild edible plants, of
which there are more than 1800 species in North America, because trapping
and hunting will SERIOUSLY slow you down...


AC

Why would a live by the skin of your teeth existence be preferable to
staying in your own neighborhood or town and working together with your
neighbors and friends?

alanc is obsessed with the idea of running for the hills and living
off the land. In fact he's claimed that's what he and an unspecified
group have already done, setting up a defensive parameter that
includes boobytraps and poison gas generators, as well as trying
to drive any neighbors away by poisoning their water and killing their
animals.

There are doubts as to his sanity...

Furthermore...What Collapse?

alanc dwells constantly on the idea of a coming collapse. He appears to
be one fo those people who are actually looking forward to it,
believing that the destruction of our current civilization will
give them the freedom and opportunity they don't have now. The means
by which The End Of The World As We Know It is to come about is less
important than their desire for it. Even though, in the actual event
of TEOTWAWKI, they will actually probably be the first to suffer...

FW

KB9WFK wrote:

responding to "your neighbor will be able to hit your house with a
thrown rock from their front porch"

you are saying that after the collapse, my neighbors biceps are
going to mutate into such freakishly large proportions that they will
be able to throw rocks 20 acres?

Certainly he was exaggerating, but 20 acre plots aren't all that large.
Unless I can't do math in my head anymore (quite possible): if your
house was offset 80% off center towards the neighbor's lot and his
front porch offset similarly toward yours (not totally unreasonable),
the throw would be possible, I think (I could throw a rock close to 100
yards as a kid and I was far from the best). The concept is not hugely
off. From center to center, probably more on point, it would take a
great tee shot rather than a thrown rock.

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 02:43:51 GMT, Alan Connor wrote:

(snip)
Who said anything about a "skin of your teeth existence". It is possible to
live very comfortably with no animal products and in a camoflauged settlement.

Yeah, in a fantasy, ANYTHING is possible.


As for staying with your friends and neighbors, well, if you live on a road,
then refugees and bandits will find you, easily, and you'll have to deal with
them.

Yeah, everybody knows that refugees and bandits can ONLY travel on roads. :/

(less so with a small, remote town, of course)


It is also very hard to be self-sufficient in a town and impossible if the
majority of people aren't prepared.

The resources generally aren't the land and trees and minerals and water.
(most municipal water systems will not survive and are very easy to sabotage,
giving
bandits a way to bring you to your knees)

Yeah, land, trees, minerals and water don't exist in towns. :/


Furthermore...What Collapse?

The one that pillaging the planet with a lifestyle that requires a large
under-class inevitably leads to.

Like the Great Depression.

The Great Depression was just an almost-collapse of an economic system.


That's all the Collapse is, a Great Depression in a world with too many
unhappy people that lacks the resources and social cohesivenss to recover.

It is the Final Depression.

It ain't final until the Fat Lady sings. So far all I hear is a stupid man
crowing.

Well it will be a good thing when "America Collapse"
Then you will not have a ISP to post you crap!

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 03:28:33 GMT, Alan Connor wrote:

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 02:33:59 GMT, (Pete Cresswell) wrote:


RE/
If you HAVE to run, then you had better know your wild edible plants, of
which there are more than 1800 species in North America, because trapping
and hunting will SERIOUSLY slow you down...

Think of how old you are.

Now pick a number: the number of estimated years between you and a natural,
inevitable death from old age.

Life is sweet - albiet much too short - and either one of us could wake up dead
tomorrow - heart attack, virus, drunk driver...or just plain stupidity.


Sure.

Stop thinking about the end of the world and enjoy what you have left



I am not thinking about the end of the world. But of the end of an incredibly
destructive culture that MUST die, and soon, or there will be no life on
Earth.

Sorry buddy, reality won't go away just because you don't choose to think
about it.

What I hear you saying is: Well, there's a 99% chance of rain today, but
I am going to leave my raincoat and umbrella behind because it depresses
me to think about the rain.


If you stick your head in the sand, something nasty may very well come along
and **** you in the ass.

And you DESERVE it.

(by-the-way, I think Industrial-Capitalism STINKS and not only enjoy thinking
about another way to live, but find the subject fascinating)



AC

In article , Heynony
wrote:

KB9WFK wrote:

responding to "your neighbor will be able to hit your house with a
thrown rock from their front porch"

you are saying that after the collapse, my neighbors biceps are
going to mutate into such freakishly large proportions that they will
be able to throw rocks 20 acres?

Certainly he was exaggerating, but 20 acre plots aren't all that large.

TYPE ERROR: "Acres" are a unit of area, not a unit of distance.

It's simlar to saying "Bob is five pounds older than Fred."

You retards need to get off the Net.


--Tim May

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 04:52:18 GMT, Raid said:

Well it will be a good thing when "America Collapse"
Then you will not have a ISP to post you crap!

You must be new to the Alan Connor saga.
Alan and his band of hippies who live at the "wildwood" hippy commune
plan to weave their own ISP out of hemp fibers. You missed the
dissusion of how alan and his buddys hand rolled their own transistors
while sitting around the camp fire.

On Sat, 17 Jan 2004 21:31:14 -0800, Tim May
wrote:

In article , Heynony
wrote:

KB9WFK wrote:

responding to "your neighbor will be able to hit your house with a
thrown rock from their front porch"

you are saying that after the collapse, my neighbors biceps are
going to mutate into such freakishly large proportions that they will
be able to throw rocks 20 acres?

Certainly he was exaggerating, but 20 acre plots aren't all that large.

TYPE ERROR: "Acres" are a unit of area, not a unit of distance.

I think everyone was pretty much picturing the 20 acres as a square
and getting the distance from that. Note Heynony's reference to
placement of the houses on a 20 acre plot.

It's simlar to saying "Bob is five pounds older than Fred."

Who the hell are Bob and Fred and how many years taller is he?

You retards need to get off the Net.

--Tim May
Ouch. That really hurt my feelings Tim. I see the humour content of
my post missed you completely or did you really think that I was
serious about the mutated neighbor?
Talk about retards.. Kettle, meet Mr. Pot.
When I want my smart-assed replies peer reviewed I'll give you a call.
Perhaps you deserve killing...

kb9wfk

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 03:28:33 GMT, Alan Connor wrote:

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 02:33:59 GMT, (Pete Cresswell) wrote:


RE/
If you HAVE to run, then you had better know your wild edible plants, of
which there are more than 1800 species in North America, because trapping
and hunting will SERIOUSLY slow you down...

Think of how old you are.

Now pick a number: the number of estimated years between you and a natural,
inevitable death from old age.

Life is sweet - albiet much too short - and either one of us could wake up dead
tomorrow - heart attack, virus, drunk driver...or just plain stupidity.


Sure.

Stop thinking about the end of the world and enjoy what you have left



I am not thinking about the end of the world. But of the end of an incredibly
destructive culture that MUST die, and soon, or there will be no life on
Earth.

Sorry buddy, reality won't go away just because you don't choose to think
about it.

Reality? Snicker. Since when have you become acquainted with
reality?


What I hear you saying is: Well, there's a 99% chance of rain today, but
I am going to leave my raincoat and umbrella behind because it depresses
me to think about the rain.

You need your hearing checked. You might get a reality check at the
same time.



If you stick your head in the sand, something nasty may very well come along
and **** you in the ass.

Fantasizing again, Alan/David?


And you DESERVE it.

(by-the-way, I think Industrial-Capitalism STINKS and not only enjoy thinking
about another way to live, but find the subject fascinating)

Aha. There ya go. "*Thinking* about another way to live."
*Thinking*, not *doing*. Alan/David, I'm proud of you. You've
finally come to terms with your fantasy life. Good Boy.
Sue



AC

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 05:52:06 GMT, KB9WFK wrote:

On Sat, 17 Jan 2004 21:31:14 -0800, Tim May
wrote:

In article , Heynony
wrote:

KB9WFK wrote:

responding to "your neighbor will be able to hit your house with a
thrown rock from their front porch"

you are saying that after the collapse, my neighbors biceps are
going to mutate into such freakishly large proportions that they will
be able to throw rocks 20 acres?

Certainly he was exaggerating, but 20 acre plots aren't all that large.

TYPE ERROR: "Acres" are a unit of area, not a unit of distance.

I think everyone was pretty much picturing the 20 acres as a square
and getting the distance from that. Note Heynony's reference to
placement of the houses on a 20 acre plot.

It's simlar to saying "Bob is five pounds older than Fred."

Who the hell are Bob and Fred and how many years taller is he?

You retards need to get off the Net.

--Tim May
Ouch. That really hurt my feelings Tim. I see the humour content of
my post missed you completely or did you really think that I was
serious about the mutated neighbor?
Talk about retards.. Kettle, meet Mr. Pot.
When I want my smart-assed replies peer reviewed I'll give you a call.
Perhaps you deserve killing...

ROFL!
Sue who thoroughly enjoys your sense of humor

kb9wfk

On 18 Jan 2004 04:37:13 GMT, (Frank White)
wrote:

In article ,
says...

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 00:28:29 GMT, Alan Connor wrote:



In North America at present, including Canada, there are about 500,000
square
miles of mountain forests that are removed from major population centers
and in a climate that is cold-temperate or better.

Assuming 300,000,000 people in the U.S. and Canada, and that 5% of those
people can make it to, or are already in, the Rockies (etc.), that gives
these
areas a post-Collapse population density of approximately 30 people per
square mile, or about 20 acres apiece, back-to-back.

(your neighbor will be able to hit your house with a thrown rock from
their
front porch)


(these areas include a lot of grasslands, too, but are predominantly
forested)


In these conditions, only a survival group that can remain inconspicuous
will
have a chance of avoiding continual battles with refugees or roving
bandits,
or continually running from them, and the only way to accomplish this is
to
have a plant-based lifestyle.



If you HAVE to run, then you had better know your wild edible plants, of
which there are more than 1800 species in North America, because trapping
and hunting will SERIOUSLY slow you down...


AC

Why would a live by the skin of your teeth existence be preferable to
staying in your own neighborhood or town and working together with your
neighbors and friends?

alanc is obsessed with the idea of running for the hills and living
off the land. In fact he's claimed that's what he and an unspecified
group have already done, setting up a defensive parameter that
includes boobytraps and poison gas generators, as well as trying
to drive any neighbors away by poisoning their water and killing their
animals.

There are doubts as to his sanity...

Doubts? Doubts? The dude is a ****ing loon. A Walter Mitty consumed
by the Tarnsman of Gor books. A paranoid with at least 5 alter egos,
most of whom are also ****ing loons.

We are not sure if he is not GunKid or Mabu the Gagnificicent.
Shrug..but he makes a great punching bag.

Furthermore...What Collapse?

alanc dwells constantly on the idea of a coming collapse. He appears to
be one fo those people who are actually looking forward to it,
believing that the destruction of our current civilization will
give them the freedom and opportunity they don't have now. The means
by which The End Of The World As We Know It is to come about is less
important than their desire for it. Even though, in the actual event
of TEOTWAWKI, they will actually probably be the first to suffer...

FW

Alan/Mabu/GunKid will load up their Main Battle Wheelbarrows with
laser sighted Lorcin .380s, DingDongs and Twinkies, a couple dogeared
and stained copies of Hustlers Beaver Hunt Specials and shortly be run
over by a middle aged long haired Vietnam vet in a Dodge Ram pickup
Bugging Out, who will only look in the rear view mirror to see what
caused that gyser of shit and the muffled thump.

Gunner

" ..The world has gone crazy. Guess I'm showing my age...
I think it dates from when we started looking at virtues
as funny. It's embarrassing to speak of honor, integrity,
bravery, patriotism, 'doing the right thing', charity,
fairness. You have Seinfeld making cowardice an acceptable
choice; our politicians changing positions of honor with
every poll; we laugh at servicemen and patriotic fervor; we
accept corruption in our police and bias in our judges; we
kill our children, and wonder why they have no respect for
Life. We deny children their childhood and innocence- and
then we denigrate being a Man, as opposed to a 'person'. We
*assume* that anyone with a weapon will use it against his
fellowman- if only he has the chance. Nah; in our agitation
to keep the State out of the church business, we've
destroyed our value system and replaced it with *nothing*.
Turns my stomach- " Chas , rec.knives

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 04:52:18 GMT, Raid wrote:

Well it will be a good thing when "America Collapse"
Then you will not have a ISP to post you crap!


Sorry Bubba, but like firearms, nuclear weapons and oral sex, the
genie is out of the bottle. Even after a Collapse..the Net will be one
of the first things to become reimplimented. In one fashion or
another.

Gunner


On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 03:28:33 GMT, Alan Connor wrote:

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 02:33:59 GMT, (Pete Cresswell) wrote:


RE/
If you HAVE to run, then you had better know your wild edible plants, of
which there are more than 1800 species in North America, because trapping
and hunting will SERIOUSLY slow you down...

Think of how old you are.

Now pick a number: the number of estimated years between you and a natural,
inevitable death from old age.

Life is sweet - albiet much too short - and either one of us could wake up dead
tomorrow - heart attack, virus, drunk driver...or just plain stupidity.


Sure.

Stop thinking about the end of the world and enjoy what you have left



I am not thinking about the end of the world. But of the end of an incredibly
destructive culture that MUST die, and soon, or there will be no life on
Earth.

Sorry buddy, reality won't go away just because you don't choose to think
about it.

What I hear you saying is: Well, there's a 99% chance of rain today, but
I am going to leave my raincoat and umbrella behind because it depresses
me to think about the rain.


If you stick your head in the sand, something nasty may very well come along
and **** you in the ass.

And you DESERVE it.

(by-the-way, I think Industrial-Capitalism STINKS and not only enjoy thinking
about another way to live, but find the subject fascinating)



AC

" ..The world has gone crazy. Guess I'm showing my age...
I think it dates from when we started looking at virtues
as funny. It's embarrassing to speak of honor, integrity,
bravery, patriotism, 'doing the right thing', charity,
fairness. You have Seinfeld making cowardice an acceptable
choice; our politicians changing positions of honor with
every poll; we laugh at servicemen and patriotic fervor; we
accept corruption in our police and bias in our judges; we
kill our children, and wonder why they have no respect for
Life. We deny children their childhood and innocence- and
then we denigrate being a Man, as opposed to a 'person'. We
*assume* that anyone with a weapon will use it against his
fellowman- if only he has the chance. Nah; in our agitation
to keep the State out of the church business, we've
destroyed our value system and replaced it with *nothing*.
Turns my stomach- " Chas , rec.knives

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 07:02:33 GMT, Gunner
wrote:

On 18 Jan 2004 04:37:13 GMT, (Frank White)
wrote:

In article ,
says...

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 00:28:29 GMT, Alan Connor wrote:



In North America at present, including Canada, there are about 500,000
square
miles of mountain forests that are removed from major population centers
and in a climate that is cold-temperate or better.

Assuming 300,000,000 people in the U.S. and Canada, and that 5% of those
people can make it to, or are already in, the Rockies (etc.), that gives
these
areas a post-Collapse population density of approximately 30 people per
square mile, or about 20 acres apiece, back-to-back.

(your neighbor will be able to hit your house with a thrown rock from
their
front porch)


(these areas include a lot of grasslands, too, but are predominantly
forested)


In these conditions, only a survival group that can remain inconspicuous
will
have a chance of avoiding continual battles with refugees or roving
bandits,
or continually running from them, and the only way to accomplish this is
to
have a plant-based lifestyle.



If you HAVE to run, then you had better know your wild edible plants, of
which there are more than 1800 species in North America, because trapping
and hunting will SERIOUSLY slow you down...


AC

Why would a live by the skin of your teeth existence be preferable to
staying in your own neighborhood or town and working together with your
neighbors and friends?

alanc is obsessed with the idea of running for the hills and living
off the land. In fact he's claimed that's what he and an unspecified
group have already done, setting up a defensive parameter that
includes boobytraps and poison gas generators, as well as trying
to drive any neighbors away by poisoning their water and killing their
animals.

There are doubts as to his sanity...

Doubts? Doubts? The dude is a ****ing loon. A Walter Mitty consumed
by the Tarnsman of Gor books.

Oddly enough, I'm watcing The Secret Life of Walter Mitty right now.
Hipockita, hipockita (sp?).
Sue

In article ,
says...

On Sat, 17 Jan 2004 21:31:14 -0800, Tim May
wrote:

snip

You retards need to get off the Net.

--Tim May
Ouch. That really hurt my feelings Tim. I see the humour content of
my post missed you completely or did you really think that I was
serious about the mutated neighbor?

Tim doesn't have any humor.

Talk about retards.. Kettle, meet Mr. Pot.
When I want my smart-assed replies peer reviewed I'll give you a call.

He'll show up regardless of call, unless you manage to
offend him to the point he killfiles you.

There are a lot of us in his killfile...

Perhaps you deserve killing...

Woo. That's interesting. That's what Tim says about almost
everyone else.



FW