(Laur) wrote in message om...
Dear fellow gardeners,
I have a small garden, and have had one every year for the past
couple of years. I've never had deer eat anything. One reason is
because I grow herbs in my garden, and deer don't like herbs. Also,
to keep bugs away from our tomato plants, I surround the perimeter of
the garden with marigolds. I hope that this helps.
Laurie

A friend of a friend swears that trolling wire streched around the
garden befuddles the deer through some effect of magnetism. He claims
that the deer walk up to the wire, startle, and walk away. Has anyone
heard of such a thing? I thought that I had heard (and tried) every
folk remedy but this is a new one!!

Deer netting works well but they can and do punch through.

Sally
http://www.aneclecticgarden.com

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 18:31:37 GMT, Salty Thumb
wrote:

Frogleg wrote

The clue for folk remedies is any discussion whatsoever. IF soap (of
any brand), or human hair or urine or chile solution actually worked,
there would be no discussion. It would be in all the FAQs. It would be
standard advice in gardening mags and newspaper columns.

what you just said is: because discussion, therefore folk remedy,
therefore ineffective, which just isn't a logical conclusion.

Perhaps I wasn't clear enough. What I meant was that when there is a
lively exchange of anecdotal material and folklore remedies for a
problem, it is pretty much a given that the "solutions" proposed are
wishful thinking. For every "I sprinkled human hair around and no
longer have a problem," there are a dozen "I tried the hair thing and
it didn't make a bit of difference." If any of these myths worked
reliably, there would be no discussion. Someone would ask how to
prevent deer (or rabbits) from eating domestic greenery, the reply
would be "Avon Skin-So-Soft on cotton balls", with 2 "yes, this works"
follow-ons.

One problem with (1st hand) anecdotal evidence is that much of it is
quite truthful. Person A may very well have had deer devouring his
rosebushes, hung up a bar of soap, and then no deer. However, there
could be several reasons for this: deer weren't terrifically hungry,
and the scent of soap was enough to discourage them; deer found better
food (rosebushes had become stubs) and moved on; human activity in
the area spooked them and they decided not to return; it was one
animal doing the damage and that one died...etc., etc. So for that
person, soap "worked." Forever after, he's going to tell everyone a
bar of Lifebuoy is magic. Even if he has a similar problem later or in
another place (with hungrier deer), and soap doesn't work, he's going
to swear the formulation of the soap has changed, and wax nostalgic
about the good ol' deer-repelling version.

Frogleg wrote in
:

On Sun, 22 Aug 2004 18:31:37 GMT, Salty Thumb
wrote:

Frogleg wrote

The clue for folk remedies is any discussion whatsoever. IF soap (of
any brand), or human hair or urine or chile solution actually
worked, there would be no discussion. It would be in all the FAQs.
It would be standard advice in gardening mags and newspaper columns.

what you just said is: because discussion, therefore folk remedy,
therefore ineffective, which just isn't a logical conclusion.

Perhaps I wasn't clear enough. What I meant was that when there is a
lively exchange of anecdotal material and folklore remedies for a
problem, it is pretty much a given that the "solutions" proposed are
wishful thinking. For every "I sprinkled human hair around and no
longer have a problem," there are a dozen "I tried the hair thing and
it didn't make a bit of difference." If any of these myths worked
reliably, there would be no discussion. Someone would ask how to
prevent deer (or rabbits) from eating domestic greenery, the reply
would be "Avon Skin-So-Soft on cotton balls", with 2 "yes, this works"
follow-ons.

One problem with (1st hand) anecdotal evidence is that much of it is
quite truthful. Person A may very well have had deer devouring his
rosebushes, hung up a bar of soap, and then no deer. However, there
could be several reasons for this: deer weren't terrifically hungry,
and the scent of soap was enough to discourage them; deer found better
food (rosebushes had become stubs) and moved on; human activity in
the area spooked them and they decided not to return; it was one
animal doing the damage and that one died...etc., etc. So for that
person, soap "worked." Forever after, he's going to tell everyone a
bar of Lifebuoy is magic. Even if he has a similar problem later or in
another place (with hungrier deer), and soap doesn't work, he's going
to swear the formulation of the soap has changed, and wax nostalgic
about the good ol' deer-repelling version.


I agree except I don't think having a discussion indicates the useful /
uselessness of a folk remedy any more than having a discussion about a
manufactured herbicide (use full strength, use 2x concentration, 2x
doesn't work as well, RTFL, use a paint brush to apply, doesn't work at
all XYZ plants, etc) indicates that herbicide is a folk remedy.

While this discussion turned out to be as lively as a bottle fish
emulsion, does the fact that we are talking about it affect the validity
of your assertion (while not a folk remedy per se, but could be
considered as folk wisdom)? Perhaps everyone else in the universe is
silently nodding their head at you (lack of discussion), in which you
would be right. On the other hand, everyone may think you are wrong, but
lack the time, wherewithal or conviction to say anything.

For what it's worth, soap is also recommended as possibly effective for
"minor deer damage problems" on p.11 of Rodale's _All-New Encyclopedia of
Organic Gardening_, 1997. If it doesn't work, you can take a cold
shower afterwards.

(an eclectic garden) wrote in
om:

(Laur) wrote in message
om...
Dear fellow gardeners,
I have a small garden, and have had one every year for the past
couple of years. I've never had deer eat anything. One reason is
because I grow herbs in my garden, and deer don't like herbs. Also,
to keep bugs away from our tomato plants, I surround the perimeter of
the garden with marigolds. I hope that this helps.
Laurie

A friend of a friend swears that trolling wire streched around the
garden befuddles the deer through some effect of magnetism. He claims
that the deer walk up to the wire, startle, and walk away. Has anyone
heard of such a thing? I thought that I had heard (and tried) every
folk remedy but this is a new one!!

Deer netting works well but they can and do punch through.

Sally
http://www.aneclecticgarden.com


I don't rememeber every hearing about that one either. I doubt it is
magnetism but you never know. Supposedly certain lobsters can use the
earth's magnetic field to orient themselves, but it would probably take
more teslas (or whatever the unit is) than can be had from a simple non-
electrified wire.

Probably the deer just can't see or resolve the wire and get spooked.
Sort of like birds that never heard of glass and keep pecking at their
reflection.

Or maybe they do see it and are smart enough to think "I'm likely to
garrote myself if I need to run away, so I'll just stay away".

On Wed, 25 Aug 2004 13:13:47 GMT, Salty Thumb
wrote:

Frogleg wrote in
:

Perhaps I wasn't clear enough. What I meant was that when there is a
lively exchange of anecdotal material and folklore remedies for a
problem, it is pretty much a given that the "solutions" proposed are
wishful thinking. For every "I sprinkled human hair around and no
longer have a problem," there are a dozen "I tried the hair thing and
it didn't make a bit of difference." If any of these myths worked
reliably, there would be no discussion. Someone would ask how to
prevent deer (or rabbits) from eating domestic greenery, the reply
would be "Avon Skin-So-Soft on cotton balls", with 2 "yes, this works"
follow-ons.

I agree except I don't think having a discussion indicates the useful /
uselessness of a folk remedy any more than having a discussion about a
manufactured herbicide (use full strength, use 2x concentration, 2x
doesn't work as well, RTFL, use a paint brush to apply, doesn't work at
all XYZ plants, etc) indicates that herbicide is a folk remedy.

What I mean by "discussion" is an ongoing thread that includes "my
uncle always..." and "the pieplates worked/didn't work for me..."
introducing all the mythological fixes we've read dozens of times.

Obviously, "discussion" doesn't mean folklore, or there'd be
rec.gardens.folklore and rec.gardens.RTFL.

How would *you* distinguish between passing along the 'fact' that soap
on a rope will keep deer away from your azaleas, and the information
that RoundUp *doesn't* work on plants with thick, waxy leaves like ivy
and Vinca?

While this discussion turned out to be as lively as a bottle fish
emulsion, does the fact that we are talking about it affect the validity
of your assertion (while not a folk remedy per se, but could be
considered as folk wisdom)?

Well, at least we're not discussing the many and varied ways to get
around the serious business of putting up a deer fence. :-)

For what it's worth, soap is also recommended as possibly effective for
"minor deer damage problems" on p.11 of Rodale's _All-New Encyclopedia of
Organic Gardening_, 1997. If it doesn't work, you can take a cold
shower afterwards.

"Minor deer damage"? Fawns nibbling daintily at just the *tips* of the
asparagus? :-) *I* think it means "not very hungry deer."