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Old 07-11-2004, 01:01 AM
Mark Anderson
 
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Default Rosemary bush dying (-:

I think I did something stupid. A couple of weeks ago the weathermen
forecast night time temps in the 20s here in Chicago, Zone 5. I panicked
and brought in all the house plants. I also brought in my Rosemary bush
which is 1 1/2 years old, which I nurtured inside all last winter under
fluorescents. I placed the bush under fluorescents and for some reason
it just started dying. There is some green in the leaves but it doesn't
look good, a lot of stems have completely died. The root system is big
and it grew in a 24" wide container. I really hoped I could overwinter
it inside and have it get huge for next summer. Now it looks hopeless.

Does anyone have any idea as to how to save this? I can't believe the
root system would just die off like that. If I cut the entire plant down
will the roots spawn new stems? I since moved the plant from
fluorescents and placed it under my new HID High Pressure Sodium lights
for my indoor winter garden. It gets 14 hours of "sunlight" now.

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Old 07-11-2004, 06:29 AM
Dan
 
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Default

On Sat, 6 Nov 2004 18:01:23 -0600, Mark Anderson
wrote:

I think I did something stupid. A couple of weeks ago the weathermen
forecast night time temps in the 20s here in Chicago, Zone 5. I panicked
and brought in all the house plants. I also brought in my Rosemary bush
which is 1 1/2 years old, which I nurtured inside all last winter under
fluorescents. I placed the bush under fluorescents and for some reason
it just started dying. There is some green in the leaves but it doesn't
look good, a lot of stems have completely died. The root system is big
and it grew in a 24" wide container. I really hoped I could overwinter
it inside and have it get huge for next summer. Now it looks hopeless.


Saturate with water. Rosemary wants tons of water. Rootbound plants
need even more. Give lots of nitrogen, too (I feed it manure tea) and
a handful of lime sprinkled around the dirt..

I've also had tough luck with Rosemary, but somehow this plant is over
a year old and about 3 feet tall (no flowers yet). I believe the
major trick is "EXCESSIVE watering". Don't believe the ads when they
say "drought tolerant"

Dan

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Old 07-11-2004, 01:05 PM
Pam - gardengal
 
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Default


"Dan" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 6 Nov 2004 18:01:23 -0600, Mark Anderson
wrote:

Saturate with water. Rosemary wants tons of water. Rootbound plants
need even more. Give lots of nitrogen, too (I feed it manure tea) and
a handful of lime sprinkled around the dirt..

I've also had tough luck with Rosemary, but somehow this plant is over
a year old and about 3 feet tall (no flowers yet). I believe the
major trick is "EXCESSIVE watering". Don't believe the ads when they
say "drought tolerant"

You can't be farther away from the truth - rosemary does not need
"excessive" watering, will resent it if you do, plus it requires minimal
fertilizing as well. As with most plants native to a temperate zone, it is
not happy being grown in the house. And it needs time to acclimatize from
being outside. Keep in very bright but indirect light, water sparingly and
increase humidity levels by adding a glass or two of water to the general
vicinity. Keep out of drafts or away from direct sources of heat.

pam - gardengal


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Old 07-11-2004, 05:32 PM
Paul Below
 
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Default

On Sat, 6 Nov 2004 18:01:23 -0600, Mark Anderson
wrote:

I can't believe the
root system would just die off like that.


Wonder if it was overwatered. Rosemary roots don't like to be
constantly moist, in a pot the roots might have rotted.


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Old 07-11-2004, 08:07 PM
Dan Charette
 
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Default

Hi Mark...

I'm in Omaha and I've worked with moving Rosemary in and out through
summers and winters. I've learned a few things in the process.
Rosemary is very temperamental when it is in a pot. One, it doesn't
like excessive watering. Two, it's important to have a soil mixture
in your pot that has reasonably good drainage but not to the point of
being sand with no moisture holding ability at all. I have my plants
in a pot with a 50/50 mixture of fine silty sand and some regular
garden soil. I've found that it's also necessary to "massage" the
plants in a sense. That is that you need to get movement to the
leaves and stems somehow either via a small fan every now and then or
just ruffling the stems with your hands. And also, you need to trim
on it every now and then. It seems to me that when the plant is inert
and not interacted with physically, growth is very sparse and can be
somewhat stemmy. But when the plant is exposed to some physical
stress via a small breeze, the plant seems to grow a little more
resilient. Also, regular cuttings seem to promote new growth. Don't
give up on the plant just yet or panic by over watering what's going
on now. Just try to ease the stress the plant is seeing by trying to
make the transistion from garden to house more smooth. Make sure
you're giving it similar light conditions and soil conditions. Also,
temperature is important. My plant lives in a southern window on a
concrete floor. I've found that the evening cooling is important.
Remember, the plants origins are in a Mediterranean in a cooler zone
where sometimes it can be just above freezing. I've been trying to
grow Rosemary in this region for about 15 years now. And I've finally
seemed to have found that balance that is close enough to work. I've
got three different varieties in a single 5 gallon black plastic pot
that has been going on about 3 years with steady growth. So, just
keep experimenting and don't lose hope.

Dan


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Old 07-11-2004, 11:04 PM
Phisherman
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Sat, 6 Nov 2004 18:01:23 -0600, Mark Anderson
wrote:

I think I did something stupid. A couple of weeks ago the weathermen
forecast night time temps in the 20s here in Chicago, Zone 5. I panicked
and brought in all the house plants. I also brought in my Rosemary bush
which is 1 1/2 years old, which I nurtured inside all last winter under
fluorescents. I placed the bush under fluorescents and for some reason
it just started dying. There is some green in the leaves but it doesn't
look good, a lot of stems have completely died. The root system is big
and it grew in a 24" wide container. I really hoped I could overwinter
it inside and have it get huge for next summer. Now it looks hopeless.

Does anyone have any idea as to how to save this? I can't believe the
root system would just die off like that. If I cut the entire plant down
will the roots spawn new stems? I since moved the plant from
fluorescents and placed it under my new HID High Pressure Sodium lights
for my indoor winter garden. It gets 14 hours of "sunlight" now.


The new light may work. My rosemary bushes live outside (Zone 7) all
year. Be extra careful about overwatering, quick drainage, and no
fertilizer. You could also try to start new plants from cuttings (I
got 4 successful rootings from 7 cuttings). Generally cuttings will
root well under fluorescent lighting.
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Old 08-11-2004, 02:02 AM
Ann
 
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Default

Mark Anderson expounded:

Does anyone have any idea as to how to save this? I can't believe the
root system would just die off like that. If I cut the entire plant down
will the roots spawn new stems? I since moved the plant from
fluorescents and placed it under my new HID High Pressure Sodium lights
for my indoor winter garden. It gets 14 hours of "sunlight" now.


Here is a repost discussing the potting up of Rosemary to bring it in
for the winter:

Many people have asked how to overwinter Rosemary. A friend of mine,
a fellow member of the New England Unit of the Herb Society of
America, put this in our recent newsletter, the Pennyroyal Papers. I
hope it helps someone )

Success with Rosemary by Deb Peterson

1. Rosemary can stay outside until the temps stay below 45°. It can
withstand some frost (Don't let the pot freeze in the ground, though,
so you can't dig it out).

2. Bring it into the coolest part of the house. Rosemary is happy
with night time temperatures in the fifties or even the forties.

3. Give it as much light as possible.

4. A DRY ROSEMARY IS A DEAD ROSEMARY (not shouting, but emphasis).
Don't let it dry out, but don't keep it too wet. Texas potting is the
secret to this dilemma. (It is remarkable drought tolerant in the
summer out in the garden) Texas potting is explained below.

5. If your rosemary should develop powdery mildew, spray lightly with
a mixture of one tablespoon alcohol to a cup of water. Give it a
chill outside on a warm winter day. Powdery mildew is due to a lack
of air circulation.
************************************************** **************************

Texas Potting:

You will need:

1. Steak or roast carving fork (2 prongs)
2. A bag of perlite.
3. Appropriate sized plastic pots.
4. A source for flame

Heat the steak fork and make a double row of holes around the bottom
of the pot.

Make another row of holes just below the watering lip.

Put the perlite in the bottom of the pot to just cover the double
holes around the bottom.

Pot up your plant with regular potting soil. Water well.

Put the potted plants in a water tight container and fill the
container to any height to just above the bottom row of holes (this is
a great way to leave plants when you travel).

The secret of this system is the upper row of holes. These holes
supply air to the roots. Clay pots are porous and can be used without
making air holes. If you use clay, put at least 2" of perlite in the
bottom. This system also works well with cyclamens.
--
Ann, Gardening in zone 6a
Just south of Boston, MA
********************************
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Old 08-11-2004, 02:17 AM
Dan
 
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Default

On Sun, 07 Nov 2004 12:05:24 GMT, "Pam - gardengal"
wrote:

You can't be farther away from the truth - rosemary does not need
"excessive" watering, will resent it if you do, plus it requires minimal
fertilizing as well. As with most plants native to a temperate zone, it is
not happy being grown in the house. And it needs time to acclimatize from
being outside. Keep in very bright but indirect light, water sparingly and
increase humidity levels by adding a glass or two of water to the general
vicinity. Keep out of drafts or away from direct sources of heat.


I may be off a little bit with watering the soil, but I sprayed the
foliage all through last winter, and it seemed to enjoy it. It is one
of the more difficult herbs to keep alive, especially up here in zone
5. Definetly needs to be kept in a pot, and it will always fill the
pot and want more...which isn't a bad thing.

Does anyone know when the upright variety of rosemary starts
sprouting flowers? This one is 1 1/2 years old, 3 ft tall but no
flowers yet....a little upsetting But I am glad it's still
alive...the past two died & dried out in the pot.

Dan

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Old 08-11-2004, 06:10 PM
Bill Spohn
 
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Default

We have no trouble wintering Rosemary in the ground here in coastal BC (zone
8/9) but I agree that too much water will kill it effectively - they do seem to
like good drainage.
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Old 08-11-2004, 06:20 PM
Doug Kanter
 
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Default


"Pam - gardengal" wrote in message
news:8cojd.475638$mD.183276@attbi_s02...

"Dan" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 6 Nov 2004 18:01:23 -0600, Mark Anderson
wrote:

Saturate with water. Rosemary wants tons of water. Rootbound plants
need even more. Give lots of nitrogen, too (I feed it manure tea) and
a handful of lime sprinkled around the dirt..

I've also had tough luck with Rosemary, but somehow this plant is over
a year old and about 3 feet tall (no flowers yet). I believe the
major trick is "EXCESSIVE watering". Don't believe the ads when they
say "drought tolerant"

You can't be farther away from the truth - rosemary does not need
"excessive" watering, will resent it if you do, plus it requires minimal
fertilizing as well. As with most plants native to a temperate zone, it is
not happy being grown in the house. And it needs time to acclimatize from
being outside. Keep in very bright but indirect light, water sparingly and
increase humidity levels by adding a glass or two of water to the general
vicinity. Keep out of drafts or away from direct sources of heat.

pam - gardengal



I agree about the humidity, although I say this only in theory, because I'm
still struggling with MY rosemary plants. I recall reading that they grow
mightily along the Mediterrean coastline, in weird rocky soil, like beach
roses. Does that point to more lime, rather than the typical bagged potting
soil, which contains lots of peat moss?




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Old 08-11-2004, 07:49 PM
David Ross
 
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Default

Mark Anderson wrote:

I think I did something stupid. A couple of weeks ago the weathermen
forecast night time temps in the 20s here in Chicago, Zone 5. I panicked
and brought in all the house plants. I also brought in my Rosemary bush
which is 1 1/2 years old, which I nurtured inside all last winter under
fluorescents. I placed the bush under fluorescents and for some reason
it just started dying. There is some green in the leaves but it doesn't
look good, a lot of stems have completely died. The root system is big
and it grew in a 24" wide container. I really hoped I could overwinter
it inside and have it get huge for next summer. Now it looks hopeless.

Does anyone have any idea as to how to save this? I can't believe the
root system would just die off like that. If I cut the entire plant down
will the roots spawn new stems? I since moved the plant from
fluorescents and placed it under my new HID High Pressure Sodium lights
for my indoor winter garden. It gets 14 hours of "sunlight" now.


The problem is, of course, trying to grow a shrub (not merely a
perennial or annual) outside of its proper climate. You must
expend a great effort and still expect some grief.

In its natural environment, rosemary has a dry summer and a
not-so-dry winter (some rain but not much). The soil is "lean" but
not totally devoid of nutrients. The plant grows in full sun.

I have a rosemary bush in front of my house. It's more than 25
years old and is taller than I am (until I prune it). In the
summer, it gets watered perhaps 3-4 times. In the winter, I let
the rain take care of all watering. I never feed it.

It flowers in the early spring, after which I prune it for
appearance and not for renewal. Most of the pruning is to expose
the gnarled branches that are so picturesque.

Yes, we do get frost in the winter, sometimes several consecutive
nights. But it all disappears with sunrise. We have had snow
twice since I planted the rosemary; the snow never lingered more
than a few hours.

In the same bed as the rosemary, I have dwarf coyote bush
(Baccharis pilularis) and a valley white oak (Quercus lobata).
They all take the same ca rarely watered and never fed.
However, since they are near line of rose bushes, I would not be
surprised if their roots extend under the roses to capture some
water and nutrients or even farther under my neighbor's front
lawn.

--
David E. Ross
Climate: California Mediterranean
Sunset Zone: 21 -- interior Santa Monica Mountains with some ocean
influence (USDA 10a, very close to Sunset Zone 19)
Gardening pages at http://www.rossde.com/garden/
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Old 09-11-2004, 01:00 AM
Mark Anderson
 
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Default

In article says...
The new light may work. My rosemary bushes live outside (Zone 7) all
year. Be extra careful about overwatering, quick drainage, and no
fertilizer. You could also try to start new plants from cuttings (I
got 4 successful rootings from 7 cuttings). Generally cuttings will
root well under fluorescent lighting.


I may have overwatered and over fertilized too. During the summer months
the Rosemary flourished with lots of water. I probably should not have
watered it when I brought it inside. I also didn't know about the
fertilizer since I gave it a dose of Miracle Grow to help it transition
which now appears to have been exactly the wrong thing to do. Actually,
I shouldn't have brought it in so soon. Before bringing it in it was
extremely healthy and I considered it one of the nicest plants in my
garden. I successfully started two cuttings over the summer and they're
doing well outside. I left them out since I worried more about my big
Rosemary and ultimately ended up killing it (well it's circulating down
the drain now). I guess live and learn. These Rosemary plants grow very
slowly BTW. Now that the temps are really starting to get into the
freeze zone here in Chicago I'll be bringing the little Rosemaries in and
putting them under fluorescents for winter. Maybe next summer one of
them will graduate to the big pot that their mother lived in (unless a
miracle happens and it recovers).


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Old 09-11-2004, 04:35 AM
Phisherman
 
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Default

On Mon, 08 Nov 2004 17:20:06 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:


"Pam - gardengal" wrote in message
news:8cojd.475638$mD.183276@attbi_s02...

"Dan" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 6 Nov 2004 18:01:23 -0600, Mark Anderson
wrote:

Saturate with water. Rosemary wants tons of water. Rootbound plants
need even more. Give lots of nitrogen, too (I feed it manure tea) and
a handful of lime sprinkled around the dirt..

I've also had tough luck with Rosemary, but somehow this plant is over
a year old and about 3 feet tall (no flowers yet). I believe the
major trick is "EXCESSIVE watering". Don't believe the ads when they
say "drought tolerant"

You can't be farther away from the truth - rosemary does not need
"excessive" watering, will resent it if you do, plus it requires minimal
fertilizing as well. As with most plants native to a temperate zone, it is
not happy being grown in the house. And it needs time to acclimatize from
being outside. Keep in very bright but indirect light, water sparingly and
increase humidity levels by adding a glass or two of water to the general
vicinity. Keep out of drafts or away from direct sources of heat.

pam - gardengal



I agree about the humidity, although I say this only in theory, because I'm
still struggling with MY rosemary plants. I recall reading that they grow
mightily along the Mediterrean coastline, in weird rocky soil, like beach
roses. Does that point to more lime, rather than the typical bagged potting
soil, which contains lots of peat moss?


A small amount of agricultural lime, perhaps a tablespoon to 4 quarts
of potting soil, should be enough. Put the mixture through a hardware
cloth screen a couple times to integrate the lime. You can overdo
the lime and kill the plant. For a plant already potted, you can put
a teaspoon of *clear* household ammonia in a quart of water. (Today
it seems difficult to purchase clear ammonia due to the demand
increase of meth lab chemists.)
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Old 09-11-2004, 09:57 AM
Frogleg
 
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On Sun, 07 Nov 2004 20:17:39 -0500, Dan wrote:


Does anyone know when the upright variety of rosemary starts
sprouting flowers? This one is 1 1/2 years old, 3 ft tall but no
flowers yet....a little upsetting But I am glad it's still
alive...the past two died & dried out in the pot.


The flowers aren't a prominent feature of rosemary. I've never noticed
if a plant had to be a certain age to produce flowers -- the rather
inconspicuous lavender flowers appear randomly in the foliage in
spring, I believe.

http://www-ang.kfunigraz.ac.at/~katz...?Rosm_off.html
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