I'm frustrated about something and thought I'd vent here a bit, so excuse
me....

Where I live there seem to be 3 types of places where I can buy plants:

--Places like Lowes, Home Depot, Walmart, etc. that have "garden centers"
but that isn't the main thing they focus on.
--Mid-size to large commercial nurseries that specialize in plants.
--Small "mom-and-pop" type places.

Of those 3, I'd really prefer to patronize the last two figuring that I'll
get better plants.

BUT, at least in our area the last 2 places are very bad about labelling
their plants well. Meaning, they give you the general name of the plant,
but not the particular name or variety. Generally, places like Lowes, etc.
actually have tags on their plant that give all the information one could
desire, so why can't the local nurseries? I understand that they often
raise the plants themselves, but I'd think that would make it more important
for their own sake to track these things better.

Example, earlier today I was looking for a Passion Vine. There are many
different varieties of this plant. One large local nursery had quite a
selection in their greenhouse. This nursery is the premier nursery in this
area with several locations and friendly, helpful stuff. They had at least
5 different varieties of what I was looking for. All of them labelled "Red
Passion Vine." Never mind that several of them had different leaf shapes
and other differences were obvious. They were all grouped together as if
they were the same. A very nice staff lady tried to describe the blooms,
but that's not very helpful and it doesn't account for how obviously
different plants would have the same bloom.

Another local nursery, owned by two very nice people that have sold me many
very nice plants, had a similar selection of diverse plants all bearing tags
that simply had their color--no other information.

I WANT to buy from the local nurseries, but I also want to know exactly what
I'm buying. I wish I had the experience to look at a plant and immediately
know what variety it is, but I don't--especially if the plant isn't in
bloom. I wish nurseries in my area would do a better job with this.

Tony

This is a valid rant. I expect proper and correct labeling of all
plants. I bought some pepper plants that were supposed to be "sweet"
but 2.5 months later found out that they set your mouth on fire.
Another time bought a dogwood tree that bloomed white and it was
labeled "pink." Sure I could return it to Home Depot, but it is
established and growing exceptionally well.

For the small nursery it can be a problem, over 90% of customers don't want
to know the "Proper" name of a plant, and would rather buy it in flower or
from a picture.
You have those customers that remove labels to read then just stick them
back in the nearest pot, I have seen a plant with 5 different labels in it.
Easy when Thymus label is in rosemary, but much harder when different
varieties of the same plant, Mint cam be fairly easy to re label, but the
different forms of Michelmass Daisy can be almost impossible till around
flowering time like the idea I came across on one nursery where they have
bed labels well fastened down and if you want your plants labelled you pick
up a pencil and labels and write them yourself.
But this still doesn't stop those who pick up a plant and put it down
somewhere else. (We've all seen the cans of baked beans amongst the cans of
meat or fruit where someone had changed their mind and cant be bothered to
take them back to the place they got them from).

--
David Hill
Abacus Nurseries
www.abacus-nurseries.co.uk

Tony wrote:
: I'm frustrated about something and thought I'd vent here a bit, so excuse
: me....

: Where I live there seem to be 3 types of places where I can buy plants:

: --Places like Lowes, Home Depot, Walmart, etc. that have "garden centers"
: but that isn't the main thing they focus on.
: --Mid-size to large commercial nurseries that specialize in plants.
: --Small "mom-and-pop" type places.

: Of those 3, I'd really prefer to patronize the last two figuring that I'll
: get better plants.

Actually, places like Lowe's order from the same large wholesale nurseries
that many smaller nurseries and garden centers do. Labelling comes with
the plant and is thus often better and more accurate than that at places
that grow their own. Their turnover is high, so if your timing is right,
you can get plants fresh off the truck from the grower that are still in
peak condition.

Signage is a significant cost for a nursery or garden center and many will
trim costs that way. But failure to label informatively and accurately is
one of the surest ways to lose customers. Good signage helps customers buy
the right plants for their growing conditions and learn enough about its
care to keep it from croaking. If you're selling the Top Twenty annuals,
this isn't such a big deal but if you're trying to offer less commonly
known plants, it's absolutely crucial. Nothing will kill a standalone
garden center/nursery faster than poor and inaccurate signage and
uninformed staff.

-- Karen

The Garden Gate http://garden-gate.prairienet.org
================================================== =================
"If you have a garden and a library, you have everything you need."
^and cats -- Cicero
================================================== =================
On the Web since 1994 Forbes Best of Web 2002

"Tony" wrote:

I'm frustrated about something and thought I'd vent here a bit, so excuse
me....

Example, earlier today I was looking for a Passion Vine. There are many
different varieties of this plant. One large local nursery had quite a
selection in their greenhouse. This nursery is the premier nursery in this
area with several locations and friendly, helpful stuff. They had at least
5 different varieties of what I was looking for. All of them labelled "Red
Passion Vine." Never mind that several of them had different leaf shapes
and other differences were obvious. They were all grouped together as if
they were the same. A very nice staff lady tried to describe the blooms,
but that's not very helpful and it doesn't account for how obviously
different plants would have the same bloom.

Haul all the vines to the checkout, ask to speak to the owner ...
and point out that having clearly different vines all labelled
the same has just put his nursery on your do-not-buy list.

Then abandon the plants and go somewhere where they do label
them.

Tsu

--
To doubt everything or to believe everything
are two equally convenient solutions; both
dispense with the necessity of reflection.
- Jules Henri Poincaré

I live in a small town and know the nursery owner personally. Get to know
your nursery man/woman to the point that if you see them shopping somewhere
else, you stop and talk to them. Then tell them about the problems and ask
for their individual help the next year. They hire help each year to do the
planting and labeling, and that is where the problem can get started. Once
the nursery man knows about the problem, he can correct it the next year.

The small ones in this area close in July. No customers. I have asked him
to plant some cabbage, Brussels sprouts, Etc. for fall gardens. He said he
would check into it. At least he knows now that there is a desire to have
them.

Lowes, Wal Mart Etc. are all fine places to buy your plants. The only
problem with them is that those located in my town might have plants that
aren't for my area. I bought Thompson grapes one year and had them planted.
Then took a pruning class at the university there. At the College I was
told that Thompson grapes would not survive in that state. They never made
it to the next summer.

You just have to find someone who knows the most about plants in what ever
place you are going to buy and rely on them. Become friends with them and
let them know just what you want. The will work harder for you.

Good luck. Dwayne




"Tsu Dho Nimh" wrote in message
...
"Tony" wrote:

I'm frustrated about something and thought I'd vent here a bit, so excuse
me....

Example, earlier today I was looking for a Passion Vine. There are many
different varieties of this plant. One large local nursery had quite a
selection in their greenhouse. This nursery is the premier nursery in
this
area with several locations and friendly, helpful stuff. They had at
least
5 different varieties of what I was looking for. All of them labelled
"Red
Passion Vine." Never mind that several of them had different leaf shapes
and other differences were obvious. They were all grouped together as if
they were the same. A very nice staff lady tried to describe the blooms,
but that's not very helpful and it doesn't account for how obviously
different plants would have the same bloom.

Haul all the vines to the checkout, ask to speak to the owner ...
and point out that having clearly different vines all labelled
the same has just put his nursery on your do-not-buy list.

Then abandon the plants and go somewhere where they do label
them.

Tsu

--
To doubt everything or to believe everything
are two equally convenient solutions; both
dispense with the necessity of reflection.
- Jules Henri Poincaré

Haul all the vines to the checkout, ask to speak to the owner ...
and point out that having clearly different vines all labelled
the same has just put his nursery on your do-not-buy list.

Then abandon the plants and go somewhere where they do label
them.

Tsu

Rather than abandoning the merchant altogether, I would simply bring the
problem to his/her attention. Very often, business owners are not aware of
the problems, or believe that their signage/labelling is sufficient. I
owned/operated a small business for 10 years, and always appreciated my
customers' feedback, both positive and negative, and would always act on the
negative feedback to improve my service level. A thunk a simple discussion
will bring much more positive results than simply dumping stuff on the
products on the counter, complaining, and then walking out.

--
Shadow
Made In Canada, eh.

In Tsu Dho Nimh wrote:

Haul all the vines to the checkout, ask to speak to the owner ...
and point out that having clearly different vines all labelled
the same has just put his nursery on your do-not-buy list.

Then abandon the plants and go somewhere where they do label
them.


You live in a city, don't you? You wouldn't burn your bridges like that
in a smaller town. But you also would likely be able to talk to the
owner without having to resort to Rambo tactics to get their attention.

In some states, like California, there are laws governing the information that
must be included on plant labels. Unfortunately, this only applies to outdoor
plants. Therefore, nursery stock which originates in California, like anything
from Monrovia, will be properly labeled.
The local nurseries are not going to do anything they are not forced to do by
law. And the mom-and-pop nurseries can't afford the time to research the
subject.
If you want named cultivars of a particular plant, you probably have to
patronize the specialist mail-order houses & pay the extra cost.
Iris,
Central NY, Zone 5a, Sunset Zone 40
"If we see light at the end of the tunnel, It's the light of the oncoming
train."
Robert Lowell (1917-1977)

Iris Cohen wrote:

In some states, like California, there are laws governing the information that
must be included on plant labels. Unfortunately, this only applies to outdoor
plants. Therefore, nursery stock which originates in California, like anything
from Monrovia, will be properly labeled.
The local nurseries are not going to do anything they are not forced to do by
law. And the mom-and-pop nurseries can't afford the time to research the
subject.
If you want named cultivars of a particular plant, you probably have to
patronize the specialist mail-order houses & pay the extra cost.

Nonsense. If a nursery wants to be successful (and this is a very competitive
business given the influence of the 'box' stores), then providing proper
informational signage and correct labeling AND customer service is essential. The
nursery I work with is individually owned (could be termed a "mom and pop", but
only with a pop), but informational signage and labeling is a priority. It is all
created in-house (I write a good portion of it) and is included in addition to
growers' tag info. Growers' tag info tends to be very generic and does not always
reflect correct growing conditions for our specific location - Monrovia is
notorious for this. Monrovia also tends to rename previously named cultivars with
their own cultivar name.

While I realize that the PNW is a very active and competitive gardening region,
there is no reason why this attitude should not be carried into other areas of the
country. Running a nursery or garden center business is the same as running any
other business - to succeed you must offer a quality product at a reasonable price
and provide enough of the extras - superior customer service, guarantees, correct
information and labeling - to attract your customers away from other, competitive
sources. It's a matter of professionalism. There is no excuse for improper or
missing labeling (other than the odd misplaced or missing tag) - it reflects only
laziness or lack of knowledge.

BTW, when a plant label goes missing at my nursery and we are unable to be sure of
the particular plant/cultivar in question, it is sold at a significant discount.
The 'mystery plant' area is extremely popular with bargain hunters.

pam - gardengal

I'm frustrated about something and thought I'd vent
here a bit, so excuse me....

Hehe, you should go to a place I like going to to get
plants. I'm not sure who owns it, but I have seen four
people working there, all older Japanese people, two
males, two females. Only one speaks English very well.
Mostly, I've dealt with one woman, who is very sweet
(I think grin), but speaks very, very little English.
I get either the Japanese name of the plant or the
Hawaiian. Very rarely even a common English name. One
plant I came away with and still waiting for it to bloom
is, as far as I know, a 'big double'. A 'big double' what,
I don't know.

Tracey

The problem is that nowadays they all tend to purchase their plants from the
same wholesalers who don't give a fig about the proper identification of
plants. It is much cheaper to buy the plants from wholesalers than for them
to grow the plants themselves and there is little incentive to take the time
to bother to properly label the plants because the vast majority of people
who buy plants are uninformed and don't care what the names are. Most people
throw away the labels as soon as they stick the plants in soil.


Tony wrote in message
news:8E67F3DFDDCD7E8E.655309D77E3FB574.7C0E9686A62 ...
I'm frustrated about something and thought I'd vent here a bit, so excuse
me....

Where I live there seem to be 3 types of places where I can buy plants:

--Places like Lowes, Home Depot, Walmart, etc. that have "garden centers"
but that isn't the main thing they focus on.
--Mid-size to large commercial nurseries that specialize in plants.
--Small "mom-and-pop" type places.

Of those 3, I'd really prefer to patronize the last two figuring that I'll
get better plants.

BUT, at least in our area the last 2 places are very bad about labelling
their plants well. Meaning, they give you the general name of the plant,
but not the particular name or variety. Generally, places like Lowes,
etc.
actually have tags on their plant that give all the information one could
desire, so why can't the local nurseries? I understand that they often
raise the plants themselves, but I'd think that would make it more
important
for their own sake to track these things better.

Example, earlier today I was looking for a Passion Vine. There are many
different varieties of this plant. One large local nursery had quite a
selection in their greenhouse. This nursery is the premier nursery in
this
area with several locations and friendly, helpful stuff. They had at
least
5 different varieties of what I was looking for. All of them labelled
"Red
Passion Vine." Never mind that several of them had different leaf shapes
and other differences were obvious. They were all grouped together as if
they were the same. A very nice staff lady tried to describe the blooms,
but that's not very helpful and it doesn't account for how obviously
different plants would have the same bloom.

Another local nursery, owned by two very nice people that have sold me
many
very nice plants, had a similar selection of diverse plants all bearing
tags
that simply had their color--no other information.

I WANT to buy from the local nurseries, but I also want to know exactly
what
I'm buying. I wish I had the experience to look at a plant and
immediately
know what variety it is, but I don't--especially if the plant isn't in
bloom. I wish nurseries in my area would do a better job with this.

Tony

Then what do you do after security throws you out of the store and your are
banned from there forever?


Tsu Dho Nimh wrote in message
...
"Tony" wrote:

I'm frustrated about something and thought I'd vent here a bit, so excuse
me....

Example, earlier today I was looking for a Passion Vine. There are many
different varieties of this plant. One large local nursery had quite a
selection in their greenhouse. This nursery is the premier nursery in
this
area with several locations and friendly, helpful stuff. They had at
least
5 different varieties of what I was looking for. All of them labelled
"Red
Passion Vine." Never mind that several of them had different leaf shapes
and other differences were obvious. They were all grouped together as if
they were the same. A very nice staff lady tried to describe the blooms,
but that's not very helpful and it doesn't account for how obviously
different plants would have the same bloom.

Haul all the vines to the checkout, ask to speak to the owner ...
and point out that having clearly different vines all labelled
the same has just put his nursery on your do-not-buy list.

Then abandon the plants and go somewhere where they do label
them.

Tsu

--
To doubt everything or to believe everything
are two equally convenient solutions; both
dispense with the necessity of reflection.
- Jules Henri Poincaré

The problem of poorly labelled plants can originate from several possible
sources. It is a problem but if you visit a place which does supply you with
good quality plants, with a healthy root ball at a fair price and your gripe
is with their labelling alone. Then I'd recommend that you bring your gripe
to the owner's attention and see how they react. There is no point
abstaining from an otherwise good plant source if you know the labels are
poor kind of shooting yourself in the foot. Buy the healthy plant at modest
price with a poor label, do some research and correct the label when you put
it in your own back yard.

A common miss-labelling problem which I do object to and which I regularly
come across at locations which buy-in in bulk is due to the meddling effects
of the marketing professionals. In an age when new homes and gardens for
first-time buyers are getting smaller, when such people have not the desire
or the time to research their garden plants as enthusiasts may do, they
simply want to buy plants of a certain size that does not crowd their living
area. As a result it is very hard to find a plant carrying a labels that
honestly declares the plant's ultimate size as 20 feet, that it will do so
in five years. Otherwise such plants would never be sold. Consequently most
advertised sizes are 4-5 feet height and spread or less.
Regards,
Mike Gilmore
www.winsfordwalledgarden.freeserve.co.uk

He is also an idiot so I wouldn't take the dude seriously.

Wouldn't be surprised if he makes a scene everywhere he goes and is
constantly being thrown out of stores.

Wouldn't be surprised if he would even throws a tantrums in resturants over
his glass of water!!!


wrote in message
...
In Tsu Dho Nimh wrote:

Haul all the vines to the checkout, ask to speak to the owner ...
and point out that having clearly different vines all labelled
the same has just put his nursery on your do-not-buy list.

Then abandon the plants and go somewhere where they do label
them.


You live in a city, don't you? You wouldn't burn your bridges like that
in a smaller town. But you also would likely be able to talk to the
owner without having to resort to Rambo tactics to get their attention.