On 16 Nov 2005 07:24:38 -0800, wrote:
I would look at mowers for long term use in this order:
all honda (fairly expensive, but worth it)
John Deere
Cheaper model with a honda engine.
Going any cheaper might give you grief later, but most people have not
used a good mower to know how much better they are new not to mention 5
years later. You get what you pay for.

I am now looking at a John Deere rider mower, but it is an awful lot
of money for me. I hear what you are saying about Honda engines...
everyone says they are so good... but so far my experience with this
Sears Craftsman mower with a Honda 5.5 has been absolutely horrible.
Say what you will, but I never had a Briggs vibrate or give me
blisters on my hands like this Honda does!

Maybe a Honda mower with a Honda engine would be better, but I'd have
to be convinced by a meaningful "test drive" if you know what I mean.
No more buying without trying... I don't care what the salesman says.

Jake

Jake H. wrote:

I am now looking at a John Deere rider mower, but it is an awful lot
of money for me. I hear what you are saying about Honda engines...
everyone says they are so good... but so far my experience with this
Sears Craftsman mower with a Honda 5.5 has been absolutely horrible.
Say what you will, but I never had a Briggs vibrate or give me
blisters on my hands like this Honda does!

I've got a used JD LT155 (NOT the box store JD's) and am very happy
with it. Hydro, 38" deck, 15hp, bagger, mulch kit. The repo auction had
it for $1200 and was well worth it. It's about 3-4 years old.

I'd think about looking for a semi-used JD that is well kept and you
can save a few $$.

Kirb

On 16 Nov 2005 20:40:58 -0800, wrote:
I've got a used JD LT155 (NOT the box store JD's) and am very happy
with it. Hydro, 38" deck, 15hp, bagger, mulch kit. The repo auction had
it for $1200 and was well worth it. It's about 3-4 years old.
I'd think about looking for a semi-used JD that is well kept and you
can save a few $$.

Sounds like you did really well. I do need to better understand this
whole business of good vs. bad... new vs. old... consumer vs.
commercial... model variations, etc. before buying anything from JD in
the way of a lawn/yard/garden tractor. I've done some on-line
research (including studying their website), but I'm still not where I
feel confident enough to make an intelligent purchase. The bottom
line is that I've got to get my money's worth next time around. I
can't go on throwing away money on junk forever.

Jake

Does your state have a "Lemon Law". If you can prove that the mower was
defective and you tried to have it fixed, and it couldn't be, it might
qualify. You might use that tact the next time you go in.
You might also call the local TV station with a 'problem solver' segment.


"Jake H." wrote in message
...
On Wed, 16 Nov 2005 15:04:19 -0500, Joe Canuck
wrote:
Definitely not normal. Was it like this new?

It was like this since day one... or, more specifically, on the first
day I started it up and ran it. And no, I never hit any rocks! There
was not a single ding visible on the blade.

I could hardly believe how bad it was. I always thought Honda engines
were supposed to be so smooth!

Take it back and be firm &
polite while insisting they rectify the issue.
If no satisfaction, return it for your money.

I have returned it twice so far. My apparent mistake was not
demanding a refund immediately and allowing them to tinker with it...
twice... for more than 5 weeks (elapsed time) each visit. I honestly
thought they would fix the damn thing. They obviously didn't.

After the second service, they took the position that the mower was
running normally and that there was nothing more they could (or would)
do for me. At that point I demanded a refund, but they said no way
after so many months (5 months to be exact at that point) even though
over two months were spent in their shop and it had been run by me a
grand total of 4 times. Oddly enough, the only scratches on it at
that time were scratches put there by the Sears repair folks. No
joke.

Jake

On Thu, 17 Nov 2005 11:35:34 -0500, "Frank Rosenbaum"
wrote:
Does your state have a "Lemon Law". If you can prove that the mower was
defective and you tried to have it fixed, and it couldn't be, it might
qualify. You might use that tact the next time you go in.
You might also call the local TV station with a 'problem solver' segment.

I am still considering my options, including small claims court or
some sort of arbitration, but I'm not sure the problems with my Sears
mower rise to a level of severity that would interest the Attorney
General or a TV station. At the end of the day, it is a major
nuisance and a very bad deal... but that's about it so far. While I
am certainly ****ed (can you tell?), for all I know the mower could
last 5 or more years running this way before it explodes. Like folks
at work say to me... wrap the damn handle with foam pipe insulation &
tape or use some nice thick gloves!!! :-/ It shouldn't have to be
that way, but I must admit it: They've got a point.

Jake

I disagree. It is the 'little guy' vs the 'big guy'. All the TV stations
that I have seen with this feature just eat it up. Send it to the consumer's
protection board. Sears doesn't want bad publicity.

Maybe if you know a lawyer, ask him to send a "lawyer's letter" to Sears
customer service and a cc to the bbb or the state attorney general stating
the facts and that you would like a replacement mower. Don't deal with the
sales clucks anymore. Go higher. Aim for the dept. mgr then the store mgr
then the district or area etc.

A vibration such as you describe sounds dangerous. As a retired
firefighter/EMT, I would not trust the mower. The machine might not just
fall apart, it could shatter and when it does, you will be behind it and the
spinning blade. How much are your feet worth?



"Jake H." wrote in message
...
On Thu, 17 Nov 2005 11:35:34 -0500, "Frank Rosenbaum"
wrote:
Does your state have a "Lemon Law". If you can prove that the mower was
defective and you tried to have it fixed, and it couldn't be, it might
qualify. You might use that tact the next time you go in.
You might also call the local TV station with a 'problem solver' segment.

I am still considering my options, including small claims court or
some sort of arbitration, but I'm not sure the problems with my Sears
mower rise to a level of severity that would interest the Attorney
General or a TV station. At the end of the day, it is a major
nuisance and a very bad deal... but that's about it so far. While I
am certainly ****ed (can you tell?), for all I know the mower could
last 5 or more years running this way before it explodes. Like folks
at work say to me... wrap the damn handle with foam pipe insulation &
tape or use some nice thick gloves!!! :-/ It shouldn't have to be
that way, but I must admit it: They've got a point.

Jake

On Thu, 17 Nov 2005 20:51:14 -0500, "Frank Rosenbaum"
wrote:
I disagree. It is the 'little guy' vs the 'big guy'. All the TV stations
that I have seen with this feature just eat it up. Send it to the consumer's
protection board. Sears doesn't want bad publicity.
Maybe if you know a lawyer, ask him to send a "lawyer's letter" to Sears
customer service and a cc to the bbb or the state attorney general stating
the facts and that you would like a replacement mower. Don't deal with the
sales clucks anymore. Go higher. Aim for the dept. mgr then the store mgr
then the district or area etc.
A vibration such as you describe sounds dangerous. As a retired
firefighter/EMT, I would not trust the mower. The machine might not just
fall apart, it could shatter and when it does, you will be behind it and the
spinning blade. How much are your feet worth?

Thanks very much for your interest, but I am really not out to
publicly embarrass or otherwise try to harm Sears. It is a strange
irony (some might even say hypocritical of me) that the single biggest
holding in my 401(k) is Sears stock. Almost all of my hand tools are
Craftsman and they are great. Same with many of the power tools I
own. I also own a 6HP 4-in-1 Craftsman lawn vac that works great
(other than that the bag is way too small) and it doesn't vibrate at
all.

At the end of the day I just want this crazy vibrating lawn mower
fixed, replaced or my money refunded. Yes, my last discussion (after
the second service failed) was with the hardware manager. In
fairness, he did offer me a trade-up deal, but it made absolutely no
economic sense. He's also the one who claimed it was too late for me
to get a straight cash refund.

Based on what my lawyer charges, it would be far cheaper for me to
dump this lawn mower today and buy two brand new ones before asking
her for a single letter. Been there, done that before. It ain't
gonna happen.

Some co-workers have suggested that I bring the mower... one last
time... to a different Sears store... one about 20 extra miles away,
but with a better reputation for small engine service. That is
probably going to be my next (and last) step. If that fails: Small
Claims Court here I come!!!

Jake

Jake H. wrote:

On Thu, 17 Nov 2005 20:51:14 -0500, "Frank Rosenbaum"
wrote:

I disagree. It is the 'little guy' vs the 'big guy'. All the TV stations
that I have seen with this feature just eat it up. Send it to the consumer's
protection board. Sears doesn't want bad publicity.
Maybe if you know a lawyer, ask him to send a "lawyer's letter" to Sears
customer service and a cc to the bbb or the state attorney general stating
the facts and that you would like a replacement mower. Don't deal with the
sales clucks anymore. Go higher. Aim for the dept. mgr then the store mgr
then the district or area etc.
A vibration such as you describe sounds dangerous. As a retired
firefighter/EMT, I would not trust the mower. The machine might not just
fall apart, it could shatter and when it does, you will be behind it and the
spinning blade. How much are your feet worth?


Thanks very much for your interest, but I am really not out to
publicly embarrass or otherwise try to harm Sears. It is a strange
irony (some might even say hypocritical of me) that the single biggest
holding in my 401(k) is Sears stock. Almost all of my hand tools are
Craftsman and they are great. Same with many of the power tools I
own. I also own a 6HP 4-in-1 Craftsman lawn vac that works great
(other than that the bag is way too small) and it doesn't vibrate at
all.
Well, I hope you and other Stockholders, in Sears, start getting the
outfit back on course. I hate to see what is becoming of a former
American Institution. They bought Western Auto, gutted it and sold it to
Pep Boys. They bought KMart and are in the process of guttin it.
They are *******izing the Craftsman name and milking the Sears good name
til there won't be a "Sears" in a decade. you can no longer buysporting
Goods or Firearms from Sears. Their Automotive Department is a joke.
They bought NTW and gutted it and sold it Tire Kingdom which is cluster
f**k. Service and Warranty from Sears is only as good as the cheapest
outfit they can place it with.

tightwad wrote:
They bought KMart and are in the process of guttin it.

Actually, just the oppisite. K-Mart bought out Sears (merged, if you will).

I agree 100% with tightwad. Sears tools have gone down hill real bad. In
5 to 10 years they will be another Wards. I supose it has to be that way
as long as WalMart is a Chinese garadge sale.


From Mel & Donnie in Bluebird Valley

On Sat, 19 Nov 2005 18:35:36 -0600, tightwad wrote:
Well, I hope you and other Stockholders, in Sears, start getting the
outfit back on course. I hate to see what is becoming of a former
American Institution. They bought Western Auto, gutted it and sold it to
Pep Boys. They bought KMart and are in the process of guttin it.
They are *******izing the Craftsman name and milking the Sears good name
til there won't be a "Sears" in a decade. you can no longer buysporting
Goods or Firearms from Sears. Their Automotive Department is a joke.
They bought NTW and gutted it and sold it Tire Kingdom which is cluster
f**k. Service and Warranty from Sears is only as good as the cheapest
outfit they can place it with.

Lord knows I share your concerns. No one likes the fact that China
and Mexico have taken over virtually all of our manufacturing. How
nice it would be to buy something "Made in USA" again... or to get
someone in customer support on the phone who is not sitting in Bombay,
India. It's practically impossible now. And having the old Sears
back would be a great start at reform... but we both know that it
isn't going to happen. Welcome to the new reality.

I'm afraid that the extent of holdings in my 401(k)... which is now
more like a 101(z)... isn't going to impress anyone. If my
calculations are right, I will be able to buy exactly four (4)
McDonald's cheeseburgers on the day I retire before my 401(k) is
completely exhausted.

So much for 40 years of hard work making other people rich.

Jake

On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 01:15:41 GMT, "Retiredff"
wrote:

Actually, just the oppisite. K-Mart bought out Sears (merged, if you will).

Correct. They merged.

Jake

On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 09:49:51 -0500, (Mel M Kelly)
wrote:
I agree 100% with tightwad. Sears tools have gone down hill real bad. In
5 to 10 years they will be another Wards. I supose it has to be that way
as long as WalMart is a Chinese garage sale.

My vibrating lawn mower problems aside, I still find their mechanics
tools to be the best around... at least within my limited budget. Not
perfect... but still quite serviceable. I always buy Craftsman...
never Companion. I refuse to buy any imported mechanics tools at any
price. I am too old and grumpy to be using tools that don't fit right
or break.

Jake

Everything I have tried from Sears in the say last 5 years has been
below standard. Even a wrench set was junk. 6" angle grinder went up in
smoke. Fridge pops and cracks all the time. Water softener only lasted 5
years. I am a slow learner.


From Mel & Donnie in Bluebird Valley

Jake H. wrote:
On Tue, 15 Nov 2005 21:53:18 -0500, Joe Canuck
wrote:

Consider your mower a long term investment and purchase the best you can
afford at the moment.
Craftsman also make mowers that are Honda powered. Honda power is
definitely better that B&S.


Joe - I am experiencing extremely high vibration levels... felt back
through the handle and with audible/visual handle chatter... with my
new Sears Craftsman lawn mower with the 5.5 HP Honda engine. Can you
shed any light on this? After two lengthy visits back to their shop,
Sears insists there is nothing currently wrong with it and will not
let me try out a different one or give me a refund. So much for buyer
satisfaction.

Is it normal for Honda engines to cause handle vibrations so sever
that you get blisters pushing it for 30 minutes? I have owned many
lawn mowers in my life, most of them from Sears I am sorry to say, but
nothing that came close to vibrating and causing blisters like this.
Any ideas?

Thanks in advance,
Jake

My Honda is the smoothest running mower I have ever owned. Mine is a
Honda mower (with a Honda Engine of course) and it is very quiet and has
less vibration than any other mower I've ever used. It is very possible
that the motor is not the source of the vibration. An unbalanced blade
will vibrate like hell. Take your blades off and sharpen and balance
them or take them to a mower service place that can do it for you.