Still going back and forth with Sears
 

Clark said:

[...]

of course meaning if I get hit by a meteorite tomorrow and die.
time will tell.

Or, a 10" stick. =)

--

Eggs

APATHY ERROR: Don't bother striking any key.

Still going back and forth with Sears
 

"Clark" wrote:
Steveo wrote:
"Clark" wrote:
Great now everybody in the group knows why I wanna keep it... ;-)

Clark

Dang.

It does sound sweet... reminds me of my 1978 KZ 650 Kawasaki, (That I
still own and still runs good)
One of the first Super bikes!
only bested by the 1977 KZ 1000 back then

Clark

I hear ya, the old lady clipped your freedom! :)

Still going back and forth with Sears
 

"Clark" wrote in message
...

Yup, thirty more days, but because I "admitted" to hitting a stick with
the thing they want the Sears repair guy out to look at it first, to make
sure the mowing of the stick did not damage the mowing deck in such a way
that it hinders the deck level height adjustment.
Clark

Hi everyone ;-)
This is my first time on this group so I'd like to say a "Big Hello from
West Texas".

Out in this part of the world, West Texas & Eastern New Mexico Sears shut
down all the local repair stations and don't even have a traveling repair
person, now when a mower needs to be fixed they want you to take it to a
Sears store where it will be shipped 500 miles to Albuquerque, New Mexico
where they will check it out and call you about needed repairs and of course
you can't look at the parts they say are bad. Mine isn't in warranty so I
let a local fix anything with a motor shop fix it and was happy with the
service.

I hope everyone enjoys Labor Day next Monday.

Albert of Earth
The E-mail address is fake so please don't try.














--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Still going back and forth with Sears
 

Albert of Earth wrote:

[....]

Hi everyone ;-)
This is my first time on this group so I'd like to say a "Big Hello from
West Texas".

How close to Midland are you and is Midland still there?

[....]

Still going back and forth with Sears
 

"Jim" wrote in message
...
Albert of Earth wrote:

[....]

Hi everyone ;-)
This is my first time on this group so I'd like to say a "Big Hello from
West Texas".

How close to Midland are you and is Midland still there?

[....]

Midland is still there but fortunately I am 180 miles northeast of there.
Albert of Earth




--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Still going back and forth with Sears
 

Clark wrote:
This friggen thing must have been built by retarded illegal immigrants on a
Friday before a three day weekend,

Don't get me wrong, there are allot of things I like about this lawn
tractor, but.
for those who forget or don't know, the link is here.
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_07128738000P?filter=Horsepower%7C22+ hp&vName=Lawn+%26+Garden&cName=Lawn+Tractors&sName =Lawn+Tractor+Series&sLevel=2|3


The Sears guy came to see the mower for the 2nd time about a month ago, at
my request to check the engine after the motor was stopped cold by a friggen
twig, anyway.

The Sears guy did like the Toro (32" 8hp rear engine) and looked at that
more than the one he was supposed to be looking at, but I digress.

I have really have liked the new mower since I took apart the seat kill
switch and fixed it so I could lean or stand up if I have to (a little
cardboard and some shipping tape did the trick) yea, I was gonna do paper
clips but it is a four wire switch etc. Oh and the new blades are allot
tougher.

The reason I called Sears this time (I'm starting to think I'm a pain in the
ass) but, The mower deck has 6 settings as do most, and well 3 hits the
ground and 2 and 1 , well, don't work.

So I went to Sears today and checked all their models, guess what? All of
the mowers worked from 1 to 6 and topped out at four inches. (yes I brought
a tape measure too)

The deck just sits to low, for instance I need to mow at a height of 5 and
even then I'm at a mere 1 1/2 inches ( it tops out at 1 3/4 inches at six)

The Mower deck is supposed to max out on 6 at a level of 4 inches

I tried adjusting everything! I even went to Tractor Supply and bought a
cable crimp and put it on the "non adjustable" side (then adjusted the other
side) , but then level one, two and six did not work (but I did get about 3
1/2 inches of blade height at level 5).

Any ideas????
I have a month before I can just return it, but like I said there are allot
of things I like about this mower.

Clark

Likely the deck hangers are bent. I'd guess when you hit that "twig"
(that stopped the mower and bent the deck into the blade) it shoved the
entire deck back and bent some stuff.

I have to take issue with your original description of events. It just
doesn't ring entirely true. The stick you showed could not have caused
the damage you described. At worst it would have jammed between the
blade tip and deck, bend the blade, and caused everything to stop, maybe
even break a belt. But the fact that the blade cut into the deck means
that the deck was pushed (read bent) into the path of the blade. That
takes a pretty substantial amount of force. You said the engine also
stopped which makes me think that whatever you hit was large enough to
stop the forward motion of the tractor. Maybe a stump or some other
immovable object?

Was Kathy using it when it happened or were you?

--
Art

Still going back and forth with Sears
 

Art wrote:
Clark wrote:
This friggen thing must have been built by retarded illegal
immigrants on a Friday before a three day weekend,

Don't get me wrong, there are allot of things I like about this lawn
tractor, but.
for those who forget or don't know, the link is here.
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_07128738000P?filter=Horsepower%7C22+ hp&vName=Lawn+%26+Garden&cName=Lawn+Tractors&sName =Lawn+Tractor+Series&sLevel=2|3


The Sears guy came to see the mower for the 2nd time about a month
ago, at my request to check the engine after the motor was stopped
cold by a friggen twig, anyway.

The Sears guy did like the Toro (32" 8hp rear engine) and looked at
that more than the one he was supposed to be looking at, but I
digress. I have really have liked the new mower since I took apart the
seat
kill switch and fixed it so I could lean or stand up if I have to (a
little cardboard and some shipping tape did the trick) yea, I was
gonna do paper clips but it is a four wire switch etc. Oh and the
new blades are allot tougher.

The reason I called Sears this time (I'm starting to think I'm a
pain in the ass) but, The mower deck has 6 settings as do most, and
well 3 hits the ground and 2 and 1 , well, don't work.

So I went to Sears today and checked all their models, guess what? All of
the mowers worked from 1 to 6 and topped out at four inches.
(yes I brought a tape measure too)

The deck just sits to low, for instance I need to mow at a height of
5 and even then I'm at a mere 1 1/2 inches ( it tops out at 1 3/4
inches at six) The Mower deck is supposed to max out on 6 at a level of 4
inches

I tried adjusting everything! I even went to Tractor Supply and
bought a cable crimp and put it on the "non adjustable" side (then
adjusted the other side) , but then level one, two and six did not
work (but I did get about 3 1/2 inches of blade height at level 5).

Any ideas????
I have a month before I can just return it, but like I said there
are allot of things I like about this mower.

Clark

Likely the deck hangers are bent. I'd guess when you hit that "twig"
(that stopped the mower and bent the deck into the blade) it shoved
the entire deck back and bent some stuff.

I have to take issue with your original description of events. It just
doesn't ring entirely true. The stick you showed could not have caused
the damage you described. At worst it would have jammed between the
blade tip and deck, bend the blade, and caused everything to stop,
maybe even break a belt. But the fact that the blade cut into the
deck means that the deck was pushed (read bent) into the path of the
blade. That takes a pretty substantial amount of force. You said the
engine also stopped which makes me think that whatever you hit was
large enough to stop the forward motion of the tractor. Maybe a stump
or some other immovable object?

Was Kathy using it when it happened or were you?


Hi Art.

I was on the mower, what happened was the blade hit the stick the stick then
like catapulted the blade into the mower deck (this deck is one of the fancy
high output types so the deck is not flat but dips from the top down towards
the discharge) so the blade hits the deck cuts into the deck about 2 1/2
inches and that is when everything stopped.

I never hit anything that would have bent anything like hangers which in my
case would be beneficial because the mower is advertised to have a 4 inch
cut and is only slightly less than 3 1/2 inches, and that's without my fat
ass on it. gotta be nearer 3 when I'm on, (I weight 185)

Clark

Still going back and forth with Sears
 

Clark wrote:
Art wrote:
Likely the deck hangers are bent. I'd guess when you hit that "twig"
(that stopped the mower and bent the deck into the blade) it shoved
the entire deck back and bent some stuff.

I have to take issue with your original description of events. It just
doesn't ring entirely true. The stick you showed could not have caused
the damage you described. At worst it would have jammed between the
blade tip and deck, bend the blade, and caused everything to stop,
maybe even break a belt. But the fact that the blade cut into the
deck means that the deck was pushed (read bent) into the path of the
blade. That takes a pretty substantial amount of force. You said the
engine also stopped which makes me think that whatever you hit was
large enough to stop the forward motion of the tractor. Maybe a stump
or some other immovable object?

Was Kathy using it when it happened or were you?


Hi Art.

I was on the mower, what happened was the blade hit the stick the stick then
like catapulted the blade into the mower deck (this deck is one of the fancy
high output types so the deck is not flat but dips from the top down towards
the discharge) so the blade hits the deck cuts into the deck about 2 1/2
inches and that is when everything stopped.

I never hit anything that would have bent anything like hangers which in my
case would be beneficial because the mower is advertised to have a 4 inch
cut and is only slightly less than 3 1/2 inches, and that's without my fat
ass on it. gotta be nearer 3 when I'm on, (I weight 185)



I have seen a lot of bent blades but I've never seen one that was bent
such that it stretched and sliced into the deck.
Let's just say it is a 20" blade. That is 10" from the center bolt or
it's pivot point to the tip. The deck will be approximately 10-1/4"
minimum distance from that same point. It is physically impossible to
bend a blade (by hitting a stick of any size) in such a way that it
becomes longer. The deck *must* be bent for that to happen. Either the
spindle mounting point was twisted causing the blade pivot point to move
or the edge of the deck was pushed into the path of the blade. Either
way that would take a pretty substantial amount of force and more than
the stick you describe could possibly be responsible for.

--
Art

Still going back and forth with Sears
 

Art wrote:

[....]

I have seen a lot of bent blades but I've never seen one that was bent
such that it stretched and sliced into the deck.
Let's just say it is a 20" blade. That is 10" from the center bolt or
it's pivot point to the tip. The deck will be approximately 10-1/4"
minimum distance from that same point. It is physically impossible to
bend a blade (by hitting a stick of any size) in such a way that it
becomes longer. The deck *must* be bent for that to happen. Either the
spindle mounting point was twisted causing the blade pivot point to move
or the edge of the deck was pushed into the path of the blade. Either
way that would take a pretty substantial amount of force and more than
the stick you describe could possibly be responsible for.

--
Art

ok Art, you have compelled me to tell my deck wreck story.

it all happened when I was mowing over a location where I
knew a sweet gum root was sticking up higher than cutting
level 3 and I forgot to raise the deck to cutting level 4.
the deck itself hit the root with sufficient force driving
the deck back into the blade on the right side. the blade
actually sliced into the deck and cut in a downward
direction for about one inch. the blade did not bend the
portion of the deck where the blade pivot point,
referred to as the spindle, bent.

the PTO belt got a flat spot burned on it before I was able
to disengage the PTO. lots of stinky white smoke was all I
got for my ruined belt. the flat spot was sufficient to
force the discarding of the belt since it produced the out
of balance thumping that will lead to a ruined oil seal on
the PTO shaft extending from the bottom of the 22hp motor
where the PTO belt runs on it's pulley.

at this point I was thoroughly ****ed off with myself since
it had only been about 2 weeks prior I'd had to do major
repairs as a result of the big down hill ditch wreck. I
decided to work off the hostilities by attacking the sweet
gum root. I felt better after that sweet gum root was
declared to be no more.

the next day I removed the deck, stripped it down and
reintroduced it to the 10 pound maul the anvil the torch and
the welder. I could almost hear the deck saying "oh shit not
again." after enjoying a nice day in my workshop and some
really good coffee the deck was restored to it's correct shape
with the addition of some new reinforcing structural stabilizers.
the repair worked out well and now when I go over the spot where
the sweet gum root used to be, I just smile.

ps: I feel sorry for people who have to call for help and then
wait for someone to show up with their name written on their shirt.

Still going back and forth with Sears
 

on 8/30/2007 6:32 PM Jim said the following:
Art wrote:

[....]

I have seen a lot of bent blades but I've never seen one that was bent
such that it stretched and sliced into the deck.
Let's just say it is a 20" blade. That is 10" from the center bolt or
it's pivot point to the tip. The deck will be approximately 10-1/4"
minimum distance from that same point. It is physically impossible to
bend a blade (by hitting a stick of any size) in such a way that it
becomes longer. The deck *must* be bent for that to happen. Either the
spindle mounting point was twisted causing the blade pivot point to move
or the edge of the deck was pushed into the path of the blade. Either
way that would take a pretty substantial amount of force and more than
the stick you describe could possibly be responsible for.

--
Art


ok Art, you have compelled me to tell my deck wreck story.

it all happened when I was mowing over a location where I
knew a sweet gum root was sticking up higher than cutting
level 3 and I forgot to raise the deck to cutting level 4.
the deck itself hit the root with sufficient force driving
the deck back into the blade on the right side. the blade
actually sliced into the deck and cut in a downward
direction for about one inch. the blade did not bend the
portion of the deck where the blade pivot point,
referred to as the spindle, bent.

the PTO belt got a flat spot burned on it before I was able
to disengage the PTO. lots of stinky white smoke was all I
got for my ruined belt. the flat spot was sufficient to
force the discarding of the belt since it produced the out
of balance thumping that will lead to a ruined oil seal on
the PTO shaft extending from the bottom of the 22hp motor
where the PTO belt runs on it's pulley.

at this point I was thoroughly ****ed off with myself since
it had only been about 2 weeks prior I'd had to do major
repairs as a result of the big down hill ditch wreck. I
decided to work off the hostilities by attacking the sweet
gum root. I felt better after that sweet gum root was
declared to be no more.

the next day I removed the deck, stripped it down and
reintroduced it to the 10 pound maul the anvil the torch and
the welder. I could almost hear the deck saying "oh shit not
again." after enjoying a nice day in my workshop and some
really good coffee the deck was restored to it's correct shape
with the addition of some new reinforcing structural stabilizers.
the repair worked out well and now when I go over the spot where
the sweet gum root used to be, I just smile.

ps: I feel sorry for people who have to call for help and then
wait for someone to show up with their name written on their shirt.


Here in the glacial carved Hudson Valley, we have buried rocks the size
of Volkswagens. You cannot dig a hole more than a foot deep without
hitting a rock which may be from the size of a football up to the
aforementioned VW.
I have been scalping rocks and tree branches, with my cheap Murray
tractor and mower deck, that are much bigger than the OP's bout with a
twig. I have never bent a blade so much as to even scrape the sides or
top of the metal mower deck. When I do my annual sharpening, I may have
to straighten a blade a little with my hammer and vise anvil.
If I had happen what the OP experienced, I would have bought, borrowed,
or stolen a truck, to bring it right back to Sears, drive it inside and
left it on the floor if they didn't get me a new one.



--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

Still going back and forth with Sears
 

Art wrote:
Clark wrote:
Art wrote:
Likely the deck hangers are bent. I'd guess when you hit that "twig"
(that stopped the mower and bent the deck into the blade) it shoved
the entire deck back and bent some stuff.

I have to take issue with your original description of events. It
just doesn't ring entirely true. The stick you showed could not
have caused the damage you described. At worst it would have jammed
between the blade tip and deck, bend the blade, and caused
everything to stop, maybe even break a belt. But the fact that the
blade cut into the deck means that the deck was pushed (read bent)
into the path of the blade. That takes a pretty substantial amount
of force. You said the engine also stopped which makes me think
that whatever you hit was large enough to stop the forward motion
of the tractor. Maybe a stump or some other immovable object?

Was Kathy using it when it happened or were you?


Hi Art.

I was on the mower, what happened was the blade hit the stick the
stick then like catapulted the blade into the mower deck (this deck
is one of the fancy high output types so the deck is not flat but
dips from the top down towards the discharge) so the blade hits the
deck cuts into the deck about 2 1/2 inches and that is when
everything stopped. I never hit anything that would have bent anything
like hangers
which in my case would be beneficial because the mower is advertised
to have a 4 inch cut and is only slightly less than 3 1/2 inches,
and that's without my fat ass on it. gotta be nearer 3 when I'm on,
(I weight 185)

I have seen a lot of bent blades but I've never seen one that was bent
such that it stretched and sliced into the deck.
Let's just say it is a 20" blade. That is 10" from the center bolt or
it's pivot point to the tip. The deck will be approximately 10-1/4"
minimum distance from that same point. It is physically impossible to
bend a blade (by hitting a stick of any size) in such a way that it
becomes longer. The deck *must* be bent for that to happen. Either the
spindle mounting point was twisted causing the blade pivot point to
move or the edge of the deck was pushed into the path of the blade.
Either way that would take a pretty substantial amount of force and
more than the stick you describe could possibly be responsible for.


Sorry Art this deck is not like other decks, I know exactly what your
talking about, but this deck dips down at the discharge (behind it), I
guess it's some kinda aerodynamic thing,
If you want I can post a link to a picture.

Clark

Still going back and forth with Sears
 

willshak wrote:

[....]
If I had happen what the OP experienced, I would have bought, borrowed,
or stolen a truck, to bring it right back to Sears, drive it inside and
left it on the floor if they didn't get me a new one.

now that's the attitude I can admire, appreciate and respect.
if you ever need someone to hold the door open while you're
driving one back inside, you just let me know.. the visual
of those sears customers scurrying for their safety puts a
big grin on my wide eyed country boy face.

best 2U

Still going back and forth with Sears
 

on 8/30/2007 7:01 PM Clark said the following:
Art wrote:

Clark wrote:

Art wrote:

Likely the deck hangers are bent. I'd guess when you hit that "twig"
(that stopped the mower and bent the deck into the blade) it shoved
the entire deck back and bent some stuff.

I have to take issue with your original description of events. It
just doesn't ring entirely true. The stick you showed could not
have caused the damage you described. At worst it would have jammed
between the blade tip and deck, bend the blade, and caused
everything to stop, maybe even break a belt. But the fact that the
blade cut into the deck means that the deck was pushed (read bent)
into the path of the blade. That takes a pretty substantial amount
of force. You said the engine also stopped which makes me think
that whatever you hit was large enough to stop the forward motion
of the tractor. Maybe a stump or some other immovable object?

Was Kathy using it when it happened or were you?

Hi Art.

I was on the mower, what happened was the blade hit the stick the
stick then like catapulted the blade into the mower deck (this deck
is one of the fancy high output types so the deck is not flat but
dips from the top down towards the discharge) so the blade hits the
deck cuts into the deck about 2 1/2 inches and that is when
everything stopped. I never hit anything that would have bent anything
like hangers
which in my case would be beneficial because the mower is advertised
to have a 4 inch cut and is only slightly less than 3 1/2 inches,
and that's without my fat ass on it. gotta be nearer 3 when I'm on,
(I weight 185)

I have seen a lot of bent blades but I've never seen one that was bent
such that it stretched and sliced into the deck.
Let's just say it is a 20" blade. That is 10" from the center bolt or
it's pivot point to the tip. The deck will be approximately 10-1/4"
minimum distance from that same point. It is physically impossible to
bend a blade (by hitting a stick of any size) in such a way that it
becomes longer. The deck *must* be bent for that to happen. Either the
spindle mounting point was twisted causing the blade pivot point to
move or the edge of the deck was pushed into the path of the blade.
Either way that would take a pretty substantial amount of force and
more than the stick you describe could possibly be responsible for.



Sorry Art this deck is not like other decks, I know exactly what your
talking about, but this deck dips down at the discharge (behind it), I
guess it's some kinda aerodynamic thing,
If you want I can post a link to a picture.

Clark


Actually, it is like all other mower decks. The back of the deck is set
at the depth desired and the front is a little higher. The idea is that
the mower deck cuts twice. The front of the blades make the first cut
higher than the depth setting and the trailing edge makes the second cut
to the depth desired.
Instead of leaving long blades of cut grass, there will be shorter pieces.

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

Still going back and forth with Sears
 

On 8/31/2007 9:41 AM, willshak wrote:
on 8/30/2007 7:01 PM Clark said the following:



Sorry Art this deck is not like other decks, I know exactly what your
talking about, but this deck dips down at the discharge (behind it),
I guess it's some kinda aerodynamic thing,
If you want I can post a link to a picture.

Clark


Actually, it is like all other mower decks. The back of the deck is set
at the depth desired and the front is a little higher. The idea is that
the mower deck cuts twice. The front of the blades make the first cut
higher than the depth setting and the trailing edge makes the second cut
to the depth desired.
Instead of leaving long blades of cut grass, there will be shorter pieces.


I take great care leveling my decks. If the front lip seems high, it
merely eases movement into the swath. Blades tilted up enough to make a
difference regarding grass height/blade length would be noticeable in
the finished lawn.
The effect you mention (usually on high-end mowers/blades) can be
achieved with a blade that looks as if the first inch or two has been
twisted up; edge on the blade looks (or doesn't look) like this:
___ ___
\_____------I------_____/


Lawns around Lake Sam Rayburn are very sandy, tending to erode the tips
of blades. When eroded past their useful life, they leave a slight
ridge with twin blade decks and two ridges with triples. Blades tilted
up would tend to do the same.
One of my lawn tractors, a twin blade 40" Murray, suffered my backing
over a thick door mat. (Hemp, I do believe.) After trying to get the
kink out of the blades, I replaced them, but couldn't get the ever so
slight warp out of the deck. As long as I used a 1/4" spacer on the
left side of the deck when leveling, it cut perfectly. Otherwise, the
lawn looked like I cut it with a low tire.
Tires are another thing. At 8 or 10 psi, most gauges aren't accurate
enough to get tires exactly the same pressure. Turf tires can vary,too.
The best way to adjust tire pressure is with a tape measure or length
of string marked with the front and rear circumference of the tires.
Simply loop the tape or string around the tire and adjust the air
pressure till both sides are equal. It might surprise you that the
actual pressure might differ from left to right. As long as the
circumference is equal, you will be level. (Measure twice, bleed once.)
I may be wrong on these points, but they have served me well. I've been
cutting St Augustine since nineteen and fifty somethin'.
Any are welcomed (and encouraged) to disagree (except the mean ol' trolls).


--
Ted
I wasn't born in Texas but
I got back here as soon as I could


No matter how great and destructive your problems may seem
now, remember, you've probably only seen the tip of them.

Still going back and forth with Sears
 

Good advice.
"xPosTech" wrote in message
...
On 8/31/2007 9:41 AM, willshak wrote:
on 8/30/2007 7:01 PM Clark said the following:



Sorry Art this deck is not like other decks, I know exactly what your
talking about, but this deck dips down at the discharge (behind it), I
guess it's some kinda aerodynamic thing,
If you want I can post a link to a picture.

Clark


Actually, it is like all other mower decks. The back of the deck is set
at the depth desired and the front is a little higher. The idea is that
the mower deck cuts twice. The front of the blades make the first cut
higher than the depth setting and the trailing edge makes the second cut
to the depth desired.
Instead of leaving long blades of cut grass, there will be shorter
pieces.


I take great care leveling my decks. If the front lip seems high, it
merely eases movement into the swath. Blades tilted up enough to make a
difference regarding grass height/blade length would be noticeable in the
finished lawn.
The effect you mention (usually on high-end mowers/blades) can be achieved
with a blade that looks as if the first inch or two has been twisted up;
edge on the blade looks (or doesn't look) like this:
___ ___
\_____------I------_____/


Lawns around Lake Sam Rayburn are very sandy, tending to erode the tips of
blades. When eroded past their useful life, they leave a slight ridge
with twin blade decks and two ridges with triples. Blades tilted up would
tend to do the same.
One of my lawn tractors, a twin blade 40" Murray, suffered my backing over
a thick door mat. (Hemp, I do believe.) After trying to get the kink out
of the blades, I replaced them, but couldn't get the ever so slight warp
out of the deck. As long as I used a 1/4" spacer on the left side of the
deck when leveling, it cut perfectly. Otherwise, the lawn looked like I
cut it with a low tire.
Tires are another thing. At 8 or 10 psi, most gauges aren't accurate
enough to get tires exactly the same pressure. Turf tires can vary,too.
The best way to adjust tire pressure is with a tape measure or length of
string marked with the front and rear circumference of the tires. Simply
loop the tape or string around the tire and adjust the air pressure till
both sides are equal. It might surprise you that the actual pressure
might differ from left to right. As long as the circumference is equal,
you will be level. (Measure twice, bleed once.)
I may be wrong on these points, but they have served me well. I've been
cutting St Augustine since nineteen and fifty somethin'.
Any are welcomed (and encouraged) to disagree (except the mean ol'
trolls).


--
Ted
I wasn't born in Texas but
I got back here as soon as I could


No matter how great and destructive your problems may seem
now, remember, you've probably only seen the tip of them.