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Old 18-10-2008, 05:20 PM
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Unhappy Less lawn, more ants ....

Hi

Just bought a house in Kent that had an old age couple living in it, the back garden (approx 90 foot by 50 foot) had very rough grass maybe 8-10 inches long - I was told by a neighbour that it was cut by their son when he had a chance, but only maybe 6 times a year. The result is very bumpy with dips and hollows (that I can live with) an impressive amount of thatch (thats why God invented scarifiers) but, most impressivly, cutting it for the first time today down to about 3 inches, I found approx 25 ants nest, with patches of earth coming through the grass, some about the size of a dinner plate, some bigger. They are full of Brown ants with some black ones.

Any suggestions?? I could go bankrupt boiling water to shove down them so would rather not go that route.

Searching the web doesnt show much, one site suggested dilute solution of borax, but little else.

Sugestions?? Anyone???

Help - or its napalm time again...

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Old 19-10-2008, 12:17 AM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden
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Default Less lawn, more ants ....

Paul the Stump wrote:

... an impressive amount of thatch (thats why God invented
scarifiers)


Not to go off (too far) on a tangent, but the machine known as a
"scarifier" seems to be unique to the UK. It's unknown to North America
as far as I know.

Please describe how it works.
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Old 19-10-2008, 02:23 PM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden
Bob Bob is offline
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Default Less lawn, more ants ....

look up verticutter

"Lawn Guy" wrote in message ...
Paul the Stump wrote:

... an impressive amount of thatch (thats why God invented
scarifiers)


Not to go off (too far) on a tangent, but the machine known as a
"scarifier" seems to be unique to the UK. It's unknown to North America
as far as I know.

Please describe how it works.



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Old 19-10-2008, 04:23 PM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden,alt.home.repair
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Default Scarifier vs Verticutter vs Dethatcher (was: Less lawn, more ants)

Bob wrote:

look up verticutter


Seems to me that in the UK, scarifiers are a common product to be found
for sale at the average lawn/garden store (ie the eqivalent to Home
Depot or Lowes) but in Canada (probably US too) all you will see
(seasonally) for sale are lawn mowers and snow blowers.

Does anyone know for sure is a scarifier is the same as a verticutter
(verticle cutter), and is either of them also known as a de-thatcher?

Examples:

AL-KO 3800VB Powerline Petrol Lawn Scarifier:
http://www.mower-magic.co.uk/acatalo...l_Aerator.html

Honda GX160 Petrol Verticutter:
http://www.camon.co.uk/Verticutter.htm

Dethatcher (pictures):
http://www.landscape-america.com/pro.../dethatch.html
http://www.veseys.com/ca/en/store/ma...lawndethatcher

Then we have other types of equipment:

Billy Goat CR550H 5hp Honda Compact Power Rake
http://www.cairnsmowercity.com/prod559.htm

Billy Goat AE551 5.5hp Core Lawn Aerator
http://www.cairnsmowercity.com/prod551.htm

-----------------

Earlier this spring I was looking for an all-in-one machine that would
be used primarily in the spring, and it would do the following or have
the following capabilities:

- gas powered, 5 to 10 hp
- push or walk behind (not ride on)
- important feature is that it's a high suction vaccum cleaner
with large canister recepticle
- vacuum deck contains brushes, knives, blades, wires, or some
other spinning, whirling mechanism that can beat the ground
and dislodge loose debris for the vacuum to pick up (like a
beater bar on a vacuum cleaner). Minimal harm to grass.

Uses:

- pick up gravel, sand, pea-sized stones or small broken bits of
asphalt on driveways, small parking lots, or the roadway in front
of your house in the spring that was left behind by winter road
dammage and sand/gravel put down by road maintanence vehicles
during the winter.

- clean the lawn in the spring of all the various loose organic
debris, leaf and twig fragments (etc) that even a lawn mower with
a bag and with the deck set low to the ground will not pick up.

- grind up (to an extent beyond what a lawn mower would do) and pick
up leaves in the fall.

Cost: Between $500 and $750 USD.

Is there such a machine?
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Old 19-10-2008, 06:59 PM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden
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Default Scarifier vs Verticutter vs Dethatcher

[a.h.r. removed]

Lawn Guy said:

-----------------

Earlier this spring I was looking for an all-in-one machine that would
be used primarily in the spring, and it would do the following or have
the following capabilities:

- gas powered, 5 to 10 hp
- push or walk behind (not ride on)
- important feature is that it's a high suction vaccum cleaner
with large canister recepticle
- vacuum deck contains brushes, knives, blades, wires, or some
other spinning, whirling mechanism that can beat the ground
and dislodge loose debris for the vacuum to pick up (like a
beater bar on a vacuum cleaner). Minimal harm to grass.


If you're constantly beating the ground with "brushes, knives, blades,
wires, or some other spinning, whirling mechanism", how the hell do you
expect to do "minimal harm to grass"?


Uses:

- pick up gravel, sand, pea-sized stones or small broken bits of
asphalt on driveways, small parking lots, or the roadway in front
of your house in the spring that was left behind by winter road
dammage and sand/gravel put down by road maintanence vehicles
during the winter.


Doesn't your street department clean your street?


- clean the lawn in the spring of all the various loose organic
debris, leaf and twig fragments (etc) that even a lawn mower with
a bag and with the deck set low to the ground will not pick up.

- grind up (to an extent beyond what a lawn mower would do) and pick
up leaves in the fall.


Do you really expect a machine that you've used all year to grind gravel,
sand, stones, broken asphalt, etc, to still have the capabilities to mulch
leaves AND:

Cost: Between $500 and $750 USD.


LMAO. You're a ****ing idiot.


Is there such a machine?


Good god, no. Buy a ****ing rake.
--

Eggs

-A balanced diet is a cookie in each hand.


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Old 19-10-2008, 07:21 PM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden,alt.home.repair
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Default Scarifier vs Verticutter vs Dethatcher

Eggs Zachtly wrote:

If you're constantly beating the ground with "brushes, knives,
blades, wires, or some other spinning, whirling mechanism",
how the hell do you expect to do "minimal harm to grass"?


Well, since there are things called "scarifiers" and "verticutters" and
aerators that apparently do beat or cut or slice into the ground, with
the goal of working the top layer without chewing up the grass too
badly, then I'd say that it shouldn't be too hard to dislodge and remove
loose shit on the ground and between the grass blades without chewing up
the grass too much.

Doesn't your street department clean your street?


Yea - halfway through the summer.

And they don't clean my 5000 sq.ft. commercial office parking lot.

Do you really expect a machine that you've used all year to grind
gravel, sand, stones, broken asphalt, etc, to still have the
capabilities to mulch leaves


Sure, with an appropriate quick-change of internal components.

AND:
Cost: Between $500 and $750 USD.


Anything's possible if it's made in China.

LMAO. You're a ****ing idiot.


You're a ****ing ass wipe.
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Old 19-10-2008, 08:41 PM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden,alt.home.repair
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Default Scarifier vs Verticutter vs Dethatcher

On Oct 19, 1:21*pm, Lawn Guy wrote:
Eggs Zachtly wrote:
If you're constantly beating the ground with "brushes, knives,
blades, wires, or some other spinning, whirling mechanism",
how the hell do you expect to do "minimal harm to grass"?


Well, since there are things called "scarifiers" and "verticutters" and
aerators that apparently do beat or cut or slice into the ground, with
the goal of working the top layer without chewing up the grass too
badly, then I'd say that it shouldn't be too hard to dislodge and remove
loose shit on the ground and between the grass blades without chewing up
the grass too much.

Doesn't your street department clean your street?


Yea - halfway through the summer. *

And they don't clean my 5000 sq.ft. commercial office parking lot.

Do you really expect a machine that you've used all year to grind
gravel, sand, stones, broken asphalt, etc, to still have the
capabilities to mulch leaves


Sure, with an appropriate quick-change of internal components.

AND:
Cost: *Between $500 and $750 USD.


Anything's possible if it's made in China.

LMAO. You're a ****ing idiot.


You're a ****ing ass wipe.


Youb have totally different pieces of equipment all confused as one
item under different names.

A scarifier is used to score or scarify hard pan soils and break it
up. Dooes not really work all that well for aeration as it destroys
too much surface area and pulls up roots etc.
An aerator is simply a device thatpoles elongated holes slots or a
round rod or tapered blade into the soil to allow water and air
infusion. It does not remove dead grasses nor does it break up the
soil it merely pierces the ground foro water and air infusion.
A dethatcher is just that, usually a stiff spring that scrubs along
the ground betweenthe tufts of grass that pulls up and deposits dead
and cut and built up grass and other debri onthe surface where its
raked and gathered up and hauled off to compost pile or trash. I may
scratch the soil surface a small amount but not enough to do any
damage to roots or disturb the soil as it is mainly intended and
designed to loosen up and bring tot he top the packed in grass
clippings etc.
Never heard of a verticutter.

FOr an already established lawn or redoing an establisehd lawmn all
you need is an aerator and dethatcher. ONly need a scarifier i fyour
breaking up hard pan to plant whatever initially, similar to a disk
harow but it does not go as deep and its usually much smaller in width
covered as well. Although the scarifiers on the backs of bulldozers
and largher ag type tractors usualy consist of one or two huge long
teeth that is drug into the soil to break up the hard pan to deeper
depths than most harrows will go. It takes decent hoprsepower to pull
a scarifier, where a dethatcher or aerator takes minimal power
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Old 20-10-2008, 06:10 PM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden,alt.home.repair
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Default Scarifier vs Verticutter vs Dethatcher (was: Less lawn, more ants)


"Lawn Guy" wrote in message ...
Bob wrote:

look up verticutter


Seems to me that in the UK, scarifiers are a common product to be found
for sale at the average lawn/garden store (ie the eqivalent to Home
Depot or Lowes) but in Canada (probably US too) all you will see
(seasonally) for sale are lawn mowers and snow blowers.

Does anyone know for sure is a scarifier is the same as a verticutter
(verticle cutter), and is either of them also known as a de-thatcher?

Examples:

AL-KO 3800VB Powerline Petrol Lawn Scarifier:
http://www.mower-magic.co.uk/acatalo...l_Aerator.html

Honda GX160 Petrol Verticutter:
http://www.camon.co.uk/Verticutter.htm

Dethatcher (pictures):
http://www.landscape-america.com/pro.../dethatch.html
http://www.veseys.com/ca/en/store/ma...lawndethatcher

Then we have other types of equipment:

Billy Goat CR550H 5hp Honda Compact Power Rake
http://www.cairnsmowercity.com/prod559.htm

Billy Goat AE551 5.5hp Core Lawn Aerator
http://www.cairnsmowercity.com/prod551.htm

-----------------

Earlier this spring I was looking for an all-in-one machine that would
be used primarily in the spring, and it would do the following or have
the following capabilities:

- gas powered, 5 to 10 hp
- push or walk behind (not ride on)
- important feature is that it's a high suction vaccum cleaner
with large canister recepticle
- vacuum deck contains brushes, knives, blades, wires, or some
other spinning, whirling mechanism that can beat the ground
and dislodge loose debris for the vacuum to pick up (like a
beater bar on a vacuum cleaner). Minimal harm to grass.

Uses:

- pick up gravel, sand, pea-sized stones or small broken bits of
asphalt on driveways, small parking lots, or the roadway in front
of your house in the spring that was left behind by winter road
dammage and sand/gravel put down by road maintanence vehicles
during the winter.

- clean the lawn in the spring of all the various loose organic
debris, leaf and twig fragments (etc) that even a lawn mower with
a bag and with the deck set low to the ground will not pick up.

- grind up (to an extent beyond what a lawn mower would do) and pick
up leaves in the fall.

Cost: Between $500 and $750 USD.

Is there such a machine?


A Verticutter is another name for Vertimower which is used for dethatching
lawns , It is hard work and very messy .
(VERTIMOWING or DE-THATCHING is the physical cutting and removal of the
thatch, The vertimower has around 25 tungsten tipped blades) Virticutter is
not the universal name , Virtimower is and is used to Virticut .

If you want to Aerate Lawn you need an Aerator or as some people call a
Coring machine (A lawn aerator is a garden tool designed to aerate the soil
in which lawn grasses grow. Aeration improves soil drainage) the average
machines uses about a 5.5HP engine.


A scarifier can be a hand help tool normally with 3 bent prongs that are
dragged threw hard soil to break it up , a Plow , Rotary Hoe, cultivator or
Tiller all perform to the same job on different scales.

The 3 above machines are all entirely different and individual machines , No
one machine can perform all the 3 tasks.

The money you expect to pay would make a small down payment on a Vertimower.
A friend who does this for a living just paid $5300 for his Vertimower.


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Old 20-10-2008, 07:20 PM
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Cool

Excellent. Brilliant. Outstanding. So helpful.

For the record, a scarifier is a set of either human or electric motor powered tines, height adjustable, which is used on grass to pull up and clear the dead thatch that lies on the ground between the blades, thereby helping the grass grow, strong and tall and thick, in that oh so British way.

I have no interest in any machine with whirling bl;ades (except, see Monty Pythoins Flying Circus, Series 2 I believe - "The Architects Sketch").

Now that is clear, can I assume that no one so far has any idea about the point of the damn post??????

Just thought I should ask ...... :-)
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Old 21-10-2008, 12:21 AM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden
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Default Scarifier vs Verticutter vs Dethatcher

[again, a.h.r. snipped as it has NOTHING to do with the subject]

Lawn Guy said:

Eggs Zachtly wrote:

If you're constantly beating the ground with "brushes, knives,
blades, wires, or some other spinning, whirling mechanism",
how the hell do you expect to do "minimal harm to grass"?


Well, since there are things called "scarifiers" and "verticutters" and
aerators that apparently do beat or cut or slice into the ground, with
the goal of working the top layer without chewing up the grass too
badly, then I'd say that it shouldn't be too hard to dislodge and remove
loose shit on the ground and between the grass blades without chewing up
the grass too much.


Ya. Ok. Let's see....

Who the hell said that those tools do their job "without chewing up the
grass too badly"? (Hint: you) Aerification should take place only twice a
year at most (once a year is plenty for a low-traffic lawn). De-thatching
as needed, probably once every 5-10 years. That process tears the hell out
of the turf. How the **** do you think you can get to the thatch, and
remove it, without going through the turf first?

Believe it or not dumbass, the turf needs time to recover after these
processes. That's why they aren't done on a weekly basis. You want a
machine that you're going to use a lot, doing the same damage. You'll have
a yard full of dirt in no time. With a nym like "Lawn Guy", you're pretty
****ing clooless about turf management, aren't you.

[rest snipped]
--

Eggs

-A drunk man's words are a sober man's thoughts.


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Old 21-10-2008, 12:54 AM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden,alt.home.repair
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Default Scarifier vs Verticutter vs Dethatcher (was: Less lawn, more ants)

Full-Quoter Slick wrote:

A Verticutter is ...

If you want to Aerate Lawn ...


Which I don't.

A scarifier can be a ...


The 3 above machines are all entirely different and
individual machines , No one machine can perform all
the 3 tasks.


I'm not looking for a machine that Aerates.

I'm looking for an out-door, gasoline-powered vacuum cleaner that can
vacuum sand, gravel and small stones from paves surfaces, and then
(perhaps by changing a part or two) will dislodge and vaccum up anything
not nailed down on my lawn (leaving only grass) and then (perhaps by
changing a part or two) will vacuum up, pulverize and turn to dust
leaves in the fall.
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Old 21-10-2008, 01:25 AM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden
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Default Scarifier vs Verticutter vs Dethatcher

Shit-head Eggs Zachtly wrote:

Aerification should take place only twice a year at most


I never said I wanted to aerate, and I never said that it's normal to
aerate frequently, or that aerating (frequently or infrequently) causes
no harm to grass.

De-thatching as needed, probably once every 5-10 years.


Since I bag my grass when I cut it, I don't have a need to de-thatch.

That process tears the hell ut of the turf.


And it's my understanding that the grass comes right back in 2 weeks
because you're not pulling their roots out.

Believe it or not dumbass, the turf needs time to recover after
these processes. That's why they aren't done on a weekly basis.


I never said they were.

And I never said I wanted to vaccum my lawn constantly either. I said I
would use it in the spring to remove all the shit left behind by the
winter.

You want a machine that you're going to use a lot,


No I didn't you ****ing turd.

I said I wanted a machine that is essentially an out-door vacuum cleaner
that I'd use (a) in the spring (on my lawn and on paved surfaces) to
clean the winter shit, and (b) in the fall to grind up and collect the
leaves.

you're pretty ****ing clooless about


You've got reading comprehension problems - don't you?
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Old 21-10-2008, 01:38 AM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden
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Default Scarifier vs Verticutter vs Dethatcher

Lawn Guy said:

Since I bag my grass when I cut it, I don't have a need to de-thatch.


Do you even understand what thatch is?

--

Eggs

What was the greatest thing before sliced bread?
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Old 21-10-2008, 01:41 AM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden
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Default Less lawn, more ants ....

Paul the Stump wrote:

can I assume that no one so far has any idea about
the point of the damn post??????


Get yourself 250 to 500 ml of any of the following. Go with Sevin,
Dursban, or anything containing Diazonon or Malathion as your first
choice.

Mix 10 to 20 ml of the chemical of your choice in 1 L of warm water.
Dump entire liter onto / into ant hill. Pour slowly so most of it
enters the colony and doesn't just run off laterally.

Do that to every ant hill and in 24 hours you won't have an ant problem
any more.

Don't spray any of this stuff - it kills bees and that's not good.

If you have one of those shop vac's - like this one:

http://www.ridgid.com/Tools/12-Gallon-Vac/EN/index.htm

or smaller, use it to vacuum out the ants first and clean out their
colony before you pour the chemicals. Place the nozzle squarely over
their exit holes. This will help the pesticide reach further into the
colony, and the vacuuming will suck up some ants that you can kill (or
re-locate) later.

The vacuuming will help you remove the excess dirt and return the lawn
to the flat contour it had before, and might extricate some remnants of
living grass that was buried under the dirt. After a week, throw down
some grass seed, cover with top soil, and mix in some granular lawn
fertilizer and water liberally for a week or two.

-------------------------------

Sevin (Carbaryl)
Product names include Carbamine, Denapon, Dicarbam, Hexavin, Karbaspray,
Nac, Ravyon, Septene, Sevin, Tercyl, Tricarnam, and Union Carbide 7744.

Merit (Imidacloprid) made by Bayer
Trade names include Merit, Admire, Provado, Gaucho

Temik (Aldicarb)
Only trade or product name I know of is Temik.

Dursban (Chlorpyrifos)
Trade names include Brodan, Detmol UA, Dowco 179, Dursban, Eradex,
Lorsban, Piridane, Stipend

Cygon (Dimethoate)
Trade names include Cekuthoate, Chimigor 40, Cygon 400, Daphene,
De-Fend, Demos NF, Devigon, Dimate 267, Dimet, Dimethoat Tech 95%,
Dimethopgen, Ferkethion, Fostion MM, Perfekthion, Rogodan, Rogodial,
Rogor, Roxion, Sevigor, Trimetion.

Bug-B-Gon (Diazinon)
Trade names include Basudin, Dazzel, Gardentox, Kayazol, Knox Out,
Nucidol, and Spectracide.

No common trade name - (Malathion)
Also known as carbophos, maldison and mercaptothion. Trade names for
products containing malathion include Celthion, Cythion, Dielathion, El
4049, Emmaton, Exathios, Fyfanon and Hilthion, Karbofos and Maltox.
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Old 21-10-2008, 01:50 AM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden
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Default Scarifier vs Verticutter vs Dethatcher

Eggs Zachtly wrote:

Since I bag my grass when I cut it, I don't have a need to
de-thatch.


Do you even understand what thatch is?


Some say it's the remnants of cut grass and other organic debris.

Others say it's the stems and the crowns of dead grass just above the
soil.

Regardless of what thatch is, if any of it is NOT rooted in the ground
then by bagging your grass every time you mow you are defacto reducing
the tendency for thatch buildup.


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