On May 23, 6:36*pm, "HLS" wrote:

snip

*I have had only one BS engine really
disappoint me, and that was because the casting was make of parmesan cheese.

If the engine plant is in Milwaukee, they probably used cheddar.

Joe

"muzician21" wrote in message
...
Have a B&S on a 70's era Snapper 21" pusher with an aluminum deck. I
believe the engine is probably 10 years newer than the rest of the
mower.

Maybe 10 years ago I took it to a repair shop who installed a solid
state unit to replace the points. Even with the solid state ignition
it was never one-pull start, but as I recall it usually started with
probably 3 - 5 pulls. Now it takes probably 20 pulls or more and
monkeying with the throttle. Once it fires it runs like a clock, runs
up and down the speed range fine. It's also easier to re-start once
it's been running - though still not one pull. Doesn't seem to use an
inordinate amount of oil, no discernible smoke out the exhaust. It
gets what I'd call moderate use. I'm in central Florida so it gets run
bi-weekly or so during the rainy months, not at all during the months
of what passes for a winter down here.

I'm mechanically inclined but not well-versed on the theory of this
kind of engine. I've had it broken down far enough to remove and flush
the gas tank, change the points when it had points, replace the pull
rope. I've change the spark plug of course. I know it should start
much easier than it does. Any suggestions where to look, what to
tweak? There isn't that much to it from what I can see, so it
shouldn't be that difficult. I believe this mower has a lot of life
left in it.

Thanks for all input.

As Stormin suggested I agree you should check the "air gap" on the ignition
coil even though it sounds like a fuel problem. I remove the ignition coil
every few years and clean the edges and magnet on the flywheel with
sandpaper and coat it with a little oil or vaseline or whatever. This helps
keep down the rust. I generally use three thicknesses of printer paper to
adjust the air gap. Check the spark plug connector and clean out any
corrosion and squeeze it a bit with pliers to ensure good contact.
Sometimes the spring for the governor will get a bit stretched and can be
shortened to where it just barely has tension with the engine off. Try
holding the throttle all the way closed while it's running and adjust the
idle speed to where it seems about right. If it's too low it may be hard to
start. Also, if the throttle/choke cable has slipped it can cause the choke
to be on or off when you want it the other way. Removing the head might be
in order to--scrape off the carbon deposits and clean the valve seats being
careful not do damage the seats. I have had success many times simply by
putting some high-temp silicone on the old head gasket and reusing it.

My old B&S lawnmower sounds very similar to yours but it's only 23 years
old. My experience with these engines is that as long as the piston is
still attached to the crankshaft they can be made to mow lawns. I was
having a lot of trouble with mine in the past with hard starting and I even
turned the engine sideways so I could pull the rope from the side. This
arrangement also eliminated some problems with the cable moving out of
adjustment as it eliminated the 90 degree turn in the cable. Also, check to
be sure the blade is tight. These things need it to maintain momentum.

On Sun, 24 May 2009 09:57:26 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

* If the spark plug is Champion, try a different brand. They
had bad sparkplugs in the past.

Plenty of good advise for the OP, so far. I would start with a new
plug with a hotter heat-range. Putting a "hot plug" in one mower was a
solution for me.

Some pre-gapped plugs are not accurate and should always be checked ,
before install.

muzician21 wrote:
Have a B&S on a 70's era Snapper 21" pusher with an aluminum deck. I
believe the engine is probably 10 years newer than the rest of the
mower.

Maybe 10 years ago I took it to a repair shop who installed a solid
state unit to replace the points. Even with the solid state ignition
it was never one-pull start, but as I recall it usually started with
probably 3 - 5 pulls. Now it takes probably 20 pulls or more and
monkeying with the throttle. Once it fires it runs like a clock, runs
up and down the speed range fine. It's also easier to re-start once
it's been running - though still not one pull. Doesn't seem to use an
inordinate amount of oil, no discernible smoke out the exhaust. It
gets what I'd call moderate use. I'm in central Florida so it gets run
bi-weekly or so during the rainy months, not at all during the months
of what passes for a winter down here.

I'm mechanically inclined but not well-versed on the theory of this
kind of engine. I've had it broken down far enough to remove and flush
the gas tank, change the points when it had points, replace the pull
rope. I've change the spark plug of course. I know it should start
much easier than it does. Any suggestions where to look, what to
tweak? There isn't that much to it from what I can see, so it
shouldn't be that difficult. I believe this mower has a lot of life
left in it.

Thanks for all input.

I've worked on a lot of standby generators with small
engines and one of the problems with older engines
that have accumulated a lot of hours is valve seat wear.
The valve recedes into the head decreasing clearance
at the end of the valve stem. You can actually heat up
such an engine with a propane torch and the expansion
of the metal parts will allow it to start easily. If you
can adjust the valve clearance, I do believe your engine
will start easily again.

TDD

On Sat, 23 May 2009 20:13:16 -0500, Fat Moe
wrote:

muzician21 wrote:
Have a B&S on a 70's era Snapper 21" pusher with an aluminum deck. I
believe the engine is probably 10 years newer than the rest of the
mower.

Maybe 10 years ago I took it to a repair shop who installed a solid
state unit to replace the points. Even with the solid state ignition
it was never one-pull start, but as I recall it usually started with
probably 3 - 5 pulls. Now it takes probably 20 pulls or more and
monkeying with the throttle. Once it fires it runs like a clock, runs
up and down the speed range fine. It's also easier to re-start once
it's been running - though still not one pull. Doesn't seem to use an
inordinate amount of oil, no discernible smoke out the exhaust. It
gets what I'd call moderate use. I'm in central Florida so it gets run
bi-weekly or so during the rainy months, not at all during the months
of what passes for a winter down here.

I'm mechanically inclined but not well-versed on the theory of this
kind of engine. I've had it broken down far enough to remove and flush
the gas tank, change the points when it had points, replace the pull
rope. I've change the spark plug of course. I know it should start
much easier than it does. Any suggestions where to look, what to
tweak? There isn't that much to it from what I can see, so it
shouldn't be that difficult. I believe this mower has a lot of life
left in it.

Thanks for all input.
Sounds like it's time to do a little work on the carburetor. Put a new
diaphragm in it if it the older type that uses those. As the motors age
it's worth while to make a priming port in the air cleaner, drill a hole
you can plug after starting and spray some carb cleaner in it to start
it. Also check the valve clearances (those easy spin engine valve
clearances are pretty critical for easy starting) and a good spark plug.
Would help if you posted the engine model number. On newer ones
with primer bulbs and bowl/float it's common for the main jet to get
clogged over winter.

Put some "sea foam" in the tank to clear out the jets and see what
happens. If it has adjustable jets try setting 1/4 turn richer to see
if it helps. Definitely sounds like it is starting too lean.

On the early Briggs, that means pulling the head, and then
using special equipment to get the spring ends back on.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote in
message ...

I've worked on a lot of standby generators with small
engines and one of the problems with older engines
that have accumulated a lot of hours is valve seat wear.
The valve recedes into the head decreasing clearance
at the end of the valve stem. You can actually heat up
such an engine with a propane torch and the expansion
of the metal parts will allow it to start easily. If you
can adjust the valve clearance, I do believe your engine
will start easily again.

TDD

Stormin Mormon wrote:
On the early Briggs, that means pulling the head, and then
using special equipment to get the spring ends back on.


I like the Vanguard engines because they have overhead valves
that are easy to adjust. It makes it easy to get one of them
running good again.

TDD

On May 24, 9:11*am, JP wrote:
On May 23, 4:30*pm, muzician21 wrote:





Have a B&S on a 70's era Snapper 21" pusher with an aluminum deck. I
believe the engine is probably 10 years newer than the rest of the
mower.

Maybe 10 years ago I took it to a repair shop who installed a solid
state unit to replace the points. Even with the solid state ignition
it was never one-pull start, but as I recall it usually started with
probably 3 - 5 pulls. Now it takes probably 20 pulls or more and
monkeying with the throttle. Once it fires it runs like a clock, runs
up and down the speed range fine. It's also easier to re-start once
it's been running - though still not one pull. Doesn't seem to use an
inordinate amount of oil, no discernible smoke out the exhaust. It
gets what I'd call moderate use. I'm in central Florida so it gets run
bi-weekly or so during the rainy months, not at all during the months
of what passes for a winter down here.

I'm mechanically inclined but not well-versed on the theory of this
kind of engine. I've had it broken down far enough to remove and flush
the gas tank, change the points when it had points, replace the pull
rope. I've change the spark plug of course. I know it should start
much easier than it does. Any suggestions where to look, what to
tweak? There isn't that much to it from what I can see, so it
shouldn't be that difficult. I believe this mower has a lot of life
left in it.

Thanks for all input.

I have found that a lot of times the muffler is plugged.
I have got some good byes because of a plugged muffler.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I never heard that one, I have had a 2 stroke spark arrestor clog up.

On May 24, 8:40*pm, The Daring Dufas
wrote:
Stormin Mormon wrote:
On the early Briggs, that means pulling the head, and then
using special equipment to get the spring ends back on.

I like the Vanguard engines because they have overhead valves
that are easy to adjust. It makes it easy to get one of them
running good again.

TDD

What about low compression, then its toasted.

muzician21 wrote in
:

Have a B&S on a 70's era Snapper 21" pusher with an aluminum deck. I
believe the engine is probably 10 years newer than the rest of the
mower.

Maybe 10 years ago I took it to a repair shop who installed a solid
state unit to replace the points. Even with the solid state ignition
it was never one-pull start, but as I recall it usually started with
probably 3 - 5 pulls. Now it takes probably 20 pulls or more and
monkeying with the throttle. Once it fires it runs like a clock, runs
up and down the speed range fine. It's also easier to re-start once
it's been running - though still not one pull. Doesn't seem to use an
inordinate amount of oil, no discernible smoke out the exhaust. It
gets what I'd call moderate use. I'm in central Florida so it gets run
bi-weekly or so during the rainy months, not at all during the months
of what passes for a winter down here.

I'm mechanically inclined but not well-versed on the theory of this
kind of engine. I've had it broken down far enough to remove and flush
the gas tank, change the points when it had points, replace the pull
rope. I've change the spark plug of course. I know it should start
much easier than it does. Any suggestions where to look, what to
tweak? There isn't that much to it from what I can see, so it
shouldn't be that difficult. I believe this mower has a lot of life
left in it.

Try this: it won't cost you anything and it worked it my case. In fact I
have to do it every year due to poor quality gas.

First drain the gas tank completely along with the hose to the carborator.
Next either *temporarily* plug or otherwise stop any ability for liquid
to come out of the hose. Vice grips on the end works fine if placed right.
Leave the hose attached to the tank however and remove the tank from the
mower. Put about 1 cup of Varsol into the gas tank. Screw on the lid for
the gas tank so it won't leak. Shake the tank vigoursly for about a minute
or so. Drain the fluid from both ends - the tank and the hose.

After a years mowing the filter at the bottom of my gas tank gets so
clogged with gunk that it changes colour from silver to black. You can
check by draining the tank and looking at it carefully if it's visible.

I went for two years having to start it with ether the first time every
year. Even took it in for service with no improvement before I figured
this out. Now it will start on choke first pull when it's 45 degrees F.
Every time.

ransley wrote:
On May 24, 8:40 pm, The Daring Dufas
wrote:
Stormin Mormon wrote:
On the early Briggs, that means pulling the head, and then
using special equipment to get the spring ends back on.
I like the Vanguard engines because they have overhead valves
that are easy to adjust. It makes it easy to get one of them
running good again.

TDD

What about low compression, then its toasted.

With butter and jam?

TDD

That will give you a heart attack..... butter. You should
use margarine, but that has trans fats. Ah, well. Give up.
Go be a monk in Tibet.

Did we hear back, why the engine isn't starting properly?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote in
message ...

What about low compression, then its toasted.

With butter and jam?

TDD

Stormin Mormon wrote:
That will give you a heart attack..... butter. You should
use margarine, but that has trans fats. Ah, well. Give up.
Go be a monk in Tibet.

Even worse. In Tibet, they like butter so much that they put it in their
tea. But it's not just any butter, it's yak butter. And it's not just any
yak butter, it's _rancid_ yak butter. No thanks.

Did we hear back, why the engine isn't starting properly?

If you have a yak, you don't need any lawnmower.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in
:

That will give you a heart attack..... butter. You should
use margarine, but that has trans fats. Ah, well. Give up.
Go be a monk in Tibet.

Did we hear back, why the engine isn't starting properly?

I have my doubts whether we will - gg, spam war going on, and crossposted
to four entirely different groups.

muzician21 wrote:
Have a B&S on a 70's era Snapper 21" pusher with an aluminum deck. I
believe the engine is probably 10 years newer than the rest of the
mower.

Maybe 10 years ago I took it to a repair shop who installed a solid
state unit to replace the points. Even with the solid state ignition
it was never one-pull start, but as I recall it usually started with
probably 3 - 5 pulls. Now it takes probably 20 pulls or more and
monkeying with the throttle. Once it fires it runs like a clock, runs
up and down the speed range fine. It's also easier to re-start once
it's been running - though still not one pull. Doesn't seem to use an
inordinate amount of oil, no discernible smoke out the exhaust. It
gets what I'd call moderate use. I'm in central Florida so it gets run
bi-weekly or so during the rainy months, not at all during the months
of what passes for a winter down here.

I'm mechanically inclined but not well-versed on the theory of this
kind of engine. I've had it broken down far enough to remove and flush
the gas tank, change the points when it had points, replace the pull
rope. I've change the spark plug of course. I know it should start
much easier than it does. Any suggestions where to look, what to
tweak? There isn't that much to it from what I can see, so it
shouldn't be that difficult. I believe this mower has a lot of life
left in it.

Thanks for all input.


If its a 70s mower with a 10-year-newer B&S engine, that would mean its
an 80s-vintage B&S. That would be about the lowest point in the armpit
of quality of B&S carburetors, and it agrees with your symptoms. The
"pulsa-jet" carbs of that era used the vacuum pulses of the intake
runner to operate a diaphragm that pumped fuel up from the tank to the
carb. They also had a vacuum-operated choke that had a tendency to not
choke enough when cold and choke too much when hot. They tended to work
fine once you got them running, but they were HARD to get going the
first time because there just isn't enough vacuum pulse to pump the fuel
while you're yanking the rope. Especially when they aged a little and
the pump diaphragm got a little stiff You could try a carb rebuild kit,
but frankly the only way I ever made an 80s Briggs run truly great was
to scavenge the carb (and fuel tank) off an older (70s or even late 60s)
engine.