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Old 09-01-2014, 08:12 PM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden
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Common use fertilizer used to come pretty generic, like 8-8-8, 10-10-10, 13-13-13, with little-to-no micro-nutrients. Last spring I started seeing something different, like 10-10-10 with "up to 8% sulfur" and "up-to-12% chlorine". That's not MICRO-nutrients! I contacted the factory and asked why, and got weird answers. "Soil needs sulfur and they are eliminating it from industrial smokestacks", and "Don't use chlorine if you plant tobacco" (what about veggies?)

Have you heard anything about all this or am I the only one who noticed the fine print?

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Old 10-01-2014, 07:49 PM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden
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wrote:

Common use fertilizer used to come pretty generic, like
8-8-8, 10-10-10, 13-13-13, with little-to-no
micro-nutrients. Last spring I started seeing something
different, like 10-10-10 with "up to 8% sulfur" and
"up-to-12% chlorine". That's not MICRO-nutrients!
I contacted the factory and asked why, and got weird
answers. "Soil needs sulfur and they are eliminating it
from industrial smokestacks", and "Don't use chlorine if
you plant tobacco" (what about veggies?)


i'm about the last person to ask about those type
of fertilizers as i've not used them for some years
now. next time i'm at a store i'll take a look and
see what they have on 'em.

sulfur would be ok in small amounts for a garden
that has a higher pH (8 or higher). they must be
talking about chlorine compounds and i'd not
generally want those as some might be as common as
table salt. for an arid climate or near arid climate
garden you really don't want to add salt to the
garden. for places that do get enough rain to
leach salts away it isn't as bad, but i still
would not want it.


Have you heard anything about all this or am I the only
one who noticed the fine print?


i have read a few things about what is used for
filler in some manufactured fertilizers and that
it can be about anything. i don't think there are
as much regulations as long as it isn't certain
animal wastes/byproducts.

as a rule, if i don't know what is in it or where
it came from i don't put it on my gardens.

i think what you might be seeing is that more and
more people want to know what it is in what they are
buying. so the manufacturers are now spelling out
what they use whereas before people didn't care.

i am not surprised at all to hear about flue
scrubbings being used as filler. if the power plants
don't have to pay to have it landfilled they are
coming out ahead on the deal.


songbird
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Old 12-01-2014, 02:06 AM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden
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On Friday, January 10, 2014 1:49:21 PM UTC-6, songbird wrote:
wrote:



Common use fertilizer used to come pretty generic, like


8-8-8, 10-10-10, 13-13-13, with little-to-no


micro-nutrients. Last spring I started seeing something


different, like 10-10-10 with "up to 8% sulfur" and


"up-to-12% chlorine". That's not MICRO-nutrients!


I contacted the factory and asked why, and got weird


answers. "Soil needs sulfur and they are eliminating it


from industrial smokestacks", and "Don't use chlorine if


you plant tobacco" (what about veggies?)




i'm about the last person to ask about those type

of fertilizers as i've not used them for some years

now. next time i'm at a store i'll take a look and

see what they have on 'em.



sulfur would be ok in small amounts for a garden

that has a higher pH (8 or higher). they must be

talking about chlorine compounds and i'd not

generally want those as some might be as common as

table salt. for an arid climate or near arid climate

garden you really don't want to add salt to the

garden. for places that do get enough rain to

leach salts away it isn't as bad, but i still

would not want it.





Have you heard anything about all this or am I the only


one who noticed the fine print?




i have read a few things about what is used for

filler in some manufactured fertilizers and that

it can be about anything. i don't think there are

as much regulations as long as it isn't certain

animal wastes/byproducts.



as a rule, if i don't know what is in it or where

it came from i don't put it on my gardens.



i think what you might be seeing is that more and

more people want to know what it is in what they are

buying. so the manufacturers are now spelling out

what they use whereas before people didn't care.



i am not surprised at all to hear about flue

scrubbings being used as filler. if the power plants

don't have to pay to have it landfilled they are

coming out ahead on the deal.





songbird


Thanks! I was thinking that sulfur was being added with a purpose but your opinion that it was just a byproduct from a filler makes much more sense. And they probably see it to their benefit - you'll have to buy more lime more often, hopefully their brand, to counteract the pH change from their sulfur. The chlorine is probably a byproduct of their potassium/potash treatment prior to mixing the fertilizer.

I guess these compounds have always been in fertilizers, but they used to be listed as micro-nutrients, like .05%. When they started being listed in 8%-12% amounts, the same or higher as the NPK amounts, it really drew my attention.

Thanks again.
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Old 12-01-2014, 03:47 PM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden
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wrote in message
...
Thanks! I was thinking that sulfur was being added with a purpose but your
opinion that it was just a byproduct from a filler makes much more sense.
And they probably see it to their benefit - you'll have to buy more lime
more often, hopefully their brand, to counteract the pH change from their
sulfur. The chlorine is probably a byproduct of their potassium/potash
treatment prior to mixing the fertilizer.


I guess these compounds have always been in fertilizers, but they used to
be listed as micro-nutrients, like .05%. When they started being listed in
8%-12% amounts, the same or higher as the NPK amounts, it really drew my
attention.


Sulfur is necessary. It is not just a byproduct that is put in the
fertlizer for filler.
http://www.soil.ncsu.edu/publication.../AG-439-15.pdf





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Old 13-01-2014, 04:03 AM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden
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On Sunday, January 12, 2014 9:47:10 AM UTC-6, Ralph Mowery wrote:

Sulfur is necessary. It is not just a byproduct that is put in the fertlizer for filler. http://www.soil.ncsu.edu/publication.../AG-439-15.pdf


True, it is necessary in some amounts. But when soil tests show a pH of 6.0 or less, adding sulfur is not necessary for most plants. (Blueberries & azaleas excepted). A thick subsoil can retain sulfur and cause problems if more is added. Which was my point. Cotton fields in the South fertilized steadily over decades are in very poor condition because of component buildup.


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Old 14-01-2014, 02:03 PM posted to alt.home.lawn.garden
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On 1/9/2014 2:12 PM, wrote:

Common use fertilizer used to come pretty generic, like 8-8-8,
10-10-10, 13-13-13, with little-to-no micro-nutrients. Last spring
I started seeing something different, like 10-10-10 with "up to 8%
sulfur" and "up-to-12% chlorine". That's not MICRO-nutrients!


No, they're secondary nutrients.

I contacted the factory and asked why, and got weird answers. "Soil
needs sulfur and they are eliminating it from industrial
smokestacks",


No, no, no. It comes from the basic source of potassium for that
fertilizer. Potassium is the third primary element (NPK). The most
common sources of K for chemical fertilizers are Potassium Chloride
(yes, chlorine) and Potassium Sulfate (yes, sulfur). The amount of
sulfur present in the fertilizer isn't enough to significantly change
the pH of the soil unless you were to drastically over-apply the
fertilizer. Don't worry about it. As for the chlorine, it's another
essential element for plant development, but like all elements, some
plants are more sensitive to it than others. Soils in coastal areas
tend to have higher levels of chlorine, whereas soils far from the
coast tend to have fairly low levels of chlorine.

and "Don't use chlorine if you plant tobacco" (what
about veggies?)


In the case of tobacco, an oversupply of chlorine affects the ability
of the dried leaf to burn cleanly. In most cases of home gardening,
use of potassium chloride-containing fertilizers will be just fine. In
fact, in areas where the natural soil level of chloride is low (such
as the US Midwest) applying a chloride-containing fertilizer can be
beneficial. Some of the benefits are increased crop yields, improved
quality, and increased disease resistance in plants. But if you're
concerned about it, look for a fertilizer whose potassium content come
from potassium sulfate.

Also, chloride is water soluble and will leach out of soils over time.
It's not usually an accumulator.


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