On Mon, 8 Sep 2003 11:12:11 -0400, "Dave Gower"
wrote:


Read the instructions on the bottles. It explains it all.

You should read the instructions on the whiskey bottle, it's addling
your brain...

chemical peddling idjit!

http://www.monsanto.com/monsanto/us_...orig/label.pdf

ANNUAL WEEDS
• Apply to actively growing grass and broadleaf weeds.
• Allow at least 3 days after treatment before tillage.

PERENNIAL WEEDS
Apply this product as follows to control or destroy most perennial
weeds:
NOTE: If weeds have been mowed or tilled, do not treat until plants
have resumed active growth and have reached the recommended
stages.
Repeat treatments may be necessary to control weeds regenerating
from underground parts or seed. Repeat treatments must be made
prior to crop emergence.
The addition of 1 to 2 percent dry ammonium sulfate by weight or 8.5

Canarygrass, reed / Timothy / Wheatgrass, western—Apply 2 to
3 quarts of this product per acre. For best results, apply to actively
growing plants when most have reached the boot-to-head stage of
growth. Allow 7 OR MORE DAYS after application before tillage.

Bindweed, field—For control, apply 4 to 5 quarts of this product per
acre west of the Mississippi River and 3 to 4 quarts east of the
Mississippi River. Apply when the weeds are actively growing and are
at or beyond full bloom. Do not treat when weed is under drought
stress as good soil moisture is necessary for active growth. For best
results, apply in late summer or fall. Fall treatments must be applied
before a killing frost. Allow 7 or more days after application before
tillage.

Bermudagrass, water (knotgrass)—Apply 1.5 quarts of this product
plus 0.5 to 1 percent nonionic surfactant by total spray volume in
5 to 10 gallons of water per acre. Apply when water bermudagrass is
actively growing and 12 to 18 inches in length. Allow 7 or more days
before tilling, flushing or flooding the field.
Fall applications only—Apply 1 quart of this product plus 0.5 to 1
percent nonionic surfactant by total spray volume in 5 to 10 gallons
of water per acre. Fallow fields should be tilled prior to
application.
Apply prior to frost on water bermudagrass that is actively growing
and 12 to 18 inches in length. Allow 7 or more days before tillage.

On Tue, 09 Sep 2003 00:17:02 GMT, Pam wrote:



Your commentary below I quite admired.

-paghat the ratgirl

Thank you.
pam - gardengal


OK group hug.... :)
(or would we be accused of being religious zealot greenies?)

Tom Jaszewski wrote:
On Tue, 09 Sep 2003 00:17:02 GMT, Pam wrote:



Your commentary below I quite admired.

-paghat the ratgirl

Thank you.
pam - gardengal

OK group hug.... :)
(or would we be accused of being religious zealot greenies?)

Get that tree out of the middle.

--
GO #40

(Seymour) wrote:
I live in southern New Jersey. My lawn is just awful, bare spots,
crabgrass, uneven ground, hard ground, black and red ants. I've spent
the last 2 years trying to improve it by fertilizing, seeding, weed
and feed, Scott's lawn soil. It seems the more I try, the worse it
gets. The crab grass halter I put down in the spring didn't do
anything.
I'm thinking of borrowing my father's Rototiller and diggin the whole
thing up and overseeding it. Anybody agree? I would think that this
is a good time to do it.
Please advise.

As an aside, you don't need to till real deep, two inches is plenty.
The drawback to deep tilling is it will have sink holes from rain,
and it won't support foot traffic, or the lawn-mower, without rutting.

Good luck, this is the best time to do it.

--
GO #40

Tom Jaszewski wrote:
On Tue, 09 Sep 2003 00:17:02 GMT, Pam wrote:



Your commentary below I quite admired.

-paghat the ratgirl

Thank you.
pam - gardengal

OK group hug.... :)
(or would we be accused of being religious zealot greenies?)

Get that tree out of the middle.

--
GO #40

(Seymour) wrote:
I live in southern New Jersey. My lawn is just awful, bare spots,
crabgrass, uneven ground, hard ground, black and red ants. I've spent
the last 2 years trying to improve it by fertilizing, seeding, weed
and feed, Scott's lawn soil. It seems the more I try, the worse it
gets. The crab grass halter I put down in the spring didn't do
anything.
I'm thinking of borrowing my father's Rototiller and diggin the whole
thing up and overseeding it. Anybody agree? I would think that this
is a good time to do it.
Please advise.

As an aside, you don't need to till real deep, two inches is plenty.
The drawback to deep tilling is it will have sink holes from rain,
and it won't support foot traffic, or the lawn-mower, without rutting.

Good luck, this is the best time to do it.

--
GO #40

Tom Jaszewski wrote:
On Tue, 09 Sep 2003 00:17:02 GMT, Pam wrote:



Your commentary below I quite admired.

-paghat the ratgirl

Thank you.
pam - gardengal

OK group hug.... :)
(or would we be accused of being religious zealot greenies?)

Get that tree out of the middle.

--
GO #40

(Seymour) wrote:
I live in southern New Jersey. My lawn is just awful, bare spots,
crabgrass, uneven ground, hard ground, black and red ants. I've spent
the last 2 years trying to improve it by fertilizing, seeding, weed
and feed, Scott's lawn soil. It seems the more I try, the worse it
gets. The crab grass halter I put down in the spring didn't do
anything.
I'm thinking of borrowing my father's Rototiller and diggin the whole
thing up and overseeding it. Anybody agree? I would think that this
is a good time to do it.
Please advise.

As an aside, you don't need to till real deep, two inches is plenty.
The drawback to deep tilling is it will have sink holes from rain,
and it won't support foot traffic, or the lawn-mower, without rutting.

Good luck, this is the best time to do it.

--
GO #40

"Dave Gower" wrote in message ...
"Bishop Don Magic Juan" insertnamehere.co.uk wrote

...Must wait at least seven days for Roundup to do
its work. Tilling a few hours after application competely nullifies the
purpose of Roundup.

No. If that were the case then Roundup would be rendered ineffective if it
rained or there was a heavy dew any time within a week after application.

Any type of herbicide (selective or universal) requires a few hours to soak
in. It then takes a week for the plant to die. This will happen whether the
soil is turned over or not (except of course that turning the soil over
increases the damage).

Read the instructions on the bottles. It explains it all.



It's true that Roundup works by absorption. However, if the soil is
tilled within a few hours, the roundup will not be distributed
throughout the plant. Tilling will chop off the sprayed parts of some
of the weeds, leaving the lower part and root system unaffected.
Waiting until the weeds are dead is the correct strategy. BTW, what
is the big hurry anyway.

Some of your other advice is wrong too, like telling him not to use
crabgrass killer or weed killer next spring. That is just plain
wrong. A lawn that is planted now should have pre-emergent crab grass
preventer applied next spring and also spot weed control as needed.
Neither of these products is harmful at that point and it's completely
consistent with the label directions.

Do you even know the difference between crabgrass killer and
pre-emergent products? Failure to control crabgrass or weeds next
spring is a prescription for disaster.