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#16
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January issue of Orchids magagzine--a snore
I'm surprised no one has mentioned it yet.
The Orchid Digest is where you should be. http://www.orchiddigest.com/ $32/yr or $60 for 2 years. Granted, it's only published 4 times a year, but the magazine is so heads and shoulders above the AOS magazine that there's almost no comparison. The final issue of each year is always a larger special issue that goes in-depth into a topic. The final issue for 2005 was a romp through orchid color forms. Recent special year-end issues have seen comprehensive treatments of the genera Phalaenopsis, Cattleya, and Phragmipedium. I refer to each of those regularly. -Eric in SF www.orchidphotos.org |
#18
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Award Slides
Smbcna. [now Ctph., according to RHS] Garnet Glory 'Juno Beach' HCC/AOS was
provisionally awarded in June or July 2001. I had to follow up several times just to get the award registered, finally got the certificate about a year later and never got a slide [and most recently, I'm following up AGAIN because the award info, which was previously in WildCatt, has somehow disappeared from the last update I got ...], nor any separate paperwork to request a copy of the slide, that I can recall. But (no disrespect to the photographer), I actually didn't care for the award photo on that one and got one on my own digital camera that I like better. Rhv. [now Van., according to the RHS] Ocean Storm 'Juno Beach' HCC/AOS was provisionally awarded in October 2004. I'm still trying to get the award registered (awaiting my bill from Pam Guist after talking to her and being sent back to the judging center, talking to them, and being told several weeks ago that I'd be getting a bill from Pam). Nor has there been any mention of the slide. Guess I'll go talk to the folks at the judging center .... again. Kenni "Al" wrote in message ... You can get slides copied into .jpg files at the Ritz camera store here in Leesburg. They used to provide a slide with the award documentation that you get after you pay the invoice... has that stopped? It is that professionally taken portrait of the awarded flower (albeit in slide form) that makes it worth the cost of the award. ;-) "Kenni Judd" wrote in message ... Danny: That's not the only thing that's going to break AOS, as I think you can see from this thread. Membership is already either voting, or threatening to vote, with their feet/$$. As membership and prestige decline, the awards become less valuable -- on that point, I have to say that for $60 or even $40 to register an award, I really think I should get a copy of the award photo to use on my website, but NO, that's not included. And because they do insist on using slides, it doesn't even pay for me to buy one from the photographer, because I have no use for the slide, I need a digital or at least something I could scan. I should perhaps also note that AOS HQ suffered major damage from Hurricane Wilma. I expect it's well-insured, but that never covers everything ... even after the deductible. So, cynical though this may sound, I will not be surprised by more price increases. And if I don't get 2 more awards this year, the membership will lapse again. Kenni "danny" wrote in message news Photography costs can eat up a lot of the award fee. For those of us who get slides duplicated instead of shooting a whole roll of the flower it eats up almost the entire award fee. We send in 36 slides for every award so that they can be distributed to all of the other judging centers. If AOS keeps adding new judging centers this system is going to break eventually (or a switch to digital will need to happen.) -danny |
#19
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Award Slides
Well, these were both provisional awards. They are a real bear to
track. I wish more exhibitors were as punctual as you are. Most run and hide, refuse to pay for the award until we bill them anyway, then they get off their asses to get the plant identified, registered or what have you... THEN the paperwork starts through the AOS system, which takes a minimum of 6 months. In the meantime the AOS photographer has the slides stored someplace and if no one tells him that the award has been cleared they just sit and wait until someone asks for the slides. BTW, your awards are in OrchidWiz. K Barrett Kenni Judd wrote: Smbcna. [now Ctph., according to RHS] Garnet Glory 'Juno Beach' HCC/AOS was provisionally awarded in June or July 2001. I had to follow up several times just to get the award registered, finally got the certificate about a year later and never got a slide [and most recently, I'm following up AGAIN because the award info, which was previously in WildCatt, has somehow disappeared from the last update I got ...], nor any separate paperwork to request a copy of the slide, that I can recall. But (no disrespect to the photographer), I actually didn't care for the award photo on that one and got one on my own digital camera that I like better. Rhv. [now Van., according to the RHS] Ocean Storm 'Juno Beach' HCC/AOS was provisionally awarded in October 2004. I'm still trying to get the award registered (awaiting my bill from Pam Guist after talking to her and being sent back to the judging center, talking to them, and being told several weeks ago that I'd be getting a bill from Pam). Nor has there been any mention of the slide. Guess I'll go talk to the folks at the judging center ... again. Kenni "Al" wrote in message ... You can get slides copied into .jpg files at the Ritz camera store here in Leesburg. They used to provide a slide with the award documentation that you get after you pay the invoice... has that stopped? It is that professionally taken portrait of the awarded flower (albeit in slide form) that makes it worth the cost of the award. ;-) "Kenni Judd" wrote in message ... Danny: That's not the only thing that's going to break AOS, as I think you can see from this thread. Membership is already either voting, or threatening to vote, with their feet/$$. As membership and prestige decline, the awards become less valuable -- on that point, I have to say that for $60 or even $40 to register an award, I really think I should get a copy of the award photo to use on my website, but NO, that's not included. And because they do insist on using slides, it doesn't even pay for me to buy one from the photographer, because I have no use for the slide, I need a digital or at least something I could scan. I should perhaps also note that AOS HQ suffered major damage from Hurricane Wilma. I expect it's well-insured, but that never covers everything ... even after the deductible. So, cynical though this may sound, I will not be surprised by more price increases. And if I don't get 2 more awards this year, the membership will lapse again. Kenni "danny" wrote in message news Photography costs can eat up a lot of the award fee. For those of us who get slides duplicated instead of shooting a whole roll of the flower it eats up almost the entire award fee. We send in 36 slides for every award so that they can be distributed to all of the other judging centers. If AOS keeps adding new judging centers this system is going to break eventually (or a switch to digital will need to happen.) -danny |
#20
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January issue of Orchids magagzine--a snore
Al wrote:
I think it is somewhat weird to award a grower a CCM or CCE and then present him/her with a bill to register it.. I would suppose that AOS awards are mainly of interest to commercial growers, so can it be written off as a business expense? I can't see much point of the AOS judging system for the average hobbyist, particularly the flower quality awards. I don't take my plants to judging, but I don't imagine that the satisfaction of an AOS award is any greater than the pleasure that I derive (at no cost) from hearing my friends Oooh and Aaah over a plant at the local society meeting. |
#21
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January issue of Orchids magagzine--a snore
Hum.... Good idea. I did order a special issue on phals, and it was
very well done. Thanks! |
#22
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Award Slides
K -- Maybe I'm missing something, but would it really be that difficult for
AOS to arrange with RHS to receive a copy of the grex registration (directly from RHS) when a provisionally-awarded plant is named? Or at least to provide some written instructions to the exhibitor, with the provisional award? Kenni "K Barrett" wrote in message ... Well, these were both provisional awards. They are a real bear to track. I wish more exhibitors were as punctual as you are. Most run and hide, refuse to pay for the award until we bill them anyway, then they get off their asses to get the plant identified, registered or what have you... THEN the paperwork starts through the AOS system, which takes a minimum of 6 months. In the meantime the AOS photographer has the slides stored someplace and if no one tells him that the award has been cleared they just sit and wait until someone asks for the slides. BTW, your awards are in OrchidWiz. K Barrett Kenni Judd wrote: Smbcna. [now Ctph., according to RHS] Garnet Glory 'Juno Beach' HCC/AOS was provisionally awarded in June or July 2001. I had to follow up several times just to get the award registered, finally got the certificate about a year later and never got a slide [and most recently, I'm following up AGAIN because the award info, which was previously in WildCatt, has somehow disappeared from the last update I got ...], nor any separate paperwork to request a copy of the slide, that I can recall. But (no disrespect to the photographer), I actually didn't care for the award photo on that one and got one on my own digital camera that I like better. Rhv. [now Van., according to the RHS] Ocean Storm 'Juno Beach' HCC/AOS was provisionally awarded in October 2004. I'm still trying to get the award registered (awaiting my bill from Pam Guist after talking to her and being sent back to the judging center, talking to them, and being told several weeks ago that I'd be getting a bill from Pam). Nor has there been any mention of the slide. Guess I'll go talk to the folks at the judging center ... again. Kenni "Al" wrote in message ... You can get slides copied into .jpg files at the Ritz camera store here in Leesburg. They used to provide a slide with the award documentation that you get after you pay the invoice... has that stopped? It is that professionally taken portrait of the awarded flower (albeit in slide form) that makes it worth the cost of the award. ;-) "Kenni Judd" wrote in message ... Danny: That's not the only thing that's going to break AOS, as I think you can see from this thread. Membership is already either voting, or threatening to vote, with their feet/$$. As membership and prestige decline, the awards become less valuable -- on that point, I have to say that for $60 or even $40 to register an award, I really think I should get a copy of the award photo to use on my website, but NO, that's not included. And because they do insist on using slides, it doesn't even pay for me to buy one from the photographer, because I have no use for the slide, I need a digital or at least something I could scan. I should perhaps also note that AOS HQ suffered major damage from Hurricane Wilma. I expect it's well-insured, but that never covers everything ... even after the deductible. So, cynical though this may sound, I will not be surprised by more price increases. And if I don't get 2 more awards this year, the membership will lapse again. Kenni "danny" wrote in message news Photography costs can eat up a lot of the award fee. For those of us who get slides duplicated instead of shooting a whole roll of the flower it eats up almost the entire award fee. We send in 36 slides for every award so that they can be distributed to all of the other judging centers. If AOS keeps adding new judging centers this system is going to break eventually (or a switch to digital will need to happen.) -danny |
#23
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Award Slides
Kenni Judd wrote: Smbcna. [now Ctph., according to RHS] Garnet Glory 'Juno Beach' HCC/AOS was provisionally awarded in June or July 2001. I had to follow up several times just to get the award registered, finally got the certificate about a year later and never got a slide [and most recently, I'm following up AGAIN because the award info, which was previously in WildCatt, has somehow disappeared from the last update I got ...], nor any separate paperwork to request a copy of the slide, that I can recall. But (no disrespect to the photographer), I actually didn't care for the award photo on that one and got one on my own digital camera that I like better. Rhv. [now Van., according to the RHS] Ocean Storm 'Juno Beach' HCC/AOS was provisionally awarded in October 2004. I'm still trying to get the award registered (awaiting my bill from Pam Guist after talking to her and being sent back to the judging center, talking to them, and being told several weeks ago that I'd be getting a bill from Pam). Nor has there been any mention of the slide. Guess I'll go talk to the folks at the judging center ... again. Kenni "Al" wrote in message ... You can get slides copied into .jpg files at the Ritz camera store here in Leesburg. They used to provide a slide with the award documentation that you get after you pay the invoice... has that stopped? It is that professionally taken portrait of the awarded flower (albeit in slide form) that makes it worth the cost of the award. ;-) "Kenni Judd" wrote in message ... Danny: That's not the only thing that's going to break AOS, as I think you can see from this thread. Membership is already either voting, or threatening to vote, with their feet/$$. As membership and prestige decline, the awards become less valuable -- on that point, I have to say that for $60 or even $40 to register an award, I really think I should get a copy of the award photo to use on my website, but NO, that's not included. And because they do insist on using slides, it doesn't even pay for me to buy one from the photographer, because I have no use for the slide, I need a digital or at least something I could scan. I should perhaps also note that AOS HQ suffered major damage from Hurricane Wilma. I expect it's well-insured, but that never covers everything ... even after the deductible. So, cynical though this may sound, I will not be surprised by more price increases. And if I don't get 2 more awards this year, the membership will lapse again. Kenni "danny" wrote in message news Photography costs can eat up a lot of the award fee. For those of us who get slides duplicated instead of shooting a whole roll of the flower it eats up almost the entire award fee. We send in 36 slides for every award so that they can be distributed to all of the other judging centers. If AOS keeps adding new judging centers this system is going to break eventually (or a switch to digital will need to happen.) -danny Hi Kenni, On those provisional awards: They will play hell trying to find the slide if you don't remind Pam of the parents. The photographer, naturally, identified the slide w/what he(she) had which was just the parents. I had a tough time w/my Odcdm. Luke Skywalker 'Orchid Island' till I sent Pam the parents-- then I got my slide. Bill |
#24
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Award Slides
Kenni, ARE YOU KIDDING???? What do you want for your lousy $60. ??????
LOL Bill |
#25
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Award Slides
Kenni Judd wrote:
K -- Maybe I'm missing something, but would it really be that difficult for AOS to arrange with RHS to receive a copy of the grex registration (directly from RHS) when a provisionally-awarded plant is named? Or at least to provide some written instructions to the exhibitor, with the provisional award? Kenni Unfortunately it is a bit more complicated than that... AOS and RHS don't necessarily play well together, but that is the least of it. Large problem is that you are supposed to obtain permission of the hybridizer to register an award. And there is a fee associated with it. And if it is already in progress (somebody submitted the paperwork a week before you do), it gets more complicated. And then there is the whole species and genera changing names problem... I don't think it would be easier if AOS was involved. It would be nice to give some written instructions to the exhibitor, though. Maybe even a copy of the registration form. Unfortunately, I don't think that is going to happen on an organized level. Now that it has been brought to my attention (never thought about it before), I'll make sure to keep a few extra copies of the forms in my judging kit. But that is just me. Maybe it is one step towards changing the world... Rob -- Rob's Rules: http://littlefrogfarm.com 1) There is always room for one more orchid 2) There is always room for two more orchids 2a) See rule 1 3) When one has insufficient credit to obtain more orchids, obtain more credit |
#26
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Award Slides
On Fri, 06 Jan 2006 08:40:10 -0800, K Barrett
wrote: Well, these were both provisional awards. They are a real bear to track. I wish more exhibitors were as punctual as you are. Most run and hide, refuse to pay for the award until we bill them anyway, then they get off their asses to get the plant identified, registered or what have you... THEN the paperwork starts through the AOS system, which takes a minimum of 6 months. In the meantime the AOS photographer has the slides stored someplace and if no one tells him that the award has been cleared they just sit and wait until someone asks for the slides. BTW, your awards are in OrchidWiz. K Barrett I got an award on a Bulbo last year. It is almost bloom time again and I have heard nothing. This past year with the 2 storms messing with the physical plant has messed with the mental equipment too. People are too busy making sure things are not lost to rain and water to do the mundane processing of new awards. I got the slide of my first awarded plant (Ascda. Suksamran Sunlight 'Scarlet Letter' AM/AOS). I am not sure Bulbo. dearei 'Long's Peak' (HCC/AOS) will ever make it. I have been told to wait to pay until the AOS bills me, or they will get mixed up. I do think the slides and matching them is part of the slow down. I welcome a switch to digital. |
#27
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Award Slides
Rob: On your first point: AOS and RHS should get together and work
something out. Do they need a mediator??? I could go to England this summer, on their tab VBG. It REALLY just CAN'T be that hard to implement some system for a copy of the RHS registration to come to AOS and from there be sent to the proper person. By email, it would take maybe 30 seconds of someone's time. And at $60 (the non-AOS-member charge to register an award), I think that could easily include even a hard copy by mail. Unfortunately it is a bit more complicated than that... AOS and RHS don't necessarily play well together, but that is the least of it. I know about the hybridizer permission rule, it's been very easy to obtain for all 3 of my RHS registrations. Registering with RHS has been the EASY part in both award cases (although yes, there is yet another fee involved to do that) -- the third registration was for a plant that I want to clone even though it hasn't been awarded. Actually, the info on how to do that part of it was very readily available when I went looking for it, and I've found the RHS _very_ easy to deal with -- I send them their form and their $$, they send me back the registration papers, within a very reasonable time. There probably are cases of a prior application to name the same grex, but I can't imagine it's wide-spread. In any event, there probably are at least a few folks who get awards, that don't know even these basics, so they should be included when you write up those instructions. Large problem is that you are supposed to obtain permission of the hybridizer to register an award. And there is a fee associated with it. And if it is already in progress (somebody submitted the paperwork a week before you do), it gets more complicated. And then there is the whole species and genera changing names problem... I don't think it would be easier if AOS was involved. It's the info on the AOS process that seems to be a closely-guarded secret. It's been different both times I tried to get an award registered, but in each case, it's been extremely onerous compared to the RHS registration process. Each has taken numerous follow-up calls and/or email messages on my part, and taken more than a year. Written instructions would be at least a start on remedying this problem. If you write them up, I want a copy for myself and I think I can make sure they are given out at the WPB judging center [which happens to be AOS HQ]. You'll take care of it in your area, maybe K will do it in hers, and the rest of the country will have to fend for itself G. Kenni It would be nice to give some written instructions to the exhibitor, though. Maybe even a copy of the registration form. Unfortunately, I don't think that is going to happen on an organized level. Now that it has been brought to my attention (never thought about it before), I'll make sure to keep a few extra copies of the forms in my judging kit. But that is just me. Maybe it is one step towards changing the world... Rob -- Rob's Rules: http://littlefrogfarm.com 1) There is always room for one more orchid 2) There is always room for two more orchids 2a) See rule 1 3) When one has insufficient credit to obtain more orchids, obtain more credit |
#28
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Relevance of Awards
Myrecodia: Yes, commercial growers "write off" the registration fees, but
that does not make them FREE. It's just a percentage discount, depending on the grower's tax bracket. At 15%, 28%, or even the next bracket up "off" for the tax deduction, it's still a real cost. Nor do we get to "write off" all the TIME we spend shepherding these things through the process, a _much_ bigger cost. I would suppose that AOS awards are mainly of interest to commercial growers, so can it be written off as a business expense? This brings up a whole 'nother can of worms. IMHO, the AOS standards and the taste of the orchid-buying public in my locale (south Florida) has been drifting further and further apart for quite some time now. To the point where it's a point I teach in my class on orchid selection: "Don't be too impressed by AOS awards. They give no points for a lot of things you would like -- fragrance, ease of growing, ease of blooming, frequency of blooming, etc." Now, for the AOS fans out there, I'll concede that some of these things would be hard to plug into the judging standards, but that doesn't actually resolve the issue. I didn't say I had a solution, I'm just agreeing with an observation of the problem. Kenni I can't see much point of the AOS judging system for the average hobbyist, particularly the flower quality awards. I don't take my plants to judging, but I don't imagine that the satisfaction of an AOS award is any greater than the pleasure that I derive (at no cost) from hearing my friends Oooh and Aaah over a plant at the local society meeting. |
#29
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January issue of Orchids magagzine--a snore
Hi,
I'm totally with you on this one, but I see a lot of really competitive people growing orchids and the AOS award "notch" on their belt is one way to give in to that competitive urge. -Eric in SF www.orchidphotos.org I can't see much point of the AOS judging system for the average hobbyist, particularly the flower quality awards. I don't take my |
#30
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Award Slides
Rob wrote:
Kenni Judd wrote: K -- Maybe I'm missing something, but would it really be that difficult for AOS to arrange with RHS to receive a copy of the grex registration (directly from RHS) when a provisionally-awarded plant is named? Or at least to provide some written instructions to the exhibitor, with the provisional award? Kenni Unfortunately it is a bit more complicated than that... AOS and RHS don't necessarily play well together, but that is the least of it. Large problem is that you are supposed to obtain permission of the hybridizer to register an award. And there is a fee associated with it. And if it is already in progress (somebody submitted the paperwork a week before you do), it gets more complicated. And then there is the whole species and genera changing names problem... I don't think it would be easier if AOS was involved. It would be nice to give some written instructions to the exhibitor, though. Maybe even a copy of the registration form. Unfortunately, I don't think that is going to happen on an organized level. Now that it has been brought to my attention (never thought about it before), I'll make sure to keep a few extra copies of the forms in my judging kit. But that is just me. Maybe it is one step towards changing the world... Rob WHAT? You don't give out instructions on how to register an unnamed hybrid or how to get an unidentified orchid identified??? Say its not so! Say I'm misreading that. K Barrett |
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