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Old 18-08-2009, 12:33 AM posted to rec.gardens.orchids
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Default Jungle Feed

Hi , Any thoughts on Jungle feed and can anyone point me in the direction to
finding out what is in jungle feed ?

It is 1-0-1 , i have found out it is from a stock solution of 12.8- 4.8 -
14.5 so how do they get 1-0-1 ?

Regards Keith



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Old 18-08-2009, 12:36 AM posted to rec.gardens.orchids
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Posts: 140
Default Jungle Feed


"keith kent" wrote in message
...
Hi , Any thoughts on Jungle feed and can anyone point me in the direction
to finding out what is in jungle feed ?

It is 1-0-1 , i have found out it is from a stock solution of 12.8- 4.8 -
14.5 so how do they get 1-0-1 ?

Regards Keith

Sorry it is called Jungle Green
Keith




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Old 18-08-2009, 02:32 PM posted to rec.gardens.orchids
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Posts: 198
Default Jungle Feed

Dilute it about 12:1 or 13:1

12.8/12=1.07
4.8/12=0.4
14.5/12=1.21

Rounding to the nearest whole number, that's 1-0-1

Ray Barkalow - First Rays LLC - www.firstrays.com
Plants, Supplies, Equipment, Books, Artwork
Free Services & Lots of Info!


-----Original Message-----
From: keith kent ]
Posted At: Monday, August 17, 2009 6:33 PM
Posted To: rec.gardens.orchids
Conversation: Jungle Feed
Subject: Jungle Feed

Hi , Any thoughts on Jungle feed and can anyone point me in the
direction to
finding out what is in jungle feed ?

It is 1-0-1 , i have found out it is from a stock solution of 12.8- 4.8
-
14.5 so how do they get 1-0-1 ?

Regards Keith


  #4   Report Post  
Old 18-08-2009, 02:32 PM posted to rec.gardens.orchids
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Posts: 198
Default Jungle Feed

Read this:

http://www.orchidboard.com/community...400-msu-fertil
izer-vs-green-jungle-orchid-food.html

Ray Barkalow - First Rays LLC - www.firstrays.com
Plants, Supplies, Equipment, Books, Artwork
Free Services & Lots of Info!


-----Original Message-----
From: keith kent ]
Posted At: Monday, August 17, 2009 6:37 PM
Posted To: rec.gardens.orchids
Conversation: Jungle Feed
Subject: Jungle Feed


"keith kent" wrote in message
...
Hi , Any thoughts on Jungle feed and can anyone point me in the

direction
to finding out what is in jungle feed ?

It is 1-0-1 , i have found out it is from a stock solution of 12.8-

4.8 -
14.5 so how do they get 1-0-1 ?

Regards Keith

Sorry it is called Jungle Green
Keith




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Old 19-08-2009, 06:11 PM posted to rec.gardens.orchids
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Posts: 140
Default Jungle Feed

Jungle FeedThanks for that Ray , i did see the orchidboard post after doing a search.
I am going to buy the Akerne orchids feed which is basically the MSU i think http://www.akerne-orchids.com/index.htm as it is the only one available in the EU .
As the feed is 13 -3- 15 does this mean that less feed will be required compared to the 1-0-1 .
If so this is just what i am looking for ,as i mix up at 160lts a time sometimes and liquid feeds ,i just use too much of the stuff even to get the mix to 350ppm .
Regards Keith
"Ray B" wrote in message news:[email protected]
Dilute it about 12:1 or 13:1

12.8/12=1.07
4.8/12=0.4
14.5/12=1.21

Rounding to the nearest whole number, that's 1-0-1

Ray Barkalow - First Rays LLC - www.firstrays.com
Plants, Supplies, Equipment, Books, Artwork
Free Services & Lots of Info!



-----Original Message-----
From: keith kent ]
Posted At: Monday, August 17, 2009 6:33 PM
Posted To: rec.gardens.orchids
Conversation: Jungle Feed
Subject: Jungle Feed

Hi , Any thoughts on Jungle feed and can anyone point me in the direction to
finding out what is in jungle feed ?

It is 1-0-1 , i have found out it is from a stock solution of 12.8- 4.8 -
14.5 so how do they get 1-0-1 ?

Regards Keith



  #6   Report Post  
Old 19-08-2009, 11:37 PM posted to rec.gardens.orchids
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First recorded activity by GardenBanter: Jul 2008
Posts: 198
Default Jungle Feed

What I have learned is that most professional growers (not just
orchids), control their feeding by managing the ppm N in the solution,
and letting the rest of the nutrients "tag along" in the ratios of the
preferred formula.

I shoot for 125 ppm N in my fertilizer solution at all times. It's easy
to determine the amount to use - just divide 10 by the %N on the label,
and the result is teaspoons to add per gallon. For you sophisticated,
metricated folks, divide 13 by the %N to get the ml/L.

Ray Barkalow - First Rays LLC - http://www.firstrays.com
www.firstrays.com
Orchid Plants, Supplies, Equipment, Books
Artwork, Free Services & Lots of Info!

From: keith kent ]
Posted At: Wednesday, August 19, 2009 12:11 PM
Posted To: rec.gardens.orchids
Conversation: Jungle Feed
Subject: Jungle Feed

Thanks for that Ray , i did see the orchidboard post after doing a
search.
I am going to buy the Akerne orchids feed which is basically the MSU i
think http://www.akerne-orchids.com/index.htm as it is the only one
available in the EU .
As the feed is 13 -3- 15 does this mean that less feed will be required
compared to the 1-0-1 .
If so this is just what i am looking for ,as i mix up at 160lts a time
sometimes and liquid feeds ,i just use too much of the stuff even to get
the mix to 350ppm .
Regards Keith
"Ray B" wrote in message
news:[email protected]
Dilute it about 12:1 or 13:1
12.8/12=1.07
4.8/12=0.4
14.5/12=1.21
Rounding to the nearest whole number, that's 1-0-1
Ray Barkalow - First Rays LLC - www.firstrays.com
Plants, Supplies, Equipment, Books, Artwork
Free Services & Lots of Info!

-----Original Message-----
From: keith kent ]
Posted At: Monday, August 17, 2009 6:33 PM
Posted To: rec.gardens.orchids
Conversation: Jungle Feed
Subject: Jungle Feed
Hi , Any thoughts on Jungle feed and can anyone point me in the
direction to
finding out what is in jungle feed ?
It is 1-0-1 , i have found out it is from a stock solution of 12.8- 4.8
-
14.5 so how do they get 1-0-1 ?
Regards Keith

  #7   Report Post  
Old 20-08-2009, 03:21 PM posted to rec.gardens.orchids
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First recorded activity by GardenBanter: Oct 2006
Posts: 11
Default Jungle Feed

On Aug 19, 6:11*pm, "keith kent" wrote:
Jungle FeedThanks for that Ray , i did see the orchidboard post after doing a search.
I am going to buy the Akerne orchids feed which is basically the MSU i thinkhttp://www.akerne-orchids.com/index.htmas it is the only one available in the EU .
As the feed is 13 -3- 15 does this mean that less feed will be required compared to the 1-0-1 .
If so this is just what i am looking for ,as i mix up at 160lts a time sometimes and liquid feeds ,i just use too much of the stuff even to get the mix to 350ppm .
Regards Keith *


Keith,


Yes, "Akerne's RAIN MIX" is the MSU fertiliser for rainwater etc.
Our TAP MIX version is not there yet as we have trouble getting all
the ingredients, let us just say that one of the ingredients needed
can be used for other purposes.... making it very hard to near
impossible to get hold of.

Have a chat with my father at the BOGA fayre end of the month
concerning your concentration.
We go up to 550ppm for ALL our orchids (no exception) and this
includes, amongst others, anything from Disa, Cyrpipedium,
Paphiopedilum, Masdevallia over to Cattleya and Cymbidium.


kind regards,

Kenneth Bruyninckx
Akerne Orchids, Belgium

http://www.akerne-orchids.com
  #8   Report Post  
Old 20-08-2009, 05:56 PM posted to rec.gardens.orchids
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First recorded activity by GardenBanter: Jul 2008
Posts: 198
Default Jungle Feed

Thanks for jumping in, Kenneth.

Even GreenCare - the folks that make the original "MSU" fertilizers -
have to resort to more-expensive raw materials for the tap water
formula.

The whole "dissolved solids" level discussion is hard to deal with,
which is why EC or going with the nitrogen loading is more manageable.

For example, using the MSU RO formula, for 125 ppm N, adding up the
weight percentages of all of the cations present gives a dissolved
solids level of about 355 ppm. However, as one must add 3.55 grams of
the powder to a gallon of water for 125 ppm N, that is an addition of
938 ppm.

Now I'm quite sure that all of the constituents of the mineral molecules
don't contribute to the dissolved solids content - some of those are
water, after all - so that suggests that the TRUE dissolved solids
content is lower than that last calculation would imply, but how do you
determine that?

TDS meters really are of little value, as they are just cheap EC meters
with a built-in conversion factor to ppm. Unfortunately, the factor
should change with the make-up of the ionic species dissolved, so it
technically cannot be a single factor for all fertilizers and solutions.
Let's also not forget that different manufacturers use different
conversion factors! I have two - at a 125 ppm N solution, one tells me
the TDS is about 480 ppm, the other 610. About all TDS meters are good
for is assessing whether the solution you made up this time is different
from the last time.

Ray Barkalow - First Rays LLC - www.firstrays.com
Orchid Plants, Supplies, Equipment, Books
Artwork, Free Services & Lots of Info!


-----Original Message-----
From: Kenneth ]
Posted At: Thursday, August 20, 2009 9:22 AM
Posted To: rec.gardens.orchids
Conversation: Jungle Feed
Subject: Jungle Feed

On Aug 19, 6:11*pm, "keith kent" wrote:
Jungle FeedThanks for that Ray , i did see the orchidboard post

after doing a search.
I am going to buy the Akerne orchids feed which is basically the MSU i

thinkhttp://www.akerne-orchids.com/index.htmas it is the only one
available in the EU .
As the feed is 13 -3- 15 does this mean that less feed will be

required compared to the 1-0-1 .
If so this is just what i am looking for ,as i mix up at 160lts a time

sometimes and liquid feeds ,i just use too much of the stuff even to get
the mix to 350ppm .
Regards Keith *


Keith,


Yes, "Akerne's RAIN MIX" is the MSU fertiliser for rainwater etc.
Our TAP MIX version is not there yet as we have trouble getting all
the ingredients, let us just say that one of the ingredients needed
can be used for other purposes.... making it very hard to near
impossible to get hold of.

Have a chat with my father at the BOGA fayre end of the month
concerning your concentration.
We go up to 550ppm for ALL our orchids (no exception) and this
includes, amongst others, anything from Disa, Cyrpipedium,
Paphiopedilum, Masdevallia over to Cattleya and Cymbidium.


kind regards,

Kenneth Bruyninckx
Akerne Orchids, Belgium

http://www.akerne-orchids.com

  #9   Report Post  
Old 20-08-2009, 09:53 PM posted to rec.gardens.orchids
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Posts: 140
Default Jungle Feed

Jungle FeedThanks Ray & Kenneth .
I am hoping to go to the Boga fayre !
Regards Keith
"Ray B" wrote in message news:[email protected]
Thanks for jumping in, Kenneth.

Even GreenCare - the folks that make the original "MSU" fertilizers - have to resort to more-expensive raw materials for the tap water formula.

The whole "dissolved solids" level discussion is hard to deal with, which is why EC or going with the nitrogen loading is more manageable.

For example, using the MSU RO formula, for 125 ppm N, adding up the weight percentages of all of the cations present gives a dissolved solids level of about 355 ppm. However, as one must add 3.55 grams of the powder to a gallon of water for 125 ppm N, that is an addition of 938 ppm.

Now I'm quite sure that all of the constituents of the mineral molecules don't contribute to the dissolved solids content - some of those are water, after all - so that suggests that the TRUE dissolved solids content is lower than that last calculation would imply, but how do you determine that?

TDS meters really are of little value, as they are just cheap EC meters with a built-in conversion factor to ppm. Unfortunately, the factor should change with the make-up of the ionic species dissolved, so it technically cannot be a single factor for all fertilizers and solutions. Let's also not forget that different manufacturers use different conversion factors! I have two - at a 125 ppm N solution, one tells me the TDS is about 480 ppm, the other 610. About all TDS meters are good for is assessing whether the solution you made up this time is different from the last time.

Ray Barkalow - First Rays LLC - www.firstrays.com
Orchid Plants, Supplies, Equipment, Books
Artwork, Free Services & Lots of Info!



-----Original Message-----
From: Kenneth ]
Posted At: Thursday, August 20, 2009 9:22 AM
Posted To: rec.gardens.orchids
Conversation: Jungle Feed
Subject: Jungle Feed

On Aug 19, 6:11 pm, "keith kent" wrote:
Jungle FeedThanks for that Ray , i did see the orchidboard post after doing a search.
I am going to buy the Akerne orchids feed which is basically the MSU i thinkhttp://www.akerne-orchids.com/index.htmas it is the only one available in the EU .


As the feed is 13 -3- 15 does this mean that less feed will be required compared to the 1-0-1 .
If so this is just what i am looking for ,as i mix up at 160lts a time sometimes and liquid feeds ,i just use too much of the stuff even to get the mix to 350ppm .


Regards Keith


Keith,



Yes, "Akerne's RAIN MIX" is the MSU fertiliser for rainwater etc.
Our TAP MIX version is not there yet as we have trouble getting all
the ingredients, let us just say that one of the ingredients needed
can be used for other purposes.... making it very hard to near
impossible to get hold of.

Have a chat with my father at the BOGA fayre end of the month
concerning your concentration.
We go up to 550ppm for ALL our orchids (no exception) and this
includes, amongst others, anything from Disa, Cyrpipedium,
Paphiopedilum, Masdevallia over to Cattleya and Cymbidium.



kind regards,

Kenneth Bruyninckx
Akerne Orchids, Belgium

http://www.akerne-orchids.com

  #10   Report Post  
Old 20-08-2009, 10:44 PM posted to rec.gardens.orchids
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First recorded activity by GardenBanter: Oct 2006
Posts: 11
Default Jungle Feed

Small, but very important correction.

I meant to say that we add fertilizer to reach conductivity of 550 S,
not 550ppm....


Kenneth.


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Old 21-08-2009, 11:00 PM posted to rec.gardens.orchids
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Posts: 140
Default Jungle Feed

So that is around 350 ppm ,do you feed at this rate all year round or reduce
..
Obviously in winter watering is reduced for most plants so will get feed
less frequently .
Kenneth ,can you confirm that the 2.5 kg rain mix will be for sale at the
Boga show as i am traveling some distance so don`t want to be disapointed if
it is not .
Regards Keith
"Kenneth" wrote in message
...
Small, but very important correction.

I meant to say that we add fertilizer to reach conductivity of 550 S,
not 550ppm....


Kenneth.


  #12   Report Post  
Old 22-08-2009, 05:15 PM posted to rec.gardens.orchids
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First recorded activity by GardenBanter: Jul 2008
Posts: 198
Default Jungle Feed

Keith,

Unless you're growing stuff like Den. nobile, that needs a "winter rest"
- i.e., no nitrogen whatsoever - I find it advantageous to feed year
round.

In fact, all of my plants get 125 ppm N (about twice the concentration
Kenneth uses) at every watering.

Ray Barkalow - First Rays LLC - www.firstrays.com
Orchid Plants, Supplies, Equipment, Books
Artwork, Free Services & Lots of Info!


-----Original Message-----
From: keith kent ]
Posted At: Friday, August 21, 2009 5:00 PM
Posted To: rec.gardens.orchids
Conversation: Jungle Feed
Subject: Jungle Feed

So that is around 350 ppm ,do you feed at this rate all year round or
reduce
..
Obviously in winter watering is reduced for most plants so will get feed

less frequently .
Kenneth ,can you confirm that the 2.5 kg rain mix will be for sale at
the
Boga show as i am traveling some distance so don`t want to be
disapointed if
it is not .
Regards Keith
"Kenneth" wrote in message
..
..
Small, but very important correction.

I meant to say that we add fertilizer to reach conductivity of 550 S,
not 550ppm....


Kenneth.


  #13   Report Post  
Old 22-08-2009, 09:19 PM posted to rec.gardens.orchids
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First recorded activity by GardenBanter: Aug 2007
Posts: 140
Default Jungle Feed

Jungle FeedHi Ray ,i have just used your online ppm calculator and inputted 13-3-15 at 0.75 teaspoon a gallon came out at
129n -p 13 -k 123 total TDS 265 ppm
This seems low to me as i would normally aim for around 400-450ppm at the most in summer then reduce to around 250 in winter.
i feed 3 weeks .once a month i use plain RO with added Cal ,mg at this time i would also use the plain RO to add Physan for the monthly treatment .
Regards Keith


wrote in message news:[email protected]
Keith,

Unless you're growing stuff like Den. nobile, that needs a "winter rest" - i.e., no nitrogen whatsoever - I find it advantageous to feed year round.

In fact, all of my plants get 125 ppm N (about twice the concentration Kenneth uses) at every watering.

Ray Barkalow - First Rays LLC - www.firstrays.com
Orchid Plants, Supplies, Equipment, Books
Artwork, Free Services & Lots of Info!



-----Original Message-----
From: keith kent ]
Posted At: Friday, August 21, 2009 5:00 PM
Posted To: rec.gardens.orchids
Conversation: Jungle Feed
Subject: Jungle Feed

So that is around 350 ppm ,do you feed at this rate all year round or reduce
.
Obviously in winter watering is reduced for most plants so will get feed
less frequently .
Kenneth ,can you confirm that the 2.5 kg rain mix will be for sale at the
Boga show as i am traveling some distance so don`t want to be disapointed if
it is not .
Regards Keith
"Kenneth" wrote in message
...
Small, but very important correction.

I meant to say that we add fertilizer to reach conductivity of 550 S,
not 550ppm....



Kenneth.

  #14   Report Post  
Old 23-08-2009, 03:29 AM posted to rec.gardens.orchids
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First recorded activity by GardenBanter: Jul 2008
Posts: 198
Default Jungle Feed

Dont forget that the calculator you used is giving the calculated
solids loading of nitrogen, phosphorus, and potassium only, without
regard to the other minerals in the fertilizer.

Ray Barkalow - First Rays LLC - http://www.firstrays.com
www.firstrays.com
Orchid Plants, Supplies, Equipment, Books
Artwork, Free Services & Lots of Info!

From: keith kent ]
Posted At: Saturday, August 22, 2009 3:19 PM
Posted To: rec.gardens.orchids
Conversation: Jungle Feed
Subject: Jungle Feed

Hi Ray ,i have just used your online ppm calculator and inputted 13-3-15
at 0.75 teaspoon a gallon came out at
129n -p 13 -k 123 total TDS 265 ppm
This seems low to me as i would normally aim for around 400-450ppm at
the most in summer then reduce to around 250 in winter.
i feed 3 weeks .once a month i use plain RO with added Cal ,mg at this
time i would also use the plain RO to add Physan for the monthly
treatment .
Regards Keith


wrote in message
news:[email protected]
Keith,
Unless you're growing stuff like Den. nobile, that needs a "winter rest"
- i.e., no nitrogen whatsoever - I find it advantageous to feed year
round.
In fact, all of my plants get 125 ppm N (about twice the concentration
Kenneth uses) at every watering.
Ray Barkalow - First Rays LLC - www.firstrays.com
Orchid Plants, Supplies, Equipment, Books
Artwork, Free Services & Lots of Info!

-----Original Message-----
From: keith kent ]
Posted At: Friday, August 21, 2009 5:00 PM
Posted To: rec.gardens.orchids
Conversation: Jungle Feed
Subject: Jungle Feed
So that is around 350 ppm ,do you feed at this rate all year round or
reduce
..
Obviously in winter watering is reduced for most plants so will get feed

less frequently .
Kenneth ,can you confirm that the 2.5 kg rain mix will be for sale at
the
Boga show as i am traveling some distance so don`t want to be
disapointed if
it is not .
Regards Keith
"Kenneth" wrote in message
..
..
Small, but very important correction.
I meant to say that we add fertilizer to reach conductivity of 550 S,
not 550ppm....

Kenneth.

  #15   Report Post  
Old 23-08-2009, 11:11 PM posted to rec.gardens.orchids
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First recorded activity by GardenBanter: Aug 2007
Posts: 140
Default Jungle Feed

Jungle FeedOh, ok Ray .
So going for 0.75 with that feed is o.k ?
Would it also be best to feed at every watering at this rate .?
Keith

Ray B" wrote in message news:[email protected]
Don't forget that the calculator you used is giving the calculated solids loading of nitrogen, phosphorus, and potassium only, without regard to the other minerals in the fertilizer.



Ray Barkalow - First Rays LLC - www.firstrays.com

Orchid Plants, Supplies, Equipment, Books

Artwork, Free Services & Lots of Info!



From: keith kent ]
Posted At: Saturday, August 22, 2009 3:19 PM
Posted To: rec.gardens.orchids
Conversation: Jungle Feed
Subject: Jungle Feed



Hi Ray ,i have just used your online ppm calculator and inputted 13-3-15 at 0.75 teaspoon a gallon came out at

129n -p 13 -k 123 total TDS 265 ppm

This seems low to me as i would normally aim for around 400-450ppm at the most in summer then reduce to around 250 in winter.

i feed 3 weeks .once a month i use plain RO with added Cal ,mg at this time i would also use the plain RO to add Physan for the monthly treatment .

Regards Keith





wrote in message news:[email protected]

Keith,

Unless you're growing stuff like Den. nobile, that needs a "winter rest" - i.e., no nitrogen whatsoever - I find it advantageous to feed year round.

In fact, all of my plants get 125 ppm N (about twice the concentration Kenneth uses) at every watering.

Ray Barkalow - First Rays LLC - www.firstrays.com
Orchid Plants, Supplies, Equipment, Books
Artwork, Free Services & Lots of Info!



-----Original Message-----
From: keith kent ]
Posted At: Friday, August 21, 2009 5:00 PM
Posted To: rec.gardens.orchids
Conversation: Jungle Feed
Subject: Jungle Feed

So that is around 350 ppm ,do you feed at this rate all year round or reduce
.
Obviously in winter watering is reduced for most plants so will get feed
less frequently .
Kenneth ,can you confirm that the 2.5 kg rain mix will be for sale at the
Boga show as i am traveling some distance so don`t want to be disapointed if
it is not .
Regards Keith
"Kenneth" wrote in message
...
Small, but very important correction.

I meant to say that we add fertilizer to reach conductivity of 550 S,
not 550ppm....



Kenneth.



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