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Old 04-12-2004, 03:00 AM
Drbob92031
 
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Default HOW DO I ???

Help! I have resurected a dying phal. that my son was ready to throw away. It
now has a spike ready to bloom and it has two(2) new seperate sets of leaves
with many aerial roots to each new group of leaves.. My question is.. how is
the best way of propergating this Phal, with the new growth?
Thanks in advance for any help,
Bob
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Old 04-12-2004, 05:45 AM
 
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Hi Bob. Sounds like you have two small babies on the plant. (Kiekies).
I've heard people say they let them get plantable size then separate
them thereby becoming new plants by themselves. As for the one that's
about to bloom, don't do anything to the plant now if you don't want the
buds to drop off (bud blasting they call it). Congratulations on
salvaging the phal. - they're my favorite orchid - mostly because
they're easy to grow and because I can't grow anything else......Burr

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Old 04-12-2004, 05:45 AM
 
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Hi Bob. Sounds like you have two small babies on the plant. (Kiekies).
I've heard people say they let them get plantable size then separate
them thereby becoming new plants by themselves. As for the one that's
about to bloom, don't do anything to the plant now if you don't want the
buds to drop off (bud blasting they call it). Congratulations on
salvaging the phal. - they're my favorite orchid - mostly because
they're easy to grow and because I can't grow anything else......Burr

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Old 04-12-2004, 01:34 PM
Drbob92031
 
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THANKS FOR THE RETURN, BUT I STILL WANT TO KNOW WHERE ON THE PLANT I SHOULD CUT
OFF THE KIEKIES
THANKS AGAIN FOR THE INPUT.SORRY TO BE SUCH A PAIN.
BOB
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Old 04-12-2004, 03:21 PM
J Fortuna
 
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Bob,

I don't know if the netiquette has changed in the last few years, but last
time I checked, posting in all upper case was considered the equivalent of
shouting, and was impolite. Did you really want to shout at us? I hope not.

Assuming you did not mean to shout:

First a question: Are those keikis coming from a spike (like flowers, up
high) or from the base of the plant?

If they are basal keikis, coming from the bottom of the plant, then I have
been told that one should not separate the keikies since in all likelihood
they share roots with the mother plant and may not be able to survive as
independent plants. In this case just enjoy the plants together, and it will
be quite impressive when all these plants bloom together.

If the keikies are growing from a spike however, then do not cut off the
keikis until they have at least 4 inches of roots total (for example: two
roots 1 inch each plus one root 2 inches long). If you cut the keikie off
earlier it won't have enough roots to survive without the mother plant. Once
the roots are well developped enough, you can try twisting the keikie off
the mother plant's spike, by holding the keiki by its base and giving it a
sharp twist, or you could cut the spike as close to the keiki as possible
without damaging the keiki. Then pot the keikie into its own little pot and
treat like any other Phal.

I've got one plant that started out as a keikie on a flower spike sometime
in 2002. This young Phal is in spike for the second time now. The first time
in bloomed I was amazed that the flowers were about the same size as the
parent plant only there were fewer of them (only 3 flowers). It's one of
those huge white flowered Phals.

I also have two Doritaenopsis with a basal keikie each, started this year.
The Dtps Kenneth Schubert basal keikie has been growing so fast that in two
or three years it may be hard to distinguish the mature plant from the
keikie. The other Dtps basal keikie sort of stopped growing, but its two
leaves look healthy, so I hope the mother plant is for now just
concentrating it's energy on flowering, and will continue to grow the basal
keikie once flowering season is over, or something like that.

Best,
Joanna

"Drbob92031" wrote in message
...


THANKS FOR THE RETURN, BUT I STILL WANT TO KNOW WHERE ON THE PLANT I

SHOULD CUT
OFF THE KIEKIES
THANKS AGAIN FOR THE INPUT.SORRY TO BE SUCH A PAIN.
BOB





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Old 04-12-2004, 03:21 PM
J Fortuna
 
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Bob,

I don't know if the netiquette has changed in the last few years, but last
time I checked, posting in all upper case was considered the equivalent of
shouting, and was impolite. Did you really want to shout at us? I hope not.

Assuming you did not mean to shout:

First a question: Are those keikis coming from a spike (like flowers, up
high) or from the base of the plant?

If they are basal keikis, coming from the bottom of the plant, then I have
been told that one should not separate the keikies since in all likelihood
they share roots with the mother plant and may not be able to survive as
independent plants. In this case just enjoy the plants together, and it will
be quite impressive when all these plants bloom together.

If the keikies are growing from a spike however, then do not cut off the
keikis until they have at least 4 inches of roots total (for example: two
roots 1 inch each plus one root 2 inches long). If you cut the keikie off
earlier it won't have enough roots to survive without the mother plant. Once
the roots are well developped enough, you can try twisting the keikie off
the mother plant's spike, by holding the keiki by its base and giving it a
sharp twist, or you could cut the spike as close to the keiki as possible
without damaging the keiki. Then pot the keikie into its own little pot and
treat like any other Phal.

I've got one plant that started out as a keikie on a flower spike sometime
in 2002. This young Phal is in spike for the second time now. The first time
in bloomed I was amazed that the flowers were about the same size as the
parent plant only there were fewer of them (only 3 flowers). It's one of
those huge white flowered Phals.

I also have two Doritaenopsis with a basal keikie each, started this year.
The Dtps Kenneth Schubert basal keikie has been growing so fast that in two
or three years it may be hard to distinguish the mature plant from the
keikie. The other Dtps basal keikie sort of stopped growing, but its two
leaves look healthy, so I hope the mother plant is for now just
concentrating it's energy on flowering, and will continue to grow the basal
keikie once flowering season is over, or something like that.

Best,
Joanna

"Drbob92031" wrote in message
...


THANKS FOR THE RETURN, BUT I STILL WANT TO KNOW WHERE ON THE PLANT I

SHOULD CUT
OFF THE KIEKIES
THANKS AGAIN FOR THE INPUT.SORRY TO BE SUCH A PAIN.
BOB



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Old 05-12-2004, 06:18 AM
Steve
 
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J Fortuna wrote:
.........................
If they are basal keikis, coming from the bottom of the plant, then I have
been told that one should not separate the keikies since in all likelihood
they share roots with the mother plant and may not be able to survive as
independent plants. .......................................



I would add to that, that the nature of the way Phals grow will
guarantee that that basal keikis will eventually become separate plants,
like it or not. Phals die at the bottom and grow from the top. Old
leaves eventually fall off at the bottom as new ones grow at the top.
The oldest roots die at the bottom as new ones grow farther up. When the
bottom roots die of old age, the "trunk" dies too. Eventually the dead
part moves up and and reaches the junction. At that point, the parts
will pretty much just fall apart.
Bob, don't misunderstand. When I say dead, I'm not speaking of some
disease. I'm just talking about the normal progression of the growth. It
will take some years before the parts fall apart and the new basal
growths will have had their own root systems for a long while at that
point. If you don't want to wait that long, do leave them alone until
you are ready to repot. When you are repotting the plant, you will be
able to see if there are roots on the new off shoots. If so, you can
probably just snap them off and pot them up in their own pot. I just
leave mine alone until they fall apart.

Steve


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Old 07-12-2004, 12:03 AM
Drbob92031
 
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I don't know if the netiquette has changed in the last few years, but last
time I checked, posting in all upper case was considered the equivalent of
shouting, and was impolite. Did you really want to shout at us? I hope not.


Dear Joanna:

I did not realize the caps lock was depressed. I apologize for the
unintentional loud and offensive shouting.

In response to your so detailed "how to" I
must answer you with another question

First a question: Are those keikis coming from a spike (like flowers, up
high) or from the base of the plant?


They are on spikes that originate from the base of the plant. The keikeis

are about 10" from the base of the plnt, each with multiple leaves and ariel
roots about 4 in number and some are longish (about 4 to 5 inches, the roots).
The spike is dark brown in color wih a few bands of straw colored areas going
around it.
Bob


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Old 07-12-2004, 02:07 AM
J Fortuna
 
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Bob,

Sounds like you have the keikies on flower spikes and not basal keikies
(those would be right at the base not 10 inches away), and it sounds like
the roots of the keikies are long enough to separate the keikies from the
mother plant.

Note: if both the mother plant and the keikie are doing well and have
healthy looking leaves, you do not need to separate the keikies if you do
not want to -- I just saw in Al's orchid greenhouse some plants that had
keikies with long roots, and the keikies had multiple spikes on them, and
all the plants were doing well. Al was commenting to me that while some
people claim that it is important to separate the keikies from the mother
plant when the roots are long enough, in his experience it is not always
necessary.

If you do want to separate the keikies from the mother plant, first try
twisting the keikies off with a sharp wrist movement. If not successful,
then try cutting off the keikie, cutting the spike as close to the keikie as
possible without damaging the keikie. Then plant the keikies just like any
Phal only in small pots.

The dark brown color of the spike is normal for a Phal (though some spikes
will be more green, and others may be more purplish). The straw colored
bands are nodes, this is where a Phal might branch or bud or keikie from.
However, chances are high that the nodes on your Phal spike are no longer
active, and may not do anything else.

Since it has produced two healthy keikies, if you have any doubts about the
health of the mother plant, then I would suggest that you not only twist or
cut off the keikis, but also cut off the flower spike, as close to the base
as possible without damaging the base of the plant. If you cut off the
spike, the mother plant will hopefully be able to concentrate its energy on
getting healthy itself, if it is not healthy. Has the mother plant grown any
new leaves of its own recently (not keikie leaves, but leaves coming from
the center top of the mother plant's crown)? If not, then I would cut off
the flower spike and plant the keikies separately.

I hope that this answers any remaining questions on this subject. If not,
feel free to ask more.

Best,
Joanna

"Drbob92031" wrote in message
...

I don't know if the netiquette has changed in the last few years, but

last
time I checked, posting in all upper case was considered the equivalent

of
shouting, and was impolite. Did you really want to shout at us? I hope

not.

Dear Joanna:

I did not realize the caps lock was depressed. I apologize for the
unintentional loud and offensive shouting.

In response to your so detailed "how to" I
must answer you with another question

First a question: Are those keikis coming from a spike (like flowers, up
high) or from the base of the plant?


They are on spikes that originate from the base of the plant. The

keikeis
are about 10" from the base of the plnt, each with multiple leaves and

ariel
roots about 4 in number and some are longish (about 4 to 5 inches, the

roots).
The spike is dark brown in color wih a few bands of straw colored areas

going
around it.
Bob




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Old 07-12-2004, 02:31 AM
Drbob92031
 
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Hi again Joanna:

Has the mother plant grown any
new leaves of its own recently (not keikie leaves, but leaves coming from
the center top of the mother plant's crown)?
Yes,so I will not cut off the flower spike,which in any case I am loathe to

do.
I think I will just wait and see what transpires. The flower spike is growing
in leaps and bounds.
Thanks for all the trouble you are going through to resolve my concerns. I ont
think I worried this much when my son was little.
Bob




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Old 07-12-2004, 02:58 PM
J Fortuna
 
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Bob,

If you leave the keikies on, if they look like they might not be getting
enough water from the mother plant, you can attach some moss to the keikie
roots using a net of some sort -- I think I have seen the suggestion of
using women's pantyhose for this purpose, or some other kind of netting, it
might be a challenge to do it so that it looks aesthetically pleasing. This
way you could water the keikies and they would retain a bit more water
around their roots. This is a good idea if the keikie roots seem to dry out
and if the keikie leaves are not firm enough, signs of not enough water. Of
course, if you think that the keikies are not receiving enough water, then
separating them from the mother plant would be the way to go after all. I
would only leave the keikies on the mother plant if all the plants continue
to look healthy.

Best,
Joanna

"Drbob92031" wrote in message
...
Hi again Joanna:

Has the mother plant grown any
new leaves of its own recently (not keikie leaves, but leaves coming from
the center top of the mother plant's crown)?
Yes,so I will not cut off the flower spike,which in any case I am

loathe to
do.
I think I will just wait and see what transpires. The flower spike is

growing
in leaps and bounds.
Thanks for all the trouble you are going through to resolve my concerns. I

ont
think I worried this much when my son was little.
Bob




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Old 08-12-2004, 07:24 PM
Drbob92031
 
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Joanna;

The arile roots and he leaves on the keikeis look good and feel lirm and
solid,. I ma electing to take your asvice and leving them on the mother plant.
Thanks for all you time and knowledge.
Bob
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Old 08-12-2004, 10:40 PM
Kenni Judd
 
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Good decision. I had a batch of triple-spike phals a few years ago that
made keikis on all 3 spikes. I found that the keikis matured and bloomed
much faster when left attached to "mom" than when separated, and two years
later when the "moms" each made new multiple spikes and each of the keikis
also flowered, they made an absolutely SPECTACULAR display.
--
Kenni Judd
Juno Beach Orchids
http://www.jborchids.com

"Drbob92031" wrote in message
...
Joanna;

The arile roots and he leaves on the keikeis look good and feel lirm and
solid,. I ma electing to take your asvice and leving them on the mother

plant.
Thanks for all you time and knowledge.
Bob



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Old 10-12-2004, 09:11 PM
Drbob92031
 
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Thanks to all ( Kenni and Joanna in particular) for their input. It makes a
beginner feel welcome and under good "wings".
Bob
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Old 10-12-2004, 09:11 PM
Drbob92031
 
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Thanks to all ( Kenni and Joanna in particular) for their input. It makes a
beginner feel welcome and under good "wings".
Bob
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