Forest isn't really the best environment for rabbits, which are grazers
rather than browsers - woodland edges and clear areas within the forest are
better, so I'm not sure your original assumption is particularly valid.
Rabbit manure is not wonderful fertilizer on its own - composted it's OK,
high potash & phosphate, but raw it tends to burn the plants.

--
May glorious Shamash make his face to shine upon you

Gilgamesh of Uruk
(Include Enkidu in the subject line to avoid the spam trap)
"Richard McDermott" wrote in message
...

"Archimedes Plutonium" wrote in message
...
I was wondering about rabbit manure. In some forests, other than insects
and their bodies as fertilizer it seems as though rabbit manure is one
of the most
available. For we all know that in pristine forests, humans do not go in
there with
fertilizer and that natural fertilizer is what sustains untouched
forests. I suppose
birds contribute natural fertilizer but it seems as though insects are
the biggest
single contributor. Then there are rabbits. So I wonder if anyone has
done analysis of rabbit pellets as a fertilizer?

And can someone tell me why rabbits love elm and locust and cherry
shoots
and twigs but hate currant.

Archimedes Plutonium,
whole entire Universe is just one big atom where dots
of the electron-dot-cloud are galaxies

I met a man from New Jersey whose hobby was growing giant Halloween
pumpkins, he said he grew the state's biggest one year. He said he would
only use rabbit manure for fertility.

"Gordon Couger" wrote in message
news:3e744d56$1_1@newsfeed...

"Archimedes Plutonium" wrote in message
...


Richard McDermott wrote:


I met a man from New Jersey whose hobby was growing giant Halloween
pumpkins, he said he grew the state's biggest one year. He said he
would
only use rabbit manure for fertility.

I would like to know how much nitrogen rabbit manure contains. I suspect
it
is the best nitrogen source for grasslands other than that of buffalo
manure.

I suspect that every ecosystem becomes inhabitated by a sustaining
commensalism between plants that give food to animals and those animals
vice versa give fertilizer to those plants. The food pyramid of an
ecological

environment is one in which there is a mathematical relationship of the
spreading
of plant nutrients and what types of animals and the number of those
animals
for that environment.

I suspect that a long time ago-- hundreds of millions of years ago, the
grasslands
arose and called for some smallish type animal that feeds on grasses and
multiplies very rapidly and constantly eats and prunes the grasses and
small
trees and must scatter that nitrogen nutrient. Answer: rabbits.

Can someone tell me if rabbit remains of feces and urine is any higher
in
nitrogen than is insect feces and body decay.


The nutriant content of manure depeds most ly on how they are handled
between the time the depart the animal and are taken up by the crop. Every
day it lays in the open nitrogen is lost. The smell of manure is largly
ammonia, If it gets wet and stands water bactera make methaned out of it.
If
it gets rained on and water doesn't stand on it the nirtogen compoundes
are
desloved and leacehed into the ground. If you are on sandy soil the
nitrogen
is quickly past the root zone if you are in clay the bacterai my turn it
to
methane. Even from the start most manures are hinger in phospahtes than
than
the crop neds when you supply all the crops nitroge needs with manure or
composte. Composting looses nrogen to the air as well.

At best you have a good source of unbalaced fertilzer at worst you have a
poor source of very unbalece fetelizer. While manures add desirable
elemtents to the soil that minearl fertilezers don't you will spend a very
great deal of time tending rabbint and handeling rabbitt manure to furnish
fertizar for 10 acres of crops. Unless you are growing, coco, murajana or
opium popies you won't make a living.
--
Gordon

Gordon Couger
Stillwater, OK
www.couger.com/gcouger



The majority of the fauna in any terrestrial ecosystem consists of
invertebrates. In any established ecosystem, where no food is being
exported, the nitrogen input must equal the nitrogen output unless the
system is changing.. The balance is affected by nitrifying and
nitrogen-fixing bacteria (principally nitrosomonas, nitrobacter and
azotobacter types) which fix atmospheric N and thus increase the available
nitrogen, and denitrifying bacteria which release gaseous N from compounds
of nitrogen. The presence or absence of lagomorphs will have at most trivial
effects on these processes (unless they graze leguminous plants
preferentially, when they will tend to depress the amount of available
nitrogen compounds in the soil.)
--
May glorious Shamash make his face to shine upon you

Gilgamesh of Uruk
(Include Enkidu in the subject line to avoid the spam trap)

On Sat, 15 Mar 2003 13:25:58 -0600, Archimedes Plutonium
wrote:



Richard McDermott wrote:


I met a man from New Jersey whose hobby was growing giant Halloween
pumpkins, he said he grew the state's biggest one year. He said he would
only use rabbit manure for fertility.

I would like to know how much nitrogen rabbit manure contains. I suspect it
is the best nitrogen source for grasslands other than that of buffalo manure.

I suspect that every ecosystem becomes inhabitated by a sustaining
commensalism between plants that give food to animals and those animals
vice versa give fertilizer to those plants. The food pyramid of an ecological

environment is one in which there is a mathematical relationship of the
spreading
of plant nutrients and what types of animals and the number of those animals
for that environment.

I suspect that a long time ago-- hundreds of millions of years ago, the
grasslands
arose and called for some smallish type animal that feeds on grasses and
multiplies very rapidly and constantly eats and prunes the grasses and small
trees and must scatter that nitrogen nutrient. Answer: rabbits.

Can someone tell me if rabbit remains of feces and urine is any higher in
nitrogen than is insect feces and body decay.

Archimedes Plutonium,
whole entire Universe is just one big atom where dots
of the electron-dot-cloud are galaxies


http://plenty.150m.com/My_Links_Page..._manure01.html
_

- Charles
-
-does not play well with others

Rabbits are grazers, its a simple fact. They will feast on fresh roots
and shoots at the first chance they will get. Thats why they tend to
chew grass to the ground then eat new shoots rather than older ones.

A possible reason for only eating selected plants may be due to the
hardness of the root.

Rabbit fertilizer may be good for the soil but if you think about it
there are lots of types of manure good for the ground. The rabbits
are most likly to have a negative impact by disturbing the soil,
generating weed growth and causing structual loss to the soil.

Tim
Uni Student
--------------------------
http://www.angelfire.com/dc/stormeagle

Archimedes Plutonium wrote in message ...
I was wondering about rabbit manure. In some forests, other than insects
and their bodies as fertilizer it seems as though rabbit manure is one
of the most
available. For we all know that in pristine forests, humans do not go in
there with
fertilizer and that natural fertilizer is what sustains untouched
forests. I suppose
birds contribute natural fertilizer but it seems as though insects are
the biggest
single contributor. Then there are rabbits. So I wonder if anyone has
done analysis of rabbit pellets as a fertilizer?

And can someone tell me why rabbits love elm and locust and cherry
shoots
and twigs but hate currant.

Archimedes Plutonium,
whole entire Universe is just one big atom where dots
of the electron-dot-cloud are galaxies

Archimedes,

I got this from the internet.

Fertilizer (NPK) values for rabbit manu

Nitrogen 2.4%
Phosphorus 1.4%
Potassium 0.6-0.8%

Rabbit manure is an excellent plant fertilizer due to its composition
and concentration of NPK. It produces fast and abundant plant growth.

Rabbit manure should be composted for about three weeks, which lessens
the chance of harmful pathogens and breaks down the manure, which
makes it more useable to the plant and reduces the smell. Fresh
rabbit manure is high in acid content from the urine and should not be
used. However, when the manure has been aged and air-dried, rabbit
manure will not "burn" the plants when applied directly to the plants.

Best Regards,
-Kevin

Archimedes Plutonium wrote:

I am trying to nail-down the inverse or reverse relationship. As to why
plants need animals to reform nitrogen.

Plants lack the biochemical pathways for large scale protein
degradation. That is the specialty of saprophytes (e.g. fungi and
bacteria). Legumes are able to convert atmospheric nitrogen to usable
form by virtue of rhizobia bacteria in root nodules (it is the
bacteria which do the conversion). Plants can also use inorganic
(mineral) nitrate as a source of nitrogen. Higher animals are a
relatively minor source of nitrogen.

I believe there exists some inverse or reverse relationship between plants and
animals so that both can live on Earth and without the other, both would quickly
die.

There is an important symbiosis between plants and animals, in that
plants use carbon dioxide and emit oxygen, and animals do the
opposite.

Steve Turner

Real address contains worldnet instead of spamnet

Archimedes Plutonium wrote in message ...

Yes, thanks Kevin, Charles in a different post with a reference showed a
2.4% nitrogen for rabbits which is one of the highest concentrations of nitrogen.

What I really want to know is why the animal body is constructed in the way it
is such that when nitrogen passes through the animal body that it is a fertilizer
for plants. What does the animal body do to nitrogen that plants find it impossible or extremely
difficult to also do to nitrogen. That is the question I
really want to know the answer. For throughout the entire existence of the plant
kingdom on Earth, has required the simultaneous existence of the animal
kingdom. And I believe it all comes down to some key elements such as nitrogen. That the plant kingdom
cannot exist without the animal kingdom because plants cannot transform and move the nitrogen that
animals can do.

So, Kevin, what happens to nitrogen when it goes through a rabbit body for
which that same nitrogen when it goes through a plant body such as a grass
is unable to transform or change?

snips

The principle is that only 2/3 of the nitrogen in plants can exist
in animals. This is known as the 2/3 Nitrogen Barrier Principle.
This is because only 2/3 of the volume of a sphere can fit in a
cube of the same size. Therefore an animal can metabolize only
some of the nitrogen if eats and the nitrogen it excretes in all
forms can be no more than 2/3 of the nitrogen it consumes.

Actually the mathematical form of the NBP is similar to the Heisenberg
Uncertainty Principle where delta x * delta p = Planck constant

In the Nitrogen Barrier Principle we have a delta x term and it is
metabolism of the rabbit. And we have a delta p term which is the
variable of breakeven nitrogen.

In HUP, there is simultaneity involved in that you cannot
simultaneously
make 100% precise measurement of both position and momentum.

In NBP, there is simultaneity involved in that you cannot
simultaneously
make 100% precise measurement of both Nitrogen and metabolism.

NBP becomes the HUP of energy accounting when trying to turn
Nitrogen energy into metabolism. It is impossible for any future
metabolism machine to supply humanity with Nitrogen that gives more in
output than
input.

In short, NBP says that the highest form of Metabolism in the Universe
is
Nitrogen and Nitrogen metabolism to produce biology. Once humanity
burns
out all of the Nitrogen in the Solar System, then humanity has
exhausted
this Solar System and is looking for the end of its existence. The end
of
humanity.

I hope this clarifies things.

Cheers,
Tony

Tony writes

The principle is that only 2/3 of the nitrogen in plants can exist
in animals. This is known as the 2/3 Nitrogen Barrier Principle.
This is because only 2/3 of the volume of a sphere can fit in a
cube of the same size. Therefore an animal can metabolize only
some of the nitrogen if eats and the nitrogen it excretes in all
forms can be no more than 2/3 of the nitrogen it consumes.

Absolutely. Well known principle.

Actually the mathematical form of the NBP is similar to the Heisenberg
Uncertainty Principle where delta x * delta p = Planck constant

Everyone knows that.

In the Nitrogen Barrier Principle we have a delta x term and it is
metabolism of the rabbit. And we have a delta p term which is the
variable of breakeven nitrogen.

In HUP, there is simultaneity involved in that you cannot
simultaneously
make 100% precise measurement of both position and momentum.

In NBP, there is simultaneity involved in that you cannot
simultaneously
make 100% precise measurement of both Nitrogen and metabolism.

Tell us something new.

NBP becomes the HUP of energy accounting when trying to turn
Nitrogen energy into metabolism. It is impossible for any future
metabolism machine to supply humanity with Nitrogen that gives more in
output than
input.

Stating the obvious.

In short, NBP says that the highest form of Metabolism in the Universe
is
Nitrogen and Nitrogen metabolism to produce biology. Once humanity
burns
out all of the Nitrogen in the Solar System, then humanity has
exhausted
this Solar System and is looking for the end of its existence. The end
of
humanity.

Last prediction I heard was about 2B yrs, assuming no population growth
of humans.

I hope this clarifies things.

Pretty obvious stuff. I'm sure archie has heard it all before.

--
Oz
This post is worth absolutely nothing and is probably fallacious.
Note: soon (maybe already) only posts via despammed.com will be accepted.

Steve Turner wrote in message . ..
Archimedes Plutonium wrote:

I am trying to nail-down the inverse or reverse relationship. As to why
plants need animals to reform nitrogen.

Plants lack the biochemical pathways for large scale protein
degradation. That is the specialty of saprophytes (e.g. fungi and
bacteria). Legumes are able to convert atmospheric nitrogen to usable
form by virtue of rhizobia bacteria in root nodules (it is the
bacteria which do the conversion). Plants can also use inorganic
(mineral) nitrate as a source of nitrogen. Higher animals are a
relatively minor source of nitrogen.

True enough. There are some plants that eat meat (like Venus Flytrap)
but they are generally located in nitrogen depleted areas.

There is an important symbiosis between plants and animals, in that
plants use carbon dioxide and emit oxygen, and animals do the
opposite.
Um, not quite. Plants respire just fine. It's just that they make
their own oxygen so that they can use respiration in an oxygen
atmosphere to reduce the sugars they've made to use energy.
Photosynthesis is the storage of energy. Respiration is the use or
release of that energy. Animals do the latter. Plants do both.

Some symbiosis not because of the nitrogen or carbon cycles but for
breeding purposes. Some higher plants have learned to use animals to
pollinate them and spread their seeds. Wind pollination is inefficient
and random. Animal pollination is efficient relative to wind
pollination. Animals carrying seeds away from the mother plant helps
spread them in different directions instead of just downwind. In
return, animals get valuable nutrition. Most lower plants don't take
advantage of this situation as they developed before animals were
important to the ecosystem.

In conclusion, the hypothesis that the nitrogen cycle must include a
direct animal to plant transfer does not seem to have any proof and
the symbiosis exists for other reasons, in indirect transfer (animal
to ground to plant) and in other cycles.

Todd O.

Why do bunnies taste like chicken??



"Archimedes Plutonium" wrote in
message ...
| I was wondering about rabbit manure. In some forests,
other than insects
| and their bodies as fertilizer it seems as though rabbit
manure is one
| of the most
| available. For we all know that in pristine forests,
humans do not go in
| there with
| fertilizer and that natural fertilizer is what sustains
untouched
| forests. I suppose
| birds contribute natural fertilizer but it seems as though
insects are
| the biggest
| single contributor. Then there are rabbits. So I wonder if
anyone has
| done analysis of rabbit pellets as a fertilizer?
|
| And can someone tell me why rabbits love elm and locust
and cherry
| shoots
| and twigs but hate currant.
|
| Archimedes Plutonium,
| whole entire Universe is just one big atom where dots
| of the electron-dot-cloud are galaxies
|

"Archimedes Plutonium" wrote in message
...
Sun, 16 Mar 2003 19:27:57 GMT Charles wrote:



http://plenty.150m.com/My_Links_Page..._manure01.html
_


Thanks for the excellent site of comparison of rabbit manure to other
manure. Rabbit manure is unusually high in nitrogen.

Can someone tell me in chemistry if the animal body does something
with nitrogen that the plant body cannot do to nitrogen?

SNIP
Yes.
It degrades the protein, which contains nitrogen.
The protein is originally created by plants.
You have this entirely the wrong way round, I'm afraid.


--
May glorious Shamash make his face to shine upon you

Gilgamesh of Uruk
(Include Enkidu in the subject line to avoid the spam trap)

Oz wrote in message
...
Tony writes

Pretty obvious stuff. I'm sure archie has heard it all before.

a big assumption.

I think the interesting thing will be to watch and wait and see how
archie recycles it in a few months time. It can be amusing to try and
trace the roots of some of his ideas. Tony may bear the awful
responsibility of being the source of the next bee in archies bonnet.


--
Jim Webster

"The pasture of stupidity is unwholesome to mankind"

'Abd-ar-Rahman b. Muhammad b. Khaldun al-Hadrami'

Jim Webster writes
I think the interesting thing will be to watch and wait and see how
archie recycles it in a few months time. It can be amusing to try and
trace the roots of some of his ideas. Tony may bear the awful
responsibility of being the source of the next bee in archies bonnet.

From little seeds so do mighty oaks grow.

--
Oz
This post is worth absolutely nothing and is probably fallacious.
Note: soon (maybe already) only posts via despammed.com will be accepted.

Oz wrote in message
...
Jim Webster writes
I think the interesting thing will be to watch and wait and see how
archie recycles it in a few months time. It can be amusing to try and
trace the roots of some of his ideas. Tony may bear the awful
responsibility of being the source of the next bee in archies bonnet.

From little seeds so do mighty oaks grow.

Tony might have provided the great to produce a pearl of great price

although it has to be admitted that the odds are against it


--
Jim Webster

"The pasture of stupidity is unwholesome to mankind"

'Abd-ar-Rahman b. Muhammad b. Khaldun al-Hadrami'

"Frank Martin" wrote in message
...
Why do bunnies taste like chicken??

Everything tastes like chicken? A tautology?



"Archimedes Plutonium" wrote in
message ...
| I was wondering about rabbit manure. In some forests,
other than insects
| and their bodies as fertilizer it seems as though rabbit
manure is one
| of the most
| available. For we all know that in pristine forests,
humans do not go in
| there with
| fertilizer and that natural fertilizer is what sustains
untouched
| forests. I suppose
| birds contribute natural fertilizer but it seems as though
insects are
| the biggest
| single contributor. Then there are rabbits. So I wonder if
anyone has
| done analysis of rabbit pellets as a fertilizer?
|
| And can someone tell me why rabbits love elm and locust
and cherry
| shoots
| and twigs but hate currant.
|
| Archimedes Plutonium,
| whole entire Universe is just one big atom where dots
| of the electron-dot-cloud are galaxies
|