#1   Report Post  
Old 04-02-2003, 04:27 PM
BenignVanilla
 
Posts: n/a
Default Settlement Tanks

"Howard" (remove XYZ) wrote in message
...
The shape of the setting tank makes a big diff too. Think about how much
further solids have to drop in a tall narrow tank then in a shallow one.

Maybe you should look into another method of getting the coarse crap out.
Either brushes or maybe a vortex screen sort of device. Seen a DIY but
do not recall the URL. Maybe someone else has it bookmarked.


I am mostly concerned with keeping large particles out of my pump. If little
stuff makes it to the veggie filter, I won't mind. I posted somewhere that I
intend to have a fairly shallow veggie filter, so cleaning it should not be
an issue. So maybe the better question I could have asked is, what is the
best way to keep the large particles down? I want to have a bury-able
solution. I am leaning toward a large rubber made design that will have the
pump in one end, and the feed in the other. Both separated by some screening
material.

BV.





  #2   Report Post  
Old 04-02-2003, 05:15 PM
John Hines
 
Posts: n/a
Default Settlement Tanks

"BenignVanilla" wrote:

"Howard" (remove XYZ) wrote in message
...
The shape of the setting tank makes a big diff too. Think about how much
further solids have to drop in a tall narrow tank then in a shallow one.

Maybe you should look into another method of getting the coarse crap out.
Either brushes or maybe a vortex screen sort of device. Seen a DIY but
do not recall the URL. Maybe someone else has it bookmarked.


I am mostly concerned with keeping large particles out of my pump. If little
stuff makes it to the veggie filter, I won't mind. I posted somewhere that I
intend to have a fairly shallow veggie filter, so cleaning it should not be
an issue. So maybe the better question I could have asked is, what is the
best way to keep the large particles down? I want to have a bury-able
solution. I am leaning toward a large rubber made design that will have the
pump in one end, and the feed in the other. Both separated by some screening
material.


Like this one?

http://www.aquaart.com/StrBsk.html

Also serves as a priming pot. You do have one of those in your plans
right?


  #3   Report Post  
Old 04-02-2003, 06:26 PM
BenignVanilla
 
Posts: n/a
Default Settlement Tanks

"John Hines" wrote in message
...
"BenignVanilla" wrote:

snip
I am mostly concerned with keeping large particles out of my pump. If

little
stuff makes it to the veggie filter, I won't mind. I posted somewhere

that I
intend to have a fairly shallow veggie filter, so cleaning it should not

be
an issue. So maybe the better question I could have asked is, what is the
best way to keep the large particles down? I want to have a bury-able
solution. I am leaning toward a large rubber made design that will have

the
pump in one end, and the feed in the other. Both separated by some

screening
material.


Like this one?

http://www.aquaart.com/StrBsk.html


For $35? Wow...I guess building one is a useless idea.

BV.



  #4   Report Post  
Old 04-02-2003, 07:09 PM
John Hines
 
Posts: n/a
Default Settlement Tanks

"BenignVanilla" wrote:

"John Hines" wrote in message
.. .
"BenignVanilla" wrote:

snip
I am mostly concerned with keeping large particles out of my pump. If

little
stuff makes it to the veggie filter, I won't mind. I posted somewhere

that I
intend to have a fairly shallow veggie filter, so cleaning it should not

be
an issue. So maybe the better question I could have asked is, what is the
best way to keep the large particles down? I want to have a bury-able
solution. I am leaning toward a large rubber made design that will have

the
pump in one end, and the feed in the other. Both separated by some

screening
material.


Like this one?

http://www.aquaart.com/StrBsk.html


For $35? Wow...I guess building one is a useless idea.


Check out the rest of their (aquaart) products, they have a bunch of
stuff that will save you time. For example

http://www.aquaart.com/draininstall.html


  #5   Report Post  
Old 05-02-2003, 11:15 PM
~ jan
 
Posts: n/a
Default Settlement Tanks

http://www.aquaart.com/StrBsk.html

For $35? Wow...I guess building one is a useless idea.


Did I miss something? SrBsk are usually used on out-of-the-water pumps and
it appears to me that BV is going to use a submersible.....

That said, BV, here's what you're missing in going with small settling
tanks, they may be easy to clean due to size, but you will be cleaning them
often, and IME I do mean often. I originally started with a 10 gallon
filter on my koi ponds which worked the first year with tiny fish and lots
of plants, (basically the ponds were veggie filters). 10 gallons was a snap
to clean (15 minutes) but it had to be done EVERY day. If you make your
pond system an every day or even every few day maintenance chore, I hope
you have no plans of ever being sick or on vacation, cause no one can keep
up the pond better than the pond master builder (that's you).....

Take a little extra time now and dig a hole for a 40 gallon Rough Tote
Trough at the very least*, use window screening and up flow. In the ground
with water hyacinths growing in the top and it will soon be invisible.
Depending on the inhabitants in your pond, you'll only clean this every 3-6
weeks.

Everyone is right though, that said your veggie filter can also be your
mechanical filter** you've just got your pump placement wrong, imo. It
needs to go after the veggie filter, preferable in a container large enough
that it can't suck it dry faster than it can fill.***

* I'd used a 55 gallon barrel as you get more vertical space to keep the
screen off the bottom but also away from the hyacinth roots.

** A mechanical chamber is still easier than removing all your plants and
cleaning the veggie filter if you have to do it more than once/year. If you
are in an area with winter, the veggie filter should be cleaned in winter
or before spring start up, imo.

***For pump protection you need enough vertical space to use a float switch
so if something clogs the system the pump will shut off rather than burn up
or suck the pond dry.

Just out of curiosity have you looked at my website? ~ jan )


See my ponds and filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Wet!~
Tri-Cities WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website


  #6   Report Post  
Old 06-02-2003, 02:48 PM
BenignVanilla
 
Posts: n/a
Default Settlement Tanks

"~ jan" wrote in message
...
http://www.aquaart.com/StrBsk.html


For $35? Wow...I guess building one is a useless idea.


Did I miss something? SrBsk are usually used on out-of-the-water pumps and
it appears to me that BV is going to use a submersible.....


Yes, it is my intent to use a submersible pump. You are correct.

That said, BV, here's what you're missing in going with small settling
tanks, they may be easy to clean due to size, but you will be cleaning

them
often, and IME I do mean often. I originally started with a 10 gallon
filter on my koi ponds which worked the first year with tiny fish and lots
of plants, (basically the ponds were veggie filters). 10 gallons was a

snap
to clean (15 minutes) but it had to be done EVERY day. If you make your
pond system an every day or even every few day maintenance chore, I hope
you have no plans of ever being sick or on vacation, cause no one can keep
up the pond better than the pond master builder (that's you).....


This may be the most important paragraph that I have read since I started my
pond design. This was exactly my intent; a small easy to clean pre-filter.
Daily sounds awful. My hole goal behind a VF is to reduce maintenance.

Take a little extra time now and dig a hole for a 40 gallon Rough Tote
Trough at the very least*, use window screening and up flow. In the ground
with water hyacinths growing in the top and it will soon be invisible.
Depending on the inhabitants in your pond, you'll only clean this every

3-6
weeks.

Everyone is right though, that said your veggie filter can also be your
mechanical filter** you've just got your pump placement wrong, imo. It
needs to go after the veggie filter, preferable in a container large

enough
that it can't suck it dry faster than it can fill.***


Damn, just when I thought I had my design perfect. I intended to have a
bottom drain and skimmer run to my VF. In the VF, we plan to have a
decorative pot or urn sitting, raises a bit out of the water. I intend to
have the feed from the pond come in thru the bottom of this urn. The urn
will be seperated into two sections by some screening with the pump above
the screen. The water would then overflow the urn, and spill into the VF,
which would feed the main pond via 4'' pipe. I figured every now and then I
could shut the pump down, close a valve and overflow the urn and it's
collected gunk into the VF. I figured it would be easy to clean, would not
be a maintenance nightmare, and would also look nice.

I haven't figured out if this pond will be above the main pond or on the
same level yet. I am guessing slightly above, maybe even raised about a
foot, with a nice retaining wall/place to sit.

* I'd used a 55 gallon barrel as you get more vertical space to keep the
screen off the bottom but also away from the hyacinth roots.


If buried, how do you easily clean it?


** A mechanical chamber is still easier than removing all your plants and
cleaning the veggie filter if you have to do it more than once/year. If

you
are in an area with winter, the veggie filter should be cleaned in winter
or before spring start up, imo.


I don't mind emptying the VF once or twice a year. I plan to make it
shallow, so that should not be a big deal.

***For pump protection you need enough vertical space to use a float

switch
so if something clogs the system the pump will shut off rather than burn

up
or suck the pond dry.


The switch is a neccesity. I have a 5 year old and a 2.5 year old. 'Nuff
said?

Just out of curiosity have you looked at my website? ~ jan )


I have but not in awhile...time to revisit.

BV.


  #7   Report Post  
Old 06-02-2003, 03:07 PM
John Rutz
 
Posts: n/a
Default Settlement Tanks



~ jan wrote:
http://www.aquaart.com/StrBsk.html


For $35? Wow...I guess building one is a useless idea.



Did I miss something? SrBsk are usually used on out-of-the-water pumps and
it appears to me that BV is going to use a submersible.....

That said, BV, here's what you're missing in going with small settling
tanks, they may be easy to clean due to size, but you will be cleaning them
often, and IME I do mean often. I originally started with a 10 gallon
filter on my koi ponds which worked the first year with tiny fish and lots
of plants, (basically the ponds were veggie filters). 10 gallons was a snap
to clean (15 minutes) but it had to be done EVERY day. If you make your
pond system an every day or even every few day maintenance chore, I hope
you have no plans of ever being sick or on vacation, cause no one can keep
up the pond better than the pond master builder (that's you).....

Take a little extra time now and dig a hole for a 40 gallon Rough Tote
Trough at the very least*, use window screening and up flow. In the ground
with water hyacinths growing in the top and it will soon be invisible.
Depending on the inhabitants in your pond, you'll only clean this every 3-6
weeks.

Everyone is right though, that said your veggie filter can also be your
mechanical filter** you've just got your pump placement wrong, imo. It
needs to go after the veggie filter, preferable in a container large enough
that it can't suck it dry faster than it can fill.***

* I'd used a 55 gallon barrel as you get more vertical space to keep the
screen off the bottom but also away from the hyacinth roots.

** A mechanical chamber is still easier than removing all your plants and
cleaning the veggie filter if you have to do it more than once/year. If you
are in an area with winter, the veggie filter should be cleaned in winter
or before spring start up, imo.

***For pump protection you need enough vertical space to use a float switch
so if something clogs the system the pump will shut off rather than burn up
or suck the pond dry.

Just out of curiosity have you looked at my website? ~ jan )


See my ponds and filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Wet!~
Tri-Cities WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website


to add to what Jan said

one of my filter setups runns 1200 gph through 4 50 gal drums and then
into the veggie filter when I shut down last fall there was 2 in of
muck in each of the barrels and 3 in in the veggie filter.
if I remember right this setup ran from end july to sept
this may give a idea of how much a 5 gal bucket would pick up
--
John Rutz

I'm not Porg am not am not am so
see my pond at:
http://www.fuerjefe.com

  #8   Report Post  
Old 06-02-2003, 09:58 PM
~ jan
 
Posts: n/a
Default Settlement Tanks

VF = Veggie Filter
PF = Pre-filter
BF = Bio-filter
AKCA = Associated Koi Clubs of American
KHA = Koi Health Advisors

Jan wrote: with small settling tanks, they may be easy to
clean due to size, but you will be cleaning them often,
I hope you have no plans of ever being sick or on vacation, cause no one can keep
up the pond better than the pond master builder (that's you).....


BV replied: This may be the most important paragraph that I have read
since I started my pond design.


)

I intended to have a bottom drain and skimmer run to my VF. In the VF, we plan to have a
decorative pot or urn sitting, raises a bit out of the water. I intend to
have the feed from the pond come in thru the bottom of this urn. The urn
will be seperated into two sections by some screening with the pump above
the screen.


You lost me. If I'm reading the above correctly it sounds like you're
thinking the pump is going to pull the water from the bottom drain and
skimmer? Submersible pumps "usually" push water. As on my ponds (and is
also the most highly recommended way of doing it by the AKCA/KHA materials)
the skimmer and bottom drain work by gravity.

This does not mean that if you have a 4 foot pond you need a 4 foot deep
VF. Gravity will still work on piping going uphill as long as it is below
the surface level of the pond.

You just don't want you piping go up, down and up, as bubbles can collect
at the high point before the piping goes down reducing pipe size due to the
trapped air.

* I'd used a 55 gallon barrel as you get more vertical space to keep the
screen off the bottom but also away from the hyacinth roots.


If buried, how do you easily clean it?


This is mentioned in my website, so short form: I clean the prefilter by
putting plugs in the bulkheads between the PF & BFs. Break my syphon (you'd
be turning a valve) lift out the water hyacinths to a holding bucket, grab
the screening and dump on the grass to rinse with a sprayer. Put old
submersible in to drain down to the muck and use my shop vac to suck out
the muck. (I have a full stock/overstock koi pond and I'm still only
cleaning my pre-filter every 6 - 8 weeks, takes about an hour).

I don't mind emptying the VF once or twice a year. I plan to make it
shallow, so that should not be a big deal.


Once a year, is almost a must if you have to winterize.... twice a year or
mid-season, even that might get old. Those pots are heavy. ;o) If someone
was where the winters were mild like zone 8 or higher, using a mechanical
filter before the VF and they probably could go a few years before cleaning
the VF.

The switch is a neccesity. I have a 5 year old and a 2.5 year old. 'Nuff
said?


Hey, water hyacinths will be your worst enemy over kids. I never had a
problem with my boys, but the ponds went in when the youngest was 5.
I'd be more worried about a younger child falling in. ~ jan


See my ponds and filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Wet!~
Tri-Cities WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website
  #9   Report Post  
Old 07-02-2003, 02:02 PM
BenignVanilla
 
Posts: n/a
Default Settlement Tanks

"~ jan" wrote in message
...
snip

Thanks for all of the tips...once again my design has evolved. This version
has existed for about 3 days now, so I am beginning to think I am close. OK
here goes...

Main Pond, 2500-3000 gallons or so
Twin bottom drains and skimmer routed together to a single feed pipe
Single feed pipe dumps into VF, 300-400 gallons.
A pump house made from a large rubbermaid pulls water from VF and empties
back to main pond
Pump will be separated from Rubbermaid using screen to protect against
debris in the pump
Urn will sit in middle of VF, and will have it's own small pump in order to
provide some splashing sounds and viewing interest.

BV.


  #10   Report Post  
Old 08-02-2003, 07:19 AM
~ jan
 
Posts: n/a
Default Settlement Tanks

Yes, that's sounding better to me. ) ~ jan

On Fri, 7 Feb 2003 09:02:29 -0500, "BenignVanilla" wrote:


Thanks for all of the tips...once again my design has evolved. This version
has existed for about 3 days now, so I am beginning to think I am close. OK
here goes...

Main Pond, 2500-3000 gallons or so
Twin bottom drains and skimmer routed together to a single feed pipe
Single feed pipe dumps into VF, 300-400 gallons.
A pump house made from a large rubbermaid pulls water from VF and empties
back to main pond
Pump will be separated from Rubbermaid using screen to protect against
debris in the pump
Urn will sit in middle of VF, and will have it's own small pump in order to
provide some splashing sounds and viewing interest.

BV.



See my ponds and filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Wet!~
Tri-Cities WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website
Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules

Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ottos in Planted tanks 350X_Rider Freshwater Aquaria Plants 1 24-03-2003 09:32 PM
What are best internet forums for planted tanks Bob Alston Freshwater Aquaria Plants 6 13-02-2003 03:25 AM
Settlement Tanks BenignVanilla Ponds 27 08-02-2003 07:19 AM
Vortex Settlement Chambers BenignVanilla Ponds (alternative) 3 05-02-2003 11:33 PM
Vortex Settlement Chambers BenignVanilla Ponds 4 05-02-2003 11:33 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 12:44 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 GardenBanter.co.uk.
The comments are property of their posters.
 

About Us

"It's about Gardening"

 

Copyright © 2017