"Judi9000" wrote in message
...
Thanks for the info. I was just curious because birds fly off with pieces
of
our dogs food and sometimes they drop it in my ponds. The fish seem to
love it.

## All I can tell you Judi is I'm feeding catfish food mixed with some
(around 30%, I'm not exact) more expensive koi/goldfish pellets and the
difference is AMAZING! They are not fat, they grew longer and their colors
are rich and beautiful. I see no need to spent $10 or $15 a lb for food
when they're thriving on the catfish/koi mix. This is the 3rd summer
they've been on this feeding regime and we haven't had one sick fish, or one
death.
The bottom of the pond has a thin coat of clean gravel where they koi
emptied a few plant pots. :-) There is no mulm or trash (poop and plant
matter) buildup since the filter return doesn't allow anything to "sit" on
the bottom and go sour. I don't seem to have the problem Ms Solo mentioned.

I also have a friend that knows someone who feeds his koi cat food. Is it
ok to
sometimes give the fish dog or cat food or to avoid it altogether? Also my
fish
love oranges and lemons. Judi

## I also have friends who own ponds and feed cat food as treats. One guy
gives his koi those soft-moist dog patties that look like worms
(Ganesburgers perhaps ?). His fish go insane for them! Everyone here is
feeding catfish food to their koi and goldfish. That's where I learned
about it. After seeing these ponds and the healthy fish, I switched. I
haven't heard of any problems whatsoever. Why pay $10+ a lb when you can
get a 50lb bag for the same money?

Let me add.... if you do feed catfish food you don't need to feed huge
amounts for them to grow rapidly and reproduce. :-)

--
Carol.....
Don't go for looks; they can deceive.
Don't go for wealth; even that fades away.
Go for someone who makes you smile,
because it takes only a smile to
make a dark day seem bright.
Find the one that makes your heart smile.
~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~

Cat fish food is for "food" fish, it is for quick growth so they get to market in
under 2 years. Food fish farmers dont care about the long term consequences of
feeding cheap foods. But my fish are pets, and I follow the recommendations of the
people who breed and raise koi for pets. They are every bit as eager to cut their
costs as the food fish producers, but obviously they are not finding it cost
effective to feed the cheap food to their koi. I prefer to follow the
recommendations of the experts when it comes to feeding my fish.
below is a reprint. Most people are overfeeding their fish which is both costly and
unhealthy for the fish. It isnt necessarily the total amount fed, but too much fed
at one time. Koi have very short intestines and the food is in and out quickly
(depending on water temp of course). Their normal feeding pattern is a little bit
all day long.

"Jo Ann and Steve got 77 koi in their big pond. they range from 5-20 lbs each
Steve gives them 2 pints of food per night (which weighs 16 oz), combination of Ogata
and Rangen. the RETAIL cost of feeding their monsters is:
6.5 cents per day per koi
45 cents per week per koi
23.63 bucks per year per koi cause they feed 365 days a year down there in Ala and
they heat their ponds. The koi are monsters and are still growing.

their 5 lb fish are around 18-22", so it averages out maybe to around 0.25 lbs per
inch for those big fish. a quick and dirty estimate of the average is they got 940
lbs of koi and feed 16 oz of food per day.

I am not sure how many koi I got. Lets say 25 koi from 6-14", I know they arent 0.25
lbs per inch, but lets say my 25 fish weigh in at 40 lbs. I should be feeding 1/24th
as much food as they do, or 2/3 of an ounce per day. Well, I think I feed more than
that cause I been feeding a bit less than 1/2 cup or around 1.2 oz of food per day.

Last year I bought
5 lbs of Rangen ($4/lb) $20.00
5 lbs of Ogata (5.50/lb) 27.50
5lbs of romet B ($4) 20.00
--------------------------------------------
67.50
I had Ogata left this spring been using it and will run out this week.
I have romet B left and I gave away at least half to people with sick fish.

I started feeding around April 15 when the water is above 55oF.
I quit feeding around Oct 8th. I didnt keep records on first and last feeding. But
this was around 25 weeks I fed the koi. Lets say 24 weeks cause I forget to feed
them every day. So 24 weeks X 7 days X 1.2 ounces per day = 201 ounces per year or
12.6 lbs. If I feed them according to Steve's rate, I should feed 110 ounces per
year or 6.9 lbs of food.
However, I feed 25 koi 12.6 lbs of food per year, average price is $5/lb or so comes
out to $2.50 per koi. Feeding at Steve's rate 6.9 lbs x $5 = 34.50 or $1.38 per koi
per year.
It doesnt add up right, I have more food left over so I may have missed more feedings
than I thought or not feed 1/2 cup. I dunno.
Yeah, that comes out to about 1/2 lb per year per fish.
High quality koi food is around $5 per lb.
High quality koi food has more digestible nutrition per ounce so I dont have to feed
as much and there is less waste coming out the other end to foul my water and foul my
filters. Anybody wanna feed catfish food to save a few bucks no skin off my nose.
I will feed my fish what experts like Brett feeds his." Ingrid


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

wrote in message
...
Cat fish food is for "food" fish, it is for quick growth so they get to
market in
under 2 years. Food fish farmers dont care about the long term
consequences of
feeding cheap foods. But my fish are pets, and I follow the
recommendations of the
people who breed and raise koi for pets.

** I follow whatever works best for my fish and they are thriving on the
catfish food, as are the fish of my friends. Why fix what isn't broken?
My koi and goldfish have been thriving and reproducing just fine. So are
theirs.
I was also told by a dog breeder from a dog newsgroup that my dogs would be
dead in a few years on inexpensive Wal-Mart dog food - SUPRISE ....
they're now, 13, 11 and 10 years old! So far all three are still healthy.
OK, so one is hard of hearing now. :-) They're paying several times the
$$$ for all kinds of Deluxe and Designer brand dog foods.

They are every bit as eager to cut their
costs as the food fish producers, but obviously they are not finding it
cost
effective to feed the cheap food to their koi.

** You're talking about businesses, people in business to make money. You
can be sure they're not paying the $10 to $15+ a lb the dealers are charging
the public for these special-edition koi foods. Most of us with pet koi
are not looking to make money on our pets or raise thousands of fry a year.
All we want is a food that keeps them healthy, in good condition and to
enjoy watching a few baby fish. And catfish food fits the bill.

I prefer to follow the
recommendations of the experts when it comes to feeding my fish.
below is a reprint.

** The "experts" can come and check out my fish any time they want. :-)

Most people are overfeeding their fish which is both costly and
unhealthy for the fish. It isnt necessarily the total amount fed, but too
much fed
at one time. Koi have very short intestines and the food is in and out
quickly
(depending on water temp of course). Their normal feeding pattern is a
little bit
all day long.

** Overfeeding is another issue. I think most people learn fast enough how
much to feed per feeding after seeing slimy, furry food floating on the
surface at the next feeding time.

"Jo Ann and Steve got 77 koi in their big pond. they range from 5-20 lbs
each
Steve gives them 2 pints of food per night (which weighs 16 oz),
combination of Ogata
and Rangen. the RETAIL cost of feeding their monsters is:
6.5 cents per day per koi
45 cents per week per koi
23.63 bucks per year per koi cause they feed 365 days a year down there in
Ala and
they heat their ponds. The koi are monsters and are still growing.

** Jo Ann is in business and gets her feed wholesale, for one thing. Most
of us pet owners out here aren't buying in bulk. I have around 30 koi of
assorted sizes, and around 50 goldfish, some 8 to 10" long. It costs us
about $25.00 to $30.00 a year to feed them all. If I had 70 koi and 100
goldfish it would around $60.00 a year to feed them. Jo Ann is paying
$1,819.51 - big difference. Also,... since our fish never manage to eat the
whole 50 lbs, what's left is not kept over. It gets mixed in the Wal-Mart
food for the dogs. They love it.

Snipped list of figures for brevity.

Since all the ponds in my area are thriving, and all the fish reproducing,
we'll stick to catfish food and let those who feel they need a more
expensive food go for it!
--
Carol.....
I've learned that it takes years to build up trust, and it only
takes suspicion, not proof, to destroy it.
º¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤º ~*~ ~*~ º¤º°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤º ~*~ ~*~

That's the same kind of dog food we feed our dog. The birds sometimes drop
pieces in the ponds and the fish LOVE IT!!! Thanks .

I think that is sooo funny that your dogs eat the fish food! Never heard of
that one before!!! judi

Carol, as I was feeding my fish today, my cute little mini dachsund came up to
visit me and the fish. I had him do a few tricks for me and gave him some
pieces of the koi food. He loved it!!! Thanks for the cute idea. Judi

Judi9000 wrote:
I think that is sooo funny that your dogs eat the fish food! Never heard of
that one before!!! judi

Well, when I was a teen, one of my cats LOVED the tropical flake food for
the tanks. She'd follow me at feeding time to clean up anything that
dropped. One day, she figured out where the canister was stored and chewed
it open and wolfed down a good deal of the fish food.... then went outside
and threw it all back up. She hasn't wanted fish food since, heh.

So... moral of this story is keep the food away from the pets that like
it lest they glut themselves much to their (and your) distress at the
gastronomical outcome of such glutting.

Judi9000 wrote:
I think that is sooo funny that your dogs eat the fish food! Never heard of
that one before!!! judi

Our dogs also eat fish food. They beg and do their tricks, and I usually
give them a pellet or two. And if they don't get enough, they slurp it
out of the pond when it gets close enough to them.
--
Zk
3500gal pond, 13 pond piggies
Oregon, USDA Zone 7

"Judi9000" wrote in message
...
I think that is sooo funny that your dogs eat the fish food! Never heard
of
that one before!!! judi
========================
Dogs will eat almost anything, or at least all those I have ever owned did.
These 3 are no exception. When I feed my dogs I mix the leftover catfish
food with the dry Ol Roy dog food, table scraps of all kinds, 1/2 can of
some kind of meaty dog food and hot water. The only dog to ever get sick
and need the vet was the dobie who came down with erlicciosis (sp ?) from a
tick-bite.
--
Carol.....
I've learned that it takes years to build up trust, and it only
takes suspicion, not proof, to destroy it.
º¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤º ~*~ ~*~ º¤º°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤º ~*~ ~*~

"Judi9000" wrote in message
...
Carol, as I was feeding my fish today, my cute little mini dachsund came
up to
visit me and the fish. I had him do a few tricks for me and gave him some
pieces of the koi food. He loved it!!! Thanks for the cute idea. Judi
==================
I believe he did! :-) My dogs also love cat food - any brand and in any
form. Dogs are natural born scavengers and from what I learned can handle a
wide range of foods. Their livers also produce starch splitters to help
digest carbohydrates in their diets. I was surprised to learn that.....
being they're carnivores.

In the late 1980s I had a large male mutt (shelter pup) who loved hunting
season. He'd drag home all the hunter's leavings after dressing out the
deer. Sometimes skeletons with little meat on them. Any deer nearby that
were hit by cars were also dragged home. He'd feast on them for days.
Now there's too much traffic and we keep the dogs in a huge fenced in area
when they go outside.
--
Carol.....
I've learned that it takes years to build up trust, and it only
takes suspicion, not proof, to destroy it.
º¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤º ~*~ ~*~ º¤º°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤º ~*~ ~*~