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Old 21-05-2004, 01:03 PM
Tim Downie
 
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Default Pond pump speed control

Is is possible to use a speed controller (like a light dimmer) with a small
pond pump?

I have a Bermuda 3000 (3000l/hr) submersible pump that's really a bit more
powerful than I need. The motor has a solid rotor that appears to be made
of a ferrite like material.

I know that speed controllers can cause overheating problems with some
motors but given that it's underwater with water bathing the rotor, I don't
imagine this would be a problem in this case.

Tim
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Old 21-05-2004, 01:03 PM
BigWallop
 
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Default Pond pump speed control


"Tim Downie" wrote in message
...
Is is possible to use a speed controller (like a light dimmer) with a small
pond pump?

I have a Bermuda 3000 (3000l/hr) submersible pump that's really a bit more
powerful than I need. The motor has a solid rotor that appears to be made
of a ferrite like material.

I know that speed controllers can cause overheating problems with some
motors but given that it's underwater with water bathing the rotor, I don't
imagine this would be a problem in this case.

Tim


Unless you want to boil the water. It is simpler to install a restriction washer to
the outlet spout I would think. If the diameter of the spout is, say, 10 mm full
bore. Then placing a washer with a hole size of 5 mm should greatly reduce the output
from the spout.

Is the fancy head removable ? If it is, then put a small rubber washer with a smaller
hole on top before you put the head back on.


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Old 21-05-2004, 02:04 PM
Mickey
 
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Default Pond pump speed control

Get a smaller pump it may pay for itself in electricity.

"Tim Downie" wrote in message
...
Is is possible to use a speed controller (like a light dimmer) with a
small
pond pump?

I have a Bermuda 3000 (3000l/hr) submersible pump that's really a bit more
powerful than I need. The motor has a solid rotor that appears to be made
of a ferrite like material.

I know that speed controllers can cause overheating problems with some
motors but given that it's underwater with water bathing the rotor, I
don't
imagine this would be a problem in this case.

Tim
--
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Old 21-05-2004, 02:05 PM
Andy McKenzie
 
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Default Pond pump speed control

"Mickey" wrote in message
...
Get a smaller pump it may pay for itself in electricity.

"Tim Downie" wrote in message
...
Is is possible to use a speed controller (like a light dimmer) with a
small
pond pump?

I have a Bermuda 3000 (3000l/hr) submersible pump that's really a bit

more
powerful than I need. The motor has a solid rotor that appears to be

made
of a ferrite like material.

I know that speed controllers can cause overheating problems with some
motors but given that it's underwater with water bathing the rotor, I
don't
imagine this would be a problem in this case.


Quick calculation - 3000 l/hr pump takes 30 Watts - 1500l/hr pump takes 20
watts, so you save 10 watts switching to a smaller pump. 10 watts costs
about 5 assuming you run the pump 24*7, pumps cost 50, so you only save
money by changing the pump after 10 years!

Of course these numbers are almost certainly wrong!

I thought the best way to control the flow would be to bleed some water off
before the fountain/filter or whatever is taking too much water.

Andy


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Old 21-05-2004, 04:06 PM
Gale Pearce
 
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Default Pond pump speed control

You can restrict the outflow side of the pump, but not the intake or you
will burn out your pump prematurely - I use a "ball valve" to reduce the
waterflow on my submersible pump on the line to my filter
Gale :~)
"Tim Downie" wrote in message
...
Is is possible to use a speed controller (like a light dimmer) with a

small
pond pump?

I have a Bermuda 3000 (3000l/hr) submersible pump that's really a bit more
powerful than I need. The motor has a solid rotor that appears to be made
of a ferrite like material.

I know that speed controllers can cause overheating problems with some
motors but given that it's underwater with water bathing the rotor, I

don't
imagine this would be a problem in this case.

Tim
--
Remove the obvious to reply by email.





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Old 21-05-2004, 04:08 PM
 
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Default Pond pump speed control

Easy solution just screw a splitter onto it and divert the extra water to a
spitter or your water fall....MIKE
"Tim Downie" wrote in message
...
Is is possible to use a speed controller (like a light dimmer) with a

small
pond pump?

I have a Bermuda 3000 (3000l/hr) submersible pump that's really a bit more
powerful than I need. The motor has a solid rotor that appears to be made
of a ferrite like material.

I know that speed controllers can cause overheating problems with some
motors but given that it's underwater with water bathing the rotor, I

don't
imagine this would be a problem in this case.

Tim
--
Remove the obvious to reply by email.



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Old 21-05-2004, 05:10 PM
Benign Vanilla
 
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Default Pond pump speed control


"Tim Downie" wrote in message
...
Is is possible to use a speed controller (like a light dimmer) with a

small
pond pump?

I have a Bermuda 3000 (3000l/hr) submersible pump that's really a bit more
powerful than I need. The motor has a solid rotor that appears to be made
of a ferrite like material.

I know that speed controllers can cause overheating problems with some
motors but given that it's underwater with water bathing the rotor, I

don't
imagine this would be a problem in this case.


I'd suggest the following...

1. Get a new smaller pump, and sell this one on eBay. Your electric bill
will thank you.
2. Attach a short piece of hose, and a valve downstream from the pump. It's
not a problem to restrict the output of the pump. You don't want to restrict
the input.

BV.


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Old 21-05-2004, 05:21 PM
Ian Stirling
 
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Default Pond pump speed control

In uk.d-i-y Benign Vanilla wrote:

"Tim Downie" wrote in message
...
Is is possible to use a speed controller (like a light dimmer) with a

small
pond pump?

I have a Bermuda 3000 (3000l/hr) submersible pump that's really a bit more
powerful than I need. The motor has a solid rotor that appears to be made
of a ferrite like material.

I know that speed controllers can cause overheating problems with some
motors but given that it's underwater with water bathing the rotor, I

don't
imagine this would be a problem in this case.


I'd suggest the following...

1. Get a new smaller pump, and sell this one on eBay. Your electric bill
will thank you.


Pumps may use less than sticker ratings.
I have several 600W submersible pumps, that are (IIRC) 3000l/sec, from
lidl.
I stuck a meter on them, and they come out at around 360W.
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Old 21-05-2004, 05:23 PM
Geoff Beale
 
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Default Pond pump speed control


BigWallop wrote:

Unless you want to boil the water. It is simpler to install a
restriction washer to the outlet spout I would think. If the
diameter of the spout is, say, 10 mm full bore. Then placing a
washer with a hole size of 5 mm should greatly reduce the output from
the spout.

Is the fancy head removable ? If it is, then put a small rubber
washer with a smaller hole on top before you put the head back on.


---
http://www.basecuritysystems.no-ip.com

Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.688 / Virus Database: 449 - Release Date: 18/05/04


Rather than waste the pump's output by restricting it, run a "T" off the
output side and divert some of the flow to a home-made venturi (another
"T" with a restrictor on the long side and and an air intake tube into
the short side - you have to experiment a bit to get it right). This
will add valuable oxygenation to your pond and add a little more
movement to the water. Balance the flow between the two outputs with
ball valves on the hoses.
--
Geoff Beale
Extract digit to email.


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Old 21-05-2004, 06:06 PM
Ian Stirling
 
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Default Pond pump speed control

In uk.d-i-y Tim Downie wrote:
Is is possible to use a speed controller (like a light dimmer) with a small
pond pump?

I have a Bermuda 3000 (3000l/hr) submersible pump that's really a bit more
powerful than I need. The motor has a solid rotor that appears to be made
of a ferrite like material.

I know that speed controllers can cause overheating problems with some
motors but given that it's underwater with water bathing the rotor, I don't
imagine this would be a problem in this case.


In this case, simple speed controllers won't actually work, it'll stay at
a constant speed (3000RPM) until it stops working, and hums loudly.
Suitable speed controllers are going for around 40-50 quid on ebay.
Search on
inverter phase motor induction
on ebay, searching titles and descriptions.


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Old 21-05-2004, 06:08 PM
Tim Downie
 
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Default Pond pump speed control

Gale Pearce wrote:
You can restrict the outflow side of the pump, but not the intake or
you will burn out your pump prematurely - I use a "ball valve" to
reduce the waterflow on my submersible pump on the line to my filter
Gale :~)


I've already got a restrictor and T-piece on the pump outlet so I can
control the output at present. Somehow it doesn't feel "right" to reduce
the flow this way. I can't help feeling that it's putting extra load on the
pump. As I have a reasonably hefty lamp dimmer kicking around, I was just
wondering if using a device like this would be more mechanically
"sympathetic" IYKWIM. (Probably complete nonsense I know).

Tim

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Old 21-05-2004, 07:10 PM
John Laird
 
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Default Pond pump speed control

On Fri, 21 May 2004 11:20:01 +0100, "Tim Downie"
wrote:

Is is possible to use a speed controller (like a light dimmer) with a small
pond pump?

I have a Bermuda 3000 (3000l/hr) submersible pump that's really a bit more
powerful than I need. The motor has a solid rotor that appears to be made
of a ferrite like material.

I know that speed controllers can cause overheating problems with some
motors but given that it's underwater with water bathing the rotor, I don't
imagine this would be a problem in this case.


Pace "Home Improvement", there is no such concept to a man as "too much
power". What you need is more pond...

--
Too much month at the end of the money.

Mail john rather than nospam...
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Old 21-05-2004, 07:10 PM
Benign Vanilla
 
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Default Pond pump speed control


"John Laird" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 21 May 2004 11:20:01 +0100, "Tim Downie"
wrote:

Is is possible to use a speed controller (like a light dimmer) with a

small
pond pump?

I have a Bermuda 3000 (3000l/hr) submersible pump that's really a bit

more
powerful than I need. The motor has a solid rotor that appears to be

made
of a ferrite like material.

I know that speed controllers can cause overheating problems with some
motors but given that it's underwater with water bathing the rotor, I

don't
imagine this would be a problem in this case.


Pace "Home Improvement", there is no such concept to a man as "too much
power". What you need is more pond...

--
Too much month at the end of the money.


Well put.


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Old 21-05-2004, 08:06 PM
Jeff Lowe
 
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Default Pond pump speed control


"Tim Downie" wrote in message
...
Gale Pearce wrote:
You can restrict the outflow side of the pump, but not the intake or
you will burn out your pump prematurely - I use a "ball valve" to
reduce the waterflow on my submersible pump on the line to my filter
Gale :~)


I've already got a restrictor and T-piece on the pump outlet so I can
control the output at present. Somehow it doesn't feel "right" to reduce
the flow this way. I can't help feeling that it's putting extra load on

the
pump. As I have a reasonably hefty lamp dimmer kicking around, I was

just
wondering if using a device like this would be more mechanically
"sympathetic" IYKWIM. (Probably complete nonsense I know).


Since these are just turbine pumps, there is no difference as far as the
pump is concerned as to the location of the restriction on either the input
or output. I would not use a lamp dimmer since these are typically just
triacs and have a spiky output waveform which will cause motor heating,
however a variable speed control for a ceiling fan should work fine. One
other aspect to be aware of is that many pumps use either a fan or in the
case of submersibles, water to cool the motor. In this case any restriction
of flow, either by speed control, or by restriction may result in some
heating and should be watched.

Jeff Lowe


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Old 21-05-2004, 08:06 PM
Lurch
 
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Default Pond pump speed control

On Fri, 21 May 2004 17:05:22 +0100, in uk.d-i-y "Tim Downie"
strung together this:

I've already got a restrictor and T-piece on the pump outlet so I can
control the output at present. Somehow it doesn't feel "right" to reduce
the flow this way.


If you read the instructions on most pumps that's how it's supposed to
be done. And under high pressure it probably would put additional
strain on the pump, but not really a concern at low pressures.
--

SJW
A.C.S. Ltd.


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