I am a 2nd year ponder. Last year I had a 6 foot round about 3 feet deep
pond. I simply fell in love with the whole thing. I did fight the string
algae all year but overall I loved it. I have six gold fish and three Koi
and about 15 little minnows that my kids got out of the local creek. My pump
is a 1200 gpm. The waterfall is about six feet up.

I loved the pond thing so mush that I put in another pond this year. It
connects with the first pond and is about 4 X 8 X 4 feet. I did not ad any
fish in it and left the old fish in the first pond. All of my lilies are
coming back strong. Even the tropical ones, they don't look as strong and
as big as the others. I got some barley straw early this year and haven't
had any problem with algae this year. The pond got crystal clear and stayed
that way for two or three weeks. Then it turned, I can still see the bottom
but it has a greenish tint, and just a little dead algae floating on top
every day. Nothing I can't skim off in 2 to 3 minutes. It all looks a
little stagnant and I also now have some sick fish. (See other massage Sick
fish). I also added a bog filter about 5 X 2 X 1.5 feet. I think that's all
the info you will need. So before I keep rambling on here are my questions:



Is my pump to small?

Is the decaying barley straw making my fish sick or responsible for the
murky water?

OH one more thing! About every other day I fish out a half gallon of frog
eggs. Now I don't mind some frogs but this is too much. Anyway I can get
rid of the frogs? Thanks for your help.

"Rick" wrote in message
ink.net...
I am a 2nd year ponder. Last year I had a 6 foot round about 3 feet deep
pond. I simply fell in love with the whole thing. I did fight the string
algae all year but overall I loved it. I have six gold fish and three Koi
and about 15 little minnows that my kids got out of the local creek. My pump
is a 1200 gpm. The waterfall is about six feet up.

I loved the pond thing so mush that I put in another pond this year. It
connects with the first pond and is about 4 X 8 X 4 feet. I did not ad any
fish in it and left the old fish in the first pond. All of my lilies are
coming back strong. Even the tropical ones, they don't look as strong and
as big as the others. I got some barley straw early this year and haven't
had any problem with algae this year. The pond got crystal clear and stayed
that way for two or three weeks. Then it turned, I can still see the bottom
but it has a greenish tint, and just a little dead algae floating on top
every day. Nothing I can't skim off in 2 to 3 minutes. It all looks a
little stagnant and I also now have some sick fish. (See other massage Sick
fish). I also added a bog filter about 5 X 2 X 1.5 feet. I think that's all
the info you will need. So before I keep rambling on here are my questions:



Is my pump to small?

Is the decaying barley straw making my fish sick or responsible for the
murky water?

OH one more thing! About every other day I fish out a half gallon of frog
eggs. Now I don't mind some frogs but this is too much. Anyway I can get
rid of the frogs? Thanks for your help.


The frog eggs may be part of your problem. They can really mess up your pond
chemistry if there are enough of them. Check your nitrites, nitrates, and
ammonia levels, and your pH.

About the only way to keep frogs out of the
pond is to net it securely. Removing the eggs
when they get to be too much is a good compromise
(just take them to a natural waterway).

I agree with George. Check your water tests, especially
ammonia with all the frog activity.

Usually algae that floats up to the surface means too
much organic matter in the pond. And could be a sign
of blue green algae which will make fish sick also.
You may need to reduce your stocking level (here
Mother Nature may be doing it for you).

Barely straw.... don't use it as I don't like the idea of
any more rotting organic matter in the pond than what
comes naturally. But others do so maybe they can answer
your question.

Sound likes like you are really enjoying your pond and
with some adjustments you probably will be okay.

kathy :-)
www.blogfromthebog.com

Excessive organic waste coming from the frogs and their eggs. Get rid of
the frogs and their eggs, keep the rotten barley straw out, and don't add
any more fish. Your set up sounds great except you didn't mention anything
about your filtration system. What do you have for filter?

--
_______________________________________
"The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is
like an eggs-and-ham breakfast:
The chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."

http://community.webshots.com/user/godwino

"Rick" wrote in message
ink.net...
I am a 2nd year ponder. Last year I had a 6 foot round about 3 feet deep
pond. I simply fell in love with the whole thing. I did fight the string
algae all year but overall I loved it. I have six gold fish and three Koi
and about 15 little minnows that my kids got out of the local creek. My
pump
is a 1200 gpm. The waterfall is about six feet up.

I loved the pond thing so mush that I put in another pond this year. It
connects with the first pond and is about 4 X 8 X 4 feet. I did not ad any
fish in it and left the old fish in the first pond. All of my lilies are
coming back strong. Even the tropical ones, they don't look as strong and
as big as the others. I got some barley straw early this year and haven't
had any problem with algae this year. The pond got crystal clear and
stayed
that way for two or three weeks. Then it turned, I can still see the
bottom
but it has a greenish tint, and just a little dead algae floating on top
every day. Nothing I can't skim off in 2 to 3 minutes. It all looks a
little stagnant and I also now have some sick fish. (See other massage
Sick
fish). I also added a bog filter about 5 X 2 X 1.5 feet. I think that's
all
the info you will need. So before I keep rambling on here are my
questions:



Is my pump to small?

Is the decaying barley straw making my fish sick or responsible for the
murky water?

OH one more thing! About every other day I fish out a half gallon of frog
eggs. Now I don't mind some frogs but this is too much. Anyway I can get
rid of the frogs? Thanks for your help.

"Just Me "Koi"" wrote in message
news:HQqje.10332$6d.5424@trnddc04...
Excessive organic waste coming from the frogs and their eggs. Get rid of
the frogs and their eggs, keep the rotten barley straw out, and don't add
any more fish. Your set up sounds great except you didn't mention
anything
about your filtration system. What do you have for filter?

--
The punp had a filter with it when i
got it. it has a bag with small pebbals in it. clead daily.

The punp had a filter with it when I got it. It has a bag with small
pebbals in it. clead daily.
From prefilter the water gose in to a baral full of pea gravel the baral is
about 2.5 round and
2.5 feet deep, from there the water gose into a bog filter filled with pea
gravel about 2 X 5 X 1.5 feet, to a waterfall.
_______________________________________
"The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is
like an eggs-and-ham breakfast:
The chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."

http://community.webshots.com/user/godwino

"Rick" wrote in message
ink.net...
I am a 2nd year ponder. Last year I had a 6 foot round about 3 feet deep
pond. I simply fell in love with the whole thing. I did fight the
string
algae all year but overall I loved it. I have six gold fish and three
Koi
and about 15 little minnows that my kids got out of the local creek. My
pump
is a 1200 gpm. The waterfall is about six feet up.

I loved the pond thing so mush that I put in another pond this year. It
connects with the first pond and is about 4 X 8 X 4 feet. I did not ad
any
fish in it and left the old fish in the first pond. All of my lilies
are
coming back strong. Even the tropical ones, they don't look as strong
and
as big as the others. I got some barley straw early this year and
haven't
had any problem with algae this year. The pond got crystal clear and
stayed
that way for two or three weeks. Then it turned, I can still see the
bottom
but it has a greenish tint, and just a little dead algae floating on top
every day. Nothing I can't skim off in 2 to 3 minutes. It all looks a
little stagnant and I also now have some sick fish. (See other massage
Sick
fish). I also added a bog filter about 5 X 2 X 1.5 feet. I think that's
all
the info you will need. So before I keep rambling on here are my
questions:



Is my pump to small?

Is the decaying barley straw making my fish sick or responsible for the
murky water?

OH one more thing! About every other day I fish out a half gallon of
frog
eggs. Now I don't mind some frogs but this is too much. Anyway I can
get
rid of the frogs? Thanks for your help.

Here are a few things I would add.

For the size of the pond you may have too many fish.
I qualify this because you didn't say the total length of the fish.

I see that the pond is aprox. 1200 gal. The actual size of the pond would
help is it deep enough and circulating the water properly .

---- Bog --
The "bog" is a good idea. But.
There are some things you will want to check on.
Size, water flow, amount of water, soil, plants, etc. There is a major
difference in the acid/ alkaline levels.
Do you want a "bog", "fen", or "marsh"?
There is a definite difference between these three. For example;
A bog is acidic and over time turns into peat and then turns into coal.
(none of us will be around to see this)

I have a 1700+ gal. pond and filter it through two different marshes.
There is 7 fish for a total of 55 inches. I have hardy plants that come
back up in the spring. Cattail, Japanese Iris, Papyrus, etc.

---- Barley grass --
It's true, throw away the barley grass. It takes too long to 'activate'.
By then the fish have eaten at it, or it's broken down and gets in the
pump or waits for you to clean it out come fall.

---- Salt --
I have not seen and good or bad points about salt use. Using a marsh may
have something to do with this. I will be doing more chemical research on
this.

---- Tea Tree ---
I like natural cures so I use Tea Tree extract. People use it on
themselves and animals.
There is a caution here. http://www.messybeast.com/teatree.htm


Remember. We are all first timers and none of us was born with the
information.
I'm sure that everyone that has worked a pond has sent their fair share
of fish and plants onto their next life.
Hang in there.

"Courageous" wrote in message
...

Do you want a "bog", "fen", or "marsh"?

I thought when people talked about a "bog filter," they were usually
referring to an upflow gravel pit? (i.e., not really a "bog").

Like this:

http://www.pondsolutions.com/bog_filter.htm

C//

My bog is just like the one you showed me. That's the site I got the idea
from. I just dug the hole as deep as I could (rocks) put in the liner and
it overflows into the waterfall.

"StOrEcRaFt" wrote in message
...
Here are a few things I would add.

For the size of the pond you may have too many fish.
I qualify this because you didn't say the total length of the fish.

I see that the pond is aprox. 1200 gal. The actual size of the pond would
help is it deep enough and circulating the water properly .

---- Bog --
The "bog" is a good idea. But.
There are some things you will want to check on.
Size, water flow, amount of water, soil, plants, etc. There is a major
difference in the acid/ alkaline levels.
Do you want a "bog", "fen", or "marsh"?
There is a definite difference between these three. For example;
A bog is acidic and over time turns into peat and then turns into coal.
(none of us will be around to see this)

I have a 1700+ gal. pond and filter it through two different marshes.
There is 7 fish for a total of 55 inches. I have hardy plants that come
back up in the spring. Cattail, Japanese Iris, Papyrus, etc.

---- Barley grass --
It's true, throw away the barley grass. It takes too long to 'activate'.
By then the fish have eaten at it, or it's broken down and gets in the
pump or waits for you to clean it out come fall.

---- Salt --
I have not seen and good or bad points about salt use. Using a marsh may
have something to do with this. I will be doing more chemical research on
this.

---- Tea Tree ---
I like natural cures so I use Tea Tree extract. People use it on
themselves and animals.
There is a caution here. http://www.messybeast.com/teatree.htm


Remember. We are all first timers and none of us was born with the
information.
I'm sure that everyone that has worked a pond has sent their fair share
of fish and plants onto their next life.
Hang in there.


So I broke down and got a new pomp today. My old pump 1200GPH seemed to not
follow so hot, especially with that 6-foot rise to the top of my setup; I
don’t think that it was turning my pond over at an acceptable rate. I also
recalculated the total water volume of the two ponds and it seams to be
closer to 1600 gallons plus barrel, bog, and waterfall. So I put in the new
pump at 3000GPH and it really moves some water. In fact it moved so much
that the barrel at the top over flowed, so I tried to put another 2-inch
drainpipe on it to go to the bog. But it leaked and I was losing daylight
fast so I just shut the whole thing down for the night. Made up my mind to
put in one of those Skippy filters. (If I can find some of thoughts scrub
pads).



That filter that came with the old pump had way too much backpressure so I
think I may leave it out of the loop. Do you think that I need some kind of
pre filter if I ad a veggie filter in the Skippy?



Also the one pond has no fish in it so I plan to put a lot of plants in it
like a veggie filter but sense the shelf space is limited dose it mater that
it is four feet deep? Or will plants like watercress just grow in deep
water, or do their roots need to be able to reach button? How will they do
in more still water? Any hardy plants you could recommend.



Oh and by the way I have about 80 to 90 inch of fish. If I lose the two sick
ones 10 inches less. The one has now lost its skin on one side about 1 inch
X 1.5 inches. Got some med’s from Wall Mart that should cure 7 of 9
funguses. Not better nor worse in the last two days.



I didn’t get the meaning of you comment about the bog. Should I be looking
at some things there?



Do you or anybody else know how to get read of those frogs?



My water test is as follows; Nitrate 5-20 safe, Nitrite the color the test
strip isn’t on the chart of the test strip bottle, Hardness hard, PH 8-8.4



I better stop now I’m rambling again, Thanks for all your help. Rick

On Sun, 22 May 2005 06:33:57 GMT, "Rick" wrote:

That filter that came with the old pump had way too much backpressure so I
think I may leave it out of the loop. Do you think that I need some kind of
pre filter if I ad a veggie filter in the Skippy?

A pre-filter is always a good idea, less cleaning of that which follows.

Also the one pond has no fish in it so I plan to put a lot of plants in it
like a veggie filter but sense the shelf space is limited dose it mater that
it is four feet deep? Or will plants like watercress just grow in deep
water, or do their roots need to be able to reach button? How will they do
in more still water? Any hardy plants you could recommend.

Watercress can be put all around the edges (assuming rock edge that you can
tuck it under). It will do fine, your water isn't that still with that much
flow.

Got some med’s from Wall Mart that should cure 7 of 9
funguses.

I wouldn't use them, they are most likely sick due to poor water quality.
Did you buy test kits while you were there?

I didn’t get the meaning of you comment about the bog. Should I be looking
at some things there?

Bog: Marsh, stagnant acidic water.
Veggie filter: plants that water flows freely thru.

My water test is as follows; Nitrate 5-20 safe, Nitrite the color the test
strip isn’t on the chart of the test strip bottle, Hardness hard, PH 8-8.4

What color is it closest too? The 0 or the higher number? Forget the strips
and get Aquarium Pharmaceuticals kits. Be sure the ammonia test is the two
bottle one. www.thatpetplace.com or www.drsfostersmith.com ~ jan


See my ponds and filter design:
www.jjspond.us

~Keep 'em Wet!~
Tri-Cities WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website

Do you want a "bog", "fen", or "marsh"?

I thought when people talked about a "bog filter," they were usually
referring to an upflow gravel pit? (i.e., not really a "bog").

Like this:

http://www.pondsolutions.com/bog_filter.htm

C//

Ooops, sorry. I took the word literally.

The originator did indicate " I also added a bog filter about 5 X 2 X 1.5
feet"


Not using exact meanings shure makes things difficult to understand and
keep track of.
-----------------



Courageous wrote in
:


Do you want a "bog", "fen", or "marsh"?

I thought when people talked about a "bog filter," they were usually
referring to an upflow gravel pit? (i.e., not really a "bog").

Like this:

http://www.pondsolutions.com/bog_filter.htm

C//

Ooops, sorry. I took the word literally.
The originator did indicate " I also added a bog filter about 5 X 2 X 1.5
feet"

Sure. Note the upwell of water from the pond. This water will be oxygenated:
aerobic bacteria, in other words.

C//

So I put in that second pond this year and had problems with my water not
clearing up.

So I put in a bigger pump and a Skippy filter. The pump is a 3000GPH and
the Skippy a 100 stock tank. Of course I couldn't find that filter stuff
so I used lava rock. I can change it every year if need be till I find a
better filter material. Three days and my pond is clearer then bottle water
and maintenance free. I'm loving it.


"Courageous" wrote in message
...

Ooops, sorry. I took the word literally.
The originator did indicate " I also added a bog filter about 5 X 2 X 1.5
feet"

Sure. Note the upwell of water from the pond. This water will be
oxygenated:
aerobic bacteria, in other words.

C//

Hey Rick!
When I got rid of my lava rock, I switched to the floor scrubber pads.
You can order them on line. They are pretty inexpensive and seem to be
working great!
When you cut them to the size you want, be sure to wear gloves. :-)
W. Dale

Rick wrote:

So I put in that second pond this year and had problems with my water not
clearing up.

So I put in a bigger pump and a Skippy filter. The pump is a 3000GPH and
the Skippy a 100 stock tank. Of course I couldn't find that filter stuff
so I used lava rock. I can change it every year if need be till I find a
better filter material. Three days and my pond is clearer then bottle water
and maintenance free. I'm loving it.


"Courageous" wrote in message
.. .


Ooops, sorry. I took the word literally.
The originator did indicate " I also added a bog filter about 5 X 2 X 1.5
feet"


Sure. Note the upwell of water from the pond. This water will be
oxygenated:
aerobic bacteria, in other words.

C//

"Rick" wrote in message
nk.net...
So I put in that second pond this year and had problems with my water not
clearing up.

So I put in a bigger pump and a Skippy filter. The pump is a 3000GPH and
the Skippy a 100 stock tank. Of course I couldn't find that filter stuff
so I used lava rock. I can change it every year if need be till I find a
better filter material. Three days and my pond is clearer then bottle
water
and maintenance free. I'm loving it.
=========================
I tried using lavarock in a homemade filter some years ago. It clogged too
fast and was a bummer to try and clean. It weighed a ton when clogged with
"pond gunk." I use filter pads now with bio-squares that came with the
Tetra filters. Although the water "greens up" now and then it always clears
by itself.
--
McKoi.... the frugal ponder...
EVERYONE: "Please check people's headers for forgeries
before flushing." NAMES ARE BEING FORGED.
Do not feed the trolls.
~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o