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Dead algae.. dos that reduce oxy levels?
My greenwater finally died off, but now I have brown water.
I built one of those "milk crate" submerged filter, driven by our large pond spitter pump, but noticed this am, the fish all in a cluster, doing the air sucking thing. Does the dead algae reduce oxygen levels? I turned the bubblers on again, to add more oxygen in the water. Wonder how long it'll take the filter to clear the dead algae? -- Gareee's Homepage: http://www.fortunecity.com/tattooine.../mainframe.htm Remove Delicious spam to reply |
My greenwater finally died off, ... By itself? Does the dead algae reduce oxygen levels? Aerobic bacteria suck down oxygen like no tomorrow. Do you circulate your bottom water? If not, leave that bubbler on all the time. C// |
"Courageous" wrote in message
... My greenwater finally died off, ... By itself? Yep. I suspect lots of overcast rainy days, and increasing the number of plats to it. Does the dead algae reduce oxygen levels? Aerobic bacteria suck down oxygen like no tomorrow. And, um, Aerobi means? Do you circulate your bottom water? Nope. At least I haven't. If not, leave that bubbler on all the time. Will do. -- Gareee's Homepage: http://www.fortunecity.com/tattooine.../mainframe.htm Remove Delicious spam to reply |
"Gareee©" wrote in message ... My greenwater finally died off, but now I have brown water. ## A partial water change would probably help. I built one of those "milk crate" submerged filter, driven by our large pond spitter pump, but noticed this am, the fish all in a cluster, doing the air sucking thing. ## Now THAT doesn't sound good. Does the dead algae reduce oxygen levels? I turned the bubblers on again, to add more oxygen in the water. ## I would leave them on ALL THE TIME! Wonder how long it'll take the filter to clear the dead algae? ## No one can answer that one......... -- McKoi.... the frugal ponder... My Pond Page http://tinyurl.com/cuq5b ~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o |
Aerobic bacteria suck down oxygen like no tomorrow. And, um, Aerobi means? Air-breathing. Your pond is alive with them, they break down waste. But they need oxygen to live. If not, leave that bubbler on all the time. Will do. The bubbler forms a small current, moving water from the bottom of the pond to the top. The top of your pond aerates the water very well, but the bottom of your pond is very low in oxygen. So you move the low oxygen bottom water to the top, it gets oxygenated. The air bubbler itself adds a little oxygen also, but really plays second string to the circulation/top of your pond thing. Some folks pull water out of the bottom of their pond, pump it to a waterfall or something. A well designed pond will often have two pumps. One to power the skimmer (to get floaters off the top), and one to circulate lower water, to oxygenate the pond. You don't really need a bubbler, if you have the right set up, but it will work okay if you don't. How big is your pond, how many gallons per hour is your current pump? C// |
Gareee wrote
Aerobic bacteria suck down oxygen like no tomorrow. And, um, Aerobic means? . Requiring oxygen Went cruising google, my favorite activity when the dishes call and found: *Aerobic digestion of waste is the natural biological degradation and purification process in which bacteria that thrive in oxygen-rich environments break down and digest the waste. During this oxidation process, pollutants are broken down into carbon dioxide (CO2), water (H2O), nitrates, sulphates and biomass (micro-organisms). By optimising the oxygen supply -with so-called aerators- the process can be significantly accelerated* So lots of oxygen in the water is a goooooooood thing, as Martha would say. kathy :-) www.blogfromthebog.com this week ~ the rat-tail maggot! Pond 101 page for new pond keepers ~ http://hometown.aol.com/ka30p/myhomepage/garden.html |
So lots of oxygen in the water is a goooooooood thing, as Martha would say. Yes. In my current pond construction, I'm putting bubblers in the bog filter's cleanout tube (which is otherwise sealed). I'm aerating the bog. I have no bubblers in the main pond otherwise planned. This is partly to keep a die off from happening in the even the pump is shut down, partly to accelerate the aerobes. C// |
"Courageous" wrote in message
... Aerobic bacteria suck down oxygen like no tomorrow. And, um, Aerobi means? Air-breathing. Your pond is alive with them, they break down waste. But they need oxygen to live. ah, ok. A well designed pond will often have two pumps. One to power the skimmer (to get floaters off the top), and one to circulate lower water, to oxygenate the pond. You don't really need a bubbler, if you have the right set up, but it will work okay if you don't. How big is your pond, how many gallons per hour is your current pump? Not sure of the exact size, but it's 13x13x, 1.5-3 feet deep. The spitter is a 2-3 foot tall gargoyle, and it pulls from the homeade plastic milk carton furnace filter I built from recommendations here. (Though it doesn't seem to be doing much of a job at all of removing the floating dead algae.) This is the first time I've ever seen the fish all together doing the gaping thing.. maybe it's some common group behaviour as well? -- Gareee's Homepage: http://www.fortunecity.com/tattooine.../mainframe.htm Remove Delicious spam to reply |
"Courageous" wrote in message
... So lots of oxygen in the water is a goooooooood thing, as Martha would Well, I had shut the bubblers off in march or so, after the possibility of a freeze over. The pond is in full sun, and it's taken some time this year to get any major kind of plant growth in the pond.. I have one large lilly, with over 40 pads, a smaller one with about 10 2 inch pads, and 3 large water hyacinths. I had added 6 bunches of watercress, but the fish decided they proffered it for lunch instead of shade. they've literally devoured it all now. I recently added a bunch of water lettuce from one of the group members, but it's too early to tell if it'll "take" or not. -- Gareee's Homepage: http://www.fortunecity.com/tattooine.../mainframe.htm Remove Delicious spam to reply |
Not sure of the exact size, but it's 13x13x, 1.5-3 feet deep. Okay, I'll assume an average depth of 2.25 feet. Your pond is 13 x 13 x 2.25 x 7.48 = 3,160 gallons. The spitter is a 2-3 foot tall gargoyle, ... Hrm. A "spitter" is your only water flow? That doesn't sound like it could be very much... You should move about 3,000 gallons of water per hour. I'd look into a Sequence 750. Lots of gallons moved, low watts consumed. This is the first time I've ever seen the fish all together doing the gaping thing.. maybe it's some common group behaviour as well? Almost always means not enough oxygen in the water. C// |
"Courageous" wrote in message ... Not sure of the exact size, but it's 13x13x, 1.5-3 feet deep. Okay, I'll assume an average depth of 2.25 feet. Your pond is 13 x 13 x 2.25 x 7.48 = 3,160 gallons. The spitter is a 2-3 foot tall gargoyle, ... Hrm. A "spitter" is your only water flow? That doesn't sound like it could be very much... Here's a pic link to give you an idea.. the gargoyle can be lifted by 1 person, but it's easier with 2. For scale, the large boulder to the right cannot be lifted or budged at all... it is about 4-5 ft square, and the sundial near the spitted is a foot tall, maybe a tad higher. Our old Christmas tree behind the pond stands about 7-8 ft at the top tip. http://webpages.charter.net/gareee/Pond.jpg -- Gareee's Homepage: http://www.fortunecity.com/tattooine.../mainframe.htm Remove Delicious spam to reply |
"Gareee©" wrote in message ... "Courageous" wrote in message ... Not sure of the exact size, but it's 13x13x, 1.5-3 feet deep. Okay, I'll assume an average depth of 2.25 feet. Your pond is 13 x 13 x 2.25 x 7.48 = 3,160 gallons. The spitter is a 2-3 foot tall gargoyle, ... Hrm. A "spitter" is your only water flow? That doesn't sound like it could be very much... Here's a pic link to give you an idea.. the gargoyle can be lifted by 1 person, but it's easier with 2. For scale, the large boulder to the right cannot be lifted or budged at all... it is about 4-5 ft square, and the sundial near the spitted is a foot tall, maybe a tad higher. Our old Christmas tree behind the pond stands about 7-8 ft at the top tip. http://webpages.charter.net/gareee/Pond.jpg Nice pond, but I think Courageous is right. You need much more water flow. My puddle is only 500 imperial gallons and I have about 1500 gph split between the water fall and the fountain. -- Gareee's Homepage: http://www.fortunecity.com/tattooine.../mainframe.htm Remove Delicious spam to reply |
"Courageous" did the calculations and came up with:
Okay, I'll assume an average depth of 2.25 feet. Your pond is 13 x 13 x 2.25 x 7.48 = 3,160 gallons. Having done my own figuring and fellow ponder's figuring of their own ponds and then running a water meter, or salt calculator, we've found all to be off by 20-50%. All those folds, curves and I wouldn't be surprised plant containers (if it is an older pond) take up space. http://webpages.charter.net/gareee/Pond.jpg So with the math and the picture above I'm betting she has something over 2,000 gallons, and the only way that little filter is gonna work is to mass plant the pond. My lily pond of 1,000 gallons has 12 water lilies, 2 lotus, 4 baskets of iris, 2 baskets of arrowhead, 1 lizard tail and a few water hyacinths, plus bunches of anacharis. It looks like you have the starts of a water fall to the right? Do you have anyone mechanically inclined to help you do an out-of-the-pond filter perhaps? I'm thinking plumbing similar to what my guys did for me (see diagram on webpage under *My Filter*) where you go over the side and use siphon effect. www.jjspond.us ~ jan ~Power to the Porg, Flow On!~ |
"~ janj JJsPond.us" wrote in message
... "Courageous" did the calculations and came up with: Okay, I'll assume an average depth of 2.25 feet. Your pond is 13 x 13 x 2.25 x 7.48 = 3,160 gallons. Having done my own figuring and fellow ponder's figuring of their own ponds and then running a water meter, or salt calculator, we've found all to be off by 20-50%. All those folds, curves and I wouldn't be surprised plant containers (if it is an older pond) take up space. http://webpages.charter.net/gareee/Pond.jpg So with the math and the picture above I'm betting she has something over 2,000 gallons, and the only way that little filter is gonna work is to mass plant the pond. My lily pond of 1,000 gallons has 12 water lilies, 2 lotus, 4 baskets of iris, 2 baskets of arrowhead, 1 lizard tail and a few water hyacinths, plus bunches of anacharis. It looks like you have the starts of a water fall to the right? Do you have anyone mechanically inclined to help you do an out-of-the-pond filter perhaps? I'm thinking plumbing similar to what my guys did for me (see diagram on webpage under *My Filter*) where you go over the side and use siphon effect. www.jjspond.us ~ jan Yeah we'd talked about a waterfall on the right. I'm thinking it would be better to have a lower one, and incorporate the rock on it's side, then to drop totally off that boulder. What I can probably do, is get a larger pump, and place that inside the in pond filter as well. I'm kinda in the boonies (Our city has a total population of only 6,000), so pretty much what I can do is what I me myself. I've seen some pumps in the chicago tools catalog that look like they might do a waterfall.. or any online inexpensive alternatives would also be good. BTW, we thought there were some larger baby fish in the pond, and it's turned out they are salmanders or newts that have decided to visit! -- Gareee's Homepage: http://www.fortunecity.com/tattooine.../mainframe.htm Remove Delicious spam to reply |
I've seen some pumps in the chicago tools catalog that look like they might do a waterfall.. or any online inexpensive alternatives would also be good. You really need to look at the unit cost of water moved. Cost of operations can really get ya. The Sequence 750 is one of the most cost effective gallons- moved-to-watts-burned pumps on the market. C// |
"Courageous" wrote in message
... I've seen some pumps in the chicago tools catalog that look like they might do a waterfall.. or any online inexpensive alternatives would also be good. You really need to look at the unit cost of water moved. Cost of operations can really get ya. The Sequence 750 is one of the most cost effective gallons- moved-to-watts-burned pumps on the market. Where's the best place to purchase it, and what kind of monthly costs am I looking at? -- Gareee's Homepage: http://www.fortunecity.com/tattooine.../mainframe.htm Remove Delicious spam to reply |
You really need to look at the unit cost of water moved. Cost of operations can really get ya. The Sequence 750 is one of the most cost effective gallons-moved-to-watts-burned pumps on the market. Where's the best place to purchase it, and what kind of monthly costs am I looking at? It's 160 watts. As for what you pay for that, that's 160 watts times 24 hours = 3.8 kilowatt hours per day. You move over 3000 gallons per hour at that price. Do note that Sequence pumps aren't submersible; also, they aren't capable of driving large head (height) applications. They are designed specifically to move the maximum amount of water for the least price at minimal head. The best price I've seen on the pump is the "member's price" at AZ Ponds (http://www.azponds.com). Please be aware that I haven't actually bought anything from them, though. With these pumps, it pays to shop. I've seen them priced well over /double/ at some places. C// |
"Courageous" wrote in message
... You really need to look at the unit cost of water moved. Cost of operations can really get ya. The Sequence 750 is one of the most cost effective gallons-moved-to-watts-burned pumps on the market. Where's the best place to purchase it, and what kind of monthly costs am I looking at? It's 160 watts. As for what you pay for that, that's 160 watts times 24 hours = 3.8 kilowatt hours per day. You move over 3000 gallons per hour at that price. Do note that Sequence pumps aren't submersible; also, they aren't capable of driving large head (height) applications. They are designed specifically to move the maximum amount of water for the least price at minimal head. The best price I've seen on the pump is the "member's price" at AZ Ponds (http://www.azponds.com). Please be aware that I haven't actually bought anything from them, though. With these pumps, it pays to shop. I've seen them priced well over /double/ at some places. I was thinking of adding a uv lamp to help eliminate the algae, (though that's almost a non issue for now) Can these be using in conjunction with a uv lamp? Also, we were considering a waterfall (not huge), but the lift is about 4.5 feet.. can they handle that? A concern I'm having, is how much constant water agitation we might end up with.. the spitter, the bubblers, and now this as well. Not a huge deal, but I don;t want it to look like there's a whirlpool in my yard instead of a pond.. LOL! -- Gareee's Homepage: http://www.fortunecity.com/tattooine.../mainframe.htm Remove Delicious spam to reply |
YOu really do not need to make generalizationi statements such as
"Sequence are not made for high head applications" so evidently your not really familiar with the entire line of Sequence pumps..........Sequence makes a line of pumps that will pump up against head with any other brands normally associated with pond use.......Now if your going with their Value FLow or the 750 series its the economy line of pumps.........and you get what you paya for in regards to performanace and price......... On Sun, 17 Jul 2005 21:11:30 -0700, Courageous wrote: === === You really need to look at the unit cost of water moved. Cost of === operations can really get ya. The Sequence 750 is one of the most === cost effective gallons-moved-to-watts-burned pumps on the market. === ===Where's the best place to purchase it, and what kind of monthly ===costs am I looking at? === ===It's 160 watts. As for what you pay for that, that's 160 watts ===times 24 hours = 3.8 kilowatt hours per day. You move over 3000 ===gallons per hour at that price. Do note that Sequence pumps ===aren't submersible; also, they aren't capable of driving large ===head (height) applications. They are designed specifically ===to move the maximum amount of water for the least price at ===minimal head. === ===The best price I've seen on the pump is the "member's price" ===at AZ Ponds (http://www.azponds.com). Please be aware that I ===haven't actually bought anything from them, though. === ===With these pumps, it pays to shop. I've seen them priced well ===over /double/ at some places. === ===C// ============================================== Put some color in your cheeks...garden naked! "The original frugal ponder" ~~~~ }((((o ~~~~~~ }{{{{o ~~~~~~~ }(((((o |
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Can these be using in conjunction with a uv lamp? Certainly; although you might consider the flow rate of the lamp; if the pump exceeds it, build a manifold (an array of valves) where only one of them goes to the uv lamp. Also, we were considering a waterfall (not huge), but the lift is about 4.5 feet.. can they handle that? Yes. A concern I'm having, is how much constant water agitation we might end up with.. the spitter, the bubblers, and now this as well. Not all water movement has to go into a water feature. In your manifold, you can return some water directly to the pond, just below the surface. This will be helpful to your pond if your water source is at or near the bottom of your pond. Example: Pump--Tee--Array of valves--1 fountain, 2 water fall, 3 back to pond A picture is he http://www.aquaticeco.com/index.cfm/.../8341/cid/2034 You can make these out of cheap parts from Home Depot. C// |
"Courageous" wrote in message
... Can these be using in conjunction with a uv lamp? Certainly; although you might consider the flow rate of the lamp; if the pump exceeds it, build a manifold (an array of valves) where only one of them goes to the uv lamp. Also, we were considering a waterfall (not huge), but the lift is about 4.5 feet.. can they handle that? Yes. Cool on both counts, and the generalization thing. A concern I'm having, is how much constant water agitation we might end up with.. the spitter, the bubblers, and now this as well. Not all water movement has to go into a water feature. In your manifold, you can return some water directly to the pond, just below the surface. This will be helpful to your pond if your water source is at or near the bottom of your pond. Again, good idea. Looks like some new pond shopping might be in order. The pond is much clearer then yesterday though, and I think as long as the algae isn't in full bloom, I might actually be ok. Something I hadn't considered, is if there something the water lettuce exudes that kills algae. That's really the only major change in the pond's ecosystem that has occurred in the last week or so. He have a plantless mini pond made from a kid's pool and it is still completely green. I just a portion of the water lettuce in it as an experiment, to see if the lettuce is what killed off the algae. Plus, there are a few small watercress plants left.. I relocated them there, so they can grow back.. when they do, I'll transfer them into the main pond, for fish food. -- Gareee's Homepage: http://www.fortunecity.com/tattooine.../mainframe.htm Remove Delicious spam to reply |
Something I hadn't considered, is if there something the water lettuce exudes that kills algae. That's really the only major change in the pond's ecosystem that has occurred in the last week or so. In sal****er aquariums, both macroalgae and corals routinely engage in chemical warfare. The corals especially, but even the macroalgae. It's a possibility for fresh water plants, I suppose, although I am ignorant of the subject. C// |
Something I hadn't considered, is if there something the water lettuce
exudes that kills algae. That's really the only major change in the pond's ecosystem that has occurred in the last week or so. In sal****er aquariums, both macroalgae and corals routinely engage in chemical warfare. The corals especially, but even the macroalgae. It's a possibility for fresh water plants, I suppose, although I am ignorant of the subject. C// It's a good thought, I think most of us just figured the lettuce out competes the algae for nutrients. ~ jan ~Power to the Porg, Flow On!~ |
"~ janj JJsPond.us" wrote in message
... Something I hadn't considered, is if there something the water lettuce exudes that kills algae. That's really the only major change in the pond's ecosystem that has occurred in the last week or so. It's a good thought, I think most of us just figured the lettuce out competes the algae for nutrients. ~ jan I have a hard time believing a very small amount though would effect such a dramatic a change in such a short time period. I'll report what I see in the smaller pond (there's a larger amount in there proportionately, and if I do see an effect, maybe water lettuce could be the "magic bullet" for green water? -- Gareee's Homepage: http://www.fortunecity.com/tattooine.../mainframe.htm Remove Delicious spam to reply |
I have a hard time believing a very small amount though would effect such a dramatic a change in such a short time period. While I haven't seen what you call a "small amount of water lettuce," I've seen water lettuce. A few heads is quite a bit, a lot of biomatter. I would wonder how much the equivalent green water algae would weigh... C// |
Gareee© wrote:
My greenwater finally died off, but now I have brown water. Did you have Carol over for tea? When yiu are not looking she will poop in the pond |
Go away Carol, nobody cares about what you have to say. leave the net
and service your husband! Reel Mckoi wrote: "Gareee©" wrote in message ... My greenwater finally died off, but now I have brown water. ## A partial water change would probably help. I built one of those "milk crate" submerged filter, driven by our large pond spitter pump, but noticed this am, the fish all in a cluster, doing the air sucking thing. ## Now THAT doesn't sound good. Does the dead algae reduce oxygen levels? I turned the bubblers on again, to add more oxygen in the water. ## I would leave them on ALL THE TIME! Wonder how long it'll take the filter to clear the dead algae? ## No one can answer that one......... |
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